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 Post subject: Very sleepy
PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 3:18 pm 
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Just to keep you up to date:

First dose was 10pm Wednesday of 2mg.
This dose actually made me a little hyper, could have been mental though.

Second dose around 36 hours later because I started getting w/d's:
I took 1mg of sub around 11am and now it's about 2:13pm and this time it's making me very sleepy/drowsy.

Just making sure it's normal since the first time it made me a little hyper instead of sleepy and it's 1mg lower than the first.

Thanks.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 3:32 pm 
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Keep in mind that at doses that low, suboxone acts more like a full agonist than the partial agonist that it is. This could very well be the reason you're feeling the ups and downs. You're not on a stable dose, so this could continue to happen until you stop taking it.

That said, I'm not a doctor and I'm sure others will have some ideas.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 3:38 pm 
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I'm kind of confused... so a lower dosage is stronger than a higher dosage?
or
Is it like taking a regular opiate or something like you said about it being like a full agonist (which I don't know what that means)?

Thanks for quick reply.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 3:47 pm 
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I'm sorry, I should have been clearer. "Regular" pain pills are full agonists, whereas Suboxone is a partial agonist. Sub has a ceiling effect and you don't build up a tolerance to it, among other things. This is why sub doesn't generally make people high - when they are on a stable dose. With a stable dose, your opiate receptors are saturated and stay saturated, so there's nothing to feel when we take it. At low doses, the receptors aren't constantly saturated, so they respond a little bit more like a regular pain pill in that you "feel" the dose. The receptors go from saturated (or even partially saturated) to no saturation at all, especially considering the way you are dosing (up to every 36 hours).

I hope that explains it better. It sounds like other than this your quick taper plan is going well for you. You might just have to tough it out until you're done with the sub. With any luck, you will still get more used to it even in the short term and these effects might subside.

I hope this helps. If you have more questions, just ask away! :D

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 4:06 pm 
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I'm trying to understand and here is my attempt:

So sub blocks the opiate receptors in the brain to kinda break away from the feeling of needing an opiate and also blocking the w/d symptoms associated with that if you are either detoxing or "ran out".
The higher dosage of the sub that I take the more it blocks the opiate receptors and the smaller the dosage the less it blocks them... I'm assuming this is correct.
So by taking a smaller dose it makes it feel a little more like taking an opiate because it's not fully blocking the effects?

Please feel free to bash me or tell me I'm absolutely wrong or whatever, because I would rather know exactly what's going on than only understanding a piece of it.

On top of this, I am still going to stay on the plan I described in my other post as in:
next time I start feeling w/d's I will take 0.5mg then the next will be 0.25mg etc... until the w/d's subside.

Thank you very much for helping me through this and so far so good.

P.S: Is the sleepiness going to last all day or should it subside in a few hours or so? Don't want to walk around like the night of the living dead (well it's not that bad, just a funny reference lol)


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 5:14 pm 
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You've pretty much got it, except that sub doesn't block the opiate receptors, it occupies them, like a regular pain pill/full agonist. It's hard to say how long that tired feeling will last. I would say it would probably subside in a few hours, but I could be wrong about that. I think based on your history and how it's going, your plan might be the best thing for you. Keep at it and I hope you feel better soon.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 5:37 pm 
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Okay, so it occupies them... I was close :P

I'm still pretty sleepy... and just noticed that my palms are a little sweaty and my jaw is a little stiff.
I'm not sure if it's because of my anxiety or if it's normal (side effects?).
I was thinking of taking a half of one of my klonopins to see if it will help, but I know it's going to make me even more sleepy... no win scenario there lol.

Are those side effects normal... and do you think I should be fine if I take a half of one of my klonopins (it's been a little over 6 hours since I took the sub)? or should I wait until bedtime?


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 5:46 pm 
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I'm no doctor, but you should be fine taking a klonopin. And yes, sweating is a side effect. As for your jaw, I'm betting you're anxious and maybe you could be grinding your teeth? That can really cause jaw pain and stiffness. Just a thought I had. I still think you'll adjust better to that sleepiness. Keep us posted.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 5:50 pm 
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Yeah, I really think its my anxiety (7 years of it)... and now having to worry about when taking my klonopin is also keeping me on edge.
It's really amazing though that a lower dosage almost feels stronger (in a sense).

Thanks and will keep you updated.

P.S: Sent you a Private Message. :D


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:20 pm 
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Thank you again for your time, I really appreciate it.

I am just thinking about it too much.

I just had one last question.

Just because I only took 1mg today, does that mean that the w/d's are going to hit earlier?
or
Is it the same half life?

That's the last thing in my thinking.

Again I really appreciate it.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:42 pm 
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Yes, the way I understand it, the 1 mg might not last as long as a higher dose would.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 04, 2011 11:11 pm 
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I figured that.

I feel like I'm asking too many questions... but I feel i need to, but I do have one more question.

I never got to discuss with my doctor and now it's the weekend and my doctor is unavailable during the weekend (just a practitioner).
We never discussed why I am tapering rapidly... but I am guessing it's because I wasn't on that much along with not that long.

Does suboxone just prolong the w/d's? As in per say they say the 4th day is the worst when w/d'ing from an opiate and then your pretty much good to go but with some lingering w/d's and lack of energy but tolerable for most.

So tomorrow for me without suboxone would be the 4th day without any opiate for me.

So as mentioned, does suboxone prolong the w/d's so that the 4th day would be more like 2nd day or something like that?
I'm sure you know what I mean.
Just trying to figure what to expect this weekend.

Thank you again and sorry if I'm asking too much.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:03 am 
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Sub won't prolong the withdrawals in the way I think you mean. You're taking it pretty spread out and you're tapering quickly. In a sense, you're progressively getting your brain/body used to not having opiates. This will hopefully prevent withdrawals, which occur when you suddenly remove the opiate. I hope this helps. And no, you're not asking too many questions. As they say, knowledge is power and you're just gathering as much information as possible. The more you understand and the more informed you become, the better it is.

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-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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