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 Post subject: using subutex my way...
PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:38 pm 
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ok this is really a question/topic about using low doses of subutex to get a desired effect. First, the only reason i'm on subutex is because i couldnt get my doc (oxy) anymore. there were real (social) issues regarding my addiction, like doctor shopping, ER trips all over the state, and buying illegally. That had to stop...other then that the drug was working for me. For over six months i had mangaged to get myself down to very small doses, like 2.5 of oxy every 2 hrs. I was a great tool that i kept close attention to.

however, when i took the subutex, because of the long half life it is not having the same benefit. Becasue it last so long, it produces this sort of groggy foggyness, that dosent go away. Im sure people who have been on it a long time, dont even notice it anymore.

so, looking into how they use subs for pain management i learned that very small doses like .3mg every 4-6 hours could act similar to pain medication. I have always kept my tolerance low, and the reason for doing so is that i like to go in and out of the "high"....

I dont like to stay high....that's stupid. Without low there is now high. And i think that's why people who take it chronically say they dont get "high".... they are just numb to it... For "on" there must be "off" without it how would you ever know the differnce. That is why i prefer small doses in increments so i can feel it come on, and then feel it subiside, until i return to my old friend....."nothing"....which is the best tool anyone has to guage life by. The oposite of something is nothing.... are you beginning to understand?

If it were not for the social aspects of my addiction, (although i use a very small amount)(and threw away several prescription of fentynal) i would still be using them... I think they are better anyway.

However, since regular pain meds are not an option... my question is....finally......

DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY INFORMATION on the most effective way to use subtex for pain managament.... (like small frequent doses)....???? :?:


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2011 11:25 pm 
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FYI - I've moved this thread to the "Still Messing Around" section which is the more appropriate location for it. As a side note, I'm still drafting my response and will post it later.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 12:01 am 
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Let me get this straight, you're here on an addiction recovery forum for people who are prescribed suboxone as a legitimate tool in that recovery/remission and then you're using suboxone to get high? Better still, you're using the very explanation of how suboxone works so that you can figure out how to get high from it that you got on this very forum. An explanation, incidentally, that I myself gave you in your last thread because you asked, rather innocently enough, or so I thought. And now you want more ideas from us on how you can get a better high from suboxone, is that what your last sentence is about?

You know, there is already a huge stigma and plenty of discrimination against addicts, even recovering ones, that we're fighting every day to overcome. People, even medical personnel, hear the word "suboxone" and often judge us immediately, even though we're only on suboxone because we're in recovery. Then people like you come along, getting suboxone from a doctor, only to use it just to get high. You're only adding to that bias and discrimination, you know.

I want to stress that normally it would be none of my business what you do with your prescribed medications, but since you posted about it on an online forum, you've pretty much opened yourself up to everyone's opinions. Well, it's my opinion (and this is my PERSONAL opinion, NOT a moderator's opinion) that you're being unfair and selfish in using suboxone this way. There are addicts who are literally dying to get into a sub program but all they can find are long waiting lists, while you're taking up a slot, yet you have zero interest in recovery. There are so many other ways to get high out there, but there's only one treatment like suboxone and it's saving lives every day, or it could if it could reach all the people that need and want it. I'm sorry if my words are strong, but I feel very strongly about this. And I'm sorry if my words are too harsh.

Finally, as for your active addiction, just because you think you're in control of said addiction doesn't mean you are. Addiction is by definition not controllable. And addiction never remains the status quo forever. You might be able to sail along for awhile - maybe even a long while - but at some point in time it will begin to snowball, it always does. No one can force you into recovery, not your family/friends, and especially not a bunch of internet strangers. But hopefully you'll be ready soon, and when you are, perhaps suboxone will be appropriate for you. But for now, please stop treating suboxone like something it's not. It's a medical treatment for a legitimate condition. Maybe now is a perfect time to sit down and think about some things. How often are you chasing that high? How much is it interrupting your life? Etc etc. And of course THE question...don't you want it to stop, finally??

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 2:06 am 
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I COULDN'T HAVE STATED IT ANY BETTER, HAT!

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2011 2:49 am 
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auspicious wrote:
However, since regular pain meds are not an option... my question is....finally......

DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY INFORMATION on the most effective way to use subtex for pain managament.... (like small frequent doses)....???? :?:


The most effective way to use subutex for pain management is by listening to the advice and instructions of your doctor. I'm sure if you ask all of these questions at your next appointment he (or she) will be happy to tell you the answers.

My guess though is that at very low doses, a STABLE dose of subutex is what they shoot for, which is why the new patches are popular. They deliver as steady microgram dose over time (once the medication is built up in the bloodstream). This of course means that once acclimated there will be pain relief but no "high".


As for people who take Sub "chronically" (or as I like to think of it "appropriately") not getting high, not having ups and downs, etc...THAT IS THE FUCKING POINT OF THE MEDICATION. That's why in Sub treatment, best practice is to dose once per day. This helps to break the addictive cycle of getting high, coming down and getting high again - also known as the response/reward cycle.

Lastly, I would like to say that we are all here to support each other in our attempts at recovery and you are welcome here in that regard...but I think you will find better answers to your questions on other message boards that are devoted to that kind of thing. I'm sure you know what they are. Have a nice day!

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 9:57 pm 
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Sounds like you are facing some really serious consequences to your use. The mind can rationalize some crazy stuff. My use was defined by a week or two of use and than a month or two off, over and over and over again. While I guess this is some form of "control", at the end it was not helping me and was playing with fire.

Suboxone is a great tool to use, but its not meant to be a "not get dope sick pill".

Doctor shopping is very illegal though, I am not judging, but people can convince themselves to take some very serious risks when desperate. I would suggest sitting down, being honest and making a list of the Pros and Cons of Using and the Pros and Cons of not using. Write it out.


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 Post subject: thanks
PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 3:54 pm 
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I do believe sub is a wonderful answer to many issues. My troubles are well in the midst of being figured out. I agree with everything said here pretty much. Thanks


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:05 pm 
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I understand that using Subutex in the way you are describing.

Part of me says that what you're doing is a form of harm minimisation. You're not doctor shopping, you're not breaking the law, you're less likely to end up in court... so you are likely doing yourself less harm by taking Subutex than your drug of choice.

You and I both know though that you are still in active addiction. You are simply using Subutex as you would use your Oxy's. You still clearly believe that drugs are the answer to your problems.

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That is why i prefer small doses in increments so i can feel it come on, and then feel it subiside, until i return to my old friend....."nothing"....which is the best tool anyone has to guage life by. The oposite of something is nothing.... are you beginning to understand?


This is so typical of the kinda thoughts and perspectives I had deep in my active addiction. I was such a creative tortured soul! Such a junkie philosopher. :lol: 'You need to feel nothing in order to know what it is to feel something'. 'You need to feel low in order to feel high.' You know who originally came up with that kinda concept? Marquis de Sade. He said that you need to feel pain in order to know what pleasure is. Somehow you've distorted it in your addiction goggles. I think that's the reality you're running away from, because you're running away from any pain by taking drugs. Sometimes you just gotta break through the pain of getting clean to finally discover who you are, ya know. Sometimes you just gotta harden the (*@k up, ya know? :lol:

Finally, everything in your post was about you. Nowhere in there did you acknowledge the feelings and consequences for anyone other than your self. You are not alone though. This is the biggest symptom of addiction - the inability to see outside yourself. You got the 'blinkers on'. What you don't realise is that whenever you abuse your Subutex, you make it harder for people who want to get well to have more options in their recovery. My doctor doesn't allow me on Subutex as 'too many people got on it just to abuse it'. Thank you very much. :shock:

I really hope you get well soon. I've been where you are, don't you worry, so I will reserve judgement. But at the same time, it's frustrating how it affects other people, not to mention the people in your life as well.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:02 am 
auspicious wrote:
there were real (social) issues regarding my addiction, like doctor shopping, ER trips all over the state, and buying illegally. That had to stop...other then that the drug was working for me.


lol! You're funny.

I know that buprenorphine is dosed for pain as .2, .4, and .8 mg doses in Europe. Google Temgesic, that is what it is called.

You aren't going to find the mental 'high' you are craving with Subutex.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 5:31 pm 
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whatever happened to not judging people and just trying to help them, whether in active addiction or not?? I believe this site is meant to support people, not to come down on them for their decisions.. what i got from this post was he was explaining his addiction then saying he's now on Sub and would like to know the best way to use it for pain, I could be wrong about what he meant but either way no one should be judging him or being rude in any way at all... If anyone thinks he is still in active addiction then he's someone that needs support and help the most. Some of the responses to this persons post could very possibly turn someone away from asking for help from people on this site for fear of others "Opinions" if that what you call them. Sorry but reading this just upset me because of many people out there that need help and will come on this site and see things like this.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 5:58 pm 
sodone wrote:
whatever happened to not judging people and just trying to help them, whether in active addiction or not?? I believe this site is meant to support people, not to come down on them for their decisions.. what i got from this post was he was explaining his addiction then saying he's now on Sub and would like to know the best way to use it for pain, I could be wrong about what he meant but either way no one should be judging him or being rude in any way at all... If anyone thinks he is still in active addiction then he's someone that needs support and help the most. Some of the responses to this persons post could very possibly turn someone away from asking for help from people on this site for fear of others "Opinions" if that what you call them. Sorry but reading this just upset me because of many people out there that need help and will come on this site and see things like this.


This site IS meant to support people. Not just with false "you can do its!" either. This site is for real, truthful advice from other addicts. This person came on here asking how to get high from it. Just because he added on "for pain management" at the end of the post doesn't matter. Read the rest of the post, he isn't trying to use Sub for maintenance, he is asking if he can take it every few days and still get high without worrying about going into w/d. I can understand why people on this forum who are struggling don't like that. People like OP ruin the good name of junkies going to the Sub doctor (lol)

These are direct quotes from the OP: And i think that's why people who take it chronically say they dont get "high".... they are just numb to it... For "on" there must be "off" without it how would you ever know the differnce. That is why i prefer small doses in increments so i can feel it come on, and then feel it subiside, until i return to my old friend.[/quote]

and my favorite

First, the only reason i'm on subutex is because i couldnt get my doc (oxy) anymore. there were real (social) issues regarding my addiction, like doctor shopping, ER trips all over the state, and buying illegally. That had to stop...other then that the drug was working for me. [/quote]

OP has the right to say funny/bizarre/whatever shit, and we have the right to LOL.

I'm sorry sodone, but it is hard for me to have sympathy for this person..except maybe to feel sorry for him about being in denial.


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 Post subject: what the hell.
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 1:36 pm 
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What kind of an idiot set this up so you cant use the "back" button after previewing your post. I spent 1 hour writing something and it's gone?

Maybe someone should look into this.....

Anyway expect a post from me soon...


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 Post subject: Re: what the hell.
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 1:46 pm 
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auspicious wrote:
What kind of an idiot...


OK, is name calling really necessary?

BTW, after you've previewed your post, you don't have to go back. You can edit your post on the same page, just down lower, or submit it on that same page. And even if you did go back a page, you still shouldn't have a problem or lose your post. I've done that accidentally a few times and have never lost any of my posts. I just go forward again and there it is!

Regardless of your issue with the forum, please refrain from calling people names.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:40 pm 
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thanks Diary of a quitter for your post. Very diplomatic. and i think a lot of us would be helped to know once a day dosing would be more helpful especially when weaning off. my doctor said you should always dose twice daily..big mistake..made it more difficult to get out of that mindset. my doctor was wrong about other things too..like .. getting off will be no problem..you'll feel like you have the flu for a couple days. BS!.i tapered for months and have been off since dec.26. still not feeling that great. not horrible just when i think i am in the clear i get anxious, antsy and super fatigued...off and on. but kno this too shall pass. just wish medical profession and pharm. could be more honest


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 Post subject: Very annoying
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:28 am 
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:x I can feel the frustrations of all the legit sub user's. The same thing goes on in the methadone world even more so I believe and it really is cut throat to the one's that really need the slot at the doctor's office etc.. If auspicious wants such answers maybe she needs to go to topix forum where there is no one really serious about recovery and she could relate to active addicts as there is no way for her to relate to us at this point. If we found ourselves engaging many post like this one we will be no better than topix or bluelight etc...Where although there might be some people in recovery most people just want to learn how to use with less bad effects. Some are sicker than others so therefore we should be here for the suffering and active addict but not to teach someone how to stay in active addiction we should strive to help active be arrested. Sodone I do see your point of view and I commend you for your compassion so maybe you can reach her more effectively for her needs. But no one has done anything wrong in telling an active addict that is asking questions about continued abuse that this forum is not going to promote such counterproductive posts.

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 Post subject: Re: Very annoying
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:51 am 
finallyachance wrote:
:x I can feel the frustrations of all the legit sub user's. The same thing goes on in the methadone world even more so I believe and it really is cut throat to the one's that really need the slot at the doctor's office etc.. If auspicious wants such answers maybe she needs to go to topix forum where there is no one really serious about recovery and she could relate to active addicts as there is no way for her to relate to us at this point. If we found ourselves engaging many post like this one we will be no better than topix or bluelight etc...Where although there might be some people in recovery most people just want to learn how to use with less bad effects. Some are sicker than others so therefore we should be here for the suffering and active addict but not to teach someone how to stay in active addiction we should strive to help active be arrested.


Yeah you are so much better than all those junkies cuz your pills come in a bottle from the pharmacy.

I am all for harm reduction in any way it can come.


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 Post subject: No
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 3:47 am 
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I don't think I am better than anyone, I am a junkie myself. Just a junkie that is doing the harm reduction avenue and while I am doing this I also go to counseling and NA. I have never eluded to any fact of being better than anyone. I just don't promote telling people how to abuse pills any longer. So in a way my behavior is better than it used to be. I am not sure what you are eluding to in your comment Ironic, but why don't you just come right out and say it instead of suggesting that I think I am better than anyone.

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 Post subject: Re: Very annoying
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2012 6:00 pm 
finallyachance wrote:
:x I can feel the frustrations of all the legit sub user's... If auspicious wants such answers maybe she needs to go to topix forum where there is no one really serious about recovery and she could relate to active addicts as there is no way for her to relate to us at this point. If we found ourselves engaging many post like this one we will be no better than topix or bluelight etc...Where although there might be some people in recovery most people just want to learn how to use with less bad effects. Some are sicker than others so therefore we should be here for the suffering and active addict but not to teach someone how to stay in active addiction we should strive to help active be arrested...But no one has done anything wrong in telling an active addict that is asking questions about continued abuse that this forum is not going to promote such counterproductive posts.


You suggested someone visit a different forum for answers, implying that they don't deserve their answers here the way "legit" sub users do.

Then you even went on to say we should "strive to help active [addicts] be arrested." Why should we do that? Because they have a problem (some would even call it a "disease")? The same problem we all have, but we are lucky enough to be prescribed Sub to help us with?

Giving someone good information about Sub isn't "teach[ing] someone how to stay in active addiction." It is harm reduction.

I find it offensive that you seem to believe that the little piece of paper the doctor gives you to get your pills somehow makes you more "legit" (as you said) or worthy of help than someone without a prescription. Actually, the OP may very well have a prescription (it was a little unclear). You are judging someone based on YOUR standards for YOUR recovery and I don't think that's right.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:52 pm 
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hey ironic'. i'm not too aware of recovery right now ' because we like to stay in the middle of things 'witch make it more interesting in our addiction'. but one thing yet.' we need to be more aware of are addition :lol: it is more stronger and more danger's than we think?

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 8:00 am 
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Ironic is no longer part of this forum. I'm sorry if she made anyone feel like crap, but she won't be doing that anymore.

As you were....

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