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PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:13 pm 
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I have been taking Suboxone for about 9 months now and I've noticed that the pills are different sometimes. By that I mean that when I first starting getting them the pills were very soft and very easy to break in half, with a good orange taste and they made me feel normal with a little bit of extra energy. But the last few times I have picked up my prescription the Suboxone has been very hard and not easy to break at all, they have a terrible taste and worst of all they make me feel awful. I'm so tired I feel like a zombie, with terrible headaches and I'm really dizzy. The pills look the exact same and are from the same manufacturer. Any ideas on why they are so different?? I was wondering if maybe they are old?? Any ideas would be appreciated!!


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 15, 2008 1:57 pm 
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I wish suboxdoc could answer this cause I have the same "problem". Some times it's like they don't even work! Any thoughts?


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:34 am 
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After some observation and hassle at the pharmacy (I had to keep calling very month pre-visit to make sure that they had it in stock) I believe that they go stale and then I believe that they don't work as well. Just an observation.
-Me


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:35 am 
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I meant to spell EVERY MONTH not very. My bad. -LOL


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 1:37 am 
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Hey guys - just a quick question . . .

I have been on Subs for approximately 9 months now. I started on 24mg/day and am now on 2mg/day. This last dr. visit, I felt I was ready to go down to 1mg a day, and so my dr prescribed me 30 2mg tabs. When I started getting down to 1 mg, I noticed I was feeling horrible and that my body was still having a hard time adjusting to only 1 mg a day. So, naturally I went back up to 2mg's a day and ran out early. Not wanting to call my dr and make an appt early, I decided to cold-turkey it for a few days, feeling that I would be okay...(bad idea).

I was withdrawling from Subs for nearly 3 days straight, taking nothing and hardly being able to sleep or do much of anything. Finally, on the 3rd day, after not being able to take it, I called my dr and made an appt. I informed him of what happened and he said that I should have told him this before, and put me back on 2mg/day. When I got home and took 1 mg, I immediately felt the w/d's fade away. However, later that night, when it came time to take another 1 mg I noticed that I could not longer feel it like I used to - it wasn't having the same effect. I figured it was because my body was still getting used to it.

Now, 5 days after getting back on Subs after w/d from it for 3 days straight, I am still not able to feel it at all. I am not withdrawling per se, but I am not feeling much of anything as I did prior to being off of it for 3 days. Does my body just need to re adjust to it again, or is it because I am taking too much? My last dose was 3.5 mgs, and I still feel nothing at all!

Any help would be appreciated, and thanks in advance. God bless.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 4:57 am 
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I have also noticed that when the pills seem to be stale or harder to break that they have a totally different taste and that don't seem to work as well. It is very strange that this is happening. They need to find a better way to store the meds so this doesn't happen. I hate to pay for them and half or near all of them don't seem to work the way I know they can. But who knows it could all be in my head.

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Suboxone Saved My Life....


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 Post subject: Feeling from Sub??
PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 9:17 pm 
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In response to the post by S1thari, I'm confused. What "feeling" are you missing? What had you been feeling? Are you chasing a "high"?
The reason I don't understand is because I have been on Sub for approx. three (3) months now and I have not felt anything since the very first day.
Well, I guess I have felt something. Freedom. Freedom from chasing anything other than the high I now feel for life and a clear mind. Just curious.
TJ


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 10:31 pm 
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I agree these meds are not made to give you a high or a buzz. They are to help you get over your addiction. If you are taking them to get a buzz you may as well still be doing street drugs.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:43 am 
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I was talking about the effectiveness not a feeling really. Although I do feel a lil "punch" after my dose in the morning but I been on them for 6 years now and know when they're different.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:45 am 
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Six Years? Have you tried backing off or trying to quit all together?

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:29 am 
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I've been on Suboxone for 6 years too and have no intention at all to "get off" them. Not any time soon at least and my doctor agrees completely.

Foy


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 8:34 am 
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Are you joking? Thats not what this stuff is for man. All you have done is trade addictions. That is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I have only been on Suboxone for about Six months and I am almost done. I only take 1/2 an 8mg a day and I am taking Subs because I had a 240mg+ OC a day habit! You dont want to stop taking it. Its all in your head. You just need to be taking some kind of pill. I know people that took subs for a few years and they had a hard time stopping but then the DR told them to start taking vitamins and it helped them to back off. Just taking some type of pill is all they needed. Its all in your head. Trust me I know. I have a pretty decent medical background. Im sure this message is going to get a bunch of people fired up but, those are the ones that dont ever want to stop taking the Suboxone and crap!

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:58 am 
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Not fired up at all. Everybody is entitled to their opinion. I'm sure you are aware the doctor that owns this site has spoke at length on this issue. His position is the same as my doctor's and both have strong feelings against ill-informed, judgemental "advice" such as yours.

I do agree with you that at some point I will stop taking Suboxone. But I think it is a whole lot better to treat my pain like this than the abusive way I was doing it with Oxycontin.

I appreciate your words of encouragement but I think I will continue to follow the professional opinion of my doctor.

Foy


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 1:16 am 
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Foy:

If it works for your pain thats a great thing. It did for mine, and it worked quite well. I was pleasantly suprised.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 1:35 am 
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I did not post that to try to get anyone upset. Also I am not just your average junkie that had to stop and started the Suboxone program. I have been in the Health Care field for Five years. I have read a pretty good bit on this subject. My sister is also a M.D. and from everything she has read, heard from coworkers is that the average time physicans try to end the program is 9-10 months. I myself do not want to have to depend on any type of meds to get through the day. I know that many people are using the Suboxones as a "Replacement" for the street drugs. I am by no means trying to tell anyone how to take the meds. I am just telling what I have read, heard from many doctors,studied, etc. All I know is that Suboxone helped save my life! So glad that it has kind of replaced the use of Methadone. That stuff is the DEVIL!!!

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 Post subject: Methadone
PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 3:54 am 
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I never took Methadone, is it really that bad? I have a friend that takes it for pain (10mg) and he said its the best thing he's ever had and swears by it. I told him "yeah, say that when you stop taking it, I hear horror stories about it". I don't really know much about it other than that it was invented in Nazi Germany but they didn't use it because of withdrawal in soldiers, it also is a MNDA(?) receptor agonist(?) (Like PCP, Ketamine), and has a horrible withdrawal from what I've read.

Just curious. A pain doc almost put me on it months ago (the same pain doc my friend sees, he seems to love putting people on Methadone, probably because they have to stay on it).


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 Post subject: long-term Suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:36 pm 
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It is pretty clear what the 'dynamics' are with the debate over Suboxone. I talk about this issue quite a bit, as the prior posts describe. My goal with the blog and this forum is to help prevent what I see happen so often-- people who are doing great on Suboxone will feel like they are doing something wrong for staying on it-- when in fact there is no reason for them to feel that way. The comment that 'it isn't supposed to be used that way' is simply not true. I have been trained to teach other docs in the use of Suboxone, and I am very familiar with the literature related to the use of the medication. Initially there was more talk of using Suboxone as a 'tapering tool', but over time a couple things happened; first we realized that it is perhaps easier to use other meds to taper than Suboxone, because of the high potency of the drug. More importantly, people who use Suboxone short-term have a high incidence of relapse-- no surprise to anyone who understands that addiction is NOT about just getting past the withdrawal, but rather is an illness that comes back-- or more accurately never leaves.

My hope is that eventually people will use Suboxone to treat addiction just as they use a beta blocker to treat hypertension. We don't tell people with high blood pressure that they HAVE to lose weight, because the med is stopping in one year! And so I think that the pressure to 'get over addiction and stop Suboxone' is a 'fool's errand'; I watch all of these people tapering down, relapsing, restarting, tapering again-- all the time feeling more and more like losers! I want MY patients to realize that they have an ILLNESS-- it is NOT THEIR FAULT-- yes, they are responsible for the consequences of addictive behavior, but they don't DESERVE to feel like 'bad people'.

If a person takes Suboxone for 6 years, or 10, or 20-- and it helps the person lead a meaningful, full life-- that is GREAT. The person who refused Suboxone, and who had multiple relapses that cost him his family, his health, his career, and his freedom-- congratulations on avoiding Suboxone!
:!:


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:53 pm 
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Well, I'm not here to one up somebody in a forum with a useless argument that I know from experience, will not end well.

I found it extremely compelling to read about another addiction doctor arriving at the same conclusions that my doctor did. We started out with conversations like; "well, this will probably be your last perscription" and things like that. I agreed with this course of therapy then, and now it is the reverse; him telling me he thinks it would be a bad idea to stop taking Suboxone - and for all the exact reasons Dr. Junig has given. Two doctors with nothing to do with each other, with dissimilar backgrounds, separately arriving at the same conclusion.

It would be real nice if more people got it but for me, it is enough that my doctor gets it. My heart goes out to all the posts I read about care givers lacking in empathy. The required eight hour course (or whatever it is) to be a prescribing doctor probably falls far short in that regard.

Foy


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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2009 2:31 am 
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Reading the forum, I noticed some people are addicted to suboxone, some people are abusing drugs and alcohol while still taking their legally prescribed suboxone (but only when they run out of their "oxys"), BUT there are also those other people who are doing great on the medication for years.

Everyone is different. There are many factors to consider in keeping someone on it for a long period of time. One size does not fit all. It may be appropriate to keep a one patient on long term suboxone treatment but inappropriate for another patient.

I was surfing the net a few months back. Just for you all to consider this as you are taking suboxone long term: I think it was in Singapore, Suboxone used to be legal there for treatment of opiate dependence for many years. Then recently, they made it illegal for any one to receive suboxone. They allowed a few months for patients to get off the drug, then they prosecute heavily thereafter for any suboxone use.

Just be careful. What's legal today may not be legal tomorrow. Medical opinions change frequently, so do political and legal climate.

I always tell people who are on high dose controlled substances, it may be easy for you to get your medications now from your current doctor, but what if that doctor moves or gets in trouble with the DEA? Finding a new doctor to prescribe high dosages of Xanax and Oxycontin isn't always easy. So, some people become not only dependent on their drugs but also on their doctors.


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 Post subject: off subject
PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 11:34 pm 
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hey we got off subject......well you guys did I was just reading hoping there would be advice for why suboxone "goes bad". I've found that the cotton that goes in a pill bottle, or the moisture absorber in excedrin bottles is great to put in your Rx bottle to keep out moisture, I do now that it's summer. Just a thought


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

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