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 Post subject: Suicide in the rooms
PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2012 8:34 pm 
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I went to a meeting recently, and members were sharing about how a well known "older cleaner member" had just passed away by his own volition. It seemed there was a bit of confusion, because this guy was considered a pillar of the NA community, had sponsees etc.

Whenever I hear of a suicide in the rooms, I get quite angry at NA. When I was working the program every day, a full time na-na, I felt that psychiatry was a bad thing. Every day I heard them say on that hand-out "we sought help through medication, religion and psychiatry, but none of these things worked for us." Within the 12-step program, there is this idea that if a person is unhappy, or depressed in the rooms, it's because they're not working the program hard enough. The 12-steps are THE only form of personal development a person needs. There's also a suggestion that seeking help with psychiatry is risky, as drug-seeking could be the motivation rather than a need for genuine help.

When I was in the program, my last sponsor suggested that if I worked the steps hard enough, I would no longer require medication for my mental illness. He also suggested that bipolar doesn't exist, that everyone has ups and downs. He also suggested the 12-steps are the only program I need in my life. It was then that I finally realised, after doing NA for three years and working the program, going off my medications and relapsing into depression despite praying every day and working the steps.

To me, when a person kills themselves within the fellowship because they've refused to get medical help, the program has blood on its hands. The last meeting I went to, a person who I used to be friendly with (I don't do many meetings now) shared from the floor that when he was in addiction, he'd use to escape when he was depressed. Now that he's in recovery, when he's depressed he thinks of suicide to escape. And he was confused and desperate because he was doing all the suggested things in the program, and he was still having those thoughts. When I hear a guy saying that, I think he needs medical help. Yet because the program is so disparaging towards psychiatry, so many people refuse to get the help they need.

If you are in a 12-step program, and you are depressed or contemplating self-harm, or suicide. The for fucks sake see a doctor, don't see your sponsor.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 8:59 am 
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Thanks for sharing that with us, TJ. I agree with you 100%. Any person who actively dissuades someone who is suicidal from seeking help, to me, IS partly responsible. I don't see how such a person could sleep at night. I'm just so sorry to hear about someone - another addict, hell anyone - taking their own life. Just the thought of someone in that much pain breaks my heart. Many of us have been that low before and we know how horrible it feels. I hate the fact that such deep, dark depression has taken another life when it could have been treated. What a fucking waste.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 4:08 pm 
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I'm sorry to the people in NA but its a joke. Everyone could benefit from mental health treatment in some way shape or form especially addicts. The majority of us at one point used to escape our problemms and like this kid now that he doesn't have that escape he's left with one choice in his mind. In reality there are so many techniques you can learn in mental health treatment to deal with your problems. But we need help in finding those new techniques if we could do it on our own we wouldn't b in this mess in the first place. Sorry just venting that kid is crying out for help and NA and the people in it are not helping by telling him that horse shit!

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2012 5:56 pm 
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Bboy42287 wrote:
Everyone could benefit from mental health treatment in some way shape or form especially addicts.


I agree. I have always thought that if it were free to go to a therapist, I could benefit from going to treatment forever. I believe that there's always something that can be taken away from therapy...even when I am feeling healthy and not in the midst of some kind of crisis...just looking inward...being mindful of daily circumstancs, contemplating them and talking things out would be helpful no matter what point in life we are at. I would just have to get over the feeling of being uncomfortable talking about my life to a total stranger. That and money are what keeps me from going to a therapist right now.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:46 pm 
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AA--NA-'. they have this religen to beleive a light bolb or A god and when a person speaks up in a meeting for help they say talk to some one after the meating and ya you get your little talk witch is keep coming back and this god is going to do the rest and then they kill them self's we have a big f'n problem here also with suicide. :cry:
any one talks to me here, about na-aa i say you are taking a risk.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2012 7:32 pm 
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Puppets on a string. That was always the phrase that came to mind when I went to 12 step meetings. I have never seen so many people in one place that have the exact same personality. The cliques were worse than high school, and if you steered clear of the drama, which I do, you weren't "working" the program... whatever! I have already had the misfortune of running into a woman I used to see regularly at meetings. I saw her at our town grocery store. And I hear this "Kelly!" loud enough for the whole store to hear. Like she's sooooo happy to see me. ya right. I say "whats up" She asked what meetings I've been going to as she hadn't seen me around. I told her I see an addictions counselor once a week, my pdoc once a month, and I am on suboxone. You woulda thought I told her I was drowning kittens in my spare time. She said I will NEVER make it taking drugs. Ok. Thanks for sharing I said. and walked away. I probably would have said a lot more if my son hadn't been with me.

If I didn't see my pdoc and a therapist, I'd relapse over and over for the rest of my life. I enjoy having the opportunity to work through the things that lead me back to using every time.

I couldn't agree more! If you are depressed and are thinking about suicide, don't see your sponsor, see a doctor. Well said Tearjerker!

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 5:15 am 
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my doc still say's this forum is good enough for my meetings. he understands the things i go through in AA/NA

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 11:54 am 
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I just pretty much quit going two weeks ago, after attending this one group for well over six months.
there were about 6 of us that are on suboxone going, so thats why I started going 'regularly' about 6 mo ago.

Well, for one thing it was sopposed to be a young person meeting, and all kinds of "old timers" began coming, which is fine......
but when a couple of these guys found out we werent doing the 'steps' we were just coming for moral support and all that,,,,,,
um,,,
it didnt go over so well.
I tried going again, and none of my 'fellows' were there.

Somebody must have said something to the suboxone doctor, cuz now HES starting "our own" meetings down at the clinic, and there will be an actual addiction counselor/therapist, and he wants to do some sort of program where ppl that have been on sub awhile can 'help' new people with induction and all that.

So now, that meeting starts in just a couple weeks.

They "say" you just have to not want to use/drink to attend meetings.
But, Im not sure thats true.
somebody once compared NA/AA to a 'cult' on here once, and now after MY experience, I can SORTA see why???

Ive done 'some' form of the steps with my addiction therapist, so I didnt really see the point of the other ones, especially when I dont want to 'admit' that I believe in a higher power. Iknow it doesnt HAVE to be God. But try and tell one of these guys that.
I think atheists are more hated than murderers, to some people!!!!!!! not to everyone of course.
and Im not even 'sure' what I believe.
Im still trying to figure that part out..............................................

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 9:54 pm 
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amber4.14.11 wrote:

Somebody must have said something to the suboxone doctor, cuz now HES starting "our own" meetings down at the clinic, and there will be an actual addiction counselor/therapist, and he wants to do some sort of program where ppl that have been on sub awhile can 'help' new people with induction and all that.


That's awesome. That's pretty much exactly what you want in a group...


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 5:41 am 
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there was all kinds of meetings for are health that did not make the market in the past 80 or so years that could have been
pretty good, and why did AA/NA stick so well and become so DAMM strick with force and the law. i have no thing against the program but what give's any thing the right to put a (------) on some one? :o

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