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PostPosted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 7:32 pm 
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My current counselor wants me to see someone specialized in depression in pregnancy. My doctor was supposed to help me with that but I haven't heard back. So I searched and was able to find a women who specializes in pregnancy and maternal addiction. I have filled out the contact form for her. She is a little over an hour away, but I will do my best tof see her as often as possible if she will see me. I am starting to wonder if I will have to let go of my perfect job to deal with me (they will only handled so much time off for all these appointments) and to spend adequate time with my newborn once she comes. But, even though the thoughts to cut have been there at points today, I am not fearing for my life. I can't ever leave my 3 year old boy, ever. I will always find a way to fight through for him. And I really hope I begin feeling that way about my baby girl too.
I just really broke down yesterday and have still been struggeling mentally. I am getting a bit stronger mentally, though I feel sweaty on my brow, nauseated, and my right leg is driving me nuts.I feel really uncomfortable and achy right now, probably from the stress I put myself through yesterday. And wish i didn't have to work. But gladly, no visions or thoughts of cutting for the past 2 hours. Thank you for all the support!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 6:21 am 
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You're just so welcome to any help we can provide. You are not the only one here who has gone through mental crises. You're not even the first pregnant woman who has come here in crisis.

I'm so proud of you for taking the necessary steps to get help for yourself. Being proactive is so difficult when you are in the middle of depression, and the fact that you are advocating for yourself is so very strong of you. Even though you haven't felt a connection to your baby at this point, you are still advocating for her! The work that you've done to better your situation is a testament to how conscientious a mother you are. Give yourself credit and big kudos for getting the help you need!

I am glad that you are not suicidal in addition to self harming. That is a relief.

I hope that the article I included can help persuade your doctor to consider prescribing you more subutex.

Please keep us informed as to how you are doing. Many more people read your posts than comment and they are sending positive and caring thoughts your way.

Amy

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 9:20 am 
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Amy said everything perfectly!

It irritates me that ur doctor still hasn't gotten bk to u! He knows that ur having issues with the self harm and still hasn't set u an appointment up with someone yet? The staff should have worked on that before u walked out of that office. Good for u to find one on ur own.

I do think once u hold ur baby girl, that instant connection will happen.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 2:38 pm 
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Hi P+L, Amy has given you some wonderful advice and I would just like to add to that, you are a very smart and insightful young woman. You have already stated that you know that the cutting is not only dangerous for you but the baby as well. If your current counselor is not hearing you or you just don't feel a connection to them, find a new one! It has to be someone that you feel safe with completely. I am not sure where you live but if you woyld like you can private message me and I will help you find someone in your area. Please keep posting so that we know how you are doing!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 7:19 pm 
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I have little motivation to do anything more right now..including finding a counselor. My son and I got sick and I think I am starting to get tiny bits of withdraw from the lower dose now too..but it could be the cold. I just got back from working while I could and trying to see the doctor but not being able to get in until later...but later is during my sick kids nap time. And my insurance won't pay for an early fill on my script so I have to pay for it but don't have the money to until Monday. Wish he would adjust the dose. Bet insurance would pay for it then.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:13 pm 
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Hi, so are you going to be out of suboxone until Monday? If you feel withdrawl symptoms starting now, how are you going to make it until monday? That can not be good for you and any of your children including the baby. Do you have a plan? Are you involved with any support groups? EA is a great group...12 step based and people there who would be easy to talk to and going through some similar feelings. Just something to think about. I know there are groups for anxiety, possibly even something for pregnant moms. At the very least, that could give you some support. You can always message me and I will help in any way possible. It is so important for you to be healthy, for yourself and your children!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:23 pm 
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There is no way I will go until Monday with out. I only havery 3 mg left aside of right now. Maybe they will let me charge it. I just am really upset with myself for going over and now having to spend our money to get more. I wrote to my doctor through the patient portal to tell him once again that I am tired of struggling and want to be at 4mg at least and told him about the insurance issue. Hopefully he will check it. I will figure it out.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:27 pm 
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Try not to focus on the expense and just consider it a legitimate cost of pregnancy, OK? You deserve to not feel in withdrawal from a very legitimate medication for your particular disorder. Period.

Amy

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 8:27 pm 
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Ok, remember that Monday is a holiday so you know how that goes. I feel like the whole world is moving a little slower this week! Please keep us posted about how you are doing! We are all here for you!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 10:17 pm 
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Argh. I feel like he isn't listening to me, though admittedly I am confusing. I can be logical and express myself well one moment and the next, not so much. So below is a chain of correspondence between us. I am trying to admit I have been struggling with the dose this entire time but trying to be a "good sport" and suffering for it ("suffering" sounds dramatic, I know, but you get the idea). But I honestly don't think anything I say will matter so I have to get myself to except this again and try not to break down over it. Soo..here are the messages:

Doc: I sent your refill for you so it should be at the pharmacy. I also spoke with Dr Richard's office, and his nurse is supposed to be calling me back since he is on vacation, but as of now she has not called. Hang in there, I would Like to speak with Dr R (<--this is my OB) about a psychiatrist that could help. Try to stay with the three mg. Things will get better.

My message:

I have to pay to get a portion of my script, which I don't have enough money to do so until Monday. And after everything I have been reading and the info given to me from others I am really no longer feeling motivation to be held at a lower dose. I have struggled this entire time to be ok at a lower dose. Did a lot of self talk, redirecting, telling myself I am not important the baby is important, and I am just so tired of struggling and feeling lousy more then half the time. For the past few weeks i felt normal throughout most of the day, though my breakdowns have gotten worse and more intense, but at least most the day was fine. I read this study..didn't understand half of it, but the findings were written in plain English. It found no correlation between dose amount and NAS. I am really done struggling . I wish my OB Dr was here so we could get his input too. And I found a lady in spokane who seems like she might be the perfect fit
for me.

Doc: really think that you should stay on the low dose. The feelings and symptoms you are having with anxiety and depression are not related to addiction or withdrawal and turning to the suboxone for relief is not really the best solution. We need to have you see the counselor, and not up the dose of the suboxone. Maybe we need to add another med for the depression.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 11:16 pm 
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Do you feel comfortable sharing the article showing no differences in newborns due to dose differences? Or do you think he would react badly to seeing that? I see that you already mentioned it and it didn't make a dent. Sorry.

Amy

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 12:33 am 
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Maybe try to be blunt with the dr?? Something along the lines of.... I am not ok at the lower dose. I do not have cravings and physically feel better at 4mg-unlike at 3mg. If I feel bad at the low dose, that means the baby does too. I am not willing to let my child suffer just because you think I should not be at 4mg. It will make absolutely no difference when it comes to the baby experiencing NAS or not, but it does make me feel a lot better mentally and physically. I am hesitant to add another medication. I strongly feel 4mg is where I should stay. Not exactly those words but something pretty close. Can you find another doctor-or is he helping you with that too??


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 12:51 am 
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I feel like the more I try the more of a block he will have. I see my OB on Tuesday. I am going to talk to him about it and see if he may advocate on my behalf. He knows about the increased blood flow that may cause need for a higher dose. I just broke down on him last time I saw him and didn't say the right things. I was focused on my mental illness and scared and upset because I had to admit I had taken over. I only said all the bad stuff I had been feeling. I didn't say that through most of the day when I was at the higher dose I was able to focus much better while at work, I was happier. I was playing with my son more after work. I could still tell that my mental state was morphing and worsening due to the way I would react to different stressors - like actually thinking of having to admit to taking over my prescribed dose, which I only stated fretting over towards the end. But other things that are more common to set off my breakdowns would be the disconnect with my baby, relationship issues with others, worry that my son has ADD, thinking of how to deal with going back to work after baby, loosing my health insurance after my time off from work runs out, etc. And the way I react to those things has become so irrational and it scares me. But I really felt like the added dose of suboxone took away the daily discomfort, lack of focus, minor headache, the full backache feeling, and irritation towards others and the complete antisocialism.I did become extremely stressed out about how taking extra would play out, and how I put myself back into an addictive pattern by taking over my prescribed dose.
But I feel like I lost my chance to express this to him the right way or that it wouldn't really matter. When I started on this 2 years ago I was only supposed to be in it for 1 year. Maybe OB will help


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 9:29 am 
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I'm not so sure u put urself bk to addictive behavior like u said, ur just being forced to go lower than ur ready for. Being pregnant is a whole game changer, it's hard on ur body physically and mentally. There's all kinds of changes happening. To put even more on urself by throwing in feeling awful because of a dose change, especially a not wanted or ready dose change, that's got to be very tough! So I don't necessarily look at what ur going through as addictive behavior. That doctor sounds like he's not listening to u but convinced that because ur pregnant, u need a lower dose. I do think it's pretty awesome ur doctor has a portal though lol that's really cool.

Please don't forget what Michelle said about Monday being a holiday (I think it's a reserved New Years holiday). U do not want to be needing medicine and the pharmacy closed. And if u have to pay for a few then just pay it, I know it sucks because I always have to pay for my doctor and medicine, but u have to have it regardless. If my doctor suddenly dropped me to 3mg, I would faint lol, so I understand ur frustration and worry....especially being a pregnant mom with a ton of responsibility.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 5:08 pm 
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I did go and pay for 12, 2mg/0.5mg pills. It was almost $70. But i know it is worth it. I am bringing my son in to see the doc today cuz I think he may have pink eye. His doc is also my sub doc. And I am nervous to see him. I feel like it is really hard to talk to him, because I feel like everything I say he will process as me just trying to find an excuse to use suboxone, when that isn't even what is needed. And maybe he is right. Maybe something else would be better (like working out if I could find the motivation to do so). I just haven't found what would be better so what I have been doing this entire time is trying to really self talk myself out of feeling cruddy, tell myself I don't really feel any withdraw related discomfort, that it is all in my head or it is normal pregnancy stuff, so I will put on headphones and play music really loud while at work, or count up and back down from 50 to try to distract my brain, stuff like that. I have been doing this for months now. I rarely ever feel stable throughout the day. And then I have developed this prenatal depression on top of it which comes with more anxiety, and I have misused the suboxone when I have had such bad anxiety that I shake. I admit that. It helps though and I can't take anything else and am not mentally there enough to work through it with yoga or deep breathing. I just really messed up with the things i said/wrote to my doctor. Thefocus was all wrong. I was so scared about the mental illness and didn't want to deal with the daily struggle of feeling those mild withdraw type feeling anymore on top of the depression. And I also don't feel like I can tell him I have been getting daily withdraw, because i have been at 3mg or 2mg this entire pregnancy...my body should have adjusted right? So it isn't believable that i would continue to get daily mild withdraw right? That is what I think he will think... I am not really getting any withdraw, it is all in my head. I take one dose in the morning and by mid afternoon, sometimes mid morning actually, I will be starting to sweat along my brow, be getting figity and more irritable. Sometimes I get sneezy and get little shivers. Then I take my 2nd dose when I get off work and I will feel a bit better. During the time I was taking 4-6 just recently I didn't get those bodily symptoms. My anxiety and negative thought patterns have increased, however, which really scares me. Maybe I should just tell him to come read this forum,since it seems I can express myself better here. It is like I am worried of his judgement. I wanted so badly to do good, and do what he had set forth. I almost feel like I am dissapointing a parent or something. Sheesh. OK need to work. No matter what happens at least I discovered this forum. Hopefully some day I will be the one offering words of support to someone in turmoil. Thanks guys!


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:13 pm 
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The one thing that doctors often respond to is a potential relapse because of cravings. I don't like the idea of advocating dishonesty, but if he hears that you took the family minivan out, trolling the places you used to score, and only avoided buying by harming yourself, he may change his tune. I hate telling you that. I hate that we are dealing with a doctor who won't listen to reasonable information!

You can take that for what it's worth and decide what to do. If the doctor wants to start you on an antidepressant, he needs to remember that those take time to be effective. The stress you are under is not good for you or your baby. I vehemently hope he gets his head out of his ASS!!!

Amy

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:43 pm 
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This may be why he isn't budging with me. I sought help before I went to the streets. I had my own script and would supplement with my husbands, had two people I could occasionally buy some from. But what I mostly started to do at the end that was my motivation to get help was stealing from people I loved who were sick with cancer (it just so happened one person I was close to got cancer one year and then another right after). Neither liked taking their pain meds,so they had plenty and could always get more, was my justification (one of them actually had a bunch mixed in with a bottle of tylenol, and they thought it was all tylenol in there). But I felt awful and was starting to need to buy them more and more. I had a child and couldn't continue like that. Both people I stole from new their pain meds were getting taken. One of them suspected someone else (never perfect me) and the others i admitted it to because they were suspecting someone living with them and would have probably kicked him out, and icouldn't let that happen. My doc knows not all of this, but he knows I don't have many avenues. I could come up with something but I am not a very good lier. And he is very selective in who he treats. I am worried he might say no more to me.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:47 pm 
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I did too. I only ever got doctor prescribed meds. So your alternative is to say that you called a former hook-up.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 6:54 pm 
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I hate even thinking of saying that. I have thought of doing that though...first I am going go try my OB ..he may help me


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 7:00 pm 
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Oh, and I totally stole out of medicine cabinets too. When I ratted myself out to my pain doctor I spent the next day apologizing to a number of people. I hope your OB is more reasonable!!!

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