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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:18 pm 
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This forum has a pro-suboxone viewpoint and it always has. It was created because Dr. Junig wanted to counteract some of the negativity and incorrect information he was noticing online. Since the earlier days we have added sections like "Stopping Suboxone" and "Freestyle", and we already had "Side Effects" to give people a chance to be negative about sub when they needed to be and to receive help and support if they wanted to taper off.

There are many members who don't drop in every day because they are busy living their lives now that they aren't in active addiction. But sometimes, when they do drop in, they get discouraged that there seems to be a lot of negativity about the drug that has improved their lives so much. Usually that is because "Stopping Suboxone" is a really active section of our forum and a lot of the newer posts are in that section. Some of the people trying to taper off, or jump off bupe are very angry at the drug. They blame the bupe when really they are angry at their addiction. Now, the mods know that this is a stage that some folks going off bupe go through. They might be angry for a few months and then most of them come back and say, "I couldn't have quit my drug of choice without bupe and it was tough to get off, but I'm not angry anymore." However, while they were angry, they are still affecting the members reading the forum who can get a little overwhelmed by all the negativity.

Now, part of my job as a mod is to make sure that the forum stays balanced. So when people are getting off bupe we try to remember to give them a little leeway if they are pissed at the drug. But one area where we mods try to be clear is that we don't allow the people who are going off bupe to start to imply that they are going to be "completely sober", which are the words you used. When you say that you're ready to be completely sober that implies that those who choose or need to stay on bupe are not completely sober. And while you say that you are just speaking about yourself, that is not what comes across to our members who are sick of the negativity that sometimes comes from "Stopping Suboxone" and "Bupe in the Rearview Mirror." I recognize very well that this issue is not black and white because the line I walk is sometimes straddling some difficult territory.

Fortunately you don't have to approve of all the decisions I make, even if they are a little anal about certain subjects. You can choose to be offended that I changed a word of your statement or you can realize that I'm just being a little protective of the members here who don't have the choice right now to go off bupe and who don't want to hear from yet another source's opinion that they are not completely sober.

I am taking Psychopharmacology of Alcohol and Drugs in grad school right now, so I do recognize the biochemical changes that take place within the body of someone taking bupe. The more I learn about how various drugs interact with our receptor sites and the resulting possible changes in physiology, mood, and behavior, the more I learn that there are a bunch of reasons that individual people react very differently to the exact same dose of the same drug. These differences can occur because of age, metabolism, genetics, etc. And this is exactly why we do encourage people to speak from their own personal experience, not in generalities. Because one person's 3 mg of bupe with no mental effects or personality change can feel the same as another person's 0 mg of bupe. When I went on sub the only change I felt was that I no longer had an obsession and craving for percocet. I've never felt any mental impairment. My case is just an example of what I'm talking about.

As for Dr. Junig, please leave him alone, when you're upset at just me. He is a very busy person and he doesn't micromanage his mods. He is not receiving any kind of monetary or material gain for having this website (nor are the mods). He spent his own money creating and running this site just to help people on bupe. The ads that pop up on this site come up for the same reason Google will show you ads for things you've been searching. The makers of bupe products have no financial stake in this forum.

I'm not going to tell you how to feel, but please know that the people who have responded to your taper thread are very genuine about helping you and making you feel welcome here. I'm the only one here that will bother you with a one word edit of your post. :)

Amy

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2015 10:09 am 
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I agree with Amy. There were a lot of statements in ur post that made me want to defend myself on the fact of if I'm clean or not because I use suboxone. I don't think any of us want to hear that challenged. I respect anyone else who feels differently though, but the way u said it was pointing towards none of us being sober as long as we're on bupe. I'm sure ur very strong and passionate and that's a wonderful admirable thing. All of us have our own individual belief when it comes to recovery.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2015 2:05 pm 
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Hi Amy,

Thanks for your thoughts. I am going through a difficult time with getting off this medication and I'm sorry for coming off as angry. It's an emotional process and any frustration I feel is not meant to be an attack on suboxone.

I apologize if I have offended anyone's recovery when I used the phrase "finally sober". I wish I had understood the context of this forum and posted it in a more appropriate section. When I attend SMART meetings and know that there are individuals in the room who are on suboxone I avoid using expressions like that precisely for the reasons you stated Amy. I appreciate that you took the time to explain patiently where you are coming from and without resentment. I regret for saying that as I know there are plenty more people who read these forums than who actually post, which is to say many eyes land here. I would hate to be that "anonymous person online" who has a negative impact on a person's recovery. A life-saving medication should be discussed with sensitivity.

Again, I apologize if I offended anyone or have caused anyone to feel differently about their recovery. If you are on suboxone, please follow the advice of your doctor and what's best for your recovery, not how someone like myself might come off as during a difficult taper. Amy, if you feel it would be best to remove my message I won't take any offense. I definitely don't want to be a negative influence in another person's recovery, even if slightly. Good luck to everyone in their recovery!


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2015 11:52 pm 
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Dhalia, thank you so much for being willing to see things from a different point of view. That shows real maturity on your part and makes me even more glad that you are on our forum. :)

I'm so sorry you're having a difficult time as you are going through a fairly swift taper. As I mentioned, it is very common to get angry at the sub because for some folks it's a very difficult process getting off of it. If and when I decide to taper off sub I will have learned so much from the others who have gone before me, and I will definitely rely on members for support and guidance. I hope that your thread is providing you with the support that you need.

I would like to keep your message here as it is an appropriate post for this section, but I appreciate your offer to have it taken down. Your sensitivity to other members is very much appreciated. It seems that you understand that my edit of words wasn't personal. I'm so glad that we can be friends now that we understand each other better.

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Amy

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 10:01 pm 
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Hi Amy,

Thank you for your kind response! I am also glad that I was able to see this from your perspective and that we can be friends :) . Thanks again for your patience with helping me understand.

Also, just wanted to add this was a little learning experience for me in being more conscientious with how I come off online. Communicating via a screen can be quite alienating at times and I have to remember to challenge that distance by being every bit as empathetic as I would in real person. I really appreciate how you were able to bring that to my awareness.

I will keep updating my taper journal once I make some significant progress. It's definitely been quite the ups and downs this month so I am going to taper slower which will certainly help with my mood. Thank you for the good luck! Take care,

Dhalia :)


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2016 8:59 pm 
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Made me angry, didn't want this in my life


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
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