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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:40 pm 
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This is an extension of a previous thread that was locked, as I didn't have a chance to reply to razor.

I tend to rotate my stockpile of Suboxone so as to minimise my consumption of expired films. This is mainly because there still is a question mark surrounding the potential toxicity of some of naloxone's breakdown products.

The buprenorphine itself seems to be fine, and will work long past its expiry date. But I read a document some time ago that claimed naloxone can break-down / oxidise quite easily into 7,8-didehydronaloxone, which is potentially genotoxic (ie could cause damage to DNA).

I don't think there's any reason to be alarmed, because you gotta consider the risk relative to the other toxic compounds we're exposed to on a daily basis. I doubt taking a Sub film past its expiry date would be anywhere near as genotoxic as say, smoking a cigarette. Or even less than potentially eating unwashed fruit with traces of pesticides on them.

But given how easy it is to rotate one's stockpile, I still make it a habit. It's minimal effort, and might only make a tiny difference, but it's still something I do.

Apparently the modern lifestyle exposes us to a number genotoxic compounds on a daily basis, and this may be why over recent decades Western men's sperm count is half what it was in the early 1970's. So I do little things to minimise those risks, like avoiding overprescription of medication, washing the fruit I eat, and rotating my stockpile of Sub films.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:47 pm 
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That was the only reason I felt bad about locking the thread, TJ. I figured that you would find a way, however. I was just pretty sure that the "new" poster on the thread wasn't actually new.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:38 am 
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Hey TeeJay,

In the locked thread, in my last post, in the first link, is an article and w in it contains links. One is to the 2006 study on US FDA and US Dept of Defense Shelf Life Extension Program. It lists Naloxone HCL injectable with an additional 77 months shelf extension time. I'm curious on what you read on naloxone's breakdown but wanted to mention that the 2006 article does show Naloxone HCL injectable, safely stored, is stable for an add'l 77 mos post expiry. They did find liquids had less shelf life than solids. How tho, this relates to naloxone in film form, IDK.

Makes sense tho, to rotate especially given its minimal effort! P

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 4:27 am 
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I just googled and found the old document.

https://www.tga.gov.au/sites/default/files/auspar-suboxone.pdf

It's buried midway through those pages. Apparently naloxone is less stable in film form than in the tablet. Unsure how this would relate to naloxone in liquid form.

Also my country's TGA have a reputation as being a bit more "paranoid" about health and toxicity than America's FDA, and set lower thresholds for toxic levels for things often.

Maybe I'm paranoid, but I figure it isn't too hard to rotate.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 4:42 am 
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TeeJay wrote:
Also my country's TGA have a reputation as being a bit more "paranoid" about health and toxicity than America's FDA, and set lower thresholds for toxic levels for things often. Maybe I'm paranoid, but I figure it isn't too hard to rotate.


I don't think that is paranoid at all. In fact it makes perfect sense and shows that you are serious about treating your body in a different way than you probably did in active addiction. I wish my government would be more conservative when it comes to allowing certain things in to our medications and food chain. There have been way too many chemicals and drugs that were recalled after finding harmful side effects. It could be debated on an individual basis whether or not they knew about these side effects but that would take a level of honesty that you rarely seem to find in such a lucrative business as food & drug.

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