It is currently Tue Aug 22, 2017 6:21 pm



All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Our Sponsors





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 20 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:22 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
Hi,

This is my first post here, ever. I've enjoyed reading the forums here and watching the good doc's videos for years, however.

So, I am a recovering heroin (and everything in b/w) addict that put himself in treatment centers on 3 different occasions, with little success lasting at most a couple years. I'm 35 years old, and 10+ years ago, I made a friend in Canada online who told me about Suboxone. Spent several days in a hotel room with my dad going through w/d so I could try suboxone. Finally went to the doc, and it turned out Suboxone has been my miracle that provided me with a normal life. Since that day, I've been taking 8mg tablets, then films, 3 times a day - and under doctors recommendation because of my high success with it, I should remain on it for the rest of my life.

That has worked out great for me - I started a dream career and have grown in it significantly over the past decade. It has worked great for me until yesterday when I accidentally tossed out my medication while cleaning out my car, only leaving me with the two doses I had in my wallet (and its 11 days before I can get a refill). I called my doc, and they are reviewing my 10 year history and plan on calling me tomorrow to let me know if I can pick up that refill early.

I must say, I'm quite scared. I have never gone without it, and even after 24 hours since my last dose, I'm feeling like I'm on a crash course to my worst nightmare. I can tell that the w/d from this are probably going to be way worse than the drugs I used before suboxone, probably because in my addiction - I didn't score every day 3 times a day for 10 years, lol. Also, I suddenly feel the old addictive thoughts coming back, where all I can think of is getting that refill. It really sucks, and I am completely unaware of how best to deal with the w/d if my doctor doesn't approve the early refill. I certainly don't want to miss a week or two of work.

Please help, any advice you might have if things go badly for me tomorrow - what would you do to keep from "dying from w/d" and keeping your job?

And I will be sure to update you all and let ya know how things go tomorrow, thanks :)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:25 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
I should also mention - I certainly would have tapered my last two doses yesterday if I had realized I tossed my meds, so that is also not an option for me. My two options are - doc approves refill, or figure out how to deal with 11 days suboxone free.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Loss
PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:20 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2011 12:35 am
Posts: 2802
Location: Southwest
That sucks dude! IMO, if they are reviewing your 10 yr history then you should have no problem getting an early refill.

If you don't, well, we won't go there right now. You have so much Buprenorphine built up in your system that you could probably go 4-6 days w/o it and not feel any w/d's. Then again, I don't know your metabolism, whether it be fast or slow like mine.

What surprises me is why you've stayed on such a large dose for so long. Heh, if it works then why fix it. We all handle Suboxone differently so no one here can say what is in store for you if you end up going w/o. Your doctor sounds like a straight up guy so you'll be fine. IMO

Welcome here!

R

_________________
Don't take yourself so damn seriously


Top
 Profile  
 
Our Sponsors
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:26 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:39 am
Posts: 4028
Location: Sitting at my computer
Shit, that sucks, Doober!!

I have to think that your doctor will call you in the meds, though. If your 10 year history has been pretty clean, I'm thinking he won't have a problem calling it in. We've had people here before in kind of similiar situations and their doctor always called them in more.

If for some reason he doesn't call them in, you will more than likely experience wd, but Suboxone wd is NOT as intense as the wd from your previous drugs. Don't get me wrong, Suboxone wd can suck, but it's not the kind of wd where you're begging God to kill you.

Please let us know what happens tomorrow.

_________________
Be kind to yourself. Our character defects do NOT define who we are!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 9:21 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
Thanks guys, still waiting to hear back from the doc at the moment, and I can tell you that I'm already feeling pretty cruddy, not horrible, just uncomfortable - stretching a lot, sneezing/coughing a little - not too bad right now but surprised at how quickly I've started to go downhill, maybe some of it is just the anxiety from anticipation of w/d.

Will update you guys when I hear back from the doc. And still, please let me know if you have any advice on how best to manage w/d. Thanks again :)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 9:09 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
Doctor said he couldn't approve early refill b/c of some regulation, so I'm pretty much screwed. Starting to feel quite a bit more uncomfortable. Freaking out in my head a bit about the days to come. Not sure why he wouldn't do it. My record isnt just good, its perfect - I was astounded, especially since this is the only time in 10 years anything out of the ordinary has occured. I've never had a single relapse since day one, take drug tests every visit and have never failed, never abused meds, have enjoyed a good life until this stupid mistake tossing my meds in the garbage - hope it doesn't jeopardize any of the good things I've worked so hard for over the past decade. Mind you, ive never actually met my doctor, i see his nurse. The nurse felt bad, said shed try talking to him again and promised to call me back - then blew me off and never called, probably because she didnt want to bear bad news a second time.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 11:37 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:42 am
Posts: 4138
So it sounds like you have a few options at the point. Option 1 would be to try to buy some suboxone off the street. I have no idea how you would go about doing that and, of course, there's a risk of getting caught and getting into trouble. My own doctor told me that he totally understands why a person would get it off the street if they had no way of getting it legally.

Option 2, call the nurse back, ask if the doctor can prescribe clonidine and other comfort meds for the time you are in withdrawal before your next appt. Then call up your troops, those you can trust to help you, and have someone supportive be with you for the entire time you are in withdrawal. Whether it's your father, your best friend, your girlfriend, whoever. You need to keep yourself busy and stay away from any other kind of narcotics so you don't blow your recovery.

Option 3, use this as a big excuse to relapse and mess up your entire life again. We all know that it's hard to go through withdrawal, but we also all know that it can be done. If you don't want to mess up your recovery then you won't. In fact, if you choose to suck it up through this period of withdrawal, we will be here for you. We will commiserate over every yucky symptom and congratulate you when you've gotten through these uncomfortable days. Most of us have been through something similar.

Advice for after you get through this little slice of hell. When you pick up your next script, your tolerance for sub will be a bit lower. Try to go through the month taking only 2 8mg strips/pills per day. If you can go a month just using 16 mg per day, you will have 30 extra strips. Get a home safe and lock up your extra, so that if something like this were to happen again, you would be prepared. After that, you can gauge whether or not you really need 24mg a day, or if you can make it with 16mg a day. I, personally, have had side effects from sub that have decreased or gone away completely from dropping my dose.

Despite anything others have to say, if 24mg is what works for you, don't feel like you have to alter your dose. In other words, if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

Good luck and please let us know how you are doing. Don't forget to ask for a script of clonidine for withdrawal symptoms!

Amy

_________________
Done is better than perfect!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 03, 2013 12:59 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
Wow, thank you so much for all the helpful advice Amy, and Rule and Romeo as well. You are all awesome. I have some good news, finally - I managed to find a handful of my meds that I didn't realize I still had, there was two days supply left... thank god for that. I know i'm going to have to take WAY less to make it to my next refill, but that I think I can deal with, and still goto work everyday, maybe with some minor discomfort. Much better, I'm quite relieved.

Option 3 btw was never an option for me, I cannot relapse - I know I won't survive it if that were to happen, though I'm always mindful that its always possible, and do everything I can to keep that from happening, and I have a good support group around me to help keep me in check.

This experience has certainly jolted me a bit. I didn't realize just how badly my body has become re-wired to work with suboxone, not until I stopped taking it for a couple days. I also forgot how long it actually takes to get into your system - it took over an hour before I felt any level of normality after taking it this evening.

Now hopefully my doc isn't turned off by this whole ordeal, and maybe it's time to think about taking less and.. Maybe.. Quitting altogether some day.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:32 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:42 am
Posts: 4138
I'm glad to hear that you found a few more doses to help you get through until your next refill.

I think that one of the reasons that sub users decide to get off sub is because they go through a scare like yours. They go through a scare and figure out just how precarious their situation is being totally dependent on a drug. The fear is exacerbated if they have a doctor who is a jerk or just in it for the money. You can definitely increase your feelings of security, however, if you build up a stock pile.

I was playing devil's advocate with option 3, and I'm glad you rejected the idea. It's great that you have a dependable support system. With their help, I'm sure you'll get through this just fine!

Good luck and keep us updated on how you're doing!

Amy

_________________
Done is better than perfect!


Top
 Profile  
 
   
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 5:27 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 8:47 am
Posts: 939
Location: Southeastern US (Alabama)
I had a similar situation happen this past month...all the cards just lined up to be that I was going to run about 2 days short -- mainly being that my doc scheduled a 5 week appointment from my visit, instead of 4 weeks... So they were post-dating scripts for people to fill on the 7th of August..to keep those folks evenly distributed. But...I went and bought me a safe, just simply because of a mishap with my toddler...and got a bit cocky with opening my meds inside the safe. I would wake up in the morning and open 3 to 5 films...that way I didn't have to go hide in the bedroom and spend 10 minutes cutting on a film (I use scissors, and I always cut my 8mg film into 3 or 4 pieces..so when I open one, normally I go ahead and cut it up in smaller doses)...

Well, I was home alone and decided it was the time to open a few since we were spending last weekend away from home..it would be easier if I went ahead and opened 2 days worth, which turned out to be 7 that I had open in all inside my safe. And I figured "what could happen..it's not like they'll ruin before tomorrow or Monday" when I did it..."

Ah..the mistakes we make. When you're messing around with a safe, scissors, and suboxone films...KEEP COFFEE CUPS A MINIMUM OF THREE FEET AWAY!!!!
As it turns out, I was holding my coffee in my hand, and went to close the safe..and the lid hit the coffee cup, tilted it toward the safe and made a good 1/3 cup slosh out...which landed on all the films I had opened. I panicked....but what the hell could I do. By the time I got a hair dryer and plugged it in, there was nothing left but some residue and a soaked foam insert in my safe.

Imagine explaining that to my doctor...but, first time in 5 years I have had ANYTHING like that happen to my meds...I'm usually very careful with the films because they are so sensitive to moisture. She was very understanding and I promised that I would never allow anything of that nature to happen again..and she tore up my already printed script with a post-date on it and changed it from 90/this month to 100/this month.

In the same respect, the docs office had signs up when I went in last week saying "because of FDA requirements, ALL patients must bring back their empty Suboxone film wrappers or you will NOT receive your prescription"....
I know better than some FDA rule about that..it's a doctor's "best practices" decision...not some rule mandated by the FDA. The FDA doesn't care what you do with your trash...if anything it would be the DEA, but that's what the sign said. I wanted to speak up and call them on it..but they had just done me a big favor, but the doctor I see isn't the doctor who's over the entire office either....I'm sure it's his rule, not MY actual doctor who made it...

_________________
Adam Wayne P.
DOB: July 1, 1985
October 8, 2013

RIP little brother. Gone, but not forgotten.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:32 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:01 pm
Posts: 104
Jonathan- what would be the point of bringing back your empty wrappers? The only thing I could think of was to prove you weren't selling them, but if you really wanted to sell them wouldn't you just take them out of the wrappers and keep them for the doctor?

_________________
"always be at war with your vices, and at peace with your neighbors."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 2:49 pm 
Offline
3 Months or More
3 Months or More
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:56 pm
Posts: 96
Doober wrote:
Doctor said he couldn't approve early refill b/c of some regulation, so I'm pretty much screwed. Starting to feel quite a bit more uncomfortable. Freaking out in my head a bit about the days to come. Not sure why he wouldn't do it. My record isnt just good, its perfect - I was astounded, especially since this is the only time in 10 years anything out of the ordinary has occured. I've never had a single relapse since day one, take drug tests every visit and have never failed, never abused meds, have enjoyed a good life until this stupid mistake tossing my meds in the garbage - hope it doesn't jeopardize any of the good things I've worked so hard for over the past decade. Mind you, ive never actually met my doctor, i see his nurse. The nurse felt bad, said shed try talking to him again and promised to call me back - then blew me off and never called, probably because she didnt want to bear bad news a second time.



May I ask what state you're in? Bc even for narcotics I've never had tha problem. Had some pharmacists refuse to fill but then I just go somewhere else. I did a lot of traveling and wanted a half month refill so my appointments would coincide when I would be home but the doc didn't care and just filled early for like 7 months straight.....try to get an actual appoinenr and not do it over the phone...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 3:13 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 8:47 am
Posts: 939
Location: Southeastern US (Alabama)
SqueakyCleanKS wrote:
Jonathan- what would be the point of bringing back your empty wrappers? The only thing I could think of was to prove you weren't selling them, but if you really wanted to sell them wouldn't you just take them out of the wrappers and keep them for the doctor?



Yeah, I'm not sure on that one myself..I've heard of it before, but it doesn't make much sense to me. Personally, it's just something else I gotta keep up with and remember to take, but isn't that much of a problem, except now I have to cut the wrapper a different way, instead of making 3 cuts (1 cut on each side of the film, then a 3rd along the top so I have something to carry it in)...
Now, I just open it by cutting along the edge with scissors, take the film out, and put the empty back in my box that I received from pharmacy.
For them to say "oh, its the FDA, not us" is kinda silly in my mind though...why not be straight and say it's a rule THEY want to have, not the FDA. we all know better.

_________________
Adam Wayne P.
DOB: July 1, 1985
October 8, 2013

RIP little brother. Gone, but not forgotten.


Top
 Profile  
 
   
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 11:20 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
Hey, thanks again for all the helpful advice Amy and everyone else. I agree 100% with what you said Amy, and my thoughts about getting off the meds were exactly as you described.

FiveSeven - I'm in Texas, and the contract I signed says that the doctor will not replace lost (or even stolen) medication.

I'd def like to talk to my doc (his nurse actually) about what happened when I go in next month, but I'm also a little afraid to let them know how negatively this affected me - I don't want them to change anything on me, or even worse, drop me b/c of this situation.

My first doctor was out in California, and I miss him quite a bit. I wish I had someone more empathetic to my situation, someone like Dr. Junig that I could see. In California, my doc was much more like him. He cared about my sobriety, my program, everything. And, when I moved to Texas - It was several months before I found this doctor here. My old doc from California had no problem calling in my refills and allowing them to ship it to me overnight until I found the new doc here in Texas.

I would never get that sort of treatment here, but the one nice thing that they are doing for me - since I've been going there so long, and had a perfect record - they let me come in every three months, and write a prescription for a month with 2 refills each time. So even though they may not be as understanding about things, they do seem to trust me, at least until this situation occurred.

Hopefully, things remain the same or I may need to seek out a new provider.

Thanks again for everyone's replies. And, Jonathan - really sorry to hear about your issue, but glad to hear your doctor took good care of you. The saving your wrappers deal is quite strange though for sure.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 11:24 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
Oh - and a quick update. I'm doing 100% better after having found the 2-day supply. Even spreading them out.

And, Amy - I would def have to take less for a while to have an emergency backup supply, but I think I can do that no problem.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:42 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:39 am
Posts: 4028
Location: Sitting at my computer
I can't believe your doctor didn't call you in more, that's ridiculous.

Anyhow, I'm glad you found a 2 day supply, that's great. Is a day 2 day supply 48mg? If so, you shouldn't have too much trouble cutting down to 8mg or 12mg a day to stretch them out.

_________________
Be kind to yourself. Our character defects do NOT define who we are!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:57 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
Yeah, a 2-day supply for me is six 8mg films, so 48mg is right. I've been taking a half a film per day to stretch it out, and it's working better than I thought it would - probably b/c I went without for nearly two days before I realized I had those available.

And - I must be one of those who has a crazy high metabolism considering how terrible I felt having gone without for such a short time.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:08 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2010 10:39 am
Posts: 4028
Location: Sitting at my computer
Part of the reason it may be working so well is because you know you have no other choice, too. Wd certainly has a mental component to it.

Like Amy said, when you do go back to your doctor and get your script filled, you shouldn't have too much trouble putting some films back and building yourself an emergency stash. Most of us who are or were on Suboxone had some kind of emergency stash.

_________________
Be kind to yourself. Our character defects do NOT define who we are!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:58 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jul 27, 2013 10:28 am
Posts: 666
Doober wrote:
Yeah, a 2-day supply for me is six 8mg films, so 48mg is right. I've been taking a half a film per day to stretch it out, and it's working better than I thought it would - probably b/c I went without for nearly two days before I realized I had those available.

And - I must be one of those who has a crazy high metabolism considering how terrible I felt having gone without for such a short time.



Our stories are very similar except you have been on the Suboxone lots longer than I have. I was also taking 24mgs per day, taking an 8mg film strip 3 times each of those days. I have been on the sub about 3 years.

I wanted off the sub real bad and began tapering my dose without my doctors knowledge. I got the dose down to 2mg and was having problems trying to jump from that dose. Turns out it's a little bit high, and now I'm tapering lower and down to a dose of 1.75mg.

I'm very happy you were able to get your situation straightened out and get a few more subs, but what I wanted to tell you is the fact that I personally noticed no difference whatsoever between taking those high doses of 24mgs than I did taking the 2mg dose. I felt exactly the same on both doses!!! I felt the same on 12 mg, 8mg, 6mg, and 4mg too!!! Might not be the same for you or anyone else, but it sure was for me.

So I came to the conclusion that I was wasting both subs and money taking those high mgs each day. By lowering my dose down, and feeling the same, I was able to stockpile LOTS of subs so I knew I would NEVER run out again. Just a thought here and maybe it would be the same for you too?

I guess if you begin feeling ok on a dose lots lower than the 24mgs you were taking it might prove that is the same for you? I'm not telling you what to do here, only saying what I found out was true in my own case.

Good luck to you and hope you feel better real soon!

Karen
xoxo


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2013 10:52 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:25 pm
Posts: 9
Thanks Karen! Got my medication refilled now, and things are back to my sense of "normal".

How are you tapering at such small increments, 1.75?

I must not be absorbing my medicine properly or something, b/c I notice a HUGE difference when I try to take even a half of an 8mg film, but I made it okay taking a third of one three times per day until I got my refill today.

Any less than a third of a film and it's like I didn't even take anything. If I try to cut a film into fourths to get a 2mg dose, it dissolves super quick b/c it's so small, and seems almost like I didn't take any medication - or it doesn't seem to last any longer than a few hours.

Ever since they switched me from the tablets to the films, I've felt like I'm not getting as much of my medication at the same dosage -- and it even feels stronger than the tablets did when I first take my medicine, but it seems to wear-off much more quickly.

I wish they had never discontinued the tablets, those lasted all day for me, and everything felt more even-keeled instead of these ups and downs since the switch to the films.

How are you taking your medication? Any advice other than - don't talk or drink anything for 10-15 min or so?


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 20 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Our Sponsors
Suboxone Forum latest topics RSS feed Subscribe to the entire forum
 

 

 
Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group