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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:16 pm 
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Hello everyone. This is my first post on here, although I did find this site over a week ago. Your comments, experience, and insight has been so extremely valuable to me. I had NO idea what I was getting into with this!!!

So, my basical deal is that I was on 10mgs, and weaned by 1-- 2mg strip per week when I found out I was pregnant (shocker, btw!!!). 5 to 4, 4 to 3, and 3 to 2 were all fine....just a little discomfort/anxiety. THEN..3mgs to 2mgs on Day 3, woke up with restless legs, anxiety, back pain, and just overall discomfort. So, I was on 2mgs for 5 days, and in that process went to see nurse at sub doc. She told me to slow down the weaning by .25, but I was already so uncomfortable that I took 1mg on Friday, June 17th then just jumped on Saturday, June 18th. I now know after reading on here that the withdrawal could be dangerous, etc, but my sub doc and baby doc both recommended that I get off. Looking back I would have/ should have weaned longer.

What a wild strange trip!!! Days 1-3 no more discomfort than the drop to 2mgs. Then last Tuesday, wanted to crawl out of my skin...couldn't sleep, couldn't rest, yet so very, very tired and IRRITABLE. I ended up at the sub doc last Thursday, and he put me on a Clonidine patch, and some to take orally. I went to the baby doc on Friday (unscheduled, but concerned over stomach cramps) and baby is fine. I was crying so hard to my doc telling her how uncomfortable I was, and she called my sub doc and they called in Subs again. I think I was probably looking for something to stop the pain...NOT subs, but thank God they were on to me :). I was on Day 7 at this point...I couldn't turn back. She explained that I was 2/3 upstream, but if I was too miserable then I could always pick them up...they are still at pharmacy.

So, with all of that said, today is Day 10 and I can finally see some light. I think the worst part for me was that I literally felt so tired that I couldn't get up to make my kids dinner or give them a bath. Maybe it is the pregnancy too, but I just laid there like a blob, but even that was uncomfortable. I work 40hrs/ week and made it in for the most part (left early a couple of times) and that seemed to get my mind off things. The lack of sleep is getting better but still not good. I can actually walk now without feeling like I am going to disintegrate into the ground. I can not for the life of me understand how people are working out, as I am still having trouble putting one foot in front of the other. The worst part of all of this is how irritable I have been towards my 2 other children, ages 6 and 4. For some reason, I am just so hard on them and cannot stop. I keep hoping this anger will pass, as this is NOT AT ALL like me and, I am feeling INTENSE guilt on top of the physical symptoms. I don't understand how I can get so ugly with them, as I have never been this way before..regardless, I hate it and what I am doing to them.

It has been SOOO incredibly tough, but it's only been 10 days...I can't turn back. The Clonindine patch fell off after 3 days, but I have been taking the pills still. I can't tell if they are making me more tired or not, so I am kinda experimenting when I take them. Any help here would be appreciated??? How long do I take these/side effects??? And, anyone that has jumped at 2mgs that has made it through...I would LOVE TO HEAR FROM!!!!

My kids will be going on a vacation with their dad for 2 weeks starting tomorrow, so hopefully I can heal/rest and get better for all of us. I NEVER WOULD HAVE JUMPED LIKE THIS IF I WOULD HAVE KNOWN...but then again, I am grateful to be done and put this all behind me. I would LOVE to hear from people who have jumped and what I am up against in the coming days. It appears that this will last a little longer than I had hoped, but I am ready for whatever. Please don't think that I am judging anyone who continues on subs during pregnancy..I just didn't think it was right for me, since I was only on them 7 months. Boy, did I underestimate the power of them and what I was up against. Thank you all so much for taking time to read this, and I would really, really, really appreciate some feedback. Thank you!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:28 pm 
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I just re-read my post....and where I felt the withdrawals kick in was from 4mg (or 2 strips) to 2mg (or 1 strip), not 3mgs, sorry. I didn't split them up at all, so I am sure my body just flipped out when I didn't give it anything in the afternoon/evening. Could have, should have, would have done different.....


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:36 pm 
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Wow! I have to commend you for being able to work, take care of two small children and go off of Sub at the same time. Before your kids leave tomorrow give them a big hug and tell them how much you love them and then FORGIVE yourself for being snappish. It's really not your fault. The extreme tiredness you are feeling is definitely the WD, and being pregnant can only make that worse. I think at day 10 you are over the worst of it, but you should definitely spend the next 2 weeks without the fam resting, pampering yourself, getting take-out and doing whatever exercise feels comfortable.

I did jump at 2mg, and felt that the withdrawal stage was done by about day 10, but I ended up going back on because of crushing depression. Of course, I wasn't pregnant so I didn't have the incentive you have. Take good care of yourself. If you do become depressed talk to your doc, don't put it off. I know that some AD's are approved for pregnancy now, if you find you need one.
You sound like you are doing amazingly well considering the circumstances. Please continue to post and let us know how it's going!
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:46 pm 
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Thank you so much for your reply! On the Wednesday of the 2mgs, the depression kicked in BAD...it was awful!! Somewhere along the way that has gotten better. i should mention that I am an alcholic and haven't had a drink in 4 years, so I used some of the tools I learned in AA to cope and have gone to some meetings. It has still been so hard. Keep saying...this too shall pass. This isn't my first detox, so I kinda know that there might be hope at the end.

Yes, you are right about the incentive...I wanted to stop subs a while back and this just gives me motivation to do so. I had to quit Cymbalta and Klonopin too in May when I found out about pregnancy, which was a TOTAL mind trip...brain zaps, mental craziness, etc. That was tough mentally but not physically, then waited until I was "stable" off that to start the sub taper. I can't even believe I can type this.

The pregnancy has actually been the easy excuse at work to not feel good. Everyone just thinks I am struggling with morning sickness...and I do have that too!!! So, with the anger...does that subside soon??? It's weird...it's just towards my kids at home. i have been trying to stay in public as much as possible so I don't harm them anymore. I hate myself for all of this, but I KNOW this isn't me...just the withdrawals. I really appreciate you getting back to me...teared up reading it. You inspire me that you jumped at 2mgs, as well. I am sorry to hear about the depression...I know how hard that can be. I think I am just going to keep going one day at a time.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:35 pm 
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Holy shit! You just got off of Cymbalta and klonipin, and a month later you jump off of Sub! That is a lot to handle - no wonder you're having angry outbursts! I've heard people say it's taken them 9 months to a year to truly get back to normal after a bad benzo habit. Hopefully, you weren't on a high dose like that. All I can say is don't try to be wonder woman. I know you don't want to take anything while pregnant - I get that. But if things really get rough and you need some type of medication I hope you will at least consider it. Most of all your kids need a healthy, stable Mom!
It sounds like you are doing as well as is humanly possible at this point. I hope you will get plenty of rest and self care while the kids are away.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 4:43 am 
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Yes, it's definitely been ROUGH. Both my docs suggested getting off klonopin immediately, and I did that in 3 days then Cymbalta. I took .5 during the day and .5 at night for chronic tension headaches...that's why I got on norco too. Only on for 9 months, then doc tried subs. Again, would have done this slower but that was the "plan" they gave me. I'm not opposed to getting back on something if I need too. I think I might need it. Makes me fee better that it's not "all in my head" and that it IS a lot for my body/mind right now. Thank you for getting back to me. Sleep a little better 9:30-3:30...I consider that huge :) Had an ok night with kids and told them I was sorry...now it's time to care for me :).

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 12:30 pm 
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I just found out that I'm pregnant, 4 weeks along. I live in Canada and Subutex is not available. Basically my doctor told me I had two choices: taper from suboxone over a 3 week period or go on methadone. I am NOT going on methadone so I've decided to do the sub taper. I am on 4 mgs a day and will try and taper off within 3 weeks. If you had to do it again, how would you go about the taper? I hate that subutex isn't available for me to taper with but I have no other choice except to go on methadone. I'm VERY motivated to get off suboxone but of course I worry about the wds and the fact that wds could cause me to miscarry. I would think a fast taper like the one I'm going to do will no doubt cause me wds. I'm praying that they aren't too severe but who knows? Your story gives me hope though that I WILL do this. I'm also a mom to a 2 and 3 year old so I'm also hoping I can try to avoid losing it on them in the coming weeks. Not fair for them to endure my mood swings over wds but I guess the outcome will be worth it - Me off sub and baby born healthy and drug free.

I'd appreciate any and all advice about tapering you can give me. I've started at 8 mgs and have gotten down to 4 but stayed at 4 for awhile now. I've never tried going lower. Tomorrow I'll be starting 3 and keep it at that for a week then 2, 1, .5 for a few days and then jump. That's the plan but again I'd love your feedback on this.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 12:53 pm 
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I hate to be the downer in the room, but everything I've learned in the last 2.5 years is that one shouldn't stop suboxone/subutex while pregnant - especially in the first trimester. It's allegedly not safe for the fetus. I'm surprised to hear any doctor suggest tapering off while pregnant. The thing is the fetus will go through withdrawals along with the mom, but due to being inside the womb, it cannot be monitored or treated.

I'm not trying to scare anyone, but I just wanted to be honest with regard to all I've learned and read about suboxone. There are many, many posts about suboxone and pregnancy here on the forum. I would suggest that you read as many of them as possible (as well as Dr. J's blog). Many of them discuss the safety of staying on sub during pregnancy.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:08 pm 
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Free_bird, thank you for reaching out. Girl, I can feel your pain. This has been such a difficult experience, and I can totally relate to your experience. I wish that I would have found this site/forum before I really knew what I was getting into. Hatmaker, you probably know WAYYYYY more than I ever considered about this, and I can totally see how staying on subs during pregnancy, especially first trimester would be the better option.
All I have to speak from is my experience, and what I was told to do. It seems to me that there are not a lot of consistent opinions in the medical field as to what to do with pregnant women. My doc never even recommended subutex, which I find odd. They told me to wean by 1 per day! I did one strip per week.Then when I dropped from 4mgs to 2mgs and started having withdrawal...they gave me the 30 day plan tapering by .25. Again, I was already so miserable I jumped. Looking back I see how risky that was, but I just had baby checked out yesterday and all is good. I was only on subs for 7 months, and opiates for 9 months...not minimizing my situation, but not sure if that has anything to do with why I was given such an aggressive plan.
Free_bird, I am in NO position to give advice. Although, I am on Day 13 now and feel somewhat decent...it was REALLY tough. I was under constant medical supervision by sub doc and baby doc too. When I really started having bad withdrawals, they called in subs again and both agreed that if I had to go back on, it was probably the best option. My baby doc was the one who said you are 2/3 of the way there, though. That's what stuck in my head. I don't know what I would do different if I had to do it over again..probably a longer taper, listen to my body better, etc. Although, I do have to say it is a HUGE relief to be through the worst of it. I would listen to people with more experience than me with suboxone, as I did NOT have any clue what I was getting into with this. I thought 2mgs is so small, no big deal.
One thing I know for sure with the kids, is that I should have asked for more help. I tried to do it all on my own, and as a single mom really just crumbled. If you have a support system in place to assist you with them, if you do decide to jump I think that would really help. I know that I am a good Mom and one week of their life with me a little crazy will be made up for long term as a sober, healthy Mommy. Best of luck to you!!!

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:45 pm 
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Thanks for sharing your experience with me. I'm really caught in a rock and a hard place here. I don't want to be on methadone and since subutex isn't available I have to taper the suboxone. It sucks, it really does. I just got off the phone with my doctor and he's referring me to an OB who specializes in opiate dependent mothers so I'm really hoping she'll be able to help me through this. I'm very worried but reading the success stories does give me a little reassurance. I wish subutex was available but since it isn't here yet I have to play the cards I'm dealt.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:54 pm 
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Wow, Free_bird...an OB that specializes in opiate dependent mommies!!! How awesome!!! i am sure you will get your answers there. I would have LOVED to have one doc that knew what I was going through. If you absolutely have to jump, I am living proof it can be done. But, as others have said, some docs don't recommend it. Good luck to you, and please keep me posted!!!

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 2:55 pm 
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Hey there,

Just thought I'd update and get some advice. I'm down to 2 mgs now. Debating between tapering a little more or just jumping. At 2 mgs I'm surprised that I'm not feeling horrible. I have anxiety and a bit of rls going on but not unbearable. Should I maybe taper down to 1 mg and jump or just get it over with? If you did it again would you have tapered further. I'm just so worried about staying on this stuff any longer then I have to. I'm also quitting smoking so my anxiety level is through the roof at times. But I know once I get through the first two weeks it should get a bit easier. How are you doing? I'd love an update!


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:06 pm 
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Hi free_bird,

Thanks for reaching out! If I was you, I would taper as long as possible, as low as possible. I am still feeling the effects of jumping so soon, and they can be pretty intense at times (it's been 4 weeks tomorrow). I jumped at 2mgs, because I immediately went into wicked withdrawals at 2mgs. My thought process was "if I am going to feel like this on 2mgs, then why not just rip off the band-aid". If you are stabilized on 2mgs, that's great! Maybe you can drop lower and not have to suffer as hard as I did.
I felt it a lot harder and it's lasting a lot longer than I had originally hoped. I am functioning fine...I mean I am at work as we speak, kids are great, but i am dealing with a lot of anxiety, fear, low level sadness. Again, could all be pregnancy. I am going to bed good, but waking up anywhere from 3-5am and unable to go back to sleep. That is probably the most frustrating part.
How quickly did you taper? Man, it hit me hard from the 4mg to 2mg drop. Sometimes, I wonder if I will ever be the same. Reading the posts on here helps convince me that I will. It's been a long strange trip, but think it will be worth it in the end. Keep me posted. How far along are you?

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:27 pm 
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Thanks so much for getting back to me so fast! I'm 6 weeks and 4 days along. And I'm really not "stable" lol..at 2 mgs I'm anxious and have some rls going on. In fact I was just going to jump in the tub to try and relieve it a bit when I saw your post :) So at 2 mgs you went into full blown wds pretty much? I'm not that bad but maybe I should hang on at 2 mgs for another week to let my body adjust a little better and then drop to 1. Although I REALLY want to be off this stuff quickly I'm really worried about the wds and them causing any harm to my baby..but being on suboxone worries me too. :(

You are doing amazing and really your my inspiration. Whenever I doubt myself I think of you, your story gives me hope that I CAN do this!! I'm going to talk to my doc and let him know I need more time at 2. We planned for me to have dropped to 1 soon but I think it would be too fast. It's a balancing act - try and get off sub quick - but not so quick as to cause major wds. I just want this over with! I am so tired of worrying myself sick over it. But I'll keep plugging along and hopefully can get off in a couple more weeks.

You should be SO PROUD for what you've accomplished! It's nothing short of amazing :) I know your feeling crappy (I jumped from oxy twice, got through those hellish wds but it was the depression/anxiety that got me) But like everyone on here who's been able to stay clean for sometime it does get better. Hang in there, your doing amazing!!


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:57 pm 
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Awww, thank you free_bird. Funny, definitely don't feel like I've accomplished much. I kept thinking I would have this overwhelming feeling of relief/happiness from being off the meds, but that just hasn't happened for me yet. It is still a struggle, but manageable.

Yes, when I went from 4mgs to 2mgs i woke up in a definite state of withdrawal. Kicking legs hard core, headache, backache, etc. That's when I saw the sub nurse on Day 3 of that, and she told me to slow down taper for 30 days. Probably should have listened, but again, I didn't realize it would last so long. I didn't have my kids that weekend and thought 1-2 days of hell, then a week of moderate withdrawal. Boy, was I off...the worst started on Day 3, then peaked Day's 5- 7 after jumping. Would have definitely tapered longer, but really didn't realize what I was getting into, and couldn't be that patient. Just wanted it done.

Now, I will say that my opiate dependence was on hydrocodone 10 mgs x 4 per day. I took them under drs care, never took more, etc. Looking back and educating myself now, I am starting to get a little pissed that I was on 10mgs of subs for a 9 month dependence on 40mgs of hydrocodone! Seems like overkill to me. The initial phase of one week to clear my system should have been enough. I didn't really fight staying on subs, because I do have a chronic pain condition and my doc told me that I could stay on those and not become addicted/high, since I had a problem with alcohol before and started needing more pills to get relief...definite signs there was a problem developing, so I do believe that subs saved me. Then, got pregnant...and you know the rest.

My point is, I didn't think, or know, to much about opiate dependence/suboxone before I jumped. I had NO idea these little guys would hang on so long. But, like so many people say on here, I have trained my brain with external chemicals for a while, that it just doesn't quite know how to act now. Staying busy helps sooo much, but some days I just really get beat down. I keep trying to look back and think of the last time I felt somewhat "normal" and it's been a bit. But, pregnancy gives us a GREAT excuse to feel like crap, be moody, etc.! :)

Good luck to you, free-bird..i am so interested in your story and what you decide to do. Keep me posted please!!!! What did the addiction OBGYN say about withdrawing while pregnant? Neither of my 2 docs seemed too concerned with that...hmmmm.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:44 pm 
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The addiction ob gyn told my doc it would be ok for me to taper off because I was already at such a low dose of sub. I never actually got to see her. Once they knew I was a good hour and a bit away from where she was she said she would just give instructions to my doctor to let me taper off. I have a really strong feeling that the drop from 2 to 1 is going to be the tough one. I really am afraid of the wds causing m/c. I feel pretty down right now that I'm in this awful position. I know with subs looong half life I probably won't feel that bad until day 3. You said days 5-7 were the worst and then started getting a bit better after that? God I hope I can get through this. I have to, I WANT to so badly. But it's scary knowing the risks..it seems a case of damned if I do, damned if I don't. I even wonder about the baby feeling wds. I know at not even 7 weeks it would probably be better to do this now then when the baby is bigger and "feeling" more. I'm going to stay the course and keep tapering until I get down low enough and jump or start to feel so miserable I might as well jump..whichever comes first I guess. And yes, you have accomplished something huge. I'd kill to be where you are now. IT'S OVER!! Your past the worst of the physical and although I KNOW the mental is a bitch, knowing your baby is not being exposed anymore to sub has to feel pretty damn good!! :) You did it!!!!!


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 5:06 pm 
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Well, I sometimes still go back and forth whether to get back on them because of the mental/emotional beat down and duration, so I am not in the clear just yet. I usually snap out of it, though. The physical part was really only Days 3-7, then lessening each day. I never, ever, ever, felt like I was going to miscarry, or was in too much pain for my pregnancy. I mean, heck yea, it was uncomfortable...but that is it...wasn't like doubled over excrutiating pain or anything. My legs got the worst of it, and it was really hard to even walk at first, but they are fine now! Totally the lack of energy, sadness, and not sleeping were the main symptoms (still are) but don't think any of those will cause a miscarriage. Again, keep me posted...would love to hear what you decide. It is such a tough choice regardless.

And, dont let me fool you...I get in major fear that I caused my baby brain damage, undo stress, or any other negative side effect from the withdrawal. I felt like a horrible person for being in this situation in the first place, but it is what it is. Can't look back, only forward. Best of luck to you! Take care.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 5:16 pm 
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Thanks so much for posting that. You just relieved my anxiety over going through wds so much. You see when I think of wds, I have nothing to go off of except the excruciating detox I did jumping from 160+ mgs of oxy a day. Those wds WERE excruciatingly bad. I have to remind myself that this is not the case this time. I'm not jumping from insane amounts of oxy. Although I know subs powerful stuff, jumping from 1 or 2 mgs of that compared to nearly 200 mgs of oxy is no comparison. Thank you, you really are helping to set my mind at ease. I really want this over with. I'm going to taper just a little more then be done with it. And I'm sure your baby is FINE!! You got off very early and although I know it must be a daily struggle, it's one that you are SUCCEEDING at and will slowly get better. Although I think "Oh man, why did this have to happen to me?" Maybe it'll be a blessing in disguise. I could never survive the early post-detox days before long enough to see the light. Now I have no choice, I have to. And maybe when all is said and done it'll all work out for the best. A baby born healthy and free of opiates and a mommy free of them too. :) God bless you and please keep me posted on your progress. Hopefully you can help me through it when I go to jump. I could really use your support and it'll mean so much coming from someone who KNOWS exactly what this is like. Talk soon!!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 4:36 pm 
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Hey Valleygirl,

Just checking in. Hope your doing ok, let me know ok?

Down to .5 now :)

Had an ultrasound and baby is doing great! I'll be off within a couple weeks. Going to .25 and then off. Took my time with this last mg and it's paid off. No really bad wds. More annoying then anything. I'm glad I made the decision to taper. It hasn't been easy by any means but it's WORTH it ! Update when you get a chance ok?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 5:15 pm 
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Oh, that's great freebird!!! Good for you!!! I am sure that you will do GREAT getting down to that low of an amount! That is just awesome!!!

I am doing good. Going on the wellbutrin was the best decision I made. I was doing fine physically but the length of the fatigue, and the depression were just too much. I immediately started feeling better, but struggled with anxiety. Even that is leveling out now, and I am feeling good. We are moving this week and I overall I am handling it all pretty well.

I will be 19 weeks on Friday..yay! I get to find out the sex on Wednesday of next week. So, overall things are going well! Keep me posted..you are almost there!!! And, you did it the right way...not all crazy like me :).

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