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 Post subject: mistaken identity
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 1:38 pm 
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Just to clarify, BreezyAnn, it was Foundhelp who referred to suboxone as "that crap" not MSL3.


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 Post subject: Re: mistaken identity
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 1:56 pm 
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autononymous wrote:
Just to clarify, BreezyAnn, it was Foundhelp who referred to suboxone as "that crap" not MSL3.


Yeah I know that and don't really see why you are telling me that. I never said MSL3 said that.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 2:31 pm 
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Personally, I didn't take any offense to foundhelps comment. For those of us who have quit Suboxone, it's quite understandable to me why we sometimes refer to it as crap. That stuff can be very hard to get off of and the wd process leaves many of us very jaded.

If her comments had offended me, I'd probably have sent her a PM saying so. That's just me.

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 Post subject: Re: mistaken identity
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 3:57 pm 
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autononymous wrote:
Just to clarify, BreezyAnn, it was Foundhelp who referred to suboxone as "that crap" not MSL3.


The only thing I can think of is you thought I posted that last post because of the "crap" thing. I was posting in regards to Stephent's post above mine, where he was telling MSL3 that she was blaming sub. I was simply pointing out that she never did.

This next part isn't directed at you auto, its just my thoughts on the whole "crap" thing.

As far as referring to sub as crap, I agree with Romeo and believe it is her right to do so. She wasn't telling people that they need to do it her way or that nobody should take sub. She was just sharing her experience and opinions. This is what I was talking about when I posted the "ideas for the forum" thread. I believe people should be able to share the negative of their experience just as much as the positive. Now if they are pushing their views on others or telling people on sub they should get off that is a different thing. Anyway that's just my opinion for what its worth.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 4:12 pm 
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stephent wrote:
What the heck is with this doctor? How does he still have a license? Does he not have regular office hours? I do not understand that. I would have gone to the ER. Using any opiate unless its under the doctors orders (after surgery or something) is playing with fire. I doubt this is the first warning sign you had from this doctor. It is your responsibility to make your appointments ahead of time and your responsibility to find a good doctor. Do not blame the medication for that.


I understand and agree with everything you are saying, just remember everyone is different. Not trying to make excuses, just hoping you will see my point of view a little better.

First of all, you are absolutely right. I thought two or three days notice to make my appointment would be ok, but it wasnt. I should have known better, it was partly my fault. I hate going, his office moved far from me and I am busy as it is, so I procrastinate, and I dread the drive there. I cannot argue with you there.

I still dont think him disappearing for an entire week is reasonable. It has happened before where it took him three days to return my call, but never longer than that, and usually I can tough it out for three days without suboxone or have enough left before I call to make the appointment. When I first started with him, he had a secretary, and his office was in my area. After his secretary left to go to college or whatever, he decided he didnt need one really, and moved his practice closer to his area. I should have switched doctors then, but I trusted him, and its hard to find a good doctor.

I just came back from the visit today, and he looked extremely thin. He had been sick with something in his gums and had to go to an oral surgeon. I still think he should have been well enough to take care of emergencies, but whatever, Im not in his shoes. Im not going to judge him, but I am going to find someone who fits my needs more, like the new doctor I found who is in the same practice as my general practitioner, and he has secretaries.

While I was in his office today, I heard a guy ring the bell in the waiting area three times. The doctor went out to see who it was, and I heard the guy say "Ive been trying to reach you for a week, you dont understand...". Or something like that, basically he was desperate and didnt even have an appointment, he just showed up. The doctor stopped him and said ok ok, sit down, let me finish with this patient and Ill see you. So based on that and his full voicemail all week, I can tell there were a lot of upset and desperate patients. Also, he used to have something on his voicemail where if it was urgent, you could press 0 and it would take you to another voicemail, which i guess is his cell phone. He took that off for some reason, all you get is his regular voicemail. If I hadnt emailed him, he probably would have never gotten to me till today.

As for why I didnt go to the emergency room over getting the opiates, this isnt an excuse, but I have had horrible experiences in the emergency room. Ive been for reasons unrelated to drugs, once for gallstones (like I explained above) and once three days after giving birth for getting an infection and having an extremely high temperature and basically unable to even stand. Each time, I waited 8 hours crying and in pain in the seating area. It was a nightmare, I dread going to the ER.

The worst time though was related to suboxone. After I stopped using heroine out of choice, just being tired of the money and not really getting high, my boyfriend gave me half of his suboxone since he was getting off too, and he knew I couldnt afford to see the doctor at that time. We broke up and I decided no biggy, Ill take my last pill and quit. The WORST experience of my life.

I had a 5 year old son, and I was in the worst withdrawal I had ever experienced .I was basically rolling around crying from the pain and just that feeling of not being able to rest or sit or do anything comfortably. My mom took me to the ER, after waiting for 5 hours (at night), they told me they could not prescribe me with suboxone or ANYTHING, that I should instead go to a nearby ER in a hospital that also specializes in addiction. So we did. After waiting SIX hours at that ER, fidgeting and crying in a chair, they gave me a bed, where I was informed they would not prescribe me anything either. They sent me upstairs to the addiction treatment center, where they informed me they would not give me anything, all I could do is enroll in rehab which would cost over 1000 dollars. Unlike one of the above posters, my mom is not able to watch my son for days at a time, its a long story, but she is not mentally able nor is she willing. Also, I didnt have 1000 bucks. After that night of hell, I gave in and called my exboyfriend and begged him for a suboxone, which he gave me, as well as the number of his doctor, which I went to the next day. This is the doctor Im at now.

I realized the other day that my situation was different back then, I did not have a doctor prescribing me suboxone, so that was most likely why the ER would not prescribe it to me. Perhaps this time would have been different. But the experience left me absolutely scarred. Nobody in either hospital really gave a shit. They wouldnt give me ANYTHING, nothing to help me sleep, nothing to calm me, nothing. All they saw was that I was an addict, and therefore unworthy of any kind of medicine.

If this happened to me again, I would take the vicodine and xanax in a SECOND. But please remember, everyone is different. My addiction was mainly cocaine, I was never that much into pills. The only reason I snorted heroine was because it was cheaper, and I didnt even like it anymore after a while, I just wanted to avoid the withdrawals. So although I would not recommend that anyone do what I did in my situation, please understand that based on my past and my own knowledge of myself, it was the best decision for me. And if you still dont agree, it's ok. Like I said, I fully expected people to tell me that I was an idiot, and I listen carefully and can appreciate every point of view, even if I dont 100 percent agree.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:12 pm 
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I first want to say I'm glad you're feeling better MSL3. Secondly. There are some cool azz people here who called me back to the forum. You know who you are. As I explained to them. It wasn't the correction that REALLY bothered me. It was the blatent disregard for MSL3's dilemma and the jumping to the defense of suboxone. I just think Hat could have given some good advice, words or consolement, or ANYTHING before jumping right into suboxone defense mode. But I DO understand her point. My thoughts on Suboxone are that I think that it really does help some people, but I also think I would have rather withdrew from my d.o.c. and been done with it. I think since withdrawals are imminent regardless of whether it's suboxone or vicodin, I would have rather withdrew sooner, rather than later. That's just my feeling though, and I'm never going to repeat my feelings about suboxone on this forum again.

Anyhoo, I apologize to you HAT, and I hope you accept. Oh, and I believe MSL3, and myself called suboxone "crap"....But we won't do it anymore....lol


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:31 pm 
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Lol all this time I didnt realize that I had also called suboxone crap. I didnt even realize Hat was probably addressing me too. I was so out of it and upset I didnt even realize it. But anyway, like I said, Suboxone was a lifesaver for me, its just that after 5 years and several bad experiences of running out, I am just tired of being dependent on a medication as much as I am. I think about other medications that people are dependent on like maybe inhalers or insulin, but the difference is there isnt such a stigma if you go to a pharmacy or ER or wherever and tell them you need it, as opposed to suboxone. I also realize not having insulin and inhalers is more life threatening than not having suboxone, but still to me it is very serious. Its like anything in this world, even good things can be bad in certain circumstances and for certain people. And Im not even saying suboxone is bad, I am just frustrated that I am taking a medication that I know I dont NEED anymore, simply to avoid withdrawing from the medication. Im sure everyone can agree that it doesnt make sense to take a med that you really no longer need. I am sorry if I offended anyone, as you can see I was very upset and not feeling well when I posted that.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:35 pm 
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Sorry for the double post, I cant figure out how to edit posts...

But anyway, foundhelp, I think you are right. In your situation, it probably would have been the same or easier to just withdraw from what you were taking as opposed to suboxone.

This is a great example of how everyone is different though. For me, withdrawing from heroine, I would much prefer withdrawing from suboxone gradually. Plus, if I hadnt been on it all these years, who knows if I would have relapsed to other drugs? I think it's ok to say that suboxone may not have been the best option for you, there is nothing wrong with that. Everyone is different, and it doesn't make it a bad drug.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:54 pm 
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I totally agree with EVERYTHING you just said MSL3. I wish you all the success in this whole entire world. You deserve it.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:56 pm 
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It was never that big of a deal - just a gentle reminder, that's all. And thanks for the apology, although it really wasn't necessary.

At ease and as you were. (Can you tell I'm ex-military? LOL).

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 9:05 pm 
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Thanks Hat and Foundhelp, just like I said, you are both well intentioned people trying to discuss what can be a touchy subject for us all, Im glad there are no hard feelings, I think in the end we all pretty much agree on the major stuff.

Thanks Breezy Ann for understanding me so well, although I welcome disagreement with anything I say, its always nice to see someone who understands me so well! And thanks everyone else for chiming in and giving advice, I promise it won't just go in one ear and out the other


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:22 am 
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You're welcome MSL3. I just REALLY can identify with what you are going through. Been there...done that. Yes Hat I can tell you are a military lady. That's a noble career choice and I have a lot of respect for all of you. My girlfriend just got back from Afghanistan. She's a Major in the Army, and my ex-boyfriend who lives in Arizona is a Sargent. He has PTSD and is working hard to accept and deal with it. He can get really distant sometimes, but he always comes back. My girlfriend put aside some time for us when she came home 2 summers ago and I got a little worried about her. I know there's a time difference from here to there, but she had been home for 4 days and was nodding off at the table with about 10 of her friends. I'm a little worried about her. Either she's exhausted or she's on something. Neither is good.

MSL3 hang in there. Coming off of Suboxone isn't the worse thing that could happen to you. Once you set your mind to it....It's ENTIRELY possible. Just make sure you get connected with a good doctor to help control your symptoms and anxiety, and get into a supportive therapy group. My doctor is an addictionologist with a very personal interest in addiction. Two of his nephews died from overdoses. He takes addiction very seriously, and he gave me, and continues to give me the support I need. Support is one of the most important things you could have while detoxing. Good luck to you.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 10:44 am 
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hi msl3". i ment you' my shrink gave up his secretary. glad my hospitals are not like that!
i was just saying if every one was going through W/D at the same time? the forum would be bashed
all to hell" and we probably would have to make a negative suboxone forum witch i think would separate
the acute meaning of suboxone treatment. 5 year's is a long time on suboxone. but we all remember from day to day'
what got us on it in the first place. i have been on sub's for 18 months and don't plan on going off' do to w/d' and
mostly the drunk or med drug waiting for me after i am no longer in remission. its possible i will be on sub's as long as
you depending on how suboxone has me to take control of my now more full blown addiction.
my brain is now fully exposed to addiction. remission is now keeping me from it for the duration. we can not erase this
disease, we can only control it. you like ladder" and other's it can be very hard to love and control your children.
but are addiction comes first to tackle "so we can make a more stable life for our children :)


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