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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:42 pm 
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Last edited by LivingLifeFree on Thu Feb 19, 2015 3:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 09, 2015 11:34 pm 
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Hi Living,

I certainly commend you for being able to make the jump from 12mgs. That is a huge accomplishment, and you have every reason to be proud of yourself for it! I want to thank you for taking the time to come here and post about your experience. I'm sure it will be just the push some of us need to take that same plunge.

However, I have to point out that I don't agree with the way you phrased certain things above. There are so many factors that get each of us to the point that we are ready to get off bupe. The main thing, in my opinion, is having the desire to be free of it more than anything else in the world. We don't all get to that point in a short amount of time. And, you can't force yourself to be ready when you're not. You know going into it that you are going to have to suffer to some extent. It takes a lot of will power, for sure. But I don't believe that staying on suboxone for life equates to someone being weak willed, or weak minded. A strong will just isn't always enough to keep a person sober for the rest of their lives.

As for the OTC meds...you're right, we don't NEED them. But I don't see any reason to ignore the benefits you can receive from taking immodium at the peak of WD's. Whatever I find that eases the discomfort for me during that time will be a welcome addition as far as I'm concerned. I'm just not interested in getting extra street cred for doing it without them.

You are obviously a very strong person, and I'm happy to have you and your experience added to our forum. I'm sure it feels like you just fought a war and came out the victor. It is important for those who are on the verge of jumping to see these success stories and know that they can do it too. Congratulations on your 40 something days off bupe!

Q

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:48 am 
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Hi LLF,

Sharing your success story with us is a good thing! (Way to go!)

Implying that people who still take sub are weak-minded is condescending. It seems like you're trying to encourage people, but you're doing that by putting other people down.

All the latest scientific evidence reveals that addiction changes the brain in ways that take away our ability to stop drug seeking with "strong will" alone. Your experience of getting off sub is just that, your experience. And to be honest, with only 44 days off sub, you still have a long way to go. I'm glad you're feeling good about your detox, but statistics dictate that you will most likely relapse again, or at least slip up. The people who are on sub recognize that they are fighting a deadly condition. I'm sure that most of us could detox off bupe. As tough as detoxing is, however, it's far tougher to maintain your recovery months and years later.

I'm rooting for you to beat the odds and never use drugs again! Please just remember that everyone is on a different journey in recovery. Feel free to encourage others who are tapering or detoxing. Just try to stay away from labeling other people and folks here will feel much more receptive about things you have to say. :)

Amy

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:52 pm 
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Hi LLF, amazing jump story, congrats!

Two things; first, a minor warning that I hope won't be relevant to you: I experienced withdrawal symptom 'boomerangs' every several weeks after my jump, nothing major, but these made me realize that my detox from Subs was going to be a long haul. I'm coming up on 8 months, and I'm still getting sneezes and some RLS, and some other minor symptoms from time to time.

I know one of the other people that jumped at the same time as me was getting the same kind of blowback.

Secondly, I'm not sure whether will-power means much at the end of the day, when it comes to a jump, at least not for addicts like me (several years of heroin/cocaine addiction followed by Methadone/Subs). As an active addict, I was completely unable to stop -- will power simply didn't work for me, no matter how bad things got (i.e. I lost everything, and almost died).

My recovery program tells me that it is a 'power greater than myself' which has taken away my obsession (i.e. cravings) to use cocaine and opiates, and I believe this. Without this power, I never would have been able to make my jump from Subs. My only part in things was to acknowledge this 'power,' and start learning how to trust it. The promise of my recovery program is that if I continue to acknowledge and trust this power, it will continue to keep the obsession away. I'm not a humble person by nature, but I have no problem being humble about recovery.

Good luck with your taper.

-- ji

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 7:09 pm 
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Its just my opinion addicts are always searching for an easy way out. I just think people go backwards when they resort to loperamide etc. to ease withdraws. You cant always take something when things get tough, sometimes you just gotta suck it up. Pretty sure that temptation to take something to "make it easier" in whatever circumstance is what lead us all here anyways. I dont care if all hell breaks loose on me tomorrow, or 10 months from now, I will get through it. But on a positive note I felt great again today, Day 45.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 9:00 pm 
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And I just happen to think that the badge of honor should go to the person who lives to a ripe old age despite having a deadly addiction, not the person who had the toughest experience with addiction. It's absolutely ridiculous that fellow addicts would judge each other's recovery, but obviously it happens.

I can't imagine that two cancer survivors would be comparing notes on how hard they had it, in order to declare a winner. I know that addiction and cancer are not perfect comparisons, but isn't the object of all of us to survive??? Who cares if one addict survives by taking suboxone and the other survives by tapping into their higher power, etc.?? Like it's a contest.

Maybe, instead, we could work together to fight the stigma of addiction in the general public and especially in our legal system. It has been known for a long time and has now been proven scientifically that addiction is not a moral failing, but a disorder of brain processes. Our individual and collective guilt has, perhaps, prevented addicts from joining with scientific experts to advocate for ourselves and each other. Instead we waste time caring about whether or not addict A is really "clean and sober" compared to addict B. What does that get us? Can't we stop the petty labeling when it's our very lives that are at stake?

One last note, LLF. I'm sorry that I'm pouring this all out on you. :) You're definitely entitled to your own opinion and we always support any person who is trying to detox from sub. I would pay special attention to johnny though. He has been where you are now and his experience is well-respected here. I'm sorry if my pent up frustration offends or bothers you. I hope you stick around to share your continued experiences with us.

Amy

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2015 12:20 am 
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I am happy for anyone who is living their life without the help of suboxone..... absolutely. Amy & Q are absolutely right and I agree 150%. My biggest problem is addicts telling other addicts that their way of recovery is better. We should all be on the same team and encourage each other because the rest of the world sure isn't gonna understand. Honestly I feel clean and no matter what anyone says to me will not change my mind. Whatever way works for me is what I will do but that doesn't mean that my way is the only right way to do it. I will always try to help the addict that still suffers, with no judgements. If will power had anything at all to do with recovery, half of us wouldn't have ever been on this journey. I deal with so much judgement & criticism in my area over suboxone and I am extremely sensitive to this subject.

I will be one of the first ppl to always give encouragement and respect to anyone who is free from everything and living their life 100% substance free. I think that is amazing. But...it doesn't make u stronger or have more will power.

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