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PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 5:15 am 
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I've known people to iv suboxone and not have any instant withdrawals or adverse effects. People do get "addicted" to the whole ritual and process of using a needle. I never missed any of that mess but I did not iv for years and years. IMO anyone injecting thier suboxone is probably not very serious about any kind of long term sobriety. To try to create any type of rush with the medication that was prescribed to get us out of that life style is dangerous. At the same time we can't act suprised and shocked to hear people are doing this. Of course this medication is going to be abused by addicts and I'm sure in a few years someone will figure out a way to extract the nalexone out of suboxone. I'm sure people all over are working on it now. I would not expect any less. Didn't we all used to crush all our percs and extract the oxy out. They weren't prescribed with that in mind but addicts will always figure out a way to abuse just about anything. My point is some seemed almost suprised when replying but honestly weren't we doing the same thing for years. It's probably not the best place to discuss this topic (a forum to help people in recovery that are serious about thier sobriety), it would be better for bluelight or one of those forums.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 1:23 pm 
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I believe naloxone will only send you into withdrawal if you have an opiate occupying your receptors already. If not then the naloxone will not put you into withdrawal. I gave injected suboxone before with no ill effects. Does that make any sense to any of you?


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 01, 2010 5:06 am 
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I have a few things from personal experience that i would like to add to this topic and i hope no one takes any offense to this. First of all i would like to compliment katzenfreundin's well thought out, intelligent, and informative post, wich i hope everybody read in its entirety, to all of you who were so close minded about James668's post. While he wasnt exactly sure of why he didnt feel withdrawls like everyone else on the page claims you ABSOLUTELY WILL HAVE IF YOU IV INJECT SUBOXONE he was telling you of his personal experience in an effort to further everybodys knowledge of the drug and you all should have at least considered it to be true before you all shot his post down like it was a lie. Now that being said i have had much similar experience iv injecting suboxone as katzenfreundin in wich when my system was clear of any opiates and i did not experience a bit of withdrawls and it simply got me high. A quarter of an 8mg sub or aprox. 2mg injected feels much like taking a full 8mg sub orally and last just about as long. While i am in no way endorsing iv injecting suboxone or any form of drug nor would i ever, it in no way gave me any form of withdrawls and is in fact my prefered way of taking it cause i can make my perscription go alot farther and i use far less pills this way. Now i also have had a few weekends where i decided to have a little fun and did a couple of 80mg oxycotins and when i went back to my subs the next day, about 10 to 12 hours later, with the opiates still in my system, i definitely did feel some fairly severe withdrawls for about 10-15min but after that i was fine. I was simply high. So any of you out there can take my opinion and experience for what you will but i can tell you all this, what information you all knew was rock solid has now been changed by at least 3 different peoples personal experiences and i certainly hope it can change your personal preception on real peoples real experiences versus what you've been told before you are so sure about what you KNOW is right.


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 Post subject: Injecting subs?????
PostPosted: Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:55 pm 
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After much reading about this subject and consulting several associates, I decided to do the unthinkable...inject Suboxone. I took 1/2 of an 8mg strip, dissolved it with several pinches of ascorbic acid, 200ml h20, and light heat. Filtered through cotton, and slammed it. I can't say that I'm in terrible withdrawal, my nose is still running, but I do feel a slight buzz. It's nothing great, I probably won't do it again, but I figured that I could gamble 1 hour of sickness to find out for myself. It's a heady buzz, closest I can approximate is OxyContin. It's not the metallic punch of Fentanyl, the sickly prickly pop of morphine or methadone, and most definitely not the warm, loving embrace of Heroin. If one were to do this, I would recommend separating the bupe from the narcan, by dissolving the Suboxone in alcohol. WARNING!! Do not inject rubbing alcohol under ANY circumstance. Dissolve the pill, filter it into a needle through cotton, then squirt in into a cap or cooker or something and let the alcohol evaporate overnight, after the alcohol has evaporated, add water and boot. But it's been my experience that addicts are not patient people (unless they're waiting for the dopeman), so use Vodka or some other clear high-proof alcohol, if you are in a hurry, and inject. The buprenorphine is quite soluble in alcohol, whereas the naltrexone is not, that's why I suggest this method. Regardless, it's simply not worth the trouble to inject this crap, the body habituates to the feeling very rapidly when taken orally, I would imagine it's the same IV. If you want to try something else or just hate the taste, I recommend taking the Suboxone anally, as a suppository. You can cook the pill up first, then suck up into a syringe, break the tip off, then insert into anus.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 2:29 pm 
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katzenfreundin's post above was well written, editted, and complety true.


Just let me summorize:

Injeting Suboxone will cause WD if ANY full agonists opioid are in the blood/brain. EVEN if you don't feel them. You must wait for most of the full agonist to metabolize.

If you have zero opioid tolerance and nothing in the blood/brain. Injecting suboxone will cause an agonist "high". Injecting naloxone to a completey sober person, nothing would happen. It may constrict the pupils even.

You all need study what the words agonist, antagonist mean first and for all.

The antagonist naloxone, calms the receptor back to baseline, for lack of a better words.

Also, suboxone, buprenorphine, whatever, can be administered to an overdose victim. Use about the same dosage as naloxone. More can be used if necessary. If this happens, the OD victim will thank you later for not using naloxone.

And, yes, most of the WD felt from injecting suboxone, is in fact actually buprenorphine. BECAUSE buprenorphine can act as an agonist or antagonist. This is why it is labeled such.....

Come on people, read and do reasearch. Instead of getting into "pissing contests" with who is right and who is wrong. What is known about this is made clear in katzenfreundin's post and summarized in mine. (and a few others on here)


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 3:09 pm 
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Wow

jgjgjgjgjgjg's did post it first and he put it very simply.

I overlooked his/her post....

Anways, I think this issue has been settled and the topic of the thread was hi-jacked.

Anyways,

Changing from suboxone to subutex or vice versa, you shouldn't even notice a change...I bet you $20, I am so confident on this.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2011 12:34 pm 
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There's not much difference at all between suboxone and subutex when taken under the tongue. Just remember that whatever amount of Naloxone you ingest, which is so minute it's hardly noticeable, gets metabolised in 10-15 minutes. Occasionally I notice some really mild precipitated withdrawal when I take my Suboxone. Symptoms like feeling a bit colder, getting goosebumps, crying easily over radio tunes or getting a slightly runny nose. It wears off quickly and only happens occasionally. I put it down to variations of Naloxone dose in the different batches.

James668 wrote:
Honestly, I think the whole "naloxone will make you sick if you inject it" is just somethin the doctor tells us to make us scared. I only say this because ive been injecting suboxone for 2 1/2 years and have never gotten any sicker then when I took it sublingul(under tongue). I often wonder if anybody else out there injects it also. Being a herion addict I began to crave the needle as much as the drug. So when I first started on suboxone it just wasnt enough, I still had the "itch". One day I just took the plunge and said im either about to get really sick or feel really good. Thank god it was the second choice. It satisfied both my cravings and I didnt have to taste that nasty suboxone taste anymore.


That's interesting man. I'll admit that I've injected Suboxone once whilst in active addiction, and it was definitely uncomfortable enough that I would not repeat the experience. The precipitated withdrawal only lasted about 15 minutes, leaving the bupe high lingering as long as it would if I took it under the tongue. But that 15 minutes of precipitated withdrawal wasn't nice. It was like a cold shot of really dirty speed that gave me instant goosebumps and had me running to the toilet not knowing whether to sit or kneel. The only worse feeling I'd had was when I took naltrexone while on Methadone.

Interesting that most people I knew who enjoyed that feeling were also big meth shooters.


I've also injected Subutex once and that was much better. In fact, I'd probably have chosen it over heroin.

Word is "on the street" in my country that 2mg pills can be injected with minimal precipitated withdrawal, even with multiples, but the 8mg pills seem to have a higher ratio of naloxone:buprenorphine in reality so they cause more withdrawal.

Wehr wrote:
I believe naloxone will only send you into withdrawal if you have an opiate occupying your receptors already. If not then the naloxone will not put you into withdrawal. I gave injected suboxone before with no ill effects. Does that make any sense to any of you?


This is not necessarily true. Technically what you'd be going through is not withdrawal, cos as you say there's no "kicking off the receptors" going on when an opiate naive or detoxed person injects Suboxone. BUT you would still be suffering, albeit not as much. It's not a pleasant combination to have a partial agonists and full antagonists fighting over your receptors. In fact, I can't think of much worse a drug combination.

If someone injects Suboxone and doesn't suffer any ill effects at first, then it's only because the pills they use have less Naloxone in them than they should Unfortunately this is more common than most doctors would like to know.

Remember as long as long as the people here are injecting medications... you are getting ZERO recovery. FACT. If you stopped taking suboxone now you will be injecting other drugs the next day, guaranteed. I'm pretty sure you know this fact to be true. So if you want to get clean and have a full, happy life with lots of sex with a gorgeous wife to be and a black picket fence and a mortgage and a sweet car, you'd best be giving up the steel. But you know that.


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 Post subject: IV suboxone
PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 3:27 am 
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Ok so just to clear things up, you can absolutely IV subs. The only way you can do it without withdrawals is if suboxone is the only opiate that you are currently taking. If you are taking a full agonists opiate and then try and shoot it you will go into withdrawals. If you are only on subs the you will not. I have been off OC's for almost 3 years and have been on suboxone the entire time. I IVit all the time and never once has it sent me into withdrawals. It may be different for others but it doesn't make ne sick. I do feel like I get a way way better biz from IV and I'm really sick of orange. Remember this will only work if you have not taken a full opiate agonist recently or if subs are the only opiate you use. This is my first post by the way so thanks for letting me join your forum and if you have any questions for me don't hesitate to ask.


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PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2011 6:24 am 
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James668 wrote:
Honestly, I think the whole "naloxone will make you sick if you inject it" is just somethin the doctor tells us to make us scared. I only say this because ive been injecting suboxone for 2 1/2 years and have never gotten any sicker then when I took it sublingul(under tongue). I often wonder if anybody else out there injects it also. Being a herion addict I began to crave the needle as much as the drug. So when I first started on suboxone it just wasnt enough, I still had the "itch". One day I just took the plunge and said im either about to get really sick or feel really good. Thank god it was the second choice. It satisfied both my cravings and I didnt have to taste that nasty suboxone taste anymore.



All i have heard on the internet is people saying "YOU POSITIVELY CANNOT SHOOT SUBOXONE OR YOU WILL GO INTO WITHDRAWALS". I shoot around 1 or 2 8mg a day & i have never once gone into withdrawal from it. You get higher then putting them under your tounge or sniffing them. Plus, no nasty taste. I have heard of people who are actively doing opiates & shoot up a suboxone and go into withdrawal. But as long as you dont have any opiates in your system, you will be fine. I also read a post by somebody who said he wasnt doing opiates& shot up a sub and started getting cold,puking,fever,etc. Which sounded to me like cotton fever. So im sure some people who dont know too much about it would mistake the two. I just think it is better to let people know that NOT EVERYBODY THAT SHOOTS UP SUBOXONE WILL GO INTO WITHDRAWL! Only if you are actively using opiates, which in that case, why would you even want suboxone? I just wanted to clairify my experience. Thank you all.


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PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2011 11:33 am 
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Okay,I have a question. I hope I don't offend anyone,it's not my intention.
If anyone is taking Suboxone because they want to get clean,then why would you shoot up?
Isn't that still part of active addiction? Still looking for a buzz? Still addicted to the needle?

I'd really like to understand that better.


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 Post subject: Injecting suboxone
PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:28 pm 
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I live in Finland, and real heroin is practically non-existent here, aswell as are the harder opioids, codeine is available as 30mg with 500mgs paracetamol on prescription. This is an amphetamine country one could say. But my point is , that people since there is no heroin start using/abusing with buprenorphine, and the most commonly available is suboxones. And this is an increasing problem it seems.

My ex-wife´s got HIV , and the medication messes up her stomach, so she insisted on going on suboxone treatment, because suboxones help with that (and I also believe she likes to be a little high). This after some two years of purchasing them on the street, and injecting. Under the two years shooting the stuff, she got sick maybe three times, and I believe this was only because of contamination on the needle or something similar. I myself have gotten the same symtoms maybe twice, and I´ve done iv speed some 15 years and iv subs maybe 4 years, but on an irregula basis.

Now I started working as a scaffolding constructor (bloody hardcore physically ultra-heavy work) , I´ve gone on subs just to cope with the work, i take one quarter 8mg and dissolve in three ml water, this is for three doses. No adverse effects so far, I just can now deal with the muscle pain and feel better at work (I have modest problems with depression) .

My point is, that afaik, i you haven´t got any "good" opioids in your system, shooting subs is no problem with regards to the naloxone and withdrawal issue. I still do not encourage anyone to shoot them.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:50 am 
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Ok here it is. I have been injecting suboxone for 2 years and have had no problems what so ever. The only time I have had a withdrawl was when I had injected it way to soon after I had taken an opiate. I am sure that evey body is different and it could have the wrong effect on some people. I have had no trouble. The only 2 reasons that I continue to do so is because 1) I cannot stand the taste and 2) I have been a long time IV user and crave the actual needle. I dissolve the quater of suboxone in cold water and filter twice. I am not posting this for anyone to go and try this. ( TRY AT YOUR OWN RISK) I am just agreeing on the fact that it can be done. So if you take an opiate and then take sub's in any way you will withdrawl REGARDLESS! just keep that in mind. My only concern on continued IV use of sub's is the effect that it has on your organs. I do notice that when you get blood mixed in with the liquid sub that the blood will seperate and that concerns me. I have found nothing on the interenet that really can tell me about what shooting will do to your organs if anything different than taken sublingually. If anyone has any ideas or finds anything please let me know.

TY ...
adidio


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 7:35 pm 
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Injecting anything is much worse than taking it orally. Endocarditis, pill binders clogging heart/lungs, abscesses, collapsed veins, tracks, infection. These things are more common than people think. A friend of mine lost her foot from endocarditis from injecting pills and she was really sterile, always clean works.


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 Post subject: injecting
PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:01 am 
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TY. I do know that of course injecting anything is awful, I have had cotton fever and a few other complications. Because I have been a long time IV user with heroin and oxy 30 and now sub's its so hard to break the habit of actually doing the ritual. I know there are other people addicted to just that aspect. I have tried to stop injecting before to no avail. If anyone has any tips please let me know.

TY

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:23 am 
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Have you ever considered seeing an addiction counselor, one-on-one? That might just be your best bet. It's at least worth a shot. Good luck to you in your remission/recovery.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:41 pm 
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Considered getting heaps of piercings, or tatts?


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 2:58 pm 
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really funny you should mention that..... i have 13 peircings and im currently stretching out my tounge. I am currently unemployed like most of america... so i havent been able to get anymore peircings as of yet. My brother has actually been buying my monthly supply of suboxone to help me out and also because he is an addict as well. I am concerned because he has moved up the latter and has started to inject his pills. He says that he is not an addict and he has been for like 13 years or so. So he has been in a long denial stage. I havent been able to help him. So he uses the sub's to his benifit when he is out of roxies. Also I have been in and out of rehabs and have done n/a, a/a and it doesnt work for me. I am on suboxone daily as usual, but I always want to do more due to the fact of the shooting up aspect. I wish there was an easy fix but there isnt. Please guys continue to post I really love hearing everyones thoughts and advice on this subject!


TY,

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 3:04 pm 
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TY hatmaker for the encouragement. I really appreciate that.


TY

adidio 8)


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 Post subject: The Fact Is....
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 11:09 pm 
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I know this thread is very old, but I just found it on google, and would like to set the record straight about shooting Suboxone. If you are still addicted to another opioid, such as heroin, yes, you may go into withdrawals from the Narcane....If you are not, shooting Suboxone WILL NOT put you into withdrawals. I know this because SWIM did it 10 minutes ago.

I live in Maine, this state is notorious for it's history over the past 13 or so years of problems related to opioid addiction. It mostly started because of the introduction of Oxycontin in 1996 or '97. I graduated high school in 2000, and I swear in my junior year, 1999, before the whole problem really became public, half the kids in my class were high on that stuff. I remember one kid saying "the best high I've ever had came from my grandma's bathroom!"

Anyway, there are now A LOT of people in Maine on Suboxone. I also know many who abuse it. Including SWIM. I know for a fact that if you are beyond the stage where you are still addicted to something else, and you are only using Suboxone, you can shoot it, and you CAN get high off it. This is how SWIM says its best: Don't inject any more than 3-4 mg of it, trust me even if you take 4 8mg subs a day, you WILL feel it. Now, yes, the Naloxone, Narcane, whatever, will block it at first and you wont feel anything. What they dont tell you is the effects of Narcane only last about 45 mins max. As soon as that wears off, I guarantee, it's the Land of Nod.

I don't condone or recommend doing this, really, if you want to get high, go get high off a better suited drug....theres just something wrong with shooting something bright orange into your vein. I mean, it won't actually hurt you in any way, it's just freaky....I guess that's better than sludgy brown black tar heroin though. Ewww....Had that a few times in Los Angeles back in the day. Yuck. Gimme some good NYC white china any day. ANYWAY, if you want to get high and dont want to get into the habit of buying H or Oxy's or whatever anymore....SWIM says, it may be worth a 'shot'.

Be careful though, and DO NOT mix with benzo's of any kind. I've lost friends to that combination. Also, don't make it a daily thing, or even weekly, you don't want to end up turning orange or something...


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 4:00 pm 
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God This isnt ROCKET science people..

BUPRENOROPHINE has stronger affinity the receptors than NALAXONE... You get INSTANT withdrawals from the BUPRENORPHINE knocking off the opiate receptors...NOT Nalaxone.....

YOU CAN shoot SUBOXONE and not GO into instant withdrawal as long as there arent other opiates in your system...


It aint complicated people... I thought this was general knowledge


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