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PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2013 11:46 pm 
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Hello,
Anybody who might be interested in my story feel free to comment. This was the third cycle of suboxone in the past 5 years. This last cycle being almost 3 full years. I "successfully" came off of subs twice in the past, only to relapse within 2 weeks after. I am a believer in a few mentalities, the first is we must learn from our mistakes and learn to look inward at your core thinking. Evaluate the decisions you make, why do you make those decisions? This was a major process for me to take on as changing your way of thinking is indeed a mountain to climb. I have no experience with AA/NA and I acknowledge the success rates that come from these type of programs. My new thinking had taken me to the conclusion that abstinence in every form possible will be the best remedy for my recovery. Friends, contacts, old place of work, new home, and with my new way of thinking also came a decision to avoid AA/NA. I have no ill will to those programs but i want to avoid addicts to my best ability. These are mostly common sense ways to recover but not everyone takes it to heart as much as maybe they should.

On to the physical withdrawal process-
You have/will read these things several times in your internet search for withdrawal ease tips. I can only make claims that work/ed for myself.

-The most beneficial prescribed medication i had was the muscle relaxer by the generic name methocarbamol. Take as prescribed only though. A medication to use but be carefull with is clonodine, drops your blood pressure significantly. The major side effect is lethargy (like you need more reason to sit in bed and not move). I also followed the Thomas Recipe to a certain degree, however i did not partake in benzos at all. I believe they are useful for some people recovering but if you have the willpower you will find other remedies more than capable of replacing these type of drugs. The aspect of the Thomas recipe i found most powerful was taking the vitamin B6 and L-Tyrosine. Holy cow, the combination of these two dietary supplements first thing in the morning and then again approximately 1 hour before dinner time gave me that extra boost needed to stay out of my bed and do something! you must stay active and escape the brain of the addict in agony. Terrible to give in to such weakness if you are capable of fighting this disease with a fighters mentality(which i am not, but i have come to hate these handcuffs i have worn for 5+ years.)
-Quality produce and very low sodium foods are a must. Bananas(i believe this is a superfood for opiate recovery, eat two a day if possible), avacados (another great food for your body), apples, carrots, cherry tomatoes, salads, deli chicken that is low sodium is a good source of protein as well. Try to avoid any heavy carbohydrates, especially candy, soda, high sugar fruit juices.
-What i have seen ridiculed more than any other suggestion for withdrawal ease is exercise. This will differ for nearly every individual trying to go through withdrawal. One person may be able to go out on day 1 and jog, the next may not be able to walk but maybe 1 block on day 6. I must tell you how much any effort at all will not only help to kick start your muscles but also that part of your brain that gives you the ultimate satisfaction( through endorphin release and i also believe, although i cannot say for fact, your spirit will shift to a positive way of thinking. Do not just give one attempt, put every aching ounce of your body in a bit more pain to achieve this glorious feeling.
-I timed my detox to start with my 1 week of vacation, although i would not recommend more than a week as i have found as much recovery from getting into a daily routine and letting your mind focus on something besides pain is very beneficial.
-Stay fearless, stay humble, have a plan of action in place and follow that plan as the sober you would want. Do not give into the weakness, there is much to be said about overcoming your daily battles using your sheer willpower compared to over medicating to get through the symptoms. I easily could have called the doctor and asked/begged for any medication to give me relief.

I could go on and on but i will end here. If anybody would like to ask or add anything feel free to comment. There is light at the end of the tunnel, and the process of getting there is a very satisfying feeling to achieve.


Last edited by choicesWEmake on Fri Oct 25, 2013 11:10 am, edited 7 times in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 06, 2013 5:55 am 
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Great Job. Sounds like you have found the answers to your own questions. You are only day 14, I just hit 8 months and couple of weeks now. I still had to use neurotin to stop the buring sensation that detox gave me. Benzo were great great for the panic attacks, PAWS is putting me trhough. I am living in duh huh duh huh land. Unable to add two and two together.

I made it and will continue due to the support system I have been blessed with. I came to the otherside loved. Hard for most addicts because they have ruined so many others lives. If I had been told I was terrible and how dare I all the time, I wouldn't be here. I do hope you have support. Hard doing it alone. I couldn't.

Keep up the good work. Thanks your story was informational.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 3:46 pm 
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Just a quick update, if anybody is at all interested.

It is 21 days since my last suboxone dose and I have to say I am feeling very good. Around day 17/18 I noticed the aches have completely died off, although I fatigue when walking long distance or exercising a bit quicker than I like.

On day 19 I got a full nights rest, had a dream, which was the most vivid crazy dream. Since that night the dreams are slowly becoming "normal" and I am sleeping well, 8 hours each night. Before detoxing suboxone I was taking Seroquel for sleep in low dose (25mg). I never took any kind of sleep aid or benzodiazepine in addition with Seroquel. The only other sleep aid I took was Sleepy Time tea an hour before bed time, and a 5mg melatonin. I have since discontinued use of the tea and melatonin and only require my normal Seroquel at bed time.

I am still yawning quite a bit, sneezing attacks like once an hour. I have to say that the lethargy and mood issues are depleting at a rapid pace by the day. Each day is like another weight off my mind.

I have been taking walks and/or riding my bike for a few miles every night after work. I am a firm believer in a strict routine and physical activity to get back on track. Meals are eaten around the same time daily also helps your GI system (which never got to terrible).

I like to look at minor victories during detox, these minor victories add up. I believe pushing yourself through the tough times and avoiding comfort meds when you know you can power through have helped get back to "normal" quicker than the easy route. Remind yourself daily, what is your reason for quitting. For me this is very useful when getting depressed or lethargic. Everybody has that drive inside of them, it has been numbed by medication for so long that you need to help it escape. I consider progress to be a snowball effect. Slow and small as it starts but you know what as soon as you get that momentum there is no stopping it, soon its an avalanche. This is corny but it the description is relevant.

Are you strong enough?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2013 4:02 pm 
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Congratulations on getting off Suboxone!

What are you going to different this time around so you don't end up back on it a 4th time? Have you given any thought to a recovery program?

Strength may have played a part in getting off Suboxone, but it usually takes more than strength to STAY off opiates. I hope you consider some kind of recovery.

You mention in your first post learning to look inwards at your core thinking, but you realize you're viewing that thinking with an addict brain, right? That colors your perception.

I understand you want to avoid AA/NA, many of us do, but AA/NA aren't the only game in town. SMART recovery is a good option, working with an addiction counselor is a good option. I'm not trying to be harsh, I'm just shooting you straight in hopes you don't mess up again.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 2:04 pm 
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Thank you for the response. In response to your suggestions I would have to say I went through those programs in the past, ending in failure. These programs were not the detriment to my recovery however, I am just choosing a different path this time. Just because you are an addict does not mean you are required to think like an addict. It has taken 3 going on 4 years for me to nurture my relationships with my family and myself to evolve into a more mature, balance oriented person. I am far from perfect, in fact not even close. However I am taking an old fashioned approach to my recovery. Eat healthy, be responsible in all aspects of life, find balance in my mind and body through exercise and hobbies that do not plague the mind with thoughts of using. Prepare yourself for tough times, have an emergency plan (mine is through a family that truly loves me, I am blessed). I cannot predict the future but I sure as heck can plan for it. Thank you for your thoughts, I can definitely see where that can be beneficial for recovery.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 2:11 pm 
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Hey Choices-

Your plan sounds a heck of a lot like my plan. :D I've had a couple small bumps in the road but so far so good.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 12:00 pm 
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Choice

Thank you for your post. I found it very informative. Sounds like you are in a good place & will stay away from whatever brought you to the sub.

Please continue to update. I am interested in how you are. I am on sub to do basically what you have done, change habits, routines, coping etc.

Can i ask what milligram you jumped from & what brought you to the sub? Also you age? I know it's alot of questions. I am older & wonder if it will be harder for me.

Congratulations on being free!

Looking forward to an update!

Tiki


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 12:56 pm 
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Hello,
A little background info:

Sex: Male
Age: 28
Drug Use: Heroin/oxycodone
Time on suboxone: 3.5 years
Jump off dose: .25mg daily for last month of taper, no day skipping in my plan

As for why sub, at the time of induction my knowledge was slightly vague on the true benefit of sub. Short term, it made me feel "normal". After taking time to learn why it is that suboxone can be so effective, I used this precious time i had during treatment to rebuild myself and my relationships i had soiled. I don't consider I will be ever be cured, but knowing that you have the tools to fight addiction and knowing how to use them can be quite efficient. This has been a time in my life i will not forget, no matter how badly you may want to. I consider it a bump in the road that has taught/will teach many lessons on human behavior and how to predict the onset of cravings and times of poor choice. Let me know if i missed something or would like to ask something else.

Take care


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 9:43 pm 
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Wow, what a great post!

I wish that every person who comes here complaining about how suboxone ruined their life could read this! You took it and learned from it. Put in the work when the work was what was needed. And, you knew what to expect when it came time to discontinue it. I don't hear a hint of blame listed anywhere! You said you didn't really understand how suboxone would work when you started treatment, but you didn't turn around and blame the evil drug manufacturers or the money hungry doctor who "tricked you" into starting it! I love it!!!!!

I truly wish you the best of luck with your Long term recovery!

Q

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 3:03 pm 
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Reading this post has gave me so much hope now! Will subs is an awesome drug and got me off the needle, I had to jump off cold turkey at 4 mgs on Monday. Not by my decision but that's another story. Anyways, I wasn't able to taper. I ordered Withdrawal Ease and idc what people say about that stuff, it has helped me a lot. I also tried to take a couple of xanax to help with the emotional part and it just made me even more emotional lol. BUT I did slip up and Friday night I took a piece of a sub that was offered to me. It may have been about 1mg so now I'm guessing I'm back to square one after going 4 days? I need someone to please help explain this to me because I don't have any other source of help or information but I do have plenty of support from my family. I'm still taking the wd ease day and night formula and don't really feel that bad but I'm so afraid that maybe all of that sub was out of my system and now I'm going have to start over. I was also gave an 8mg sub yesterday and done half last night and half this morning. I am definitely going back to square one right? I'm not taking anymore idc if they are gave to me. I HAVE to come off these subs because I can't afford the $800 a month it was costing me to do to the doc. I have no insurance so I was paying full price. Which I did kinda taper myself down on my own without telling my doc because he started me at 3 8mg a day and I brought myself down to one 8mg a day and then down to 4mg for 2 weeks and that's when I just jumped off. I manage a restaurant so I can't take time off to stay home and wd and getting out, working or playing with my 8 yr old daughter does make me feel better and I don't have problems sleeping because the wd ease night formula has melatonin and valerian root in it so it helps me sleep really well. I have A LOT on my plate my right now and I know I've picked a bad time to go cold turkey but I didn't have a choice. I had to. Any advice, tips or anythinghv any of y'all could give me would be great. And I can't go to a doc and get some of the meds y'all have been talking about because I don't have insurance!! Thanks!!


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 3:31 pm 
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Sara, I noticed you have support from your family. If they knew how important this drug was for you, could they pull together enough for at least one more prescription. Then you could do another taper. Jump at 4 mg sounds pretty high. If you discussed this with the dr, there may be some type of financial help he can point you to. At least he would be able to help you taper w comfort meds and support.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 11:44 pm 
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I understand how money can be a major issue with recovery. However i agree with Minnie, at least 1 more prescription seems very necessary. I cannot speak to the discomforts of quitting at that dose. However if you were given a month to do a very aggressive taper i would take this route 100 times out of 100. You will be in discomfort while tapering, take this as comparison. You can jump out of a plane without a parachute and hope for the best or give yourself a parachute and give yourself a legitimate chance. Its not that i do not think you could be successful, its just putting yourself in the best situation to be successful that i notice. Stay positive regardless of the route you will take. Be honest with yourself if you truly think you are ready to discontinue your use of suboxone. I am hoping you keep courage and do the right thing. For what its worth i am hoping for the best for you.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 3:49 pm 
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Update: Day 29

I have turned a corner for the better during days 25-29. I avoided benzos and powerful sleep aids while detoxing and I believe I am reaping the benefits now. I am sleeping 7-9 hours a night, taking Seroquel as prescribed (25mg once nightly before bed). Note that I was taking Seroquel prior to detox for sleep anyways. I have discontinued use of melatonin as I am comfortable and my mind is at rest when the time comes for sleep. I owe a lot of credit to taking a strict diet of fruits and veggies with a good lean protein every meal. Taken in 3-4 balanced meals a day. Credit has also to be given to exercise, I have been walking/biking about 4-5 days a week and there is great relief when you go to lay in bed at the end of a day and actually be tired from activity and not tired from stress/detox. I have lowered my use of b6(500 mg) and l-tyrosine(500 mg) to one dose daily upon waking up. I cannot give enough praise to the focus and energy given from the combination of these two supplements in combination with a healthy diet.

I will attempt to update periodically on any lingering effects but I feel like I am entering the next phase of recovery. I consider my drug use and buprenorphine treatment a lesson in human behavior. I have no guilt for the things I have done or the enablers in my life. The path I have taken cannot be changed, however the path I take this day forward is guided by the knowledge and experiences acquired in the last 6 years.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 1:47 pm 
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Your story gives me so much hope. I was able to get one more script of the subs and I'm only taking 2mg a day and I do have some wd but not nearly as bad as the cold turkey. I've got enough to last me the rest of the month and I'm so ready to get off these damn things *pardon my language* so the first couple of days I took 4 mg like I normally was but then I decided to go down to 2mg and the Withdrawal Ease does work! It helps me during the day and also sleeping at night but usually after work I'm so tired anyways I don't need any help to sleep! My blood pressure has stopped plummeting and then sky rocketing which I suspect it was doing when I would start to get really cold and then all of a sudden I would be burning up and my face and neck would be red as a beet! The dr was against me doing this but that's because I think he wants me to stay on them so they can continue to get my $400 a month!! Please keep updating us on your journey because it is such an inspiration to me!!


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:07 am 
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Just an update:

Physically- Doing well, occasional moments of achiness or lethargy. Easy enough to power through, almost not worth mentioning. Early in detox it felt like I would make progress a few inches at a time, but as the days go by I am taking huge strides to feeling like the person I set out to be. Sleep is happening on a regular schedule and I am now starting to taper the 25mg Seroquel to get off of that. It is difficult though as 25mg is the smallest dose and the pill is quite small already. Hopefully it won't give me too much trouble.

Mentally- Staying positive everyday. Maybe every other day( just a guess at frequency) I get that slightly depressed mood(not terrible). I have found staying focused on my work, making dinner, exercising, or anything that requires more than staring at a tv or computer monitor is the best way to get my psyche back on track. Its funny how when you let the mind wander it will take you to those emotional rollercoaster times of your life. Its also incredible as humans that we have the power to overcome this using sensibility, rational, and most importantly willpower. Do not let a bump in the road ruin the whole trip.

Have a good day


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:07 pm 
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Thanks for the update! I tapered down to .25 mgs and took that for about 5 days when I realized that what little bit I was taking, probably was having no effect on me physically at all and it was more than likely just a mental thing. I stopped and it's been 6 days with no bupe! While my back and legs are protesting, I'm glad to not be a slave to those pills any longer! It's not been as bad as I thought it was going to be and definitely not as bad as going cold turkey. I've continued taking the withdrawal ease during this whole process and it has helped me so much. I just ordered 2 more bottles on Monday. The night time formula helps me stay asleep even though usually by the time I get into bed I'm so tired I have no problems falling asleep but my legs were waking me up constantly. The two most bothersome things are the runny nose and constant yawning.. I could do without either one of those! I keep tissue in my pockets all the time now because of my nose! I feel like I don't have any energy at all but I've found I can power my way through that. I have no other choice anyways. I've been exercising a little in the evenings, even if it's just a 30 minute walk and that has helped me tremendously not only physically but mentally as well. As long as I keep busy I'm okay. When I sit and try to read or check my Facebook is when my mind starts to wonder so on that you are totally right! I had 6 more of the tablets left after I decided to jump and considered flushing them but ended up giving them to my grandmother to lock up for a "just in case" measure. I'm praying that I don't need them though. Your story has been such an inspiration to me just in knowing that if one person can quit, so can I. Please keep the updates coming!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 11:37 am 
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Just a quick update for anybody who might still read this thread. I am feeling very good physically and mentally. It has been just over 9 weeks since my last dose of suboxone. Any PAWS I have experienced have been so mild that I would not even rate them higher than 2 out of 10 on a scale if 10 was hell and 0 was symptom free.

Something that I am noticing (and happy I prepared for) is as time passes you become less aware of your disease. This is a good and bad thing. It feels great to not have to worry about your medication. However something I have learned in my previous failed attempts at stopping suboxone is you must be aware of the different forms of the addiction disease. The moment you think you won, the moment you become over confident, it will suck you back as fast as the thought enters your mind.

If I can tell any fellow addict a tip it is to analyze your way of thought process. Not easy to do sometimes, force yourself to face the truth. Worst thing a drug addict can do is go with their gut. Think about each and every decision you make, what are pros and what are the cons. It sounds ridiculous to some people but I am telling you the minute I stopped lying to myself and analyzing my actions/decision making I became a much healthier person mentally and physically. You can be your own worst enemy or your own best friend. I have started to choose the latter, it feels so much better.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 4:24 pm 
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choicesWEmake wrote:
Something that I am noticing (and happy I prepared for) is as time passes you become less aware of your disease. This is a good and bad thing. It feels great to not have to worry about your medication. However something I have learned in my previous failed attempts at stopping suboxone is you must be aware of the different forms of the addiction disease. The moment you think you won, the moment you become over confident, it will suck you back as fast as the thought enters your mind.

If I can tell any fellow addict a tip it is to analyze your way of thought process. Not easy to do sometimes, force yourself to face the truth. Worst thing a drug addict can do is go with their gut. Think about each and every decision you make, what are pros and what are the cons. It sounds ridiculous to some people but I am telling you the minute I stopped lying to myself and analyzing my actions/decision making I became a much healthier person mentally and physically. You can be your own worst enemy or your own best friend. I have started to choose the latter, it feels so much better.


Post of the day award!!
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Glad you're doing well and hanging there. And more importantly, that you're learning about yourself and addiction, along the way. Keep up the good work!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:50 pm 
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Thank you for the kind words of encouragement, and the giant trophy(have a perfect spot on my virtual mantle for this).

Have a good weekend!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:54 pm 
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I couldn't have said it better myself!!!

Coming off of opiates & Sub is no cake walk! Relapsing just proves that we are vulnerable to this sickness. I thought I'd be just fine from a couple days of using opiates after coming off of Sub completely, think again!!! Your mind is a POWERFUL thing. Addiction is your minds mistress! It never leaves, and it's like a little voice in your head. To truly overcome this, you have to truly understand it.

Congrats on your days clean! I was on 105 days clean, and I slipped up. Now I'm on day 17 & I'm happy that I can say that I know the truly mind altering sickness that this is. And I hope to never take it for granted again.


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