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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:23 am 
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Okay, here is my story. I was in a car accident and hurt my back and hip pretty bad and my doctor prescribed me 80 mg oxycontin 3 times a day and 30 mg oxycodone for breakthrough pain. I didn't take 3 of the 80's in the beginning and not many of the 30's but after being on them for 2 years I was up to 3 80's a day and about 10 30's and after the first year someone told me that I should snort both because it would get in my system quicker so I started doing that instead of swallowing them. Well the day came in my 3rd year of snorting these that I went to my dr's appt and the DEA met me at the door and told me to find another doctor because they were shutting mine down. I was so very naive that I did not KNOW I was addicted to these pills until I hadn't had them for about 2 days. I was in full-blown withdrawals, writhing in pain when my brother gave me a brown powder to snort. It burned my nose and when I asked him what it was he said it was a vitamin to make me feel better. It did make me feel better and after I told my other brother that I snorted a brown vitamin he called me all kinds of names and said it was heroin. I thought people only injected heroin! Oh well, it worked for me and every dr in our area was getting their licenses taken away for prescribing too many oxy's. So I snorted heroin for about 6 months until I became so ashamed of myself that I entered a methadone clinic. I have been there for almost 3 years now and my dosage was never above 80 mg. In the last year I tapered with dr supervision down to 50 mg because I want to come off of methadone - I don't want to be on it for the rest of my life and don't think I need to be since I didn't use for very long. On Jan. 10th I went AMA because it was taking to long to taper down and I was down to 13 mgs last Saturday. I hadn't slept well for about 2 weeks and my legs were jumping like crazy at night so I talked to the dr at the clinic who told me that 1- I am a good candidate for suboxone and 2 - I was coming down too fast on the methadone and I needed to go up some so I have been at 23 mgs for the past 9 days.Truth be told, I don't feel much better at 23 mgs than I was at 13 mgs, my legs are still jumpy but now I am taking tramadol 50 mg here and there to help sleep. The dr wanted me to go up to 30 mgs but my whole thing is that I want to come off of this and I want to switch to suboxone to help me get off methadone then I want to get off of the suboxone and be done with it all. The dr wants me to take my last dosage of methadone this Friday then nothing over the weekend and come to his office on Monday hopefully in full blown withdrawals to start suboxone therapy. I don't want a high dosage of suboxone, I want the lowest dosage possible just so I can function. I have never taken suboxone before so does anyone know what would be equal to 23 mgs of methadone? I know the dr will tell me when I see him but I would like to know beforehand so I don't get talked into upping my dosage since I don't quite feel right. ANY advice would be great too because I am also contemplating just stopping the methadone completely and taking the tramadol when it gets too bad rather than switch to suboxone. I am just ready to be done with all of this. For the past year and a half I have been active in my church - nobody there knows about any of this and I feel guilty and want to be done so I don't feel like I am lying to everyone. Oh and in the 3 years I have been on methadone I didn't do heroin ever again and I haven't taken any percocets or oxycodone either. I was taking klonopin for anxiety for awhile but nothing now so I have no chance of relapse in my opinion and my counselors as well. All advice is welcome. I have 1 week to figure out what to do. Thanks!


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:58 am 
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Welcome to the forum!

Sounds like you are not quite sure what way you want to go with this.....to switch to methadone, or forget the methadone and just take tramadol instead. I can give you my opinion, and that is to get away from the tramadol completely and switch to suboxone instead.

Tramadol has it's own set of problems. It's narcotic-like and can be very addictive. To get off one should taper slowly to avoid seizures which can happen. It's another drug that keeps you stimulated and the problems aren't worth the risks involved in my opinion.

And try not to get caught up in how strong suboxone is compared to methadone. If you have a good sub doctor, he or she will usually begin you with a lower dose and build up the level until you get stable. What it takes is what it takes so try not to worry if the dose is low enough, or not too high. A usual beginning dose at induction is many times between 8-16mg or so. Could be higher of course. It certainly can vary with each of us. Point is you just want to be out of withdrawals, so the dose it takes to get there really shouldn't matter so much at that time.

When switching from methadone to suboxone it's best to get the methadone dose as low as possible, and should be around 30mgs or less. The lower the better for you. Then you will need to go into full withdrawals before taking that first dose of suboxone. Some will say to wait 24hrs, some say 36, or 48hrs, and that may be ok and work for you. But if it were me I would positively use what is called the Cows score to give you a much better idea if the time is right to take the sub. You score your symptoms and once you get to moderate/severe withdrawals the time is ok to take the first dose of sub. Here's the link to the Cows, and it explains it all near the bottom of the page.....

Cows Sheet
http://www.naabt.org/documents/cows_ind ... _sheet.pdf

Once you stop the methadone and allow the withdrawals to begin, it's best to just bite down and deal with the symptoms. It sucks for sure, but you only have to do it one time if you do it right. Don't use any tramadol while your in withdrawals or it will delay the time needed to make the switch. The entire point is you will need to get sick with symptoms to get better. It's very difficult to say just how long it will take before your ready for induction, that's why the Cows works so well....get to the score needed and your ready!

Hope this helps and good luck to you. Hopefully your doctor knows what he/she's doing switching you over. I'm sure you will be ok. If you have additional questions just ask. If you need further help it's here for you.

Karen


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:20 pm 
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Karen makes many good points. A couple more, about methadone to Suboxone conversions.... it is very difficult to avoid precipitated withdrawal in people on methadone. Karen is right-- you want the methadone dose as low as possible, and you want to be off methadone as long as possible. 3-4 days is pushing it--- and so you might get withdrawal. If you do, you MUST just stick to the plan-- and if you do, you'll be OK in a couple days.

The dose/response curve for buprenorphine is not straight, as it is with methadone-- so you cannot just take dose relationships and calculate the equivalency. With buprenorphine (the active part of Suboxone), 8 mg equals 16 mg equals 40 mg. Being on a high dose of buprenorphine doesn't make it harder to stop buprenorphine, because the first part of the taper-- from 16 to 8 to 4 mg per day--- doesn't really have any physical withdrawal associated with it.

But when inducing from methadone, I find that people do best if I push a higher dose of buprenorphine, than if I trickle in small amounts. Plus, if I induce with a small amount of buprenorphine, there is risk that the patient will try to overcome the withdrawal using heroin or methadone. So I give 8-16 mg for induction; that way I know that the patient won't die from taking something else, and I know that the patient will be feeling OK in a few days.

Some docs do it different-- but my point is that there are reasons to give different amounts of buprenorphine during induction, that are more important than the considerations about stopping soon.

Finally, as I've written many times.... be aware of the multiple studies of people who do as you plan, i.e. use buprenorphine as a short 'bridge' to abstinence. In repeated studies, out of every 100 people with that plan, only 3 or 4 are not using opioids one year later---- and about 7 are dead. The other 90 are back on their drug of choice.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:21 pm 
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I've gone thru what you're going thru now, pretty much the same thing, except that I was at a much lower dose....~10mg, for a while before I transitioned over to Suboxone. I was on such a low dose for at least a few weeks (I had been gradually tapering down over a few years) that I took about half of my dose (I had bottles) the day before I got inducted onto the Suboxone, then I got inducted by my doctor, in the office.

I, too, declared that I was going to get stabilized on the lowest dose possible. My Suboxone doctor was awesome and pretty much just gave me free reign. Gave me a script and told me to come back the next month and tell me what dose I was at (to clarify, the nurse kept in touch with me in between the first and second appointments). I experimented with different doses, taking up to 8mg/day, and those first two weeks were AWFUL. I was so out of it, I felt crazy, sick, you name it. I really went thru it.

In the end, I think a big part of the reason that I was going thru it so much was that I was taking TOO MUCH!!! Suboxone is such a potent medication. I had been listening to people saying that an average dose of Suboxone was (at the time) 8mg - 24mg/day (now most would say 8mg - 16mg/day), so I was allowing that to affect how much I was taking. I settled on 2mg/day and, after a few weeks, felt great.

Changing from methadone to Suboxone was a life-changer for me. The side effects are less, there is no clinic structure (for me it was in the way, since I was clean for so long), and the medication overall just agreed with me more. So, it was a win-win.

I wish you luck. PM me anytime. :)


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:34 pm 
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Okay, so I still haven't decided whether I am going to quit methadone cold turkey or switch to suboxone - it depends on HOW bad my withdrawal symptoms are! Today is day 2 with no methadone and so far my legs and arms are stiff, I am burping up frothy stuff and I have chills. Not intolerable as of yet. My doctor appt to switch to suboxone is Thursday night at 6:30 pm and all I have taken so far is a few tums and some valerian root to help me sleep last night (crazy leg jumping!) I thought the worst of the withdrawals were days 3-6 but now I am hearing that it may be upwards of a month or two. I think I am going to stop listening to everyone's horror stories! If there is anyone out there who has done EXACTLY what I am doing please let me know how it went! Recap- on methadone 80 mgs for 2 years, tapered down to 13 mg over 7 months then back up to 23 mg the last 2 weeks - used 80 mg oxy's, 30 mg percs, 15 mg percs for 2 years then snorted raw heroin for about 6 months before going on methadone. I will be back on over the next few days to check for messages and post updates as long as I can type/think/breathe!! lol


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:46 pm 
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I forgot to add that I did the evaluation on the COWS sheet and I scored 11. The dr said I should be at 26 or higher to switch over and I should be there by the time of my appt Thursday night.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:48 pm 
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Hi Linda,

I don't really have anything to add to the great advice you have already gotten...I think it's something you will have to decide for yourself if you want to go to suboxone or just ct the methadone. I did want to point out though, that what you said about having zero chance of relapse is just plain wrong.

An opiate addict coming off of maintenance treatment, from whatever drug they come from, is at an INCREDIBLY HIGH, risk of relapse! No joke, it's upwards of 90%. I'm not trying to scare you away from jumping, only wanting you to prepare yourself for the return of cravings when you are completely off the mmt. You haven't had any cravings for a long time now because you have been receiving a steady daily dose of opiates. When those are gone, the cravings WILL return, and you have to have a plan in place to deal with that. If you aren't already attending some type of recovery meeting or counseling I would highly suggest starting NOW.

Going into this thinking you have zero chance of relapse is just setting yourself up for failure.

Q

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:12 pm 
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lindapsmoore wrote:
I thought the worst of the withdrawals were days 3-6 but now I am hearing that it may be upwards of a month or two. I think I am going to stop listening to everyone's horror stories! If there is anyone out there who has done EXACTLY what I am doing please let me know how it went!
The best thing you can do is stop reading the horror stories and form your own opinion after the process is complete. I have made the switch myself from methadone to suboxone, and I personally know a few others that have also done the same.

You have done the best thing possible by tapering down your methadone dose just as you are suppose to do, IF you want to get on the suboxone. It's recommended you get it down to at LEAST 30mg, and the lower the better as I mentioned before. You have stopped at 23mg which is great! Is it going to be easy because of this....NO it isn't to be honest. Withdrawals are NEVER easy, but just remember, you only have to do this ONE TIME, so do it right the first time and your on your way.

Because methadone has such a long half life, it could be several days before withdrawal symptoms even begin. It varies as everyone really is different. It could take 24-96+ hours before your ready for induction to the subs. In my own personal opinion, based on experience, using that Cow's Score is the very best thing you can do to help yourself avoid PW's. I gave you the link above to it. Please use it to score your symptoms. You will know once they begin because the symptoms will mimic flu-like feelings. Again, it's no fun whatsoever, but again, it only has to be done once.

I believe that by the time your 6:30 pm Thursday night appointment gets here you should be ready for induction. It's my suggestion you take nothing to help you "feel better" while your waiting it out IF suboxone is your choice. Some say it's ok to take some "comfort meds" along the way, but if you think about it, your attempting to get sick with withdrawals to induct on subs, so why would you want to stop, or alter that process? I personally believe any comfort meds slow the process down and lengthen the time required to get to the Cows score needed. Of course it's all up to you what you do in the end. Just my suggestion.

If at all possible get someone to help score you on the Cows. Reason being you are going to be feeling horrible and it's very easy to boost your symptom number score up in order to get the score needed. I certainly did because I wanted it to be over quick. Not what you want. Make certain you the score is accurate, and once you have the desired score then it's safe to take your first dose.

I will help you all that I can. There are many others that I'm sure wouldn't mind jumping in to help. Your in good hands here. Take care and if you have additional questions just ask. Here to help and support as everyone is. Let us know how it's going each day if you possibly can.

Karen


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:35 pm 
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lindapsmoore wrote:
I forgot to add that I did the evaluation on the COWS sheet and I scored 11. The dr said I should be at 26 or higher to switch over and I should be there by the time of my appt Thursday night.
Actually that's a good sign you are moving right along. I wouldn't necessarily expect you to score that high after 2 days. As I mentioned above, the half life of methadone is very long, and symptoms may not begin for a few days, so the methadone in your system should be keeping you fairly comfortable right now. To score an 11 possibly means your metabolism is quite fast, which is good in this case!

Karen


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 24, 2014 9:44 pm 
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Yes, stop reading horror stories....half of them are BS anyway.....trust me.

Even though its going to suck to go thru all of this....just want to point out that the freedom of being off the clinic is soooooo worth it!!!! Just keep that end goal in your mind....you'll be fine. :)


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:54 am 
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Not doing so well, can't sleep mainly because of legs jumping, arms hurting and stomach pains. I took close to 1,ooo mg of valerian root to no avail. Did I mention I have 2 children at home and my disabled mother lives with me too that I take care of? Nobody except my husband knows what I am going through, nobody in my family knows that I was on methadone and I am trying to pass this off as the flu but I don't know if I am going to be able to make it to Thursday night. My husband HAS to work and there is nobody to help me with my mom or children but at least the children are in school during the day. Thank you everyone for your help so far - anything I can do to get some sleep? I have some zzzquil but I don't know if that will even work so I don't want to take it yet.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:03 am 
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To the moderator who replied to my post - I am in a support group and have been for almost 3 years. In 3 years I am the only person IN the group to actually taper down and want to quit and my counselor says that she feels like I am the only one who has a chance to succeed. Nobody has told me that the cravings will return, not the doctor or my counselor. Do you mean if I come off of everything completely? Suboxone blocks the cravings, right?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 11:39 am 
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lindapsmoore wrote:
Not doing so well, can't sleep mainly because of legs jumping, arms hurting and stomach pains. I took close to 1,ooo mg of valerian root to no avail. Did I mention I have 2 children at home and my disabled mother lives with me too that I take care of? Nobody except my husband knows what I am going through, nobody in my family knows that I was on methadone and I am trying to pass this off as the flu but I don't know if I am going to be able to make it to Thursday night.
Hey Linda,

It's definitely a fight. It's not fun, and it's so difficult to hold out, especially as long as you do until Thursday. This is where that "WANT TO" comes in. You have to REALLY want this more than anything else right now. I will tell you again, it only has to be done ONE TIME, so hang in there as best you can. It's 2 more days until induction if your going with the subs. Have you decided if that's what your going to do, switch to the subs? I hope you do because if you ever decide to get off the subs, the detox is much easier than it is with the methadone. You have to fight hard Linda. I know you can do it!

As far as the statement about cravings, I think that was to mean IF you stopped the methadone and did not switch to the subs. Then cravings are entirely possible, and most likely at some point as was said. But the suboxone is intended to stop both the withdrawal symptoms, and any cravings you may have. I can honestly tell you I had absolutely zero cravings during my 3+ years on suboxone. You have nothing to worry about if suboxone is the way your going.

Take care,
Karen :D


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:14 pm 
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I have finally decided that I AM going to switch over to suboxone. - I really want to be done with everything but judging from how I feel now there is no way that I can handle the methadone withdrawals on my own AND take care of my autistic son, my disabled mother, my other son, my husband, my house AND myself! I did manage to get about 3 hours of sleep after I took 3 more valerian root. I went to GNC this morning and got some milk thistle, passion flower, melatonin and multi-vitamins then went by Shopper's and got some Immodium, chamomile tea, bottled water and mineral water - set me back about $82 but well worth it if it works! Is there anything that can help with the chills / hot flashes?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 12:41 pm 
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lindapsmoore wrote:
I went to GNC this morning and got some milk thistle, passion flower, melatonin and multi-vitamins then went by Shopper's and got some Immodium, chamomile tea, bottled water and mineral water - set me back about $82 but well worth it if it works! Is there anything that can help with the chills / hot flashes?
I think you have made a very wise decision, Linda! I'm quite certain you will be very happy on the suboxone, and it will make you life better. It was without a doubt the best decision I ever made for myself. It literally saved my life. Now we just have to get you through the next couple days huh?

The items you purchased should certainly be helpful. Other than lots of hot baths and/or showers there really isn't much in the way of help. I'm so sorry, but I'm just being honest. I do know that sitting around thinking about it is about the worse thing to do. If you can make yourself get out of the house, go for a short walk, anything to keep moving and stay busy. I realize you have your hands full taking care of others, but this is the time you need to take care of YOU! Is there any possible way you can get someone to come over to help? Or maybe have someone take the kids for a day or two using the flu as an excuse? But of course your mother needs care and I understand the position you are in right now. Tough scenario all the way around that's for sure.

I urge you to just keep in mind that you have stopped a very powerful drug in the methadone. As a result of doing that, the symptoms are severe, and it's not suppose to be easy to deal with them right now. Your body is craving the drug like never before. It's so much a mental battle right now Linda. The drug is making your mind and body suffer in the way of symptoms in an attempt to get you to take something to ease the process. This is when you have to dig in and fight like you never have before. I've been EXACTLY where you are right now, and so has plenty of others here, so we know how difficult this is for you.

I have an idea based on what your telling me that it's entirely possible your score on the Cows may be high enough before Thursday night. Why don't you score yourself right now and post back what your score is. Please make certain it's an honest score, and the symptoms are judged correctly.

Your score as you said yeasterday was an 11, so what I'm thinking is, IF your score is indeed high enough, and the withdrawal symptoms are at least moderate between today and tomorrow, is it possible for you to call the doctor, tell him what's happening, and perhaps get in earlier than Thursday night? I say IF you are ready for induction BEFORE Thursday night, and you just can't hold on any longer, do you think the doctor would consider getting you in quicker for induction?

I hate to see you suffer a minute longer than necessary, so if it does happen, and your ready earlier than projected, I would call the doctor and check into the possibility of getting in sooner. Just a thought Linda. You may have to wait until Thursday, I was only considering the possibility IF your ready any sooner.

Take care and PLEASE hang in there. You are so close to feeling better. I'm here for you and know how difficult this is. I can tell you for certain, it's sooo worth the time spent waiting it out!

Karen


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:55 pm 
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Thanks for all of the advice Karen! I re-evaluated myself using the COWS sheet and scored a 16 so I called the doctor and he told me to come in tonight at 6:30! A little scared about the precipitated withdrawals but he is a very good doctor and I trust that he knows best! Will keep you posted and thanks again!


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 2:08 pm 
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You are so welcome! That's AWESOME, Linda!!! :D I had a feeling based on how you were feeling you may be ready sooner! Now all you have to do is hold out until tonight, and I know you can do that.

I'm sure you have a good doctor. I would think he will make sure your in moderate to severe withdrawals, and check the Cows before beginning to dose you. You should be feeling terrible, so make sure you feel well enough to drive yourself ok.

He will probably begin with a dose somewhere between 2-8mg and have you wait 30-60 minutes. You should feel much better after that time, but it may or may not be enough at that point? The doctor and you will decide if more sub is needed. It may take 8-16mg, possibly higher, to get the job done from methadone is my guess. You should be feeling good when it's all said and done in the office. Not high by any means, but feeling as normal as possible. You will know when the dose is right.

And sometimes it takes a couple days or so to get the dose just right, so don't be alarmed if that happens. But when you leave his office you will be feeling so much better. I'm so happy it has worked out like this for you!

Please give us an update after you get home. I'm excited to hear how you will be feeling. Post often, as this journey of yours is helping so many others that want to switch from methadone to suboxone or bupe. Many are reading along and will know it's entirely possible to have the same results you will have too! Good stuff Linda! :D

Karen


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:02 pm 
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Okay, so I went to the doctors last night for my induction ( hubby drove me because I did not feel like I could drive safely during rush hour traffic through Baltimore IN withdrawal ) and after the exam and the evaluation using the COWS ( I gave myself a 16 - the doctor gave me a 20! ) I was given a prescription for the suboxone strips and instructions to take 1/2 a strip immediately and another 1/2 strip in 2 hours IF I did not feel much better and IF I did not feel much worse. Kind of confusing in my condition but thankfully I understood beforehand about the precipitated withdrawals and WHAT exactly the doctor meant. Anyway, when we finished at the doctors office it was 8:30 and his office is a 45 minute drive from our house so by the time we got back home my regular pharmacy had already closed so we went to Rite Aid to try to fill the prescription... then we went to Walgreen's... then we went to Shoppers... then we went to Target... get the picture? My prescription was only for 8 strips but we could not find them anywhere and by 10 o'clock we gave up for the night. Last night was pretty bad and I did not fall asleep until around 3 am AFTER taking valerian root AND melatonin. Amazingly I slept until 10:30 this morning and felt pretty okay when I first got up but as soon as I started moving around my heart started racing and I started sweating like crazy so I got out quick to MY pharmacy and got the prescription filled but once I had the medicine in hand I started having some anxiety about TAKING it! I kept thinking that I am really going to mess my body (and mind!) up by going from methadone to suboxone and what if the suboxone didn't work for some reason and I had to go back to methadone? So after about a 2 hour long anxiety attack my cell phone rings and it is the doctor calling to check on me to see how I was doing. I told him what I was thinking and he assured me that all of this was normal and talked me into doing 1/4 of a strip and calling him back an hour later. I did the 1/4 strip and after about 30-45 minutes I FELT BETTER!!! That was at 1 o'clock and when I called the doctor back he said I can do another 1/4 of a strip if I feel like I need it but I honestly feel okay right now - I don't feel like I can clean my whole house or go grocery shopping but I am not experiencing ANY withdrawal symptoms. I think everything is going to be okay with the suboxone! I know now that I am not going to have precipitated withdrawals so if I feel like I need to I am going to do another 1/4 or even more, up to a strip a day per the doctors orders. I want to be on the lowest dose possible because my whole goal is to come off of everything but I know it is going to take some time. I have to see the doctor again next Tuesday at which time I should be stable on my dosage and from there I will only have to see him once a month. This is just the first day and I'm sure I will have a few more ups and downs but I am feeling really good about my decision to switch to the suboxone! Thank you again Karen and everyone else who responded to me - you all have been a great help to me during this time!!!


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:29 pm 
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Yay Linda! :D

Been wondering about you? I'm so happy for you! Can you imagine how you would have been feeling if you had waited until Thursday night for that appointment? :shock: Yikes! You would have been miserable. Sounds like you have an awesome doctor, and that makes all the difference.

I can't imagine the panic you must have felt driving around all night trying to get the script filled. That must have put your anxiety through the roof? And then you were able to get some good sleep regardless? Amazing is all I can say! :D

I'm a little stunned that only 2mg is all it took to get you stable. That is a very small dose Linda, so I would only suggest to be prepared to require a bit more. I think I mentioned to you that it could take a couple days or so to get you completely stable during the induction phase and feeling real good. The dose may need to be adjusted during this time. 1/4 of an 8mg strip is 2mg, and you may have to take that other 2mg later today as the doctor suggested? Time will tell of course.

But isn't it amazing how you can be feeling so bad, a 20 on the Cows, and once you get some sub in your system you begin feeling so much better? It's a wonderful tool to help us fight addiction with. You did AWESOME Linda and I'm very proud of you, and so happy it all worked out like it did.

Now you can do anything you want to be doing everyday. Just get up, take your dose when your ready, and go about your day doing whatever you want without worrying about needing something. It's an amazing feeling once it all comes together! Well done girl.

Please let us know how your feeling later. I really and truly expect you to need a bit more sub. If not that's great, but just see how you feel later and go from there. Thanks for the update and talk to you later! :D

Karen xoxo


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:49 pm 
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Awesome, so glad to hear you've been inducted successfully and are feeling better. Its a transition from a full agonist to a partial, and I felt weird for a few weeks, but SO worth it!

Make sure you come back to update. :)


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

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