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PostPosted: Sat Aug 13, 2011 8:42 am 
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I just wanted to relay something I learned recently. I was checking on any possible laws that different states might have with regard to testing moms and/or newborns for drugs (for a different member with a similar issue). What I found seems to be that only a couple states have such laws. More common is that it appears to depend on each hospital's internal policy/procedure. So if you're really concerned about it, I'd try to surreptitiously find out what your hospital policy is. Then you would at least have some real peace of mind. Take care.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:33 pm 
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hatmaker--thanks for that great advice! do you have any pointers on how i might go about doing that?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 10:30 am 
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I was actually thinking about that. Obviously to do that without giving yourself away, you'll have to be careful. If it were me, I'd call the hospital - I'm actually not sure which dept or who that would be, but i'll give it some thought and others may, too.

What I'm going to say is probably going to cause a shitstorm of disagreement, because it involves dishonesty. The thing about rigorous honesty is that real life can get in the way of that. Anyway, I would tell the person you're speaking to that someone you know (maybe a "daughter") is giving birth at their hospital in several months and you fear she is using. Then ask what their policies are with regard to drug testing infants - do they do it regularly as a policy or only as needed? In other words, feel them out and get as much info as you can. Of course you won't be giving them anything that would allow them to identify you.

Also, I doubt it will be there, but you can always check the hospital's website first, just in case. But hospital policies/procedures aren't usually something they release outside of internal channels. But to be on the safe side, I would check it first.

Again, I'm fully aware that others may/will vehemently disagree with my approach here, but in your situation, I simply can't think of any other way to find out what their policy is. In other words, what I'm saying here applies ONLY to this situation and does NOT generalize to any other situation. I still fully believe that honesty is the best way for us, but sometimes we just gotta do what we gotta do.

Good Luck!

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-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 10:58 am 
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I agree with hatmaker and think that is a very good idea. One thing I have learned thru all this is that life is not black and white, there is a huge grey area. Is honesty good? Of course but it isn't always possible. If it takes being less than truthful to protect my child then that's what it takes. It's a nice idea to think that we could always be honest and truthful but in my opinion life just doesn't always work that way. There is another thing, if they do do a routine drug test on your baby I highly doubt that they would test for sub. Sub does not show up in drug screens, they have to specifically test for it. I would take hats advice it will give you piece of mind and you can relax and enjoy the rest of your pregnancy.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 2:38 pm 
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I agree with hatmaker. But, I really really really doubt they will test for subs. I have passed many drug tests while on suboxone because it's not on any standard drug tests. It makes me laugh that they test for PCP and I have never even heard of anyone taking that drug anymore, but not for subs. Let's face it, most doctors don't know ANYTHING about suboxone, that's one of the reasons that we don't feel comfortable telling them. So they aren't test for it.

I haven't had a child while on subs, but I have had CPS in my business in 2 different states due to alcoholism. It was the WORST thing I have ever gone thru. Like another poster says, they went to her kids school, they will invade every single aspect of your life. Everyone will know you are an addict and will probably treat you differently because of it. I understand that they are there to protect children, and it's a shame that their policies are so black & white that parents have to be TERRIFIED of having them involved.

I also understand the worry of having a healthy baby. I went on one binge for about a week when I was pregnant. The rest of the time I was sober, but I worried the whole rest of the pregnancy that I had damaged my daughter. I also smoked, and did NOT tell my OB for the same reasons as some of you don't tell about subs: you KNOW they will look down on you, treat you differently, and attribute every symptom you or your baby has to smoking even if it doesn't have anything to do with that.

I will be thinking of all the women who are in this situation, and pray that all the babies are born healthy. I am blessed to have the most beautiful, healthy four year old daughter.

And one more thought, I had an impossible time getting my OB to agree to any ANTI DEPRESSANTS while i was pregnant. If they can't even agree to anti depressants, I can only imagine the grief I'd get for suboxone.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 2:51 pm 
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Recent studies (that Dr J has presented in his blog) are showing that suboxone actually has a lower rate of NAS in newborns and is pretty darn safe during pregnancy. More and more doctors are agreeing that it's better to stay on it than go off it during the pregnancy. That said, the research I did yesterday on the subject indicated that stopping suboxone in the first trimester is the most dangerous for miscarriage, but also stopping in the third trimester is just as bad, but with different outcomes. Many docs then recommend the second trimester as the best time to attempt a SLOW taper off, if one absolutely must stop sub during pregnancy.

One of the major concerns about stopping sub isn't just the miscarriage risk. It's the increased risk of relapse associated with returning cravings and the stress that can happen during pregnancy as well as post-partum. Just take care to take everything into consideration. I'd hate to see you go through all this just to self-medicate and end up back in active addiction.

But with antidepressants during pregnancy, my understanding is that they could actually contribute to more complications during pregnancy than suboxone is known to.

For Dr. Junig's words on the subject, check out his blog, SuboxoneTalkZone.

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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 4:02 pm 
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Hi Hatmaker,
I have to admit I have done no research or reading about suboxone during pregnancy because it was never a concern of mine. It's so nice to hear that it is possible to stay on it during pregnancy, with a doctor's care. I would tell the doctor b/c of my previous history of CPS.

Anyway, I didn't know that anti depressants could be worse for the baby. I did try to get off of them during my early pregnancy, but I wasn't able because of side effects of withdrawal. My doctor did switch me to Prozac for my pregnancy b/c it's the oldest and has the most data on safety during pregnancy. It got me thru, and I went back on my regular anti depressants after I had the baby.


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

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