It is currently Wed Aug 16, 2017 4:09 pm



All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Our Sponsors





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 1:32 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:36 pm
Posts: 102
When you first get suboxone treatment, it's a wonderful feeling isn't it? You feel so good, by virtue of no longer feeling so bad, that you want to shout it from the rooftops!
I was like that at first, a proper little 'suboxone evangelist.' I would collar total strangers and bore them to tears with tales of horrible junkie life, then rave about this miracle cure for addiction. This would usually result in a lot of strange looks from people once the gossiping started, and even got me into a couple of fights.
I soon learnt the lesson, which is to keep my mouth shut at all times about my problems and treatment. There are plenty of people with nothing better to do than talk behind your back,nodding wisely as you walk away with your employment card in your hand.
If you feel good about your treatment and want to let off steam about it, DO IT IN THIS FORUM! This site is the ONLY place I will discuss opiate addiction and suboxone, it's like having a very understanding family who can provide first hand advice and support. But please be discreet out in the big wide world for your own sakes, you have so much to lose from a word spoken thoughtlessly to the wrong people.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 2:40 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 2:11 am
Posts: 427
Location: Fishers, Indiana
I hear you Sneaky and it's so unfortunate. I have had literally the exact same experience. When I first started Suboxone I was just unbelievably happy and appreciative of the fact that I no longer had to spend every waking hour figuring out how I could get some oxy. It just blew my mind that I could go to sleep at night WITHOUT taking something, I could wake up and get moving WITHOUT taking something, I could be around people without taking something the list goes on and on as I'm sure you're well aware. I think it's just hard to not talk about something that has completely transformed my life. There are a couple close people who have been really open to me taking Suboxone so at least I don't have to worry about that but I'm still really, really confused and upset as to why so many other opiate addicts and normies think Suboxone is such a bad thing. It's really just sad but just even from a practical sense any disease that can be treated is almost always treated with that which has the highest success rate unless the patient has really bad side effects or is allergic to the medication. I thought the whole point of treating an opiate addict was to keep them ALIVE! It just seems like such a double standard for people to accept antidepressants as a legitmate medication while having such a problem with Suboxone or addicts taking medication for that matter.... Depression can sometimes cause suicide but ALOT more people die annually from opiate abuse and yet it's still not ok to use a medication? What? Anywho got a bit off topic but what really depresses me is thinking aboutj all the poor opiate addicts who could still be alive had they not been shamed off Suboxone by people who are too lazy to take 5 minutes to learn about the medication they're telling others not to take. I can't help but think those people responsible for pushing the addict off Suboxone deserve more than just part of the blame........ugh

_________________
"If you're going through hell, ....keep going!"
-Winston Churchill


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 6:01 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:03 pm
Posts: 991
I realize this is an older post but I missed it. I agree with what has been said, but I am not good at hiding my life from EVERYONE. I can hide it from the general population, but usually I can't help but express my opinions and if someone doesn't like it and wants to talk behind my back....more power to them. I do not care if people talk about me.

The mind naturally puts everything into categories in attempt to simplify the mass of information we are exposed to on a regular basis. If we didn't, our brain would be on overload and we wouldn't be able to function. I think Dr. Junig mentioned something similar today in that he was saying that society basically turned addiction into a "person" problem because they had no cure for it and then 12-step programs originated from the philosophy of fixing ones flaws to put addiction into remission.

Unless people are willing to draw attention to the fact that addiction is a brain disease and not the result of personal defects then nothing will ever change. I have heard enough now about the poor statistical evidence of NA/AA being successful long term to open my mind to other possibilities for recovery. But someone had to bring this to my attention first. I brought it to the attention of my therapist who was still under the impression that AA/NA was the best thing out there and he was under the impression that it had a high success rate. I brought it to the attention of my family doctor. I brought it to my mom's attention who is a nurse and works with a variety of medical professionals. I have brought it to the attention of my husband and two of my good friends. I may not have changed all of their minds about suboxone but I hope I at least opened their minds a little.

Everyone has the right to handle this however they want. I have to go to NA meetings because my doc is requiring them. I haven't gone to one since I met with her. I haven't decided if I am going to say anything about my suboxone use there or not. My guess is that over time, I won't be able to keep my mouth shut and will probably say something. I don't feel it is my responsibility and certainly feel I have the right to keep my mouth shut. I just know me and know I probably won't. To me, this is another tool for my recovery and if it creates controversy then maybe it will also create curiosity and people will start looking it up. You never know when some poor person will walk in detoxing from opiates and learn there are other options out there. I highly doubt that person will debate too much if they would still be "clean" or not. They are far more likely to just go get it if they are struggling.

I don't know what caused this post to originate however so maybe I am way off base.

Cherie


Top
 Profile  
 
Our Sponsors
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 22, 2010 9:59 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 4:42 am
Posts: 164
I have a few people in my family who I have told about my suboxone use, mainly only my mom and dad. I haven't told anyone else just because I HATE family drama. My dad has kind of a hard time understanding suboxone...He just thinks you take it for a few months and poof, you're healed. I've tried to explain to him that from the years and years of abuse that my mind has literally been re-wired. I will forever be/think different. I compared it to him taking Anti-Depressants (Which I wasn't supposed to know about) and the response was FAR less than satisfactory. I actually find happiness when I'm not high out of my mind on pills. Opiates were like my coffee. Every morning I would wake up and take whatever opiate I had. I would then go to work, take more pills then while at work be vigilant on my phone, texting people to make sure I had a deal set up after work. Basically, my day was taking pills, working for pills, buying more pills, taking more pills and repeating that process every day. I would pick up extra shifts at work just to get more pills. I was like a car and the pills were my gas. I know Suboxone has been demonized in the public due to fake Doctors like Dr. Drew and Dr. Phil but I don't care, all I know is I have my life back and don't constantly have that voice in the back of my head constantly thinking about popping, snorting, or shooting up a pill.

I would just like to take this time to thank everyone on here. It's like my little dysfunctional online family of junkies that almost always has the answer to my questions/problems and everyone really seems to genuinely care for each other.

Thank you,
Ryan. K Leddy


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:20 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member

Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 7:36 pm
Posts: 879
Location: Wisconsin
"It's like my little dysfunctional online family of junkies..."

Forgive me if I don't take that comment as a compliment. Dysfunctional Junkies? Did you really mean that?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:33 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 12:43 am
Posts: 1019
Location: Buffalo New York
Cool thread man. i remember being the same way when i first got on subs all my friends who were still doing pks and calling me cause i was the oxy connect to let them have my connect and id say no way man you got to get on suboxone fuck that oxy contin get your life together ill give you my docs number i ll let them know your calling an so on. but thats the last thing a oxy addict wants to hear when their looking for their dayily dose. thus many f$$$ yous with a quick hangup following. and i lost alot of friend, some i knew since 1st grade. but i guess in the long run its better that way cause 98% of them are still doing oxys.

But i do want to say sub saved my life. i got my TRUE friends back,my family back, got back in college getting as an bs and most of all got my gf back who gave me the choice of oxy or her and i choose oxy which hurt cause we went out for 3 years but once i got clean she was right their to help me stay clean and over time we connected again r going strong for another 3 years. and i cant say how happy i am all that r close to me have notice the true me is back and i plan to stay!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:40 am 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 4:42 am
Posts: 164
DonH,

I was being sarcastic, ever heard of it? If someone was on were to view this forum that never took suboxone or never was an opiate addict they would view us with MUCH different eyes. I am celebrating us being different, which is a compliment. You can take it however you want to take it, I don't personally care. Maybe the word Junkie or Dysfunctional scares you, I don't know but what I do know is I am glad about what I went through and the type of person it made me today. Ziggy was right, you are a nit picker.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:50 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 3:20 am
Posts: 516
Image

Get along guys!

_________________
Image
mmmm donuts!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:59 am 
Offline
Power Poster
Power Poster
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2010 2:38 am
Posts: 63
You are an idiot and know who you are!


Top
 Profile  
 
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 8:18 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:55 pm
Posts: 4933
Location: Leesburg, FL
C'mon now, why are we calling people "idiot"?

_________________
-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:41 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:36 pm
Posts: 102
Yes mayunholdup, we ARE like a little family here (unfortunately perhaps not so little?). We are the only people who can truly understand what addiction is like because we didn't learn about it from a book or a lecture. We have lived it on a daily basis, often for several years. 'Straight' people do not, and never will understand what it is like to plan your entire day around finding your next score and keeping the horrors at bay.
OF COURSE we are dysfunctional, we cannot function normally when our only waking thought is drugs drugs drugs. Your analogy to breakfast coffee or gas for the car is right on the button. I wonder now how I managed to hold down jobs for almost nine years when my absolute priority upon waking was where to get enough bags of smack to last through the day. Given enough time, this behavior does indeed become 'hardwired' into our thinking processes. I have read studies that state this to be a literal truth, whereby certain nerves in the body actually thicken in order to better transmit the 'pleasure/pain' messages that come with the euphoria and withdrawals associated with one's DOC.
Your average Joe Soap will NEVER understand what it's like to be an addict, to physically and mentally NEED something to the exclusion of all else. I have learned from bitter experience that discussing this with 'outsiders' is never a good idea, as the public perception of the 'dirty, thieving, AIDS ridden junkie' will always exist.
It's also very true that friends who still use opiates DO NOT want to know about suboxone, for one very simple reason.....YOU CAN'T GET HIGH UNTIL IT WEARS OFF! They know that taking enough sub to last for one day will screw them up for three days, and they don't like that. Some ( most) addicts have not yet reached the point where the need to get clean is greater than the urge to get blasted, so they carry on using and dismiss suboxone completely. Perhaps this is where some of the horror stories originate in the USA? I must admit that UK addicts are pretty well clued up about subutex and suboxone.Our big problem here is Heroin rather than pain meds. Almost everyone here has been on the program or knows someone who has, usually as the result of a court rehab order. However, most people relapse soon after, as they try to keep using and save the pills for the 3 days before their next piss test. This never works as they always get their calculations wrong. Well, our heroin is pretty strong stuff over here, and you just can't think straight with a head full of Mr Brown. They always get thrown off the program after the 5th or 6th failed test in as many months, so they go back to using full time. The ones who opt for methadone instead of sub are ALL still using, you can take that to the bank.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:58 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:55 pm
Posts: 4933
Location: Leesburg, FL
Sneaky-
So am I understanding correctly that some people get court-ordered suboxone treatment? Or did you just mean court-ordered rehab in general?

I wish suboxone was that understood here. I remember someone on the forum a while back who had to go off his subs because his probation officer considered it still using. Personally I think suboxone treatment is the best option, but that's just me. It seems the education surrounding suboxone still hasn't hit some, most, or all of our legal system.

_________________
-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 2:15 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:36 pm
Posts: 102
Hatmaker, the courts here are inundated with drug-related crime. Something like 20+% of all thefts are committed by heroin addicts alone according to official stats. Any addict convicted of a crime will be sent for assessment, then ordered to go to rehab, where they are given the choice of 'methadone or buprenorphine replacement therapy' as the official wording is. The Government recognises the seriousness of the problem, so now treatment is much more easily available than it was say 7 or 8 years ago. In fact when my own addiction was in it's third year I was desperate to get off the heroin, but there was nowhere to turn to at that time. The only options were cold turkey or a residential detox course costing many thousands of pounds.
One close of mine actually paid £3500 (about $6000 US?) for a Naltrexone implant back in 2003. This worked fine for the first 6 months....he started going to the gym, eating regularly etc and was a totally changed man. Then the implant wore off. Jimmy died in June 2005 from complications due to total hepatic failure, brought on by using dirty needles. If today's options had been on offer back then, perhaps he would still be around.


Top
 Profile  
 
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 2:20 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:36 pm
Posts: 102
With regard to my last post, I mean that Jimmy went back to using heroin as soon as the Naltrexone had run out. In fact he went at it with a vengance, as if making up for lost time. Yet another casualty of our disease.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 6:19 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member

Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 7:36 pm
Posts: 879
Location: Wisconsin
You can try to reduce this to whatever substandard level of discussion you would like or call me any names you would like. I simply am trying to recover from this disease as best that I can. For me, that means admitting at first that I have a lot to learn and I don't know much about addiction. To do that, I read and research as much as I can. One of the places that I have found great information is at the National Alliance of Advocates for Buprenorphine Treatment (NAABT). As part of the information they provide (for free I might add), they have a sheet titled "Why does language matter?" You can view this sheet for yourself at:

http://www.naabt.org/documents/NAABT_Language.pdf

This is what they say. I am providing this word for word:

WORDS TO AVOID AND ALTERNATIVES
Following are stigmatizing words and phrases which could be replaced with the suggested "preferred terminology" as a start in reducing the stigma associated with addiction.
Addict, Abuser, Junkie
Problems with the terms: These terms are demeaning because they label a person by his/her illness. By making no distinction between the person and the disease, they deny the dignity and humanity of the individual. In addition, these labels imply a permanency to the condition, leaving no room for a change in status.
Preferred terminology: Person in active addiction, person with a substance misuse disorder, person experiencing an alcohol/drug problem, patient (if referring to an individual receiving treatment services).

I will stop there as anyone with an interest can read the rest for themselves. I just feel that if we, as the people saddled with this terrible disease can't stop calling ourselves Junkies, how in the hell can we expect others to? Let's have some selfasteam here. If it was just humor, fine, I get that. I don't think it's funny but I fully can understand your attempt at humor. I just think, as the NAABT points out, that "language does matter". It is rare for me to ever hear a homosexual person refer to himself or his friends as "fagots" or some other term. I see someone with the illness of drug addiction calling himself or his friends a "junkie" as the same thing. It is one, very long, huge, up-hill fight to educate the general public about addiction. God help us if we have to fight the same fight with the people in active addiction themselves.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 7:37 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:03 pm
Posts: 991
I appreciated donh's post. I NEVER liked the word "addict" in referring to myself because it DID feel like it took everything good away from me and gave me ONLY my disease and I am not my disease. I wish this was a sticky somewhere. It is very positive and I agree that unless we learn to use these ourselves we cannot expect others to use them. I don't want to be labeled as a Junkie or Addict or User.

Thanks Don.

Cherie


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 8:33 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 4:42 am
Posts: 164
I didn't know this was going to cause such a ruckus and I apologize, I obviously have a different view of thinking. To me words are just words, the meaning and motive behind the word makes it what it is. I have homosexual friends who call each other "fags" or "gay" all the time. Everyone has a different line of thinking I suppose. I apologize for offending people as I was trying to use it in a friendly way. I agree, it is a disease and it seems most of us are doing whatever we can to beat it...At the same time, I've accepted what the "public eye" thinks of me...If I'm a junkie addict loser then fine, I use those words to empower me and motivate me. After all, everyone has their own addiction...Weather it be IVing drugs into your vein, cleaning your house obsessively or eating.

I apologize for those who I have offended, just know it was used as a sign of endearment. Also, Joseph...that post made literally no sense. If you could elaborate I'd gladly like to engage in a conversation with you, but there is no reason to be calling people "Idiots and know who you are."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:02 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 12:43 am
Posts: 1019
Location: Buffalo New York
I think when it comes down to it words can only go so far you have to accept what you were and what you are now. i was a junkie,addict whatever you want to call it but now im a much better person cause of what i went therw and honestly that makes me happy. so i take no offense to what you posted man my views r the same or close to.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, 2010 11:47 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:03 pm
Posts: 991
mayunholdup let me clarify....you didn't offend me at all because you did it in an endearing way towards us so I took it the way it was intended. It is like someone calling me "honey" or "sweety" which is fine when it is someone doing it in an endearing way but as soon as some jerk is doing it to be condescending I get offended. It has nothing to do with the word itself.

I did like the 2nd post donh made about the terminology at the same time. But I meant I liked it in terms of how we should refer to ourselves in general and terms we should be trying to use in general. I meant outside of this thread. (Sometimes I am not always clear when I write on here).

I don't like referring to myself as an "addict" because it doesn't feel accurate to me and it feels like it robs me of being a sister, aunt, wife, as well as intelligent, competent, career oriented, successful, etc. I think when people hear "addict" they think of the opposite of all those things and really, they don't think any farther about you than just that. They don't even care to. It then defines you. I am definitely a person who cannot take opiates and I am definitely a person who has been addicted to narcotics. But today I am not. In active addiction, being an "addict" did define my entire being. I stopped taking narcotics so other things could define me again and I could be more than just an "addict". So I don't like using the term now.

I think the only person you offended was donh....or at least of those who spoke up. I suppose there could be some lurker out there just stewing over it :lol:

Cherie


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2010 12:42 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member

Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 7:36 pm
Posts: 879
Location: Wisconsin
I didn't want to have to jump back into the fray but I guess I have to since this seems to be getting turned into a bigger deal that I ever intended. Sheeeesh, I only made an 18 word post. Here is the entirety of what I origionally said:

"Forgive me if I don't take that comment as a compliment. Dysfunctional Junkies? Did you really mean that?"

I was not offended in the true sense of that word. That's why I asked the question "Did you really mean that?" I was curious to know if that is what you honestly thought of us. If I was offended by anything it was the other comments and name calling that ensued after I made this post. That was not needed - certainly not based on the simple post above. It was then that I expanded on where I was coming from with even asking this simple question.

I completely accept your apology "mayunholdup", even though it wasn't necessary - not for your original comment anyhow. Among the many things that I hate about this disease is how I (and all of us here) are treated by others. I have lost a huge amount of everything because of this disease - from my job to the respect of some of those who know me. If I were diagnosed with cancer they would not even think of treating me (or us) this way. But being diagnosed with addiction, they feel that they can. I feel so very strongly about this that I am seriously looking into doing something about it. I am strongly considering telling my story in a variety of ways including on the speaking circuit. Drug addiction has a face that people just assume go along with it and I can assure you that I don't fit that face. That face is the "junkies" that were spoken of. That face is back alleys, dirty needles, armed robbery, and drug houses. That is what goes along with the term "junkies". It is also the perfect excuse for this disease to be brushed over. After all, it's just useless, lowlife people that are effected (junkies) so why do anything about it? I am not so naive to think I can change this thinking for everyone, but I darn well am positive that I can enlighten many people to the fact that more than "junkies" become addicted to drugs. I am told all of the time that I am just about the last guy that they would ever peg for a drug abuser. I just had someone yesterday tell me that she thinks she would have been less shocked had her dad called to tell her that he was gay! I am no better than any of you. I am no different than other drug addicts - but I am not a junkie and never will be.

I also do not set out to "nit pick" as some have asserted. I just want to try my best to have correct and truthful information on this site. In fact, I just read something written this past weekend by Dr. J. that reaffirmed that is what he hopes for with this site as well. It does no good for someone, no matter how well meaning, to post something like "Suboxone makes people's hair fall out" - when that is not true. All that does is perpetuate wrong information and confuse people. Someone then reads it, thinks it to be true and repeats it to others. So if I see something that is not correct or has no basis, no reference, nothing to support that it is true, I may call attention to it or at least question it. I have no wish to attack the writer. That is not what I'm after. I simply want to make sure that we don't perpetuate bad data or false information.

Here is what Dr. J recently wrote about his vision for this web site:

"I wanted a place where people don't just run with rumors, but rather point out concerns, and wait for someone to research the issue-- or do REAL research themselves. (any forum will get the occasional headline, like 'Suboxone makes your genitals fall off!', but someone should step in so that reason prevails)..."

That is exactly what I try to do. Nothing more. Nothing less. Unfortunately some people would rather attack the person asking the question, or challenging the post, than admit that perhaps they misspoke or made a mistake.

So just so I am clear here, this whole "junkie" thing was about a "3" on a 1 to 10 scale for me. I am very impressed, however, how mayunholdup evidently gave it some thought before maturely responding and even apologizing. Again, mayunholdup, you didn't need to do that - but thanks anyway. I appreciate it. It also reinforces to me that you are way more and way better than a "junkie".

Now, Lord, please let us move on. :)

Oh, by the way, has anyone heard that Suboxone makes your hair fall out and your genitals fall off? :lol:


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Our Sponsors
Suboxone Forum latest topics RSS feed Subscribe to the entire forum
 

 

 
Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group