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 Post subject: Suboxone withdrawl help
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:11 am 
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Hi guys, I got into a pretty nasty habit of smoking 150mg of oxycodone every day for a month and a half. I have recently quit 2 days ago and got some suboxone from someone to help with the withdrawals, i have been taking 4mg a day for 2 days now i am going to quit taking the suboxone after day 5 or 6 and i want to know how bad the withdrawals will be after i stop with the suboxone. any help is greatly appreciated! thx a bunch :)


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:49 am 
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Hi Philip,

That's an extremely hard question to answer. Is your total opiate experience 1.5 months? Not just the oxy's, I mean your total experience with opiates, 1.5 months?

If you have only been using opiates for 1.5 months and you have already successfully transitioned to Suboxone and you plan on quitting sub here in another few days, I'm going to say you are still more than likely to experience some withdrawal. Very, very difficult to say how bad though. I know in my case, I got on opiates after an accident and within 3 weeks of that accident I tried to quit and experienced withdrawal. It wasn't horrendous, but it was withdrawal. Then again, I was already an addict and had been for about 12 years. I was on weed and/or cocaine leading up to my opiate abuse days. I'm sure that played a big role in me switching over to opiates so quickly.

Again, if your opiate history is only 6 weeks long, I would use the sub in lower and lower doses, spacing them farther and farther out until I was tapered off. Man, I believe you're going to experience at least some wd, so just be ready for it.

I hope you keep us up to date. I've seen a few stories like your's here lately and I'm really curious how Suboxone works with people who have short opiate histories.


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 Post subject: day 3 now
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:03 am 
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well i would use oc every now and then for the past 2 years but i would only smoke about 60mg and would space it out at least 4 months at a time, i started smoking about every other week then every weekend then i got down to doing it everyday except it was oxycodone and about 150mg a day... day 3 without it now, still using a little suboxone to help with the withdrawals going to only use 2mg today and see how it goes. no real withdrawal as of yet just some sore muscles and a little runny nose the mental thing isn't really there with me because I'm a true pot head at heart and have been smoking allot of weed to help me through all of this... wish me luck!

I'm hoping that once i get off the suboxone i wont experience too bad of withdrawals or any seeing as i will have only been using it for 6 days or so and not that much (2mg-4mg a day) I've been reading online allot and it seems like people only have bad withdrawals after being on it for a long period of time and the others who used it quickly to taper off don't experience that bad of ones but still some none the less... any input is appreciated


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:34 am 
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Hi Phillip and welcome. Think of it this way...You would be withdrawing from regular opiates whether you were on suboxone or not. We can't really taper off our DOC - that's the problem. But we CAN taper from sub. Sub is helping you taper from your prior drug use. So you will actually be withdrawing from your DOC - really since you only plan on using sub for a very short time. (The way I see it.) But as has been said, you need to wean yourself down from the sub over time, allowing your body/brain to adjust to those lower dosages over time.

It is possible you will still have w/d, depending on how your taper goes. There have been people who've done a really fast detox using sub and have had minimal withdrawals. Keep tapering lower and lower - again, spreading those doses out as much as you can.

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 Post subject: still day 3
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:23 am 
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That's what i figured. I know that suboxone is still an opiate and so being is just really prolonging my withdrawal. I know by doing so i will still have withdrawal symptoms just hopefully not as much from the low doses of suboxone Ive been using. Even with using a low dose of suboxone i still fill like crap i think my body is getting used to not having as much opiate in its system as it was use to. ill see how tapering it to 2mg goes today. Tomorrow I'll also try tapering to 1 or 2mg. By day 5 I'm not going to take anything (will be my 5Th day of not using oxycodone and 1st day without suboxone) which in total will be only 4 days of using suboxone tapering down to 1 or 2mg... hopefully my withdrawal will be at a minimum by then. I'm thinking i will still experience minor to no pain compared to if i had gone cold turkey... any thoughts are helpful, thanks :)


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:34 am 
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Try taking the absolute lowest dose of suboxone that will stop the withdrawals instead of setting your mind at a certain number. You may not even need as much as you think. Sub is pretty damn strong. So try taking slivers at a time and once the w/d symptoms subside to a level you can tolerate, I'd stop there. Then wait until you can't stand it anymore and take another sliver - the bare minimum. I hope this helps. Keep us posted.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:07 pm 
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I have to agree with your statement about using sub to help you taper off your DOC instead of going cold turkey. Cold turkey is crazy hard to do. The sub will have carried you through the worst part of the wd process, but I'm just not sure if you'll come in for as smooth a landing as your hoping for. I am certainly hopeful that you do land beautifully though.

Being on a low dose of sub, like you are, is very encouraging to hear. HatMaker brings up a very important point though, don't fixate on a certain dose of sub. Suboxone is very, very potent and you may be able get by with even less?

Like I said in my first post, this is an extremely tough nut to crack due to your usage history. You sound like you have a pretty good grip on the situation already and that's great to hear!


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:33 pm 
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well lets hope for that smooth landing lol... thanks for the advice i will try to take slivers of the subs and see how it goes. i will keep you guys informed of my next few days trying to get through this.. (still cant wait tell day 5)


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:39 pm 
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my friend just told me that xanax helps withdrawals quite a bit so when I'm off of the suboxone on Sunday I'm going to get a bunch of xanax and take it 3 or 4 days after to help with any withdrawals i might have... any suggestions are greatly appreciated. thanks :)


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:30 am 
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NO, NO, NO!!! Bad Idea - I mean very bad idea!

Xanax can be and often is just as addictive as opiates are. In fact, for some people Xanax can be worse. Many also claim that Xanax can be harder to get off of. I am certain that Xanax withdrawal can kill you (severe cases) - where that is rare and honestly pretty much impossible from straight opiate withdrawal.

There certainly are some medications that can and do help with opiate withdrawal. Clonidine would be one of them. It is actually a high blood pressure medication but works very well for withdrawals. There are others. However, I cannot stress enough that using Xanax - especially without a prescription and without the direct supervision and care of a highly experienced addiction doc, is not a good idea at all.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:43 am 
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point taken. i know that xanax can be addicting... Ive actually had a prescription for it in the past and never got addicted to it and know exactly how much to take and what it is like, my friend told me allot of doctors actually prescribe people benzos to help with their withdrawals.. I'm sure you have heard this also.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:49 am 
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Don's right. Really, it's more typical to use Clonidine for opiate withdrawals than to use benzos. Clonidine has a specific effect on the brain and relieves many of the symptoms. Although it is a B/P medicine, it's also like the gold standard for treating opiate withdrawals. And there's no chance of addiction. Why add another addictive med like a benzo to the mix?

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 Post subject: day 4 woo
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:08 am 
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today is day 4 of no oxycodone... i am really happy with myself to this point, although it kind of sucks... I only took 2mg of suboxone today and plan on 1mg tomorrow. On day 5 I will not take a sub and see how it goes, i will however take benzo's to help with the withdrawals at that point on Sunday. i know you guys think it is a bad idea for me but i assure you i know my own system and what i like and don't like. i will not get addicted to the benzos to help me with the withdrawals. after 3 or 4 days of using the xanax I'm going to go cold turkey from everything (besides pot) lol. but yeah ill keep posting you guys and letting you know what kind of withdrawals i feel and how the next week or so goes. thanks a bunch any input is appreciated :)


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 Post subject: going on day 5 :)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 4:11 am 
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Going on the 5Th day of no oxycodone!!! As of day 4 i had no suboxone whatsoever and felt the withdrawals where pretty bearable i did however take 1.5mg of xanax to help with them. on day 5 i plan to take 1mg-2mg of suboxone depending on how bad the withdrawals are, I hear the 48hr mark of no opiates is when the withdrawals really start to kick in so i will see how it goes. If they are bearable like today i will just take some more xanax to help me and repeat the process tell i feel the withdrawals are no more, and obviously stop taking the xanax after the withdrawals subside... i guess we will see how it goes today i will let you guys know if i have to take suboxone or not later today or if i just take more xanax to help with the withdrawals. i feel like in the next 5 days i should have no more opiate withdrawals and be clean from everything besides pot... haha. but yeah any input is greatly appreciated thanks for the words of wizdom and support :)


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 9:48 am 
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Getting through withdrawals only takes one to the starting line in recovery. If you can get through a DIY detox, you have a chance, if you choose to take it. Self-prescribing pills and smoking weed isn't a good way to start. I agree that Xanax is a terrible idea. Benzos can be used as detox meds for depressant addiction, they are rarely given for opiate withdrawal, especially not a short-acting one like Xanax.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 10:13 am 
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Just one thing I wanted to add...Since you're doing a rapid taper, don't focus on taking 1 mg. I suggest to take slivers and take the absolute lowest amount necessary to address the withdrawals. This will help you in the long run. You may need much less than you think you do - sub is very strong. Just take what you need and try not to take any more. Good luck to you.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 2:21 pm 
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Ya know, I just have to jump in here. I don't expect that you are going to listen, but there very well may be other readers out there who will. This is not at all the way to go about treating an addiction to opiates. Self medicating, switching from one controlled substance (without a prescription) to another controlled substance (without a prescription) while smoking pot on top of it, is hardly a life of sobriety. I'm very glad that you are starting to look at getting your life in order. I'm very glad that you are getting off of Oxy. Unfortunately, as others have said, this is hardly the way to go about it. Even overlooking the fact that you are doing this on your own with drugs off the street, the speed of it all is likely to cause a relapse. It is rare for people to do what you are doing and stay clean - extremely rare - as in a few percent, if that.

I also fully understand that many people just have to try it for themselves to find out. I hope that you'll remain here with us so in the event that things don't work out for you, you'll still have some other options and input from other people here. As for the withdrawals, 48 hours could be the starting point, but many people have reported that 72 hours is their start. Some people don't feel changes until the third day. However, in those cases they are often on higher doses of Sub. At lower doses you very well could feel significant withdrawals at 48 hours.

The thing is, in order to be successful over the longer term, you are going to need to put more pieces into your plan. Some sort of counseling would be very helpful. It should go without saying that having an addiction specialist directing your care would be a great idea. Smoking pot is also part of the deal. You can't be drug free while smoking pot. I'm not saying it's going to ruin your life in the same way that oxy can. I'm just saying that it's counter-intuitive to be in recovery, be drug free, and still smoke pot.

Again, I am under no delusions that you are going to heed my warnings. I just don't want other readers walking this same path and thinking its the right way to go. Hopefully some of the others here will jump in with their thoughts and suggestions. I am actually surprised at how few have. What's going on? Where is everyone?


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 6:17 pm 
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Hello. Someone someone must have woke up on the wrong side of the bed today. Number one which i will not get too into right now is the marijuana, it is not physically addicting like strong opiates are but I'm sure you already know that, it also has a high number of medical purposes which is why California, Washington, oregon, and alaska are very close to making it a legal substance... it does help extremely with the withdrawls i have been facing and i want to say that it will definitely help other people that are experiencing the same thing as me. i can go on and on about how pot is not that bad for you but i am sure you can google and find out for yourself.
On the other hand taking suboxone for only 3 days I'm doubting will give me too bad of withdrawals if you have done your reaserch online like i have the people that get withdrawals from it are users who have been taking high mg's over a long period of time. I'm not saying that I'm not going to experience any withdrawals but i think you are making it out way worse than it will be. this is my second day of no opiates at all (low doses of suboxone) and my 5th day of no oxycodone... and i don't really feel that bad to be honest with you... tapering down with the subs for a few days and the xananx and pot actually helped me tremendously to get over this stuff and im sure with other people it will help them as well... you just have to know your body and your limit which i do and it helped me get over it... i am not one thats going to take benzos forever.. just enough to help me with the withdrawals tell they go away... if you also did more research you would find out that lots of medical professionals actually prescribe benzos to help with opiate withdrawals it is NOT UNCOMMON... any input is greatly appreciated :)


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 9:03 pm 
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I want to remind you guys also that pot is not a bad substance please do your research on in before you talk about how "bad" it is. caffeine aspirin and cigarettes actually kill much more people a year than marijuana does... do you even know how many people have died from a marijuana overdose? Well the answer is 0 yes that is right no one in the 1,000 years it has been around has actually died, in fact there has not even been 1 report from someone getting lung cancer from smoking marijuana alone. if it helps me as a person let it help me. so far i have yet to feel too much withdrawal symptoms of my 2ND day off the suboxone, felt a little shitty so took 1mg more of xanax, i think its good that I'm spacing the suboxone use for a couple days, hopefully i wont have to use it again for the withdrawal but if they kick in at all tomorrow which I'm hoping they wont i will only take 1mg and than go cold turkey from the suboxone from there and keep taking the xanax tell the withdrawals subside which well probably be no longer than a couple days. any who yes i agree withdrawls are one of the only parts of getting over this oxycodone but i can assure you once the withdrawals are gone i will have nothing to do with that or xanax ever again... and yes i will still smoke pot because i fill like it actually helps me thought may day to day life. if you guys don't like that than sorry but this is what i did to get over my withdrawls and so far Ive experienced a lot of pain but it definitely wasnt as bad as going cold turkey. any input is appreciated, i will keep you guys informed on what happens the next few days. thanks a bunch.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 10:03 pm 
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From what I've read in philip's posts, I don't think his goal is to quit all drugs. His goal is to get off of opiates. While I share donh's view in so much that I wish philip would quit all drug's, I'm not going to tell him I think it's imperative. I also agree with donh that any other members reading this thread may take philip's way off opiates and I think they should be cautioned that his way involves some real dangers. Everyone comes into and through recovery in their own way.

Now, with all that said, my doctor prescribed me Xanax when I quit Suboxone. 20 pills, 1mg each. I took less than 10 of them total and tossed the rest after 5 or 6 days because of the ridiculously high potential for abuse that comes with taking them. I knew I was playing with fire, I am not advocating the use of Xanax for Suboxone withdrawal, but they helped me. Suboxone withdrawal can be so friggin scary and by taking 1/4mg of Xanax at a time, it helped me.

I also used to be a major pot head. I strongly considered getting some weed during my detox, but I never did. Is the weed helping philip, I think it is. Do I wish he wouldn't do it, yeah. Do I want anyone else surfing this forum to go out and get some Xanax and smoke weed during their wd, not really, but I certainly understand where philip is coming from.

Philip, I do want you to know directly that I think, as far as the Xanax goes, you're playing with fire. I played with that same fire and got lucky. It sounds to me like you are OK as of right now, just please keep being honest with us about your Xanax use so if it does all start to go sideways on you, at least we can try and help. As for the weed, if it helps, then smoke it.

To anyone who doesn't know what Xanax is, it's in a class of drugs called Benzodiazepine's. They are wicked drug's to quit if they ever get their 'hooks' into you, from most accounts it's WAY harder to get off of Benzo's than ANY opiate. I can not stress enough the potential dangers of Xanax abuse and some of the horror stories I have read, but I also can't be a hypocrite and tell you not to use them for opiate wd when I obviously did.


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