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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 11:08 am 
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took me a while to find it but here

http://onlinetablets.net/search/?q=clonidine


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 Post subject: checkin in!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:22 pm 
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Hey ladder-Just thought I'd check in and see how you're doing today? I am trying to get to .5 daily, and am so nervouse too. So I thought of you, and how you are doing so well. I haven't got the sneezies yet, just have this obnoxious smell that won't go away today. I started on Friday and did 1mg, sat .5 sun 1 and will do the .5 tonight again. I'm trying to over power my mind, but am worried when the half life sets in I'll blow that out of the water! LOL Anyway, was just thinking of you and hoping you are having a great day today!! Oh and my dr prescribed another dose of the clonidine for mornings too while I go down. So hopefully if you are able to get some of that it will help ease your symptoms!
Hang in there!! We're all pulling for ya!
Big giant hugs!!!

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 Post subject: Thanks!!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:29 pm 
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OMG, mg113, thanks sooooo much!! I'm gonna try it out now that I've got enough time.

RainRain, thank you so much for those sweet words! It's wonderful to know someone actually wonders how you are doing, KWIM? I've been on Sub sooooo long....I wonder if there's anyone even on this forum whose been on it longer that me. It was 2005 when I started it. Of course my body is freaking out, right? I don't feel too bad right now. The mornings are roughest. I really wish my doc knew how normal it is to take Clonidine during tapering. He said we could talk about it when I decide to jump, but I need it before then. Hopefully, this online thing will work.

laddertipper

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 Post subject: Re: Thanks!!
PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 6:39 pm 
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laddertipper wrote:
OMG, mg113, thanks sooooo much!! I'm gonna try it out now that I've got enough time.

RainRain, thank you so much for those sweet words! It's wonderful to know someone actually wonders how you are doing, KWIM? I've been on Sub sooooo long....I wonder if there's anyone even on this forum whose been on it longer that me. It was 2005 when I started it. Of course my body is freaking out, right? I don't feel too bad right now. The mornings are roughest. I really wish my doc knew how normal it is to take Clonidine during tapering. He said we could talk about it when I decide to jump, but I need it before then. Hopefully, this online thing will work.

laddertipper


Yes it is no surprise your poor body is screaming at you right now! But IMO that makes you all the more of a bad ass for doing this. You are tougher then you probably think just by getting to where you are even after being on it for so long. I am surprised with your dr myself. I am a nurse and Clonidines main action is to help with blood pressure, there really is no reason that I can see that he would feel it an issue for you to take it. You will do fine with the online pharmacy, unfortunately I have much experience with them, as that is where I got all of my tramadols. It couldn't be any easier actually. It's just expensive. I don't have insurance and a 30 day supply of clonidine at a regular pharmacy here in town only costs me about 20 bucks. So you'll pay more at the online one, but if it's what you gotta do then so be it. Just remember you only need .1mg. I was just prescribed it 2 x a day now that I'm going lower, so make sure to specify that in your questionairre they give you. You'll be able to get a supply of 90 if I remember correctly. I didn't get headaches, or any problems with feeling groggy when on it. We'll see if the extra pill a day makes a difference on that, and I'll let you know right away if it does. I suffer from severe migraines though and anything will trigger it, so if I didn't get a headache from it, I don't think you will either. But I do know the fear with taking a new med, I've always had anxiety surrounding that. Anyway I better get out for my run before it gets dark. I hope you have a good evening girlie!! I'll check back with everyone before bed!! I still am holding off on my .5 tonight, going to take it as late as possible. Hugs!!!!

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We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned,
so as to have the life that is waiting for us.
The old skin has to be shed before the new one can come.
- Joseph Campbell


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 Post subject: Re: Thanks!!
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:43 am 
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RainRainGoAway wrote:
laddertipper wrote:
OMG, mg113, thanks sooooo much!! I'm gonna try it out now that I've got enough time.

RainRain, thank you so much for those sweet words! It's wonderful to know someone actually wonders how you are doing, KWIM? I've been on Sub sooooo long....I wonder if there's anyone even on this forum whose been on it longer that me. It was 2005 when I started it. Of course my body is freaking out, right? I don't feel too bad right now. The mornings are roughest. I really wish my doc knew how normal it is to take Clonidine during tapering. He said we could talk about it when I decide to jump, but I need it before then. Hopefully, this online thing will work.

laddertipper


Yes it is no surprise your poor body is screaming at you right now! But IMO that makes you all the more of a bad ass for doing this. You are tougher then you probably think just by getting to where you are even after being on it for so long. I am surprised with your dr myself. I am a nurse and Clonidines main action is to help with blood pressure, there really is no reason that I can see that he would feel it an issue for you to take it. You will do fine with the online pharmacy, unfortunately I have much experience with them, as that is where I got all of my tramadols. It couldn't be any easier actually. It's just expensive. I don't have insurance and a 30 day supply of clonidine at a regular pharmacy here in town only costs me about 20 bucks. So you'll pay more at the online one, but if it's what you gotta do then so be it. Just remember you only need .1mg. I was just prescribed it 2 x a day now that I'm going lower, so make sure to specify that in your questionairre they give you. You'll be able to get a supply of 90 if I remember correctly. I didn't get headaches, or any problems with feeling groggy when on it. We'll see if the extra pill a day makes a difference on that, and I'll let you know right away if it does. I suffer from severe migraines though and anything will trigger it, so if I didn't get a headache from it, I don't think you will either. But I do know the fear with taking a new med, I've always had anxiety surrounding that. Anyway I better get out for my run before it gets dark. I hope you have a good evening girlie!! I'll check back with everyone before bed!! I still am holding off on my .5 tonight, going to take it as late as possible. Hugs!!!!


That is fantastic to hear about not getting headaches from the Clonidine. I am just like you as far as headaches. I get bad, bad ones and they can last three days at times. Blech. They aren't actually migraines. They are from my head injury, but at this point they are pretty manageable. I have Midrin to take if needed, but I haven't taken it in so long that I really don't remember the last time I took it. That's great because for a while it seemed like I would always have a headache. I've come a long way in that regard. I think I will probably take 1/4 of the Clonidine when it gets here, just to be safe. Then, I can up it as needed. I got the .1 mg ones. I really was shocked at how easy that was. It's harder to order a book from Amazon and I had exactly five minutes before I needed to be out the door and I completed the whole order in that time. Wow!! That's simply incredible! Thank you, Canada!! Merci beaucoup!

laddertipper

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:52 am 
With my experience i never even really withdrawaled till i tried to go below .5 . Maybe this point for you is at 1 mg but regardless i tried many times to detox slower whatever, and i still felt the pain. The best advice i can give you is to bite the bullet and wake up sweaty, you cant expect it to be complately painless. And the fact you said you woke up meant you fell asleep am i right? I had nights where i didnt sleep AT ALL. What helped me was when i got so sick of it i just tried to quit cold turkey, and the pain from that was rediculous and really put my the taper in perspective ya know. Trust me it could be a hell of a lot worse and a couple sweaty nights with anxiety is well worth it to get off the drug and not feel numb. I know how defensive people get on this site if you even say sub has a negative sympton so i will re iterate, it made ME feel numb. And the feeling of being off is so amazing! I LOVEEEEEEEEEEEE LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:56 am 
Onniegrapples wrote:
With my experience i never even really withdrawaled till i tried to go below .5 . Maybe this point for you is at 1 mg but regardless i tried many times to detox slower whatever, and i still felt the pain. The best advice i can give you is to bite the bullet and wake up sweaty, you cant expect it to be complately painless. And the fact you said you woke up meant you fell asleep am i right? I had nights where i didnt sleep AT ALL. What helped me was when i got so sick of it i just tried to quit cold turkey, and the pain from that was rediculous and really put my the taper in perspective ya know. Trust me it could be a hell of a lot worse and a couple sweaty nights with anxiety is well worth it to get off the drug and not feel numb. I know how defensive people get on this site if you even say sub has a negative sympton so i will re iterate, it made ME feel numb. And the feeling of being off is so amazing! I LOVEEEEEEEEEEEE LIFE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Never mind i re read and your dosing twice daily. I was dosing every other day, the suboxone half life is 37.5 hours so your not really taking 1 mg as your dose. Its stacking in your system and for ME i never had success until i was able to put days in between dosing and from there the goal was much easier to reach. I felt like no mater how low i got with the daily dosing i was just fooling myself although ive heard others had success with this. But just remember its not like other opiates and stacks, that knowledge really helped me. And you cant expect this to be completely painless. I read your post when you started tapering and i started a couple months after you, im not comparing myself at all as im an athlete that is very in touch with his body, and was very fed up with the feeling of sub, but im clean now because of the every other day advice, and to be honest i still detoxed pretty hardcore for a week or two after i quit at .05 much worse than the actual taper, i guess we dont really know what it does. But looking back in hindsight, i was a rare case where i should have never been prescribed sub dose long term, i didnt really have a problem with opiates more than a couple weeks and immediately changed my ways and never relapsed and got high. But the sub detox was never ending it seemed, i would have rather gone through the hells of morphine detox and just been sick for 7-10 days. Of course im complaining on the wrong website though.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:04 am 
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Ladder, regarding the Clonidine.....Canadian's RULE!!! Je vous en prie, madame!

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:23 am 
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I cant believe how easy it was either, my dr gave me a script but he wont let me take more then .1 g per day because I have low bp and he thinks it will make me pass out, there have been a few days I needed on in the am and one at night .... I just want to be prepared for my jump... ya know an addict obscessing about stuff lol so I ordered 60 which should get me thru the bad days.


Viva Canada is right!!!

:)

hang tough girl


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:09 pm 
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Updating: I'm still quite stuck. Today, I got very, very down and it kinda scared me. You know when the world kinda turns all dark and terrible? I felt like throwing in the towel and saying "forget it" but I though that through and arrived at the same conclusion I always do, which is that I just need to hang tight. I ask myself if I'm okay with going back up and the answer is 'no'. So, I wonder how nice it would be to take a big heap of Sub, which I'm soooo tempted to do lately, but I think that through and I know it would kill my spirit, so the answer to that is 'no' as well. This is my 167th day of tapering with NO cheating. If I cheated, I'd be so angry at myself, so I talk myself out of it. I ask myself if I can handle going down and the answer is no, because I'm still not okay here. I ask myself if I'm okay taking Sub forever, and the answer is 'no' because to me, staying of Sub just because I cannot get off is not a good enough reason. So, I go around in this big circle and come back to the beginning. I'm a little scared of that addict part of me making a nutty decision on the fly to take a bunch of Sub. Lately, I've been so focused on the Sub and wanting to take it and waiting for it to be time to take it, being excited to take it, etc. It's not really that it makes me high, because frankly, it's only once in a while that I feel anything noticeable from it. It's more a desire to get a release from the symptoms. I had to lock my Sub up just so it would take me a bit longer to execute a hasty decision. I feel guilty for staying at one dose for sooooo long, but if I'm still sick here, then how will it be any better if I go lower, stacking effect or no stacking effect.

So, here I am at 1 mg and it's my 28th day here. It's weird because I've only heard one or two people online say they were never able to stabilize at a certain dose and had some suspected brain damage from Sub, so I know that it's highly, highly unlikely that I have damage from long-term Suboxone use. However, this little voice is certainly torturing me with that slim possibility...that may not even be a possibility. To me, if I could only get to where I feel normal here, it would mean everything because I'd be proving to myself that even if you take Sub for as long as I have, you can still taper off it if you just hang in there. I don't have a lot of confidence in that right now, just because of how long this is lasting, when it used to take me only 5 days to stabilize after a taper. Yesterday, I had a pretty good day and I was optimistic, so it was a disappointment to wake up at 3 a.m. with the electric chill things. It's so strange to go forward and backward over and over, especially because there can been no forward trend over the past few weeks. In fact, today is probably the worst day I've have in over a week. I dropped 28 days ago and got sick, then felt better, thought about dropping to .75, did that for 1 day, got very sick, went back to 1 and things settled into a reliable level of symptoms. My symptoms are the same. Sneezing (which I don't mind except when I'm trying to hold my Sub under my tongue); leg pain (which I never thought I was going to get); general aches; lethargy of the body; electric chills. Maybe I need to be on 1 mg a few months. I'm trying not to freak out. I've contacted so many, many people at so many places trying to find someone with THE answer, but no one seems to have it, so this is kinda like flying blind.

Thanks for reading guys.

laddertipper

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:45 pm 
Hi Laddertipper! I'm sorry you're having such a hard time with your taper. I know you've researched and studied and asked questions and thought and thought and thought about all this for a long time. And I know that you want more than anything to have this done and over with. I have had many of those same feelings. I don't want to just hit you with the same old cliches that we tend to hear from very well-meaning and good intentioned folks. I have heard them all too. And while I appreciate them and know them to almost all be true, they just don't help that much sometimes when we're feeling so "stuck."
I do have a thought for you though. And I hope you'll receive it in the spirit I'm sending it. Have you tried to just stop counting days and stop reaching, reaching so hard for that goal of being done? Have you tried to sort of 'tune out' a bit regarding your symptoms of withdrawal and just redirect your thoughts onto something more pleasant? I realize that may sound overly simplistic, but it's something that I am working on myself. And I'm finding that it takes more work than I thought it would! Unlike you, what I have to work on redirecting is not only my thoughts about getting off Sub, but also my thoughts and cravings for using full-agonists, wanting to get 'high.' I hate it and I find myself obsessing about it a lot. I want those thoughts and desires to be gone so badly that I almost sabotage myself by thinking about it so much. Then my thoughts turn to doubts about whether I can ever do this....get off and stay off all opiates. I can pretty quickly get myself into a dark place within my own head. Gosh, I hope that makes sense!
Anyway, I'm just suggesting that you think about just focusing more on the progress that you have made and the good things in your life, instead of the seemingly fairly mild, yet nagging w/d symptoms you're experiencing which are keeping you from continuing your taper. I swear, our minds and our words have so much power. If we're constantly thinking and speaking (writing) about our difficulties and doubts, we're almost predicting and in some ways, creating ongoing problems with this stuff. Do you agree at all? I mean, this may not apply to everything. Very few things in life are so simple as to be controlled simply by our thoughts and confessions, but I do believe there is some degree of power there.
You are doing great! You have come very far after being on Sub for such a long time. You are on a very low dose, well below 'ceiling.' Give yourself a break (sorry, had to throw a cliche in on you!) But, honestly, you are on a good track. Disappointed though you may be that things aren't happening as quickly as you like, there may be a reason for this. Perhaps by being kind of forced into going slowly, you'll avoid some problems later on down the line. I think it's just one of those situations that "is what it is." Thinking about it constantly, focusing on every problematic symptom that comes up and feeling defeated about your progress isn't changing anything. So maybe it's time to try something different.....just quit worrying about it and believe with all your heart that you WILL get there. That's what I'm trying to do myself.
I don't know if this helps you or not, ladder. I feel for you. But I do have confidence in you. Hang in there!


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 10:43 pm 
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setmefree wrote:
Hi Laddertipper! I'm sorry you're having such a hard time with your taper. I know you've researched and studied and asked questions and thought and thought and thought about all this for a long time. And I know that you want more than anything to have this done and over with. I have had many of those same feelings. I don't want to just hit you with the same old cliches that we tend to hear from very well-meaning and good intentioned folks. I have heard them all too. And while I appreciate them and know them to almost all be true, they just don't help that much sometimes when we're feeling so "stuck."
I do have a thought for you though. And I hope you'll receive it in the spirit I'm sending it. Have you tried to just stop counting days and stop reaching, reaching so hard for that goal of being done? Have you tried to sort of 'tune out' a bit regarding your symptoms of withdrawal and just redirect your thoughts onto something more pleasant? I realize that may sound overly simplistic, but it's something that I am working on myself. And I'm finding that it takes more work than I thought it would! Unlike you, what I have to work on redirecting is not only my thoughts about getting off Sub, but also my thoughts and cravings for using full-agonists, wanting to get 'high.' I hate it and I find myself obsessing about it a lot. I want those thoughts and desires to be gone so badly that I almost sabotage myself by thinking about it so much. Then my thoughts turn to doubts about whether I can ever do this....get off and stay off all opiates. I can pretty quickly get myself into a dark place within my own head. Gosh, I hope that makes sense!
Anyway, I'm just suggesting that you think about just focusing more on the progress that you have made and the good things in your life, instead of the seemingly fairly mild, yet nagging w/d symptoms you're experiencing which are keeping you from continuing your taper. I swear, our minds and our words have so much power. If we're constantly thinking and speaking (writing) about our difficulties and doubts, we're almost predicting and in some ways, creating ongoing problems with this stuff. Do you agree at all? I mean, this may not apply to everything. Very few things in life are so simple as to be controlled simply by our thoughts and confessions, but I do believe there is some degree of power there.
You are doing great! You have come very far after being on Sub for such a long time. You are on a very low dose, well below 'ceiling.' Give yourself a break (sorry, had to throw a cliche in on you!) But, honestly, you are on a good track. Disappointed though you may be that things aren't happening as quickly as you like, there may be a reason for this. Perhaps by being kind of forced into going slowly, you'll avoid some problems later on down the line. I think it's just one of those situations that "is what it is." Thinking about it constantly, focusing on every problematic symptom that comes up and feeling defeated about your progress isn't changing anything. So maybe it's time to try something different.....just quit worrying about it and believe with all your heart that you WILL get there. That's what I'm trying to do myself.
I don't know if this helps you or not, ladder. I feel for you. But I do have confidence in you. Hang in there!


Setmefree, thanks for all those reassuring words. Sometimes it is so hard to not write in lots of cliches, because we try to put our honest heartfelt thoughts into meaningful and accurate words, only to realize we just reiterated a cliche. I think cliches are just so very true :D

I do hear what you're saying and you are right about needing to redirect and focus on the positives. One thing with my taper is that I have refused to push it to a level where I cannot be a good parent and wife. I don't want to do that to my family, and really I cannot push past a certain point. My kids and husband need me to function!! I know you understand that. I've taken up some hobbies to keep my mind busy. I don't watch t.v. much anymore. I've gotten back into reading and like I've said, learned to play piano and a little guitar. For some reason, this recent little, tiny drop has left me totally sapped and sick and tired of the whole thing. I went slowly, but I still managed to push it too hard, I guess. So, I planned to take a month off once I stabilized to enjoy feeling good. Trouble is that I'm not stabilizing! It's okay. I can still take my month off, but I am just afraid that there is something wrong with me and I just cannot and will not stabilize because of that something. If I knew I'd be fine at some point, I'd be much more positive. It gets a little scary when it goes on and on. I'm worried. I've been on Sub so long, it's a partial agonist and our brains aren't wired for partial agonists, etc. Those are the things I'm worried about. I also made a big mistake in planning out how long it should take me, even though I gave myself a pretty long time. I told my whole family when I'd be done and it's just not going to happen when I thought it would. I try to hide it from the people around me, as far as how I'm feeling, but I know they can tell sometimes.

I'm just trying to shut down this fear of the unknown that is kinda creeping in. What if I warped my receptors or something and they can't recover? I don't even know what to be afraid of. The fact that we moved to a colder climate and I've been freezing for months on end does not help. I'm pretty sure that once it gets warm, everything will seem better. Yikes, I'm sorry to be so negative. Really, I'm just scared.

You're right. I don't have to deal with cravings and I totally and completely take that for granted. I rarely consider that other people are dealing with the symptoms AND cravings. Seriously, that must be so tough, because alcohol cravings were not fun, but alcohol w/d lasted five days. It would have been much, much harder to quit drinking if I'd been in w/d for months for the thing that I loved to use. I've even had some alcohol cravings lately. I'm not too worried about them. I'm used to handling those and it's been so long since I drank that I can stop myself. I just want to escape sometimes from this and there's no way to escape, which feels like being in a little box, which is where the alcohol thoughts come in.

Do you really believe it's not possible that my brain is permanently damaged? :D

Thanks again so much,

laddertipper

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 12:53 am 
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Heck, I thought my brain was permanently damaged too. You know what my wd was like and talk about being scared shitless that I would NEVER feel normal again.....I had that feeling for months and months and months, but I somehow refused to give up? Was it my stubborness, maybe? Was it the fact that I KNEW in my heart that I was done with meds, maybe? Honest to goodness, I believe, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that God 'flipped a switch' in my brain and that allowed me to be where I am today. I simply knew that it was my time to quit and I just KNEW I was going to be successful. That complete faith that He arranged this for me gave me the strength and courage that I needed on a daily basis to survive my wd. Ladder, I know you're a Christian, I know that you are hurting and scared right now and you should know that God wants you to turn all of your doubts and worries over to Him and to step out in faith. The more you let go of all this worrying and crap, the more you are giving the power back to Him to help you. The more you try to research and figure this stuff out on your own, the less help you are going to get from Him. You can keep on the path you're on now and God will allow you to completely break yourself.....once you are completely broken and you have given up complete control, then and only then will He step in completely. As long as you're trying to control things, He won't be able to help you fully. You have to remember, God gave us all free will....this is a hard one to explain.....he does not infringe upon our free will? As long as we act like we're in charge, He is OK to sit back and watch us go flying head long into a brick wall. Once we put Him in charge and submit our will to His own, then stuff really starts happening.

I can't tell you how many times in my life this has happened to me. I fight and fight like a maniac to control something in my life and only once I get to the point of complete failure is He able to step in and put me back on the right path.

I hope what I said made sense to you. It didn't seem to come out quite like I wanted it too, but I think I got my point across?

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 1:28 am 
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Yes, that's a very important thing to remember. As you know, I've got a weird relationship with religion. I wasn't raised in a religious house, but I've always known there's a God and felt that presence strongly. Life in general is so unpredictable, but the one consistent thing is that whenever I truly give up power and just accept each day as it comes and have faith, everything goes much better and lots of little things start happening to show me I'm on the right path. I do pray a lot. The only reason I was able to stop drinking was because I had nothing left but faith that if I did the right thing from that moment on, God would do the rest, and He did. God relieved that insanity, and I didn't believe it was possible, so that was a shocker. I'm really working of changing my mindset. I hit such a dark place and it scared me pretty badly. I don't know how to explain it exactly, but I could feel that I was in trouble. It's absolutely fear-based and the more I try to figure out the science behind this, the crazier it gets me. I have to believe this is going to change and that it's only a matter of time and then just hand it over to God. Romeo, you are totally spot on with this one. I need to get back to just believing that God will help me get through today and that's good enough.

((HUGS)) You are such a sweetheart :D

laddertipper

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:32 am 
Yeah, Ladder, Romeo is so right! It's always been the same for me.....The more I fight to control things in my life, the more out of control they seem to get! Yet when I just rock along, not trying to force things to happen the way I think they should or the way I want, God takes care that good things come to me.
I understand that a lot of people have big problems with organized religion......in many cases, understandably so. For me, it has become much less about "religion" or church and much more about a personal relationship with God and just learning how to live a more spiritual life. I think that's what you're working on too, Ladder, if I understood you correctly. This does require a good deal of faith. And that is where this can get quite uncomfortable for a lot of folks. Faith requires that we believe in things we cannot see, that we believe something to be so even when there is no tangible evidence of it. We have to accept that we are 'there' even before we get there....that God has promised it, therefore it is, not 'will be', not 'will be if', not 'will be when,' but is despite all evidence to the contrary sometimes. I know that sounds crazy to some, but I believe it to be so. So what to do with that? I think we have to start acting as if, speaking as if, and going about our daily life as if. Which means we have to stop worrying about it all the time. We have to stop studying so much, stop trying to figure it all out, stop worrying that perhaps somehow we are different, that somehow what's worked for others won't work for us. You're right, it's fear.....all fear. I've fought it the entire time I've been on Sub.....so afraid this won't work, so afraid I won't ever get off, so afraid I'll never be myself again, that I've done permanent damage to my brain, etc. Oh boy, do I know where you're at!
I think we just have to keep at it. Keep working every day to get out of that fear. And you're right, I do get that you have to function at a certain level for your family. I am right there with you. In fact, that's a good part of what led me to Sub in the first place. I just had been in such severe PAWS for so long that I was on the brink of losing my family. I had already lost my career over this! I had to find a way to get my act together and function at a higher level again! And I can't go back to that....not any time soon anyway. I have to function for my family. Again, that's one of the reasons I've decided I've got to chill out and be okay with taking longer to get off Sub than I really want to. I know that I will not stand up well against the pressure of w/d or PAWS again and that will lead me to relapse. And I can't afford to do that. That leaves me with no other good option that to hang out on a low dose of Sub for a good while. I just have to work on being okay with that!
Ladder, I think you know what you need to do. And I think you can do it. I'm pulling for you!


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:18 pm 
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Big hugs ladder!! You've already been told so many of the things I had wanted to say...Giving it to God being the biggest. I just want you to know that I know exactly what you are going through....I've had to struggle with emotions, and darkness even before subs, and tramadol. There were times I felt so bad, and so down, that I had completely convinced myself that it would always be that way. It's very hard to re-train your thoughts when you are not feeling well. It's only when we finally feel something good that we can get motivation to carry on. I wish there was a magic button that we could hit on those awful awful days....The only thing that I would say is to try not to focus on a time frame. I had to do that too, b/c I was scaring myself, and focusing on when it would be done...When you said that you had told your family a time frame, and then held back that you weren't reaching that from them, I knew exactly what you were talking about. So I just want to say, don't feel guilty!! I don't think that you have brain damage, but I know how easy that is to feel and think. How can we not feel that way when nothing seems to be working. Just know that you are doing great!! Yes you may have to take it a little longer, and stretch this out further, but that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with you. You are listening to your body, and not pushing to hard. You are still allowing yourself to stay at the same dose without pushing to go further down, so somewhere in that pretty head of yours, you are thinking right!! You know deep down not to push to hard, so that leads me to believe you are going to get there at some point, without any permanent damage to your brain.

My best friend at work is married to a neurologist, and if you'd like, just for added reassurance I will ask him about the neurological effects of the subs and give you the information. He has dealt with addiction for over 24 years, so he would be the first person I would feel confident in asking that.

Anyway, I won't go on and on, I just wanted to tell you that you are doing so well, and I know that you will feel more confident in that one day soon. It's not easy to re-train our bodies, especially when it's so used to things the way they are, but it will still happen. I really think giving yourself time, and losing any form of a date is the best thing to do, because you will eliviate all of that pressure. Stress alone can give you many of the symptoms you describe. Anxiety and panic attacks are also able to give you those physical symptoms you are feeling. I have this feeling that if you were able to somehow eliminate that stressor, and feeling frustrated at yourself for staying longer then you wanted too, you might see a decrease in those symptoms.

I know we are all different, so ofcourse I don't know exactly what will work, but I am rootin' for you big time!! Be proud of yourself for the smaller accomplishments first, that lead you to the bigger one...

I hope you have a good day today, and if you ever need anything or just someone to talk to I extend the invitation for anytime you need it girl!!! We are so similiar with our thoughts, and symptoms, I totally, totally relate to all of it!!!

Big giant hugs, and good vibes your way!!!
R

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The old skin has to be shed before the new one can come.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 2:40 pm 
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Rock on Ladder your doing great. We are all different and so many things factor into how we recover and taper down.
I have faith that you will reach your goal and every day you are one day closer to it. Take your time, this is YOUR TAPER DOWN.. which is not the same as everyone elses.... One day at a time easy does it :)


Hugs................

Lisa


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 5:00 pm 
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mg113 wrote:
Rock on Ladder your doing great. We are all different and so many things factor into how we recover and taper down.
I have faith that you will reach your goal and every day you are one day closer to it. Take your time, this is YOUR TAPER DOWN.. which is not the same as everyone elses.... One day at a time easy does it :)


Hugs................

Lisa


Couldn't have said it better!!! It's amazing to me how one medication can effect so many differently, but it is what it is, so you just have to keep listening to your body and adjust accordingly and you will get there!!! But we are all sooo proud of you ladder!!! I hear it in everyones words, and it's because you ROCK! You are so sweet and caring to everyone else, even when you are down....Chin up girlie, it will be okay!!

Big giant hugs!!!

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We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned,
so as to have the life that is waiting for us.
The old skin has to be shed before the new one can come.
- Joseph Campbell


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:55 am 
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ladder - have you gotten any clonidine yet? I remember really needing it to get me over the hump during a couple of difficult drops. I'd take it for a few days and it seemed to make everything so much better. It really helps settle down all those weird, wiry feelings, the anxiety, the goose-bumps/chills...even the sneezing a bit.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:25 pm 
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Yikes, you guys. I've been in a funk and haven't felt like posting much. I am not getting any better and I just feel like I have no clue what is happening inside my body. It's somewhere around Day 35 at 1 mg. I'm trying to stop counting. It's just not getting better. In fact, I hate to say this, but it seems worse. Today, the a.m. sneezing was crazy. And the legs are bad. I'm dragging my butt to the end of the day. Exhaustion with anxiety seems like it should be against the law. :lol: It's so odd to be soooo tired but unable to drink coffee because I'll start getting those lovely "FLASH! FLASH!" sweats and anxiety. I'm still believing it will get better. I feel kinda guilty updating now, because I feel like an alien and a party pooper. I wake up every morning still with that "HOLY CRAP!" thing. I hope you guys feel better than me. I cannot imagine that if I do this for two more months, it won't be any better. It has to get better.

laddertipper

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