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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 11:05 pm 
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I am currently almost 41 weeks. I'm being induced Monday. It is currently Friday. I have struggled with this my entire pregnancy. I told my OBGYN about my addiction to suboxone and she said that because I was on so little I could ween myself off. I've weened off quite a bit but I feel like PURE shit going without and I don't even know how my baby feels.. I would just like to know, does the hospital drug test before or after the delivery? And how does cps work? Are they called immediately? If I go 3 days without will I be clean?? I need some serious help :(


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 11:25 pm 
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Hi Babygirl

I can only answer for NY, yes they drug test every mother & baby. One of the reason's is to know what a person has in their system in case of an emergency. If your OB knows and she left you to taper yourself she/he will learn that a true addict needs help/support to taper. Especially when pregnant with hormones going all over the place. I can't imagine how hard that would be.

This is not being said in a mean way but imho before you deliver the doctor should be told the truth. If they don't know and somehow it doesn't show up, you and your baby will have w/d' from the sub. Something to think about.

It is also my humble opinion that if you are honest and cps is called they will respect you for being honest. I am actually involved with cps right now-I am a grandmother with custody of my 9 month old grandson. Initially the judge & law guardian were flipping out that I was on sub but as they got to know me they are fine with me now. I am just a "normal" person to them. If you have safe and clean living space for you both & are honest I don't think it will be a big deal. they may monitor you for a few months but they don't just take baby's if other things are good.

Please post again, let us know how you are and after Monday let us know all the details about your baby like weight, height etc.

Hugs to you
Em


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 12:12 pm 
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Hi bg,

Tiki gave some good advice, but I think it will definitely depend on what state you are in. Some are tougher on mothers with drugs of any kind in their systems than others. I believe the biggest issue for you is going to be that you don't have a prescription. It might be impossible this late in the game, but getting in with an addiction doctor to get a valid prescription would be your best bet. I've never heard of them turning away a pregnant mother. You might want to make some emergency calls today to anyone who will prescribe it and tell them your situation.

As for the wd's for the baby, it really depends on your dose. How much are you currently taking? I hope you are planning on breastfeeding. If you do, it may keep your baby out of wd's. A small amount of your dose will cross the barrier and be delivered in your breast milk. We have had threads here about that before, you can do a quick search and find some good info. Also, you might want to check out Dr. J's page. You can click the link on the index page that says suboxone talk-zone and find it. I know he has some articles posted there about suboxone and pregnancy.

I wish you the best of luck Babygirl. I know it is a scary situation, but odds are if you work with cps things will turn out well for you. Please keep us updated on how things turn out, ok?

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:19 pm 
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Thank you all for your support. my dose was usually 2mg but I have cut WAY back from that also. I would say probably to .5 mg a day just to keep from feeling so restless. Without it I have absolutely no energy and my muscles ache terribly. This pregnancy was unplanned and I just feel SO bad for even being in this situation. :( it is especially unfair to my baby girl. I want her to be healthy. I have read through millions of threads in this forum and it has helped me out so much, as far as support. But I haven't really came across anyone in my position.. I've read a lot of positive things about babies being born on subtext and suboxone. That eases my mind quite a bit as far as her health goes. I really do hope she is okay. Im terrified of cps. I have family coming in from out of town everywhere to be here when she is born, and I don't have the slightest clue how cps will be. I know they will barge in with questions but will they come to my house and tell my family? I wish I could just pee clean so I wouldn't have to worry about cps but even the tiniest bit in my system will show up. I don't know if they will be understanding. My family especially won't be understanding.. Even though it is last minute is it possible I could go to the sub clinic and explain my situation? Will they help me? I'm going to be so judged by everyone :( I just don't know what to do. And I have 2 days left. I can't wait to see my baby and hold her. But this whole situation just has me stressing out, ruining everything. :( I wish I would have just quit like my OB told me to.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:37 pm 
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Hi BG,

You can't do that to yourself. I'm sure you wish you could have "just quit", but if you could have done it so easily I'm sure you would have. We are all here, on this forum, for the same reason. We are addicted, and we can't just quit. Yes, there are going to be people like your OB who don't get it. But's it's not that simple.

I wish that I could tell you exactly what is going to happen with CPS, but I really have no idea. The good news is that more than likely your baby is going to be born with little to no symptoms from the small dose you have been taking. Try to keep in mind that you have done the best you could to stay sober during your pregnancy. How much worse would it have been if you had still been in active addiction while you were pregnant?

As for getting in with a sub doctor...I think the hardest part would be getting an appointment on such short notice. I don't think you will have much trouble convincing a dr. of your need for the medication. Normally, addiction doctors will go out of their way to make sure an addicted mother gets treatment during her pregnancy. You don't have much time left, but I would at least give it a shot.

Make a few calls and see what you can do. Hopefully someone else will comment with some better suggestions for you. My heart really goes out to you and your baby. I hope things will work out okay with CPS...but you need to be honest up front. I think it will look much better on you in the long run if you explain it up front rather than trying to cover it up.

Q

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 9:04 pm 
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Thank you so much qhorsegal2. It has really helped me a lot having this forum. Almost every question I have had has been answered here somewhere. Except for this situation I am in. I should have called a sub doctor a long time ago. I just really thought I could deal with this myself. I guess I will try to call them anyway and at least tell them my story. Maybe they can help. If not I suppose I will just be honest with CPS and just really hope that they don't judge me too harshly. Or worse, try to take my baby away. In my favor I do have a lovely home. I am married and my husband has a good job. I'm currently out of work but I will return where my husband also works after being home with my baby. So hopefully they will see we are determined parents. And I just hope everything turns out well. I'd rather not have people in my family know about cps. But I guess the cat will be out of the bag, seeing how my dad is living with us. But I will be sure to keep updating!


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 9:26 pm 
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I'm really sorry for your situation, BG! I wish there were more we could do to help!

Does your husband at least know about your sub use? You really need someone in your corner. If the medical staff gets pushy by insisting that your baby needs to be on morphine, despite a lack of NAS symptoms, you may need someone to advocate for you both. I really hope he is supportive of your situation.

I have a friend who had a baby on sub and she had to be quite strong with the pediatrician about not putting her baby on morphine. She demanded that she be there every time they scored him for NAS symptoms. She did not let them take him off to the nursery for that very reason. She has a lawyer for another issue and she had to threaten to call him to make sure that the pediatrician let her leave the hospital with her baby.

I don't mean to scare you, but there is a lot of judgement directed at delivering moms on sub. I think you should tell your OB the situation and then I suggest you do the same thing as my friend did. Read up on NAS testing and what all the scores mean. Don't let your baby leave the room for any reason other than an emergency. That is your right! Or insist on sending your husband with the baby. Make sure the nurses/pediatrician knows that you are educated about the signs of NAS. Ask them why they scored the way they did if the score seems off. Take a picture of the score. Document everything, especially if you feel they are scoring in a biased way. Of course, if your baby is showing NAS symptoms, you will want them to treat her with morphine. But don't let them medicate her just because you are on sub. Definitely nurse her.

Let us know how it goes! I'm hoping for the best possible result!

Amy

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2014 8:03 pm 
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I saw your post on my thread! I know you are about to be induced tomorrow!

I really wish you the best of luck. Can you post your state or PM it to me and I can check out some information on drug testing through a resource I found to find out each state's policies as of 12/1/14. I will continue to check back today to see if you let me know, so I can be sure to get the info for you. I know that I can be clean of bup by the time I deliver (unless I went into early labor), but I am concerned about the meconium testing which goes back to week 20, so I understand your fear with the drug testing!

People do not understand that we are not abusing suboxone. We used it to get clean. A lot of people (including my family) do not understand that. It's scary to think that our families could find out when we give birth. I am very nervous about that too. If CPS did get involved, I will be so embarrassed. My family has done so much for me as far as painting baby's room, buying furniture, clothing, etc. My mother comes to each appt with me. She will be so angry and shocked if she knew I was using suboxone. I know her views on it. Hopefully, if CPS did come to either of our hospital rooms, we could ask that the family be removed if anyone is near so that we can talk privately and be in control of explaining the situation to them.

I wish you luck tomorrow! Please try to relax. I have read most states don't drug test every patient, but a few do. Is there any reason for them to test you? Some places only test if they suspect withdrawal from the baby, or some places if the patient is "at-risk". Some reasons you could be "at risk" may be if you have admitted to any past drug use, if you are on any state assistance, if they know of any past STDs or current STDs you have, if you got late prenatal care or didn't know you were pregnant late into the pregnancy, or if you went into pre-term labor (which you definitely aren't!) or the baby was measuring small.

Please let me know! I would really like to know everything that happens with you so I might know when I deliver. If CPS did come to talk to you, I would just be very kind to them (not defensive), explain why you use suboxone (maybe even print out some info on it to bring to the hospital just in case), and let them know you would be willing to do anything it takes to prove you are drug-free. Say you do not abuse drugs, and would be willing to submit drug tests. Just my advice!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2014 9:04 pm 
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Remmus I would love to know what West Virginia's policy is. If you could check, or let me know how to check, I would big time appreciate it.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2014 10:27 pm 
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I hope I am allowed to link on this forum, but here is the thing I found that I mentioned in my last post. I found it when searching for info for my own state in case anyone wants to check their state on it. It's updated as of December 2014, so very up to date:
http://www.guttmacher.org/statecenter/s ... b_SADP.pdf

GiveMeHope - but WV doesn't seem to be on it? So I decided to see if I could find anything else about WV.

Another thing I found was on http://www.astho.org/Prevention/NAS-Neo ... ce-Report/ - they mention WV by saying "Some states, such as West Virginia, have mandated prenatal risk screening. In May 2008, West Virginia passed the Uniform Maternal Screening Act requiring that all healthcare providers offering maternity services use the West Virginia Prenatal Risk Screening Instrument. The screening tool collects information on conditions, demographics, and behaviors, such as substance use, that may put a woman at greater risk for a poor pregnancy outcome. States can also ensure that their Medicaid program reimburses for prenatal substance use screening."

This is the "West Virginia Prenatal Risk Screening Instrument" - http://www.wvdhhr.org/mcfh/wv_prentalri ... nt2012.pdf

After reading a few things here and there on the internet, I believe they make referrals for treatment or screen you for drugs based on your "risk". I do NOT see anything claiming they test every single mother in West Virginia.

I found this, and copied to to my notepad, but forgot the link to show you the entire report, but it was on a WV medical site: "The Report concluded that newborn illegal drug testing should be performed only with evidence of newborn and/or maternal risk indicators recieved during the assessment that will include a specialized assesment and a follow-up screening questionnaire. Only after this should a urine or blood test for illegal drugs be performed. Universal screening of women and newborns for substance abuse using biologicial specimens is not recommended. Further, the newborn drug testing should be done only for the purpose of determing appropriate medical treatment." So once again, I'm gathering based on your risk.

I also read one woman ask on a forum if they drug test in WV, and one woman responded that they never drug tested her, so there is definitely not mandatory drug testing.

Question for anyone, do you think that if you are worried that you would be considered "at risk" or if the hospitals drug test everyone in your state you may want to consider changing to a hospital/OB that doesn't know your drug history, or consider giving birth at a birthing center or at home? I know you want adequate treatment if you are actively using and the baby may go through withdrawals, but if you can get off suboxone before you deliver, and aren't concerned about withdrawals, but are worried about meconium/umbilical cord testing then you could avoid that test by delivering somewhere else.

Sorry to Babygirl6412 for jacking your thread, I hope it's okay that we discussed this on here. I am still here for support for you if you give us an update or want me to do some searching for you!


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 12:44 am 
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Thank you so much for your support! My husband does know the situation I am in. And he is very supportive. But as far as anyone else, I'm going to get a lashing. And I am from Kentucky. I know NOTHING about the way they drug test. I feel like I'm in the dark with everything :( I wonder if .5 mg will show up positive in drug testing? Where I have been doing so little I wouldn't think my baby would go through w/d.. Seeing how other people take as much as 16mg and their babies show no signs of NAS. I really hope everything works out well. Does anyone know if suboxone has any affect on the epidural? Thank you all SO MUCH for being here and being supportive. It means so much.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 12:51 am 
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And thank you so much for the link!! That really helps! At least they won't accuse me of child abuse..


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 1:07 am 
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Glad your state was in that information!

As far as the epidural goes, I read suboxone does NOT affect the numbing medicine, but if they give you Demerol or other medications it will affect those. I would Google "labor pain management" and see what opiods they sometimes give during birth and why. Then you can request for only numbing medication rather than opiates. Babycenter had some good info on that. I was kind of suprised to see that Demerol and some other stuff listed were opiates.

I really hope everything goes okay tomorrow!


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 2:04 am 
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Babygirl6412 wrote:
Thank you so much for your support! My husband does know the situation I am in. And he is very supportive. But as far as anyone else, I'm going to get a lashing. And I am from Kentucky. I know NOTHING about the way they drug test. I feel like I'm in the dark with everything :( I wonder if .5 mg will show up positive in drug testing? Where I have been doing so little I wouldn't think my baby would go through w/d.. Seeing how other people take as much as 16mg and their babies show no signs of NAS. I really hope everything works out well. Does anyone know if suboxone has any affect on the epidural? Thank you all SO MUCH for being here and being supportive. It means so much.



Epidural is 100% fine on suboxone! I had an epidural in 2012 when I had my son, the hospital did not know about the subutex (even though I did have a legal script) and my epidural gave me 100% pain relief. And I'm currently 35weeks pregnant, my doctors DO KNOW about my subutex, and they have said that the epidural is safe and effective for suboxone patients (if it doesn't work well, its likely not due to the buprenorphine).

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 10:14 am 
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Remmusx thank you so much for taking the time to check in to that! I have thought several times that I wish I could change OBs or hospitals to avoid the testing. Not to sound proud or whatever, but I'm not the "type" doctors might consider "at risk" for drug abuse. However, when I had my daughter, I admitted to being prescribed subutex, so they have that on file for me. There is also not another hospital or OB within an hour from me. (Living in WV sucks.)
Baby girl please keep us posted today!


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 11:42 am 
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Givemehope,
Are you close to morgantown? I ask this because WVU Hospitals has the number one Sub clinic in the state and region.
The Sub Drs work very closely with the other departments including OB.
They are tied togather. It may take some driving, our state is abit spread out, but thought you could check it out. . Its different up here in the north..


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 4:00 pm 
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Hey BabyGirl,

Sending love and prayers your way today. I'm sure you won't be able to update right away, but please let us know how it goes. Believe it or not, we do tend to get kind of emotionally attatched to the people who post here. Everyone will be happy to hear that everything went well for you.

Please try to enjoy this day. No matter what happens with the suboxone testing this is a very happy moment for you and your family. Don't let your worries overshadow that.

Q

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 4:45 pm 
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Razor -- I live in southern WV, about 3 1/2 hours from Morgantown. I wish I lived closer to a bigger city that is more educated with such things.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2014 11:14 pm 
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Babygirl6412 - I hope that everything is okay today! Just wanted to let you know I have thought about you, and hope everything went well! Let us know when you get a chance.


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2014 12:57 am 
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Thank you so much everyone for your support. I would just like to say I had a beautiful baby girl the 17th. She didn't show any signs of NAS except for sneezing. She also has excessive sucking. But it may just be how she is, because in her ultrasounds she was always sucking her thumb. But she is very healthy! I was very worried about CPS seeing how I didn't have a script.. But I suppose my honesty really helped me in this situation. I told my OB about the suboxone and when asked questions at the hospital I was up front and honest.. They did drug test me and I failed for sub. But that was all that was in my system. They took mercy on me and spared me the stress of CPS. My nurse was amazing. It was really stressful counting down the days of my pregnancy because I didn't have a script. But everyone was incredibly nice and understanding and I am really grateful!!! And I love my baby girl so much!!


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