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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2015 10:06 pm 
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Thanks Amy. Last night was nothing but a pain in he @$$. Daughter with fever, wife still sick as s dog. One crazy night. I had zero energy or mood all day.
Did a day skip of adderall yesterday and decided to take one today (5mg) and really regretted it. I felt soooo soooo horrible afterward. I realized that taking even tiny dose of adderall makes me crave other things. Now it's official: adderall is what caused relapses In the summer. I was hoping to drop my Suboxone dose to 2.00 mg today but couldn't. I really couldn't. Not ready yet. I guess I'll stick to the plan. Will only drop when completely done with adderall for 3-4 days. Plus, I'm going through some rough moments with family being sick, work crappp... Smh. Tomorrow is another day of skipping adderal and day after. Will take 5mg on Sat and I'm done! Sun will drop to 2mg sub. I hope.
Be well everyone (if you're reading this) :)


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2015 4:21 am 
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Glad to see your still posting. I hope your family get better soon. Its hard in early recovery when you have stressful surroundings. Im on day 56 of sub and that whole time I have had many stressors.
Keep up with the sub. I reckon you should just stay in 2.5 for while if you cab access them. It is absolute bullshit what the doctors are like in your area and in America itself.

Have a good day and stay strong :)


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2015 2:53 pm 
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Thank you Mel :)
I have more then enough Suboxone now. Thank God. Even if I'll stay on each dose for over a week and reduce by Roughly 25% or even less, I'll still have more then enough. No adderall today. Just took 1mg at around 8:45am and will take addt 1.00-1.50 in an hour or two.
Feeling strong. Feeling good.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2015 4:33 pm 
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MarceloG wrote:
Thank you Mel :)
I have more then enough Suboxone now. Thank God. Even if I'll stay on each dose for over a week and reduce by Roughly 25% or even less, I'll still have more then enough. No adderall today. Just took 1mg at around 8:45am and will take addt 1.00-1.50 in an hour or two.
Feeling strong. Feeling good.


You're doing a great job, Marcelo! I'm glad that you're able to continue your taper. Good show for stopping the adderall completely! That's one part of the puzzle!

Amy

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:54 pm 
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Thank you my friend. Thank you all for your support and guidance. I don't know why but I'm sooo constipated on this sub. As u know, I've never taken such high doses for such long period of time, plus adderall was sorta helping in that space as s stimulant. I have way too much sub built up in my system I think. I'll try to skip adderal tomorrow again and then dose again on Sat. Some websites recommend to stay on a current dose of Addie for min of 7-14 days! That's crazy and absurd. Maybe that pertains to "heavier" or "longer time" users. I don't know. I really wanted to take 0.50mg with my 1.00 pm dose but gases and bloating in my stomach kind of stopped me. Plus, I couldn't take it before 8 anyway and I heard taking Suboxone too late isn't good?
Point is---I took 2mg of sub today. Nothing else. I took some laxative my wife was prescribed when she gave birth. Hope that helps.
Tak to u guys tomorrow. Good night :)


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 7:00 am 
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keep up the good work man.
Im actually happier with my constipation. When on illegal opiates, it was really BAD. Now on 24mg sub I don't need laxatives at all. I was using them daily but none now.
I have also read sub can make you sweat a lot more than usual. Same thing. I used to sweat quite a bit, especially in social situations but now on sub I don't at all really.

We all react differently to suboxone and other drugs, I find it fascinating.

Be kind to yourself!!


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 06, 2015 7:25 am 
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Oh hands down. When I was on heavier doses of oxy (120mg a day) in the beg of the year i couldn't go to bathroom for days but all the pain and discomfort was numbed by pain pills and i didn't even notice it sometimes lol.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 07, 2015 12:53 am 
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That's it. She found out. My wife found out everything. Stupid, stupid, stupid me. Tears are running down my masculine face. Today was one of the roughest days of my life. I screwed up by leaving my compartment where I keep my cut up suboxones in individual contaniner. She found out. I haven't felt more shamed and anxious for a very very long time. I hate myself. I think I would rather her finding out that I'm using drugs than this. That way I could've said smth else. Seeing weird orange strips that look like LSD was like thunder and hail in the middle of a nice sunny day. I know she'll sleep on it and will understand. I hope so at least. I'm such a screw up.
But I'm sort of happy it happened


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 3:58 am 
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WOW, so when she found out, what did you tell her?
Please don't hate urself and think your a screw-up. Surely she would prefer legal than illegal. Did you cover by saying your getting it through a doc? I know lying is not advised but it would certainly make her feel more accepting?
I understand the relief side your feeling. You now don't have to sneak around, hiding the wrappers etc.
If or when my partner finds out, I will be in trouble for lying or not being open. Then the whole "what else aren't you telling me" conversation will start up in my situation. BUT.......they are our partners and only want the best for us.
Now she knows, you have broadened your support network and that can only be good, right?

Let us know how its going and don't forget, your doing so well and this is just a bump in the road of recovery. That bump may just be what you needed as now you have accountability to her which I think is helpful.
Good luck


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 2:25 pm 
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I think it's a good thing that she found out, remember secrets keep us sick. Ur spouse is an important support source for u, recovering in secret and sneaking around was bound to end in disaster. Give her time to process and be completely honest with her about everything. Educate her on suboxone so she doesn't consider it another drug ur abusing. If she loves you, and I'm sure she does, she'll want to see u trying. Getting sub from a legitimate doctor would be much better for you and look much better from her standpoint also though. In the end, her finding out is a good thing imo. Now u just gotta show her ur making progress, trust will return when she sees that ur really trying. Good luck!!

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 5:50 pm 
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Hi guys. Thank you for your posts.
I did end up going to a clinic and joined the program. Dr heard my story and I've explained that I do have experience with subs and feel totally perfect on 2mg now. He gave me 6 8mg films and said if I'll attend meetings (which may not be easy with my work schedule and because it's far from my house), but he said I may not need that much given my history and tolerance. My life changed dramatically during last 2 days. I went from keeping it to myself to having my loving wife and a professional Dr on my side helping me. Sure, my trust has gone down the drain. Wife doesn't trust me at all now. But I'll gain that trust back. I won't use my electronic cigarette anymore. It really bothered her. Big time.
She read about Suboxone and doesn't understand why I am using it if I wasn't using heroin and stuff. She doesn't really understand. She never will. I don't know. I'll go with the flow. I've started having best days in my life while on sub. Now I'm miserable.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 6:06 pm 
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I don't understand Marcelo? Why are you miserable? Because you have to rebuild the trust? She is there, she did not walk away! You have the opportunity to rebuild, you are getting the suboxone legally, going to meetings! The way I see it, the only way to go is up from here. You are in a very good place right now! I wish you continued success! I believe you said that you were done with adderall? And, you are on 2mgs of suboxone with a taper plan? And, enough suboxone that you can go slow and really work at your taper plan? All sounds good to me!


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 11:33 pm 
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I know ... And you are right. I feel miserable because every step I make needs to be justified. I'm surprised she took it like a smart mature women, at the end of the day.
It's just -- if she would've found just pills (even perks or oxys) I would've found smth to say (my friends, it's Tylenol, blah blah).. Orange weird looking cut up pieces of smth she thought was LSD (LMAOOOO :)) gor her really mad and worried. She was all shaking. My daughter saw it all thank God she doesn't really understand much yet. 5mg of amphet I still take every other day or so. With them, it even slower taper is required I heard. I'll be done with it by next week.

Thank u again my friends :) I feel so welcomed and warm on this forum. God bless you all ;)


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 10:29 am 
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Good morning SF family ! I just wanted to update you guys on my progress. So far, I am on the 3 being at 1.75mg. Unfortunately, I have to taper quicker than planned due to the promise I've made to my wife.
To be honest with you, first day was very good but yesterday was getting rough towards the end of the day. So, I had a little work out finally and believe it or not, it helped me immensely. I know exercise does wonders and I did not work out for a long time so it definitely benefited me in a big way. I'm not going to follow the standard so called " Roberts taper" plan where it's advised to drop every 4 days. I'll stay longer on each dose. When I'll get to 0.25mg or 0.50mg I'll stay there longer before jumping completely. I know many of you will be sick of me with my method, and I know why.
I know I may have Rough days but I won't give up. At this point chances of relapse are slim to none because now my wife is here to support me and to guide me as well as a doctor obviously ..


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 11, 2015 11:00 pm 
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"At this point chances of relapse are slim to none because now my wife is here to support me and to guide me as well as a doctor obviously."

Wow, Marcel, just that statement tells me your chance of relapse is pretty great. Anyone who thinks relapse after going through what you have is low, just doesn't get it. If recovery really was that easy and the chance of relapse was slim to none, we would not gave millions of active addicts. The fact that you are changing plans like others change their socks also raises concerns. Speeding up the plan or schedule because a spouse wants you too is yet another.

Marcel, this is serious stuff. It takes a lot of time and effort to control this disease. If only getting off the drugs (detox) were the end point. It is not. It's in many ways the starting point. Many, many people think that once they kick the drug and get through the withdrawal they are home free. Most go on to relapse. Many of those who relapse do it within days to weeks. It's part of why the relapse rates are so huge

I strongly encourage you to get into a recovery group. There is so much for you to learn about this disease. People relapse every single day in the world. I dont want you to be one of them, but if you don't alter course it's nearly inevitable. No, I don't know you personally, but many others have said and done the same.

Hopefully others will be along to chime in as well. We are not sick of hearing from you. All we want to do is help you stay alive.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:23 am 
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Well written Donh!

I agree whole heartedly with what you wrote. It was only 2 months go that I thought I would be on sub for a month and problem solved. I now know that is very untrue. My doc, this forum and NA have all taught me about how long it takes for your mind, brain, lifestyle etc, to be safe for tapering the way you want to. Its hard work and will take a long time but you have the rest of your life, so please don't hurry.
Us addicts cannot continue to be pharmacists and doctors Marcelo, and pick and choose when, what and how long. The statistics are not false. This fast taper is highly likely to end in disaster (as many people have already told you) and a relapse could even end your relationship. Your already being watched like a hawk by your wife, I imagine, and she would lose even more trust and faith in you.
Its great she knows about your situation but if she wants you off it ASAP, that's really bad.
It would be so beneficial if she were to be fully informed and educated about suboxone and addiction as a disease. Then she would be a great support and understand how important it is for you to stay on suboxone for a long period of time.
Maybe she could go with you to your next doc appointment and get the information required to help you stay on it and avoid relapse.
I know im a hypocrite as my partner doesn't know im on suboxone but Im not in any rush to get off the medication that is saving my life and when she finds out, I will be educating her with my doctors help so my recovery is not put into jeopardy.
Another thing I want to share is that I have heard many people say and I myself have experienced it, is that relapses can often make you go harder than ever on your DOC and risk losing your life. I don't know why we do this but its known to happen.
My sister was in recovery on sub for 1 month and decided she was cured. She relapsed days later, went crazy for a week on her doc and ended up dying from OD.

I really care, even though I don't know you, so please take members advice.
Best of luck x


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:18 pm 
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I hear ya guys and agree with you. I'm feeling stable on my current dose. Suboxone makes me feel good. Normal. Nothing superman-like good. Not high. I just feel like I am in control of my life. I know some Suboxone haters will think that "in not clean on Suboxone" but I am. Some meetings don't even let u attend when they find out you're taking sub. Stupid. I don't plan on dropping a dose until I'm completely stable. Trust me, if it was my choice I'd do it nice and slow. I'll be dieing from cravings and my mind can give me million reasons to use but I won't. I just can't. Thank u again for your support and guidance guys. U have no idea how much it means to me. :(

One other option would be -- using PROPER, SLOWER taper and hide it from my wife. Lying again..? I'm so tired.

It's been 19 days since last pain pill. Does that 21 day of habit building work? For me it did in the past

And again, I do understand everyone's opinion about long term use of Suboxone but just to reiterate: I haven't used large amounts of pills last 2 months. Majority of last 3 years of my life I was GOOD! 2014 was bad. First 3 months of 2015 were good. I don't need to be constantly reminded of "RELAPSE, RELAPSE, RELAPSE!" Lol. Do more, more , more sub. I have a long way ahead of my. I've made many mistakes in the past. Learned the hard way. Won't let it happen again. After all, if I have to suffer for a few days, or weeks after jumping sub and having PAWS---I deserve it for all the harm I've caused to my family.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:26 pm 
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Hi Marcelo, I too agree with Donh! You have to own your own recovery! It can not be for any other reason than it is what you want for yourself! And as Mel mentioned about her sister, I can not tell how many I have known who thought, well I have blank amount of clean time under my belt so let me just do this tonight and it lead to being right back into it or worse! I have also seen tragic situations where the person is headed to rehab and decides to have a last horah and ends up in the er or worse! Please, know that we all day this out of concern for you! I hope you understand what the concerns are and give them some thought! Of course, we will continue to be here for you!


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 7:53 pm 
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Hey Marcelo,

I hope u understand that nobody here is trying to make u do anything, these are all just suggestions from ppl who have been where ur at right now and don't want to see anything bad happen to ya. In the end ur going to do ur recovery ur own way, I get it. There's all different types of addicts out there but notice that we all have the same things happen to us. Saying that if u get paws you'll deserve the suffering because of the damage you've done to ur family, that guilt won't stop u from relapsing. Some of us lost actual custody of our children in active addiction and felt guilt like no other, but it was not enough to keep us from relapse. It's a disease that doesn't give a crap about guilt or willpower. Like everyone else has said, recovery has got to be selfish and done for u or it just won't stick.

I have zero judgment with u, I respect u just like everyone else does, we just wanna help ya, not make ya upset or anything like that. I absolutely want u to succeed for ur family. I do think that once u stop the suboxone, u will have a difficult time, I know I will too probably. We just want u to be aware of difficult times that will come. Like Michelle said, we'll be here for ya regardless of what happens :)

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 10:40 pm 
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I do understand. But "how long" is actually long enough for someone with less than 3 yrs of active addiction, with breaks in between, to stay on Suboxone u think?
For example, I'm stable on 1.75mg now, but I don't think I'm ready to drop yet. I mean, I don't want to stay on Suboxone forever. Plus, I know "one is too many and 1,000,000 is not enough"... I have relapsed before and I already told u why (improper induction, too much dropping too soon etc).. At the end of the day-- it all comes down to willpower and being strong. One has to have control of his/her mind and not let negative, disruptive thoughts take control of ones life. I'm very far from an end but I do want to continue to taper. Slowly. Staying on each dose for 7 days or longer.


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