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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:17 am 
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OH....thank you so very much! I am so grateful for everyone's response.
I wish I could figure out how to reply to each person however I'm not very good with the computer. This is a very nice place, full of wonderful caring people.

I have always taken care of everything for my family, this time I fear I will fail.

Thank you!


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:05 am 
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Dee - You could never fail when you're trying so hard. It's the other people that could fail you, they're the problem. But at a certain point you have to let go and know that you've done everything you can possibly do. You're here looking for answers and still supporting your family at the same time. I really wish you could win the lottery or maybe a vacation of some kind because you deserve it. You hang in there and we'll be here for you.

I tend to be up late at night because I have chronic insomnia. If you ever log onto the site and see that I'm also online, feel free to send me a private message if you need some support. I'm happy to offer it because people have helped me. All you have to do is click on the little button under my message that says "PM". That will take you to another page where you can type a private message that only I will see.

You can do that to any member here who has allowed that option on their forum account. I'll send you a quick one so you can see how it works. I have to remember that the screen may look different to me because I use a computer when I'm on the forum and I know some people, maybe even you might use your cell phone. I hope you have a good day today.

- OM

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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:46 am 
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Thank you so very much. You have been so helpful. It helps to know that there are people out there that truly care.

The odd thing about this war on drugs is that they have been failing for a very long time, Nixon era?

Now the war is on pain patients. I only know of my husbands situation first hand but am reading a lot when I google "pain patients cut off"
Absolute horror stories of people just getting cut off for no reason or a ridiculous reason.
The people have been in pain management for years, don't go to a pill mill.

The doctors must know of the suffering they are causing.
I'm sure that the govt knows, there are numerous petitions.

The problem for pain patients is they are too sick and weak to march on Washington.

Again, you have brightened my day quite a bit, bless you!


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:48 pm 
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Methadone beats subs for pain. What about extended release fentanyl patch? Can he be dependent or will he end up addicted


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:58 pm 
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Adrenalinejunkie89 wrote:
Methadone beats subs for pain. What about extended release fentanyl patch? Can he be dependent or will he end up addicted


Well, it does and it doesn't. The dosage of any full agonist at the mu receptor like methadone will have to increase because your body becomes tolerant to the medication and you need more of it. Buprenorphine, on the other hand, has a ceiling limit on its effects in the body. It is a safer medication than methadone because, once again, buprenorphine has a more limited effect on the CNS.

But you're right, I think, that methadone may be more of a pain relief than buprenorphine. There are just pros and cons to both.

Amy

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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:20 am 
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Thank you for responding.
My husband is trying to reduce methadone as fast as he can.
He was told that suboxone would work for his pain however we are worried.
His knees are giving out on him. He would not survive surgery for his problems.
Thanks again
D


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 2:37 pm 
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I feel so bad for your husband Dee. And you as well. I can tell your used to taking care of everything and this is kinda out of your hands. I don't have a whole lot to add as far as advice but I will add that I was on pain pills for 26 years. I had a terrible car accident and broke both hips, legs and feet multiple times. I went to my orthopedic Dr for years to get pain medicine but eventually the Dr had me go to a pain clinic. Anyway to make a long story short, the Dr was writing out excessive amounts of meds to some who really didn't need that much and got closed down. I got so sick and heard about a Suboxone clinic that a lot of the patients from the old Dr. office was going to. It was a Suboxone clinic but I didn't care as long as I wouldn't be sick any more. I had never even thought about coming off pills or getting on Suboxone. I had a huge amount of pain though. Well needless to say, after getting on the Suboxone I have been doing well. I have built the muscles up in my legs and all I ever have to take is Motrin or something over the counter. Now I definitely was an addict but I'm telling you this to say that your husband may get more pain relief from Suboxone than he thinks. I'm pretty active and do a lot of walking outside now with my dogs everyday that it doesn't rain. But I'm pleased and pleasantly surprised with the amount of pain relief and energy that I get from Suboxone. I sure hope if your hubby gets on Suboxone, that he feels just as pleased. He is probably going to be sick when coming off the Methadone, but once the Suboxone is in his system, I think he will feel great after a couple of week. I say give it a try. Have a good day. Your forum friend, Angie


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:35 am 
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Thank you Angie. I really appreciate you sharing. I have always taken care of us, not sure I can do much about this.
I've even thought about finding a doctor who specializes in the induction with suboxone to make sure they know what they are doing.

I just woke up and saw you message, thank you for sharing.You reaching out, along with everyone else is really helping me. I have been feeling very alone.
D


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 28, 2017 10:29 am 
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Hope things start looking up. Keep us updated. Best!


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:13 am 
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I will thanks again! I have not been online. I had a fall.


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 6:37 pm 
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How are you doing Dee? You said you had a fall and now we're concerned.

This subject of your husband is tough one. It is one of my main worries because as we age the body gets more susceptible to injury and pain. For me, I cannot say for sure how much it helps with pain. Meaning, I've been on it so long that it may indeed be masking some pain I'm unaware of. The only way to find out would be to stop the Suboxone for a few months and see how I feel physically. IMO, I'm in good shape and have no pain related injuries but I still worry about knee's or a hip going eventually.

Let us know how you and your husband are doing.

rule

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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 31, 2017 2:14 am 
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Like Rule said, tell us what is going on!! You fell? What happened?

Amy

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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 12:55 pm 
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You don’t have to look much beyond the front page of your local paper to see why pain managment doctors are lowering their opioid doses, especially methadone. Methadone represents only 2 percent of all opiate painkillers prescribed in the U.S. but it is involved in one out of every three accidental overdose deaths according to the CDC.

Suboxone is effective for pain and is much safer that methadone. However, the transition to Suboxone is usually difficult because metadone accumulates in the body and stays so long that precipitated withdrawal is very common. Usually, the methadone should be tapered to 30 or 40 mg per day and then a minimum of 3 days off before starting suboxone at very low doses.


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 11:42 am 
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That's exactly the advice we always give here, statcoder.

Welcome to the forum!

Amy

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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 05, 2017 8:48 pm 
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Thank you for your replies.

I have done nothing for a month but try to find help for my husband. I have met so many nice people. I have googled "Pain patients being cut off" There are many people out there on much larger doses than my husband who have just been cut off. They are confused, don't know what they did wrong. They say like my husband, I have failed back surgeries, I can't manage without pain medication. No one is listening. It has become a witch hunt. There are counterfeit drugs out there that look like percocettes or vicodin that are really fentanyl. Heroin mixed with carfentanyl (elephant tranquilizer) from China that will kill. One man told me they are putting fentanyl and carfentanyl in pot.

People are dying, I wonder the point of dealers selling drugs that will kill their customers. I can only think of rehab or subutex, suboxone. I wish I knew more.

Thank you all again. Dee


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:00 am 
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I want to make sure that everyone on here who has replied knows how much your words mean to me. That fact that I am a stranger and you replied says a lot about who you all are. I am overwhelmed. I don't know how to reply to each individual or I would.

I appreciate being asked how I am, I am good. Thank God the fall just slowed me down for a week, lol That will teach me to run.

I am pretty much resigned to the fact that he will have to do what the doctor says. I am afraid for him going into withdrawal. I have been though that once with him when his first pain doctor died and there was no one to help for 2 weeks.

I have been trying to remember exactly how long my husband has been on methadone. I think close to 11 or 12 years.

Well I mainly wanted to thank you again. I am praying this doctor knows what he is doing.


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:06 am 
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I'm wondering if anyone knows of a good Subutex/Suboxone doctor in the Virginia Washington DC area. I think my husband needs a good doctor who can help him wean down from the Methadone and place him on Subutex or Suboxone

I thought I read that going from Methadone to Subs the Subutex would be the best, is that right?
Thank you, sorry for all the messages. Just nervous I guess


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 10:26 am 
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Hey Dee!

In order to switch from methadone to buprenorphine, it's usually recommended that the person taper their methadone dose to around 30mg. Most ppl stop after that for a few days before their bupe induction.. usually around 4 days. It's not always an easy transition. Some experience precipitated withdrawal for just a bit while buprenorphine is taking over the receptors. So methadone to buprenorphine can be a bit complicated but if done right it can be manageable. I am definitely not experienced in that transition but there's lot's of threads on the forum here, hopefully u can read up on them.

I hope everything goes smooth Dee!!

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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 12:32 pm 
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The California Health Care Foundation has a good lecture for clinicians about using buprenorphine for pain. There is also a detailed PDF that describes a bridge technique that can be used to transition patients from full-agonist long-acting opioids like methadone to buprenorphine using the buprenorphine patch. It’s not a technique that very many physicians know about but they explain it very well. The PDF is legitimate and concise enough that many docs would be willing to read it and give it a try, especially, if they watch the lecture.

Dr. Howard Kornfeld is a national leader in this area and is who Prince’s people turned to when they tried to get him into treatment for his chronic pain and opioid problem.

http://www.chcf.org/events/2016/webinar ... renorphine


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 Post subject: Re: Suboxone for pain?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2017 8:29 am 
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Thank you so much for the responses. I will go to the link.

Despite the fact that my husband was being managed for pain, husband now realizes that with the current climate being like it is he will have to transfer to Suboxone. I mean that is what the govt wants. This has been in the works since about 2005. Andrew Kolodny head of PROP is in charge, despite not being a pain management specialist.

He was the head of Phoenix House, became a lobbyist. It first affected primary care, then pain patients. I just read about the first cancer patient, I have seen, who is being refused pain management.

I have done nothing but search for help/information.

Again, thank you all so much!


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