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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 1:35 pm 
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Hello All -

I've been taking Suboxone for about 3 years now. My Dr started me at 16mg/day and now I'm down to 2mg twice a day. Each visit (monthly), he says that if everything in my life is stable, that I should try skipping a dose once a week, but not any more often.

Each of the Dr's visits are $200.

I'm an alcoholic who hasn't had a drink in about 3 years. My wife's father abused things to the point where he wasn't around for her growing up so she hates me for being an addict.

Last night, she said that she had had enough with me spending $200 a month and told me how much I'd "wasted" in the past 3 years. She also said that I was addicted to Suboxone. She looked it up on the internet and found that their site does say that it can be habit forming so that was the last straw for her. She told me that I only took it because I was an addict and because it made me feel good.

She asked to see my bottle which I gave her. She counted out that I had about a week's left (which is about right on schedule.) She first said that I was never going back to a Dr again to get more for my sake and to save the money.
She also said that because of how my "weak" mind works, that she could "give me a sugar pill each day and that I wouldn't notice a difference."

I tried to tell her that I had made progress with cutting back and that I was following the Dr's taper method. She said basically that his taper method was just so that I could have more visits and get him more money. Note: She does not know anything about Suboxone besides what she read online in 15 minutes time.

At one point, she said decide: be an addict and you can have your Suboxone and we'll immediatly get a divorce OR flush them down the toilet and deal with the withdrawls. She said that she read that all that's needed for the withdrawls is a hot bath and patience. - especially at my low dose.

I waited for things to calm down, then she decided to go ahead and give me the amount she saw fit each day.

I usually dose at 7:00am and 1:30pm. This morning, I was working from home and she slept until about 11:30. I came downstairs and she had put about 1mg on the counter. She said "there's you're day's supply." I asked that if we were going to do it this way that we form a plan together. I said I usually take much more and again asked if we could consult a doctor. She said "already you are begging for more." "You are such an addict and have an incredably weak mind."

So here I am. She's pissed, yet has no idea about how powerful Suboxone. I'd really doubt that a sugar pill would substitute, but who knows.

I thought aout calling my Dr, but don't know what to say.

Please give me your thoughts on if it's possible to go through this process easily *even I read that for most it's not) while i try to continue all of my activies including 10-12 hour workdays.

Thank You Very much!


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 2:36 pm 
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Wow...Just, WOW! I'm so sorry your wife is doing that to you. It sounds like you know how wrong she is. For instance, addiction has absolutely nothing to do with a "weak mind". But I think you know that - I HOPE you know that.

I guess you don't need to hear what you already know, that she's being unreasonable and is putting you between a rock and a hard place. So I will tell you the truth: It is possible to stop suboxone where you're at and be okay. There's a post out right now called "6 days off suboxone" that you might want to read. That particular member was really lucky, so it's possible that you'll be lucky, too. But if you're closer to being "normal", you'll suffer withdrawals - clear withdrawals - if you stop at or reduce your dose significantly from 4 mg. With that said, yes, you will still probably be able to work. Distraction and activity help.

I know someone who stopped at 12 mg. I believe she only missed a half day of work. But she did get some comfort meds, like Clonodine. Anyway, many people describe it as a bad cold, but others have a great deal of trouble sleeping as well.

No one can really predict what you'll go through. If it were me, I'd work on educating your wife. Go to Dr. J's blog and start reading and start printing. Help her to understand that addiction is a disease and has nothing to do with strength or willpower.

Personally I think $200 a month is a small price to pay for your life. Oh, and FYI, if your doctor really wanted more money, he would get you off quicker so he could get a brand new patient who requires more appointments and a full induction. Each sub doctor can only have a max of 100 patients after all.

I'm sorry if this post is a bit snide...I think what your wife is doing is cruel and I guess that's come out in my words. So I do apologize. Hang in there. You'll get a lot more responses and maybe others will have more to offer than I.

Please keep us posted on how you're doing. Like I said, hang in there. (Oh and welcome to the forum :) ).

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 3:47 pm 
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Your wife is being very unreasonable and unfair to you. My wife has given me similar resistance over the 3 1/2 years I've been on suboxone but never anything this extreme . I would make an appointment with the 2 of you and your doctor so she can get educated and learn how unhealthy her actions and demands are for your recovery. She's gotta realize that you don't become an addict over night and you def don't recover from addiction overnight. My wife has become a little more understanding now that I'm tapering my dose and an end is in sight. I've been taking 32 mg's pretty much the whole 3 1/2 years I've been on it and now my doc has switched me to the film and I only take 8-12 mg's a day. Maybe your doctor can explain how much progress you've made and how far you've come and how much damage to your recover she can do by acting this way. Please keep us updated whether good or bad news.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 6:02 pm 
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Buddy I'm sorry she is being so unreasonable. I luckily have a very understanding wife, who has had alcohol issues in the past and understands what I am going through.

Its hard for me to suggest what to do, but if I were in your situation, I perhaps would try to educate her and maybe she may understand more of whats going on.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 10:08 pm 
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Hey sorry to hear what your going threw its def a hard thing to go threw. Ive been their with my gf of 5 years when she was at the end of her rope with my oxy use so i know what your going threw in a sense. anyways you may want to set up a meeting with like a drug counselor just so they can inform her whats going on with your sub use an why its taken so long. she has to realize that this drug is your life line to staying clean for now. she may be upset that your on sub spending 200 an month but its a hell of alot better then you going back to useing thats for sure. so just try your best to have some one else inform her what suboxone is for you right now.

id stay away from your dr for this meeting cause she already has it in her head as you stated he just wants money from you so she would go into the meeting with her mind made up. an i saw you said you might call your dr but dont know what to say. id be carefull with this if your thinking of getting script an keeping it a secret cause that could make things really bad it would seem like. AND IM NOT SAYING IN ANY WAY YOU PLANNED ON DOING THIS JUST INCASE YOUR WERE THINKING THAT IS WHY I SAID IT. SO PLEASE UNDERSTAND IM WITH YOU ON THIS.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 10:50 pm 
Are you KIDDING me? She put 1 mg the counter and said, "there's your day's supply"? I mean c'mon, that's degrading - you're an adult, not a 2 year old. Honestly, I would call her bluff and say you chose the divorce. If you're working 10-12 hours a day she's going to be short a lot more than $200 a month if she leaves you.

I went through almost the same thing a couple of months ago with my husband, although his issue was really more about the money, he never said I have a "weak mind". My doctor offered to have him come in for an appointment so he could explain to him the nature of addiction. In my case the whole thing got resloved (long story) and he didn't need to talk to the doctor, but for some people, they really need to learn about addiction from a medical professional.

Even if you do decide to go off Sub, going from 4mg to 1mg a day isn't in your best interest. If it were heart medicine would she suddenly give you 1/4 of your prescribed dose and say that's all you get? Definately talk to your doctor and let him know what's going on. And for God's sake, get your medicine back and take it the way it was prescribed. It sounds like you're doing really well if you've been clean for 3 years and and have tapered from 16mg to 4mg. Why sabotage yourself? You can't take the punishment for her father's alcoholism. It sounds like she's got some pretty big issues and should get some help for herself instead of trying to fix you.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 12:48 am 
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I totally agree with Lily.

What your wife is doing is fucked up and wrong. You are not weak minded, you have an illness. And not only that, but your body is dependent on the medication that you've been taking to treat your illness. She has no idea what might happen if she tries to forcibly lower your dose for you.

Maybe she should read an article about the symptoms of withdrawal, and the lingering hell that PAWS can be.

Also, she needs to take herself to an Alanon or Naranon meeting, STAT. She is not in charge of your recovery, you are.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:02 am 
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Ditto !!!!!!!! Your wife has the problem w/ Suboxone, NOT you... Theres much deeper shit going on here, like she is UNHAPPY and wants you UNHAPPY with her... She wants to control you, she will NEVER be HAPPY about this, either will you , I wish you Good Luck, PS: I'd sneak around for the short time


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:38 am 
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My amateur psychology mind thinks she might be projecting the resentment she harbours towards her own father for abandoning her onto you. And that her desire to "rescue" the addict (you) stems from some maligned freudian attraction towards men with addiction issues.

My partner also had a father with severe addiction issues (he was also violent). Her two previous partners both had addiction issues. She was abusive towards the first one, the hopelessly depressed alcoholic. The second one had the bad boy image coupled with the amphetamine addiction. Neither of them wanted to change. I guess the difference with me is that I want to change, and when she starts to get angry (I call them her "dragon lady" moments), I call her on it.

I can't really give advice. I was going to say find a different wife, but there's potential for her desire to help you to transform into something constructive to your recovery and relationship. It might be controlling and misinformed at the moment, but with some education and honest communication I don't see why she can't be a pillar of strength?

Just don't let yourself get pushed around :)


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:39 am 
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JESUS H FUCKING CHRIST! I cannot believe this woman is doing this to you. This has made me so angry.She thinks that you're taking it for PLEASURE??? She needs educating FAST. I sincerely hope you can work something out between you, but the blackmail implied by the divorce threat makes me wonder. Thank GOD my wife was so grateful for suboxone. She hated me wasting £350 a week (about $700 US I think?) on heroin, that's a far cry from $200 a month for a NECESSITY.
And apologies to all for the bad language, but I won't take it back.Please show these posts from us all to your wife, maybe she will start to understand that suboxone is not the same as alcohol or cocaine. None of us take it for FUN.
Good luck with your continued recovery my friend.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 7:57 am 
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No offense intended here, but your wife is absolutely CLUELESS! I'm sure you value your marriage, but I've gotta tell you if my wife ever pulled something like that, she'd be sleeping at her sister's house that night and from then on, until she got a freaking clue. She is putting your health and in fact your LIFE in jeopardy.

I urge you to have a rational discussion with her about this. OMFG this kind of thing really gets my blood boiling.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 8:59 am 
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I am so thankful for the people in my life! And, I'm so sorry that you are dealing with someone who is totally insane.

Itguy wrote:
At one point, she said decide: be an addict and you can have your Suboxone and we'll immediatly get a divorce

When I read this post, I thought to myself, "Addiction is the least of this man's problems. Honestly, your addiction is being treated, but your wife's issues obviously are not.

I believe that you know how unreasonable your wife is being. I'm married also. I have mostly grown children. I've been on Suboxone for a little more than a year. I don't like that I have a condition that costs my family money and I have to tell myself not to feel guilty. I know that the part of me that can feel guilty about my disease is the part that struggles to let go of the feeling that I've failed somehow because I'm an addict. It seems to me that you face the same struggle (which your wife's attitude reinforces). Otherwise, my friend, why would you have written this post?

The little voice whispering in the back of your head, "She's right. I'm a no-good addict. How dare I take from her and waste our money!" is the same voice that, at the urging of your wife, has a pretty good chance of getting you off Suboxone, withdrawals and all (which there will be). And, it's the same voice that, a few months down the road, could find a way to get you back on your DOC.

Please step back (and out your front door if necessary) and think. If your wife were to tell you, "Your seizure disorder is causing us too much money, it's the seizure medicine or a divorce ...." would you feel a need to post on a forum about it? IMHO, I don't think so. I think that you would have replied, "Whatever! You're nuts. My lawyer will contact your lawyer. And I'll warn you, I want the new flat screen."

Please don't misunderstand my reply. I'm glad that you posted and I'm concerned for you. The guilt and the shame that we feel in being addicts is a hard thing to unlearn. Staying with someone who reinforces that kind of thinking can do nothing but bury us in self-loathing.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:36 am 
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I am absolutely horrified to hear of what you are going through! Your wife is wrong. If you were a diabetic and spending 200.00 on insulin per month, I wonder if she would try to take your insulin away so that she could have the 200. She needs to understand that it is the exact same thing as what she is doing to you. Also, it is against the law, really - for her to take your prescribed medication away from you. It's wrong on so many levels.

As you and everyone here knows, you have a much better chance of getting off of the medication successfully by planning and executing a slow taper with your doctor. I would think that if your wife really loves you she will listen to reason and not do something which would cause you so much stress and discomfort. If not then perhaps you need to look at your relationship and see if it is something that is benefiting the two of you. Many times as one person becomes sober, the other is left behind unless they participate in Al-Anon or ACOA, something like that. She has many issues that she has not dealt with at all, and you are reaping the reward from that. It is not fair to you.

I hope that whatever happens you know that you have support here, and people who care about you. Please let us know how you are doing.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 3:23 pm 
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Some great, and very on target comments for IT Guy. I just hope he will be able to return to read them. Something tells me his wife has taken away his computer and limited his Internet privileges, including blocking this site to keep him from returning.

Seriously, it's bad enough having to fight this awful disease without having to deal with a crazy wife on top of it all. Taking on just one of these issues is a huge undertaking. Having to deal with both of them at the same time has got to be extremely difficult. It has to be done though. We often teach people how to treat us and by allowing your wife to pull this crap, it only reinforces to her that she can. You have to stand up to her and put an end to her stupidity and crazy behavior. The only thing worse than living with a crazy wife for five years is living with a crazy wife for five years and one day... two days... three days... etc.

It's always easier said than done but rather than getting rid of the Suboxone and keeping the wife you likely need to do it the other way around - get rid of the wife and keep the Suboxone. You see, she just has it backwards.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 8:01 pm 
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Lilly wrote:
Are you KIDDING me? She put 1 mg the counter and said, "there's your day's supply"? I mean c'mon, that's degrading - you're an adult, not a 2 year old. Honestly, I would call her bluff and say you chose the divorce. If you're working 10-12 hours a day she's going to be short a lot more than $200 a month if she leaves you.

I went through almost the same thing a couple of months ago with my husband, although his issue was really more about the money, he never said I have a "weak mind". My doctor offered to have him come in for an appointment so he could explain to him the nature of addiction. In my case the whole thing got resloved (long story) and he didn't need to talk to the doctor, but for some people, they really need to learn about addiction from a medical professional.

Even if you do decide to go off Sub, going from 4mg to 1mg a day isn't in your best interest. If it were heart medicine would she suddenly give you 1/4 of your prescribed dose and say that's all you get? Definately talk to your doctor and let him know what's going on. And for God's sake, get your medicine back and take it the way it was prescribed. It sounds like you're doing really well if you've been clean for 3 years and and have tapered from 16mg to 4mg. Why sabotage yourself? You can't take the punishment for her father's alcoholism. It sounds like she's got some pretty big issues and should get some help for herself instead of trying to fix you.



I agree here.... Seriously! Call her bluff and tell her to give you your MEDICATION back. Tell her that once she educates HER weak mind, then the two of you may reconcile your differences, but until then, YOUR health comes first, not her unreasonable, uneducated and clueless demands. GAWD I hate stupid, closed minded people with no sympathy or consideration for people, especially those whom they "love."

Lilly is right, you ain't her father.... And SHE ain't YOUR mother. Demand she give you back your meds, tell her to seriously educate herself and not just read some one-sided bullshit that she wants to hear. It sounds as if she was looking for some place on the net that says you're an addict and weak and blah blah blah so she could use that against you. Drag her ass to the computer and let her read more into than the stupid shit she's pulled together to make her argument.

I'd go tell her ass right now to give you the pills and get the fuck out. Those are YOUR demands. Your addiction, your money, your life, you're in control. She can go cry on her BFF's shoulder on how mean you are while you continue to heal. She'll be back. I guaran-damn-tee you she will. I'd also make her go to the doctor with you the next time. Maybe she'll grow a fucking heart.

Sorry... Shit like this makes my blood boil. Image


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 10:41 am 
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Hello All -

I apologize for not responding to the replies written. I did read them, though, and can't describe how much I appreciate not only getting to tell my story, but getting input about it. Since then, a lot has happened. There's even a new par tof the story I just found out about today. Here's the latest...

For about 10 days, my wife sat out bits of pills on the counter. I physically and mentally (to be honest) felt horrible and honestly scared. Even though I'm sure that the worst symptom was phycological, the lack of energy and diarea were tops physically.

I played it cool after the initial argument to let her calm down. i tried to talk to her a couple of times every couple of days but she wouldn't budge. I knew where she had the pills hidden, as I saw her get them once when I really didn't mean to be looking. I opened the bottle just to see what was left but never took anything from it.Finally after about 10 days, I asked if we could talk about it again. Without argument, she went and got the pills out of "hiding", gave them to me, and said that she was sick of dealing with it. It had been 2 weeks past my scheduled appointment for a refill. Even though I had tapered a lot, I still had a small amount left.

After 4 days of trying to make that small amount last, I knew I had to choice but to call my doctor and schedule an appt. I believe this was a Wednesday. I described the entire situation, but he said he was booked up and no exceptions. I waited a couple of days and still no open spots. On Friday, he said that he could meet me in my home town on Saturday. it's about 45 min away from his office, but he lives in the same town. He said to meet him at Starbucks at noon and that it would be an extra $50 for the visit as it was afterhours / weekend. This seemed like a sceme to me, but I didn't have a choice - guess he knew that. I went. He was an hour late, but still we talked for about 20 minutes about the situation. He was writing the script for what I had been given before, when I said that due to my taper, that half the amount would be fine. Therefore, he scripted 1/2 of the small pill (now know they are 2mg) twice daily.

I told my wife about the appt. She was more mad than ever. I just said that it was nessesary and she eventually got over it but said that I then had enough to quit. I should have then, but took them as prescribed. We haven't really talked about the topic since as I guess in her mind she thought it would be the last visit.

I took this for the next month and finally felt that my body "evened out." I established a plan with myself to quit in two months after much research. I tapered down a bit more but knew that I'd have to have 1 more appt. Last Thursday, I went to get what I considered my last script. I didn't tell the Dr this, though, as I didn't know how he'd react and lecture me about quitting too soon. I had had enough grief over this whole mess, though. He showed me the new films, showed me how to use them, and that was it. Unfortunatly, I did this without my wife knowing. I hate that I had to do that and feel really bad about it.

I wish that I could say here "wish me luck" or whatever else, but the next part is the kicker.

I started taking the films last Friday - 5 days ago - 1/2 a film as prescribed. Since then, I've kinda noticed that my sex drive had gone down. This has always been an issue for me since taking Suboxone - never was before at all - especailly for a guy in early 30s! I also started feeling kinda dizzy at times, but didn't give it much thought.

Over the past 2 years, you'd think that I would have paid attention to what strengths I was prescribed. I just never gave it much thought. I refered to them in my head as the big pills and small pills. When the Dr switched me over to the film a few days ago, he had prescribed me the one equal to a big pill. Therefore, for the past 5-6 days, I've gone from my taper down dose of under 1mg twice a day to about 4mg twice a day - 4 times the amount!!!!

I found this out this morning as I was in the shower thinking of my symptoms and it just didn't add up. As soon as I got out of the shower, I Googled "Suboxone strengths" on my phone and found this out.

Right now I'm mad and frustrated. A lot of the HARD, HARD, HARD work that I've done has gone out the window. I'm sure that since I've only been doing it 5 days, that it won't be as hard as when I was on it for a couple of years - at least I hope - but how much easier will it be if any? I've only called the Here To Help line once before to ask about the sexual side effects, but already tried calling them this morning to ask but they were closed. I haven't called my doctor yet. I wanted to talk to someone - anyone about it first. Unfortunatly, my wife can't be one of them. i guess that's my payback for not telling my wife about the last visit.

The good thing, I guess, is that if it's easy to come off the higher strenghth after a week of use, then I'll have an ample supply to taper off to the end.

Why can't I win for once?

Thanks all for listening and any comments. They are much appreciated. i promose to reply as I'm going to be on here much more now .

Thank you again -


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 1:34 pm 
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wow, I know I am late but I just read through this whole post......

I am SO sorry you have had to go through this. I don't know how I would go through it without my husbands support.

The part about losing your sex drive.....Hmm, how could you have a sex drive with the way your wife is treating you? I just am not too convinced this is a side effect. Just reading how she has threatened you and controlled/or tried to control you makes me mad!

I really hope I didn't cross a line.......but I am just really sorry this has been such a hard road you have had to go down

Jessica

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 3:19 pm 
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Thank you for your post.

I don't believe you crossed a line at all. I created the post because I wanted to hear opinions and suggestions.

I left a message with my doctor to call me without saying the issues as well as calling the Suboxone Here To Help line. I haven't heard back from the Dr. yet and the Here To Help line wasn't any help at all about the x4 dose. I'm kinda freaking out because of all the work I've done to get as far as I did.

Please keep commenting / posting... Thanks!


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 08, 2010 5:04 pm 
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First off. Sexual side effects are common with any opiate. Not all people have them. But they are common. I'm glad she gave you your pills back. Sorry I am late coming into this. I was very angry at what she did. Only YOU control your recovery. I would never let anyone touch my subs, let alone control my dose. The films are definatley different. They where different for me. I was on the pills for almost 2 years. I tried the films for a month. And I went back to pills this month. I think your wife needs alot of education about addiction and recovery. And it sounds like she may have control issues. Keep your head up. And always communicate with your doctor about any side effects. You have 2 choices with your wife as I see it. She can either get educated and support you. Or just maybe you need to take a break so you can focus on yourself and your recovery. I wish you the best of luck. Maybe you should show your wife all of this thread. To show her that her behavior was not good.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:41 pm 
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I agree with JP, that you should show your wife this thread! Well, maybe not...I am guessing it would only cause a fight and more stress.

I do not understand how your doctor gave you higher mg than you were taking without telling you. I am so sorry that happened. I personally felt no difference when switching to the films but I stayed at the same dose. I was told it was the same as the pill and would affect me the same which I assumed anyway. At first I was thinking I might "feel" different since in my head I knew it was a different looking medicine but I was happy when I felt the same!

I just hope this gets straightened out for you...we all care and support you!

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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

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