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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 7:55 pm 
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Hello everyone, I'm new to this forum, and really, new to forums in general. I've read about and talked to people that have received help from blog and forum type mediums and figured "what the hell" I'll give it a try and see how it goes.

Let me just start off by saying that yes, I know I'm an addict. I haven't taken heroine, opiates, or anything other than suboxone in well over a year (16-17 months).. Suboxone saved my life,. it brought me out of the abyss of opiate addiction and gave me a huge portion of my life back,. However, now I feel that I've only traded one addiction for another.

Let me give you a general idea of my background.. At 15 or 16 years old, I snorted my first pain pill.. I wasn't really into it, but a couple of years later I went through a bad breakup (caught my fiance' and best friend together in my bed..) and was offered again and accepted. It developed and got to the point where I was doing anything I could get my hands on.. Then I discovered the needle.. Dilaudid (spelling?) was my first IV experience, and that was the beginning of a long, arduous journey of pain, misery, and general bad shit.. After stealing some money from my brother, I decided I HAD to do something about it... So, the easiest (cheapest and only REAL available option to me at the time) was Methadone Maintenance Therapy.. $12,198 and 2 years & 3 months later, I went through 6 weeks of hell.. I was doing great for 3 or 4 months,.. then after getting out of a very oppressive relationship, I found heroin. That got real bad, real quick.. I knew I had to do something about it so I decided to try Suboxone. I didn't go to the doctor for it like I had methadone, it's easily available on the street here, and did what I needed it to do. I took myself off heroin and Oxy 30's relatively easy.. That was over a year ago.

Since I don't go to a dr for my Suboxone, it's hard to get help. My girlfriend thinks I take around 1/4 a day, but in reality it's more like 3/4's throughout the day... I'm not taking them sublingualy (spelling?) either.. I'm taking them in a way that's driving me crazy.. I'm afraid to admit it, even to a bunch of strangers I don't know for fear that she'll find out somehow. I want off of this so bad I can't stand it, but have no idea where to begin. How do I MAKE myself stop? Even if I could ONLY take them sublingually, I could taper 10x easier.. I'm planning on stopping cold turkey or taking VERY small amounts in a couple of days.. I figure 5 days and I should be able to get back to work..

Someone help me.. Please help me get my dignity back. Please help me take control again.. I have a great job, a house, a nice car, an amazing woman, everything a man my age could want.... except I have this huge, giant weight on me.. it's like I have an elephant sitting on my shoulders.. I'm afraid to drive to wrk because it's to the point where I take it with me and make periodical trips to the restroom.. How do I defeat this monster? How do I tell myself I"m disgusted with Suboxone and myself, and my method of treatment?

I don't know what else to do....


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:11 pm 
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There is no easy way out of this. The first thing you have to do, is start taking them sublingually. Get rid of your rigs and all that, assuming you're talking of the method I think you are. Cut your dosing down to a minimum of twice daily. You may have to increase your dose a little bit to level out on a once/twice daily sublingual dose, but it's worth it in the end. Once you are truly taking suboxone the way you should be, it's easier to taper down (if that's what you're after.) Tapering down from this route of administration is going to be tough. Are you doing 3/4s of an 8mg strip or a 2mg strip? I'm not sure if you mentioned the milligrams.

Of course there is always CT but that is impulsive and usually proves to be a lot more than people can handle. You really need to get back to taking it orally. If you can't do that, I'm worried about how you'll do quitting cold turkey, KWIM? Small steps. Breathe.. you'll get there. Just make one step in the right direction and quit with this ROA.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:23 pm 
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I've tried cold turkey twice in 3 months, and after the 3rd day something happens or I get overwhelmed and start again.. I want to stop taking it the way I am more than I want off of it completely, but trying to summon up the necessary willpower is exhausting to say the least. I feel like when I take them properly that I haven't taken "enough" or I feel like I'm withdrawing.. I discussed going to see a real sub doctor to see if they can help get me where I need to be.

I mean 3/4's of an 8mg strip.. I'm scared to death that I"m going to end up killing myself, or end up dead because of my administration method.. I take antibiotics to avoid infection, and ibuprofen to help with any swelling or pain associated with "misses" or running into something I don't mean to,.. I'm constantly wearing long sleeves to hide my bruises, and it's embarassing.. I'm afraid to let my girl touch me for fear she'll find out.

I just can't do this like I am anymore, but getting into a sub doctor is so expensive.. I want my life back. I feel like the piece of shit junky that I was a long time ago and it sucks.. but I can't seem to stop.. Maybe I should take more sub the way it's supposed to be taken to compensate? Until I get the $ to go to a real doc, I'm not sure what to do.. All I know is that I can't do this anymore.. I've felt this way for some time now, but it's affecting my job, my relationship(s), my mood (I'm bipolar anyway so it definitely doesn't help having this hanging over my head) I'm just not 100% sure what to do.. I know what I NEED to do, but I feel like absolute shit when I do.

I want it to be over.. I'm ready for a change..


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:30 pm 
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I urge you to get in with a real doctor and let them help you. Correct maintenance could do wonders for you and take the weight off your shoulders, and that feeling like you're still using. I think you should see a doctor and increase your dose. You are not hitting your ceiling and saturating your receptors when taking 6mgs at this time, especially when trying to take it normally after the way you have been. If you do it right and take a good dose (like 16mgs) and start there,it could make a huge difference for you.

I had a hard time breaking the habit that you have. I never did use that ROA for my sub meds but I know how addicting the process is and the sense of relief that comes with it. The problem is all the risk and the fact that you are not better yourself or your disease by doing it this way. You are SO right to have your concerns. It's only downhill from here, there is no good side to what you're doing.. only possible bad outcomes. Please see a doctor. If you need help finding one in your area, PM me and I'll do a search for you.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:46 pm 
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Just felt like throwing this out there...

There is no real solid way to judge how suboxone could indeed work for you long term unless done legally via a doctor. When you say it seemed like you have traded one drug for another... That is exactly what you did. Just instead of setting up deals for 30s you setup deals for subs. Yes. It has allowed you to pull yourself out of the madness of active addiction, but because you never changed any other the structure around it... What has really been changed other than social acceptability? Now. You are wanting to stop taking it? And then what? Will you go to daily NA or SMART recovery meetings? Will your recovery consume your lifestyle? These are things you really need to think about long and hard about it. If you think you'll stop subs and all will just go on as it has been going, you are mistaken. Right now your cravings are taken care of because of the subs, but none of the behavior or ideas/additudes have changed. Especially by taking it illegally. All I wanted to point out is that it's great that you have found a way out of this crap with suboxone, but by keeping g yourself involved in the same exact behaviors of active use and not solely focusing on your recovery.... It's something to seriously think about... What do you have without subs as far as recovery goes?


Three choices of the opiate dependent person...
-Keep using until you die.
-Take buprenorphine as prescribed and work on your recovery to help change your additudes and ideas.
-Stop using and attend daily lifelong recovery based meetings. Constantly living in an atmosphere of recovery at all times. It is your entire life.

This is it... No other choices... There are few that get away with doing nothing or little and get away clean.... But you can't rely on being the less than 1% that can happen to.

Just some words.... MM1


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 9:06 pm 
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MovieMaker1 wrote:
When you say it seemed like you have traded one drug for another... That is exactly what you did.

He knows.

It's about so much more than this, though. It's about breaking a habit that is now associated with suboxone. But I agree, a legit doctor, script, and higher dose will help wonders if OP can follow through.

T705K-

Do you get pills or film from the street? I'm hoping that you get the pills. Maybe if you had a different form of sub (like film) from the doctor, it could help break the association of the ROA.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 11:43 pm 
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Moviemaker1, I couldn't have said it any better. Your thinking has to change completely. You can be on suboxone but still be living like you're in active addiction. I snorted my subs for two years. They were prescribed and I usually took the right dose but I was still trying to get high by snorting them. I was not sober. Now that I truly want to be clean and have taken recovery seriously, I am a changed man. My thinking is completely different. I can enjoy life now without the need to be high. It's amazing. A true gift. But it took a lot of hard work, many attempts at sobriety and more pain and grief than I can put into words. But all those relapses and dope sick days were necessary for me to get to where I am today. Just stopping subs was not even close to enough. To stay sober I have to work at recovery as hard as I did to get drugs.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:19 am 
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I'm sorry, but I have to say something to the above poster. Moviemaker.

This man is fearful for his life, and looking for support. I get that you're trying to help, and have a "tough love" approach, but I don't think that he needs it. RIGHT NOW, it's about breaking his habit. When I was younger and single, I smoked pills. I've never shot up, but having a "method", and something to do at all times, is a very very hard habit to break. It's not like the quick relief of snorting, which I've also done. It's all about the process. It's a very hard thing to overcome.

With that being said, I DO agree about going to a doctor. It's hard as hell to admit it to anyone, but they've heard it all and that's what they're there for. Your girlfriend doesn't have to know, but it may be easier if she does. Having support is going to help you so much. Knowing someone is by your side and loves you. Not to mention, she can make sure to give you only what you need. Slowly tapering and maybe one day help you be done for good.

Regardless, I wish you luck. This won't be easy, but you CAN do it!!


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:59 am 
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Hi T70K5,

Welcome to the forum!!

I agree with those above who suggest you go to a Suboxone doctor and get put on a dose, sublingually, that works for you. I think that should be your first step. If you absolutely won't see a Suboxone doctor, then get enough off the street to where you can take your dose sublingually.

You mentioned how going to a Suboxone doctor is so expensive, I think the expense is well worth your life, don't you? I believe if you took Suboxone properly and in a high enough dose, your behaviors (current ROA and the whole ritual associated with it) will come under control fairly quickly.

Secondly, I think you need to get in with a good addiction counselor. Your addiction is very strong right now and working with an addiction counselor may help provide you with the knowledge and accountability you need to move forward.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 12:43 pm 
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I also want to point out that it can't be too much more than what you're spending now almost doing an entire 8mg off the street! I'm not sure how much you pay for them, but if you have insurance that should help you see a doctor and with your prescription.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 2:39 pm 
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I don't know what state you're in, but another option is to actually go to a detox facility/inpatient treatment program to physically remove yourself from the behavior/lifestyle for some time. If you don't have insurance, that could be established with the help of Social Workers. You could be started on prescribed sublingual buprenorphine at the proper dosage for you and have a plan in place and established connection for maintenance when you leave. If it is absolutely not possible to find a buprenorphine prescribing Dr., a opioid replacement clinic may be a covered option, again depending on where you are and options available to you. A clinic setting will provide structure with your dosing that may be helpful right away.

Which ever way you go, best of luck, my friend! I took to wearing old man pajamas all the time, under clothes even to appear like I weighed more than I did, but mainly to hide tracks from an unsuspecting girlfriend I lived with for a time. If you went to a facility and came clean with her, it would not be the end of the world, in reality, but it could help you determine if the relationship can sustain reality or not if that makes sense?

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 6:17 am 
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Hey T7,

I just wanted to chime in here and say that there is nothing you could tell us here that you should be ashamed of. You are among fellow addicts, we've all done things we are ashamed of. Please don't feel as if you will be judged from us. :)

Just for continuity, I would agree with the others. I really think if you get in with a doctor and can up your dose to around 16mgs or so you will feel much better. Like Tiny said, one step at a time.

Good luck.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 1:43 pm 
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Im going to search for a doctor tomorrow and will hopefully get to the place I need to be. I've thought about the inpatient facilities but I have to work..

My biggest concern is not being able to afford a real doctor and keep doing things like I am.. if I can get in to see one I think I can take charge of this nonsense.. its just scary...


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 1:44 pm 
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And I have every reason to be ashamed.. im lying to everyone I love and care about. Im killing myself in front of them and none of them even have a clue. .


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 20, 2013 3:10 pm 
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I hope you can find a doctor that makes sense for your financial situation, like you you've acknowledged, it's about life and death. I think this is one instance where you need to find a way to make it work, no matter what. It's your life. If you need any help looking for a doctor, let me know.

Good luck tomorrow.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 1:00 am 
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Do you have any kind of update for us? Even if it's just to say that you're still stuck. None of us got better overnight. We've all messed up a kabillion times too.

I hope you've taken a step, any step, forward. But if you haven't we're still here for you! Talk to us.

Amy

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:30 pm 
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Im still stuck in the same situation. I am decreasing the frequency considerably though. When I first started talking to you guys about it I was making 5-9 trips a day to a private place, now im down to 2-4


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 8:29 pm 
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Good luck, T7! We're rooting for ya!


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:30 pm 
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T70K5 wrote:
And I have every reason to be ashamed.. im lying to everyone I love and care about. Im killing myself in front of them and none of them even have a clue. .



What is your method right now, are you tapering down on your daily suboxone amount? Or are you simply increasing the amount used per load, but decreasing the overall amount of loads? Just curious.. I really hope you figure out something that works for you.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 11:15 am 
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You need extensive addiction counseling. Bottom line. These behaviors are so deeply rooted in us, we need major cognitive behavior therapy to UNlearn our addictive ways. When this medication is taken correctly, it is an amazing tool to use while you're actively seeking help for yourself. I don't say this with judgement at all! Hope you know that. I say this because I truly believe you need long term therapy in order to heal from all this. Suboxone is a small, albeit important, piece of our recovery puzzle. Sometimes the ritual or habit is just as addictive as the substance. There is one girl on here (or maybe another forum) that continues to inject water because the process of using the needle was harder to kick than the drugs. Our brain is powerful. I wish you lots of love and luck on your journey and I hope you'll continue posting.

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