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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:16 am 
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RsjxRsj.....aka, the Clonidine man, Mr. Clonidine, the clonidineator, the......you get the picture!! LOL!!!

Isn't it absolutely cuckoo how a blood pressure med (and some Xanax) can make such a huge difference??

You're a warrior man, you're kicking ass and taking names and I'm so glad to hear that you got some sleep. It's kinda funny how you mentioned hallucinating during infomercials, I had one of those moments around the two week mark....I thought I was breaking with reality and it scared the tar out of me. Your acute wd is one of the few who's line up very closely with my experience. During the first week of acute wd, when you would close your eyes to try to sleep, would you get the brain zaps?? It's like lightning would flash from left to right across my mind's eye and it would literally shock my mind and body.....very disturbing!!

Hey, you know to be careful with the Xanax, right. It's addictive stuff too. I would hate to see you get hooked on it, they say it's harded to quit than opiates. I'm sure a week to 10 days of use will be fine, just wanna make sure you're careful with it.

BTW, we love you too Bud.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:44 am 
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Gooood Morning guys,
It is 1:00am and I am up and wide awake, I'm not so pissed off about it this time because I slept during the day and also just slept from 7:00pm until just now, so what's that about 10 hours in all in one day!? AND my mind and body feel GREAT! I feel like I could start a project or something, might go walking, dunno :-)

NOW, I've got to get my days & nights put back together and get my sleep pattern back. I realize I'm going to start having to stay up later now and probably be getting up earlier. My sleep routine for the past years has been go to bed at 10pm, up at 5am.

I am just screamin' happy the waves are gone, I don't feel my bones anymore, I can't feel each and every internal organ and my skin isn't trying to rearrange itself!

As for the Xanax, oh yeah, I have fought THAT battle more than once as well. When I said small scripts, I mean like 4 each. The regular for any daytime anxiety/panic and 4 of the XR for any really hard times sleeping cuz they last so long. Just enough to get me to the 9th when I see my doc. Remember in an earlier post I talked about being strictly a "mail order" addict? Well, many times. Xanax would be included along with Pods and other things, and I have gone through HORRIBLE benzo detox in the past as well. My partner and I would order like 500 1mg at a time (years ago) and of course we'd eat em up just as fast as we could then run out. Only took ONE time to learn that lesson. I have NO desire to play with that again. I don't like them that much as it is. Recreation-ally anyway.

OMG yes, Romeo, the brain zaps. Most definitely! Right along with the body jerks, some of them so violent I'd almost fall off the couch! THAT would also happen during Xanax WD in the olden days too, just awful.

You know what else is strange but great? Cigarette smoking. I'm not liking them much lately. 1 pack in 3 days, unheard of for me... gonna try and quit that next I think.
Well guys, I'm gonna jump off here, just noticed my alcoholic neighbor's lights are on, gonna walk down the road and go see how messed up she is LOL.

Night!
-RSJ


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 8:53 am 
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Good Morning once again guys- Happy Memorial Day and DAY 16!

It's 7:00am and I just got up from sleeping another 4.5 hours. My drunk neighbor and I talked a while, she's actually one of only 3 people in the world who even knew I had a problem, she passed out on me around 2am, I walked back home, got in bed and fell asleep!

Right NOW, I feel GREAT! I can definitely say I think I am out of the "darkness". What an unbelievable and scary ride THAT was. (Thank you Jesus for letting me say that in past tense.) I just can't decide what to go do now! I had told all my friends I was down for the count this entire weekend due to a baaaad case of the flu, so don't count on me for anything. Don't wanna show up suddenly well & chipper after such a horrible illness... Or doooo I? ;-)

Oh hey, do any of you guys wear contact lenses? I just realized my lenses have been in for over 24 hours now, I've slept in them and it JUST hit me I could see and my eyes are crystal clear! Normally I could NEVER go to sleep in them or wear them any longer than 12 hours without being all dry & crusty eye'd. Strange.

I'm still gonna stick around and check in here and there, might not be as often anymore cuz I'm gonna dust off my wings and try flyin! I want anyone going through this high jump thing (or low jump or no jump) to feel free to PM me. Email me. Whichever, because Moto, Romeo, Miss LadderTipper, Brian, You guys had a profound effect on my attitude and overall hope through that really dark part, and if I can do the same for someone else it'll make that ride even more worth it!
-RSJ


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 9:18 am 
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Romeo is right. You are a warrior. What a relief it is to hear that someone is getting to the other side. I just read what you wrote to my husband to show him how insane this really can be. You hung in there, though, and you did not give up, and if you can do that, well, think of all the other stuff you can do!!!

It should only keep getting better from here on out, especially now that you are getting some sleep. You may have bad days, but then you'll start have more and more very good days in a row.

The thing about the contacts really surprised me, because I do wear contacts and have had somewhat the same experience. On a decently high dose of Sub, if I fell asleep in my contacts, I'd wake up with them plastered to my eyeballs. And my eyes always seemed to get so damn red too, which pissed me off. This is absolutely getting better. In fact, I slept in the suckers last night and they are not all dry and nasty! Amazing! I can only hope it gets better from here on out and my eyes will be just blue and white again and not blue n' white n' red, lol.

You're an inspiration. Keep posting!

laddertipper

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:02 pm 
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Motomonkey? Are you still out there? Are you still tapering? Let us know how you're doing.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 1:53 pm 
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Um, sorry, I wished everyone a happy Memorial day? Jeeeeez... LABOR DAY! Woopsie.

LadderTipper, I have really blue eyes as well, and at work they'd call me "Patriot Eyes" with the red, white & blue.
Maybe that's what I was thinking when I thought it was memorial day. Whatever *takes a bow*

-RSJ


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 7:10 am 
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Good Morning Friends. Day No. 17.
I'm feeling pretty good this morning! I'm still having really messed up sleep of course. Last night I slept from 10pm to 1am and then again just now from 3am to 5am. Even with the Clonidine & 2mg of Xanax. I didn't take anything the entire day yesterday because my theory was to try and wear myself out with hopes of getting a good sleep in. Guess it doesn't work that way. Getting ready to return to work this morning. I'm having anxiety about it because I have very little memory (sleep deprivation) of the last week and a half that I was there and I'm SURE I've got some messes to clean up, phone calls to make and explanations to make UP, but at least I feel up to it today thank GOD.
I also have this giddy feeling inside sorta like I'm a kid getting ready for my first day of a new school year. Got that ball of anxiety in my stomach.

-RSJ


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 9:13 am 
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RSJ--
Hey man. You are doing AWESOME! I remember Day 17. And 18. And...And it gets better. I had the same sleep issues. I was prescribed Traadone and that has helped. But I still get up early. The later I stay up the better--but then I might be foggy from the Tra from taking it too late. BUt all these things will eventually right themselves. My stomach is still messed up. And yeah I have the anxious feelings at times--but remember dude. We screwed our nodies and brains. Now they are fighting to regain controal. So everytime I am anxious, sleepless, or dealing with my stomach--I tell myself that my body and brain are doiing their jobs to get me back to normal.

The worst part for me was the first 12 days. I felt SO horrible. Plus I had a very active 1st grader who wanted daddy to play Star Wars with him all the time. lol I felt so bad for him. But I made it up this weekend. We watched the Star Wars Labor Day Marathon. lol You are doing great man. Keep it up. May the force be with you! Or Immodioum, Clonidine...

brian


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 11:16 am 
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Hell Yeah to the Star Wars marathon, I watched it off and on all weekend too. My daughter loves Darth Vader???

Rsj,

Congratulations on day 17!! Do you remember after one of your intial posts how I said it was like you were telling my story?? Well, you keep doing it. From the lack of sleep all the way to the anxiety about going back to work. That's all normal shit dude. Believe it or not, it gets better. I remember in my early wd reading peoples stories on some other forums and how they kept saying things would get better and I was all like, "BULLSHIT, I'm gonna feel like this the rest of my life and I can't take it anymore.....Gah!!!"

I promise you, it gets better. I know this too, you're doing awesome!!!

Brian__Tx brings up an excellent point, every time you feel shitty, remind yourself that's your body and brain healing itself. They're doing their thing to get you back to where you need to be.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 1:36 pm 
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Since I caved on August 31st after six days this has been my schedule. 4mg on the 31st, 2mg on the 1st, 4 mg on the 2nd, none 0mg on the 3rd, 2mg on the 4th, 2mg on the 5th and today the sixth to start the work week 4 mg. Guys this is the battle of my life. The storys that concern me are the storys about brain chemical levels being permanantely destroyed. Things like Serotonin and such. I have always been a very hyperactive person. The Fatigue this stuff gives me and the depression and all around feelings of being down are tough. I dont want to be stuck like this forever. I will be going to see my doctor this week to let her know whats happening. Im not sure what she can do this is going to be up to me. I just know trying to go cold turkey and run my buisness is going to be a disaster. All input from you guys is very useful and supportive. Thank You, Moto


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 4:38 pm 
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Whew Damn Moto, you ain't kiddin' about the fatigue!... Y'all hear than sound just then...? That was the sound of my ASS draggin'. WOW. But check this out...

I DO NOT know how, But I managed to pull a rabbit outta my ass up here at the office over the last week & and a half, cuz I have a hell of a high stress job & so far, I haven't had anything come back on me or any questions asked. I'm just stunned by that... It's got to be that whole "mind f$%k" thing... Apparently, through the panics, and the tears, and the pain, and the agony, I managed to get done what I needed to get done... while simultaneously, MY MIND was telling me my life was spiraling out of control, I was screwing up my job and every other aspect of my life!... I'll grant you this, I had to dig deep, but for me I think I just proved to myself just how badly I want this. My truck on the other hand... unfortunately that wasn't all in my head :P

I HAVE noticed though, EVERYONE is telling the truth about staying active, DO something... Today, every time (often) I've almost done a face-plant on my keyboard, I've made myself get out of my chair, and go out into the building and climb up and down the 10 flights of stairs, and then I'm good for another 30-45 minutes... I start wilting again, out I go... Rinse, Repeat.

I'm gonna be ok, and so is my job, and so is my truck, and so are my relationships, but most of all so is my LIFE!
(and YOURS)

-RSJ


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 8:07 pm 
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RSJ--
Oh brother. You nailed it dude. Fatigue with a capitol F. It comes and goes for me--and often if my stoimach is actng up that adds to the weakness. Sometimes I feel like I am stepping in quicksand just to walk across the room. 10 flights of steps? You're my new hero. My mind is willing but my flesh is not. I have tried a couple of times to make myself do something really strenuous--but somehow I fall short. I guess this is where we separate the men from the boys lol But your post hass inspired me to kick my fatigue in the ass and give it hell. And I plan to...tomorrow. lol You rock man and you really doi inspire me. Thanks bro.

brian'

PS--Romeo--what did you do in this regard? Exercise? Walks?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 3:12 am 
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Brian, I wish I had an answer for ya on the fatigue thing.....I let it kick my ass for an eternity. I actually got to the point where I just figured I was a lazy SOB and kinda left it at that. Eventually, the fatigue kind of dwindled away on its own, it's not completely gone, but it's a whole heck of a lot better than it was.

I believe, for myself, I learned how to be a complete lazy ass during my addiction. Whenever I had drugs, which was ALL the time, I was basically glued to the couch. I went to work everyday and all that happy crap, but if I wasn't working, I was high as Jackson Browne, at the house with my butt glued to the couch. I became a master at isolation and a professional lazy butt. To me, the fatigue is part of unlearning all those isolationist behaviors, learning how to function within society.....be a part of society. You see, just because I'm not doing drugs anymore doesn't mean I've dropped all those crappy behaviors that I picked up during addiction, not by a long shot. I guess that's a part of my recovery that's taking its sweet time to resolve itself.

Honest to goodness, I suck at the whole social thing, it intimidates me.....I've just recently been made aware of how important the whole social scene is to my recovery and now that I'm practicing being more social, the fatigue and always wanting to be a lazy ass has gotten a lot better.

As you can see, I still struggle with the whole fatigue/lazy thing, but I know this much, I ain't givin' up on it!!!

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 4:29 am 
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Good Early Morning Guys. DAY 18!

It's 3:00am and I am up and wide awake! It's alright though, I crashed out WAY early last night, like sometime between 7 and 7:30, I was SOOOooooo tired by the end of the work day. Just mentally and physically drained. Plus I finally accepted an offer to hit a happy hour with some coworkers and I was really surprised at what a good time I had! I'm not a drinker and had 3 margaritas and it completely knocked me on my ass.

Gosh Brian, I wish I had an answer for the fatigue thing too. I wonder how they treat people with "chronic fatigue" Anyway.
But the stair thing, It's a struggle, getting to the top is a long slow process, then coming down isn't so bad. But god, the effort it takes. I like Romeo's words "Pushing Molasses uphill in the sand" cuz it's so true.

Oh Romeo, now you're making me laugh. My couch, anyone that comes over, or trys to sit on it, immediately notices my ass dent and body contour on it. I've been clued to that sofa for YEARS. And yeah, I too isolated myself, became completely anti-social, it's so bad that my phone only rings about once a month and it's my mother checking to see if I still live here LOL. I plan on fixing all that too and getting out more once my energy allows me too. Last night at happy hour was a good time and it made me miss my friends. I've been pondering the idea of telling some select good friends about what I've been going through the last few years and especially the last 10 months. I just dunno though.

I'll check back in later when I get to work, it's still too early to come to a complete conclusion about hoe I feel today.
-RSJ


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 8:25 am 
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3am? sounds familiar. I am finally at a point where i sleep until 6:30--my get up time--as long as i dont go to bed before 11-12 and i am still taking trazadone. i am tempted to try without the meds and see if i can sleep--but i hate the thought of laying in bed all night counting the minutes. my job forces me to be very social--so i have had to push that button from Day One--and even throughout the whole addictive phase.

One wierd thing that I noticed. For some reason my ankles seemed fatter to me while i was on Subs. about two weeks after i got off i was back to my skinny ankles lol weird huh? I just wonder what else thos crap does to people that we dont know about. Anyway RS--hope you have an amazing and productive day. Bravo on going out with friends. Thats a big step I think. Just continue to reel it in slowly. Whats cool about these boards is they are an outlet as well to be social in small ways. Stay cool and pure. Take care dude.

Romeo--For me the fatigue is fading pretty well. Im at about 80% I think. And I think I turned a corner with my stomach issues last night. Maybe Im dreaming--we'll see. Have a great day man1

brian


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:36 am 
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Rsj,

Congratulations on hitting the club last night!! Wow, 3 Margarita's and they knocked you on your ass, you must be a cheap date!! LOL!!! I have no room to talk, I'm not a drinker either. I have trouble finishing an entire beer, heaven forbid I have 2 beers.....I'd be up on the tables, dancing like a fool!!

Just recently, I started going out to eat with a couple of people after the NA meetings that I still attend. Like you, I surprise myself at how good of a time I have. I've managed to make friends with a couple of pretty cool and pretty funny people. That alone has helped me tremendously. If I keep this up, I may learn how to be social one day, imagine that!!!

The few close friends I have know about my addiction and they know about my wd too. They were very understanding and actually eager to help me stay clean. But, you know your friends a lot better than I do, you do what you think is right.

Brian, glad to hear you're coming along so nicely......you lucky bastard!!! LOL!!!

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 12:39 am 
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Hey guys! Still pluggin' along on day 18, heading into day 19.

Today was a really interesting day. Right after that post I made around 2:30-3:00 this morning I fell asleep again and was SO pissed to hear my alarm go off! But then it hit me, woah, I slept some more! YAY!

So I got up, had a long hot shower, made some decaf and went about my usual routine, milled about the house, went outside to see what it was like out there and smell the air ( cuz I can smell stuff now :D ). And it was actually about an hour that I'd been up and moving around before the thought occurred to me WHOA, waitaminnit there's nothing wrong with me! I'm all messed up, I mean at least I'm sposed to be all messed up, right? and feeling like crap? but I don't! In that split second my eyes welled up (still real emotional, everything is right on the surface). But I wasn't hurting anywhere, my ass wasn't dragging the ground, no fatigue. I honest to god felt... Normal.

So I decided to skip the Clonidine this morning and took no xanax with me just to see how things would go, and I had a really good, productive, "good mood" morning, lunch & early afternoon.

Then about 2:30 I started to decline a 'lil bit. I started getting heavy and then the got-dang friggin' fatigue started setting in and so I went and did my stair routine, it helped but not for long. It was a looooong dragged out afternoon and took everything I had to stay awake and stop yawning and get to 5:00 and get the hell outta there.

I came home and instead of "assuming the horizontal" I've made myself do stuff... dishes, cat box, some laundry, some dishes, and again, I had a brief period of time where I forgot I was sposed to be all messed up.

So now it's nearly 11:00 and I'm wore out, tired as shit, but I'm forcing myself to stay up until 12 or so when I'm going to take a Clonidine, a Xanax XR, and have a smoke and a glass of wine out on the patio and THEN assume the horizontal.

So anyway, I've turned a corner, I'm well aware there are most likely other corners I'm going to have to navigate. But I'm just in awe of how I'm feeling and I would give A N Y T H I N G to be able to give some of that to you guys who are struggling more still.

I've been taking "Centrum Ultra Mens Formula" vitamins every morning since about day 5, double the labeled dose, I've also been taking these Electrolyte Anti-Dehydration tablets I snag from work that are for our field crews (Potassium, Magnesium & Calcium) drinking TONS of water all day long to the point I drink, pee, I drink, pee, I drink, pee... And it got me thinking, I have always had a very high metabolism, I am 6-foot 4-inches tall and I weigh 160 lbs. and have stayed that way since high school, I'm 40 now. Makes me wonder if that is making a difference and if I were to be of average height and weight would I be feeling as ok? I just dunno. All I DO know is I'm reeeally looking forward to some similance of a normal sleep pattern.

God Bless ALL of you Brian, Romeo, LadTip & Moto. I plan on tellin' my Doc. about you guys during my appointment day after tomorrow and how much REAL help everyone here IS.

I'm gonna sign off now and go have my glass of wine outside in the beautiful weather we're having (for now) and I'll be back tomorrow to check in.

Oh Brian! I'm in Texas as well and I've been thinking of you often with the horrendous fires we're having, big state, don't know where you are in it, but I hope you are well out of harms way. Back in April I had to evacuate my home and stay in a hotel for a day, we got lucky and the fires never reached our home and I hope you're well away from it as well.
And OH, the ankle thing, YES. I am noticing all KINDS of things that are different/changing. I've already discussed my vision and my contact lens issues. I have had to take a link out of my watch and I've had to stop wearing the ring my partner gave to me because it just slides off! I still weigh the exact same, haven't gotten skinnier, so something is going on, weight shifting? un-swelling? NO idea. Most notably though is my vision, hearing & sense of smell and touch (and being touched *blush*)... I think I might try and compile a before and after list of all the little freakish things that have happened and continue to happen...

Anyway, Goodnight guys.... Here's to SLEEP *fingers crossed*

-RSJ


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:24 am 
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RS--
Sounds like you and I are in the same flight pattern. I circle that same airport--feel great in the AMs--and then by afternoon I start to crash. ARGHHH! I'm actually north of the fires--but we are very dry here too. I have a friend from Bastrop though where the fires seem to be centered. I have definitely seen some differences since stopping. One is that I am alive again in every way--if ya get me lol But also like you I catch myself feeling good and am grateful. It feels like I quit so long ago--but really its just been six weeks plus. So I guess in the scheme of things I am moving along. My stomach seems to be a little better. Glad you are feeling better Tex. Stay with it. IN some ways its to your advantage that you are in a job where you are forced to perform and have to push yourself. Take care aimgo.

brian in scorching hot texas


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 11:55 am 
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RSJX, That is encouraging as far as the Fatigue goes. I constantly worry about my health & energy. Ive abused this body for many, many, years. Why should I expect it to treat me differently. It will only improve with alot of hard work, right decisions, and most of all the Grace Of God. I go see my Doc this morning and will be discussing my jump without a parachute. I am currently at 4 mgs a day. Any and all taper suggestions are welcome. I believe the key for me will be patience and tapering moderately. Two words I have never used in my life. Patience, & Moderation. If I didnt have to try and keep a buisness open I could just close the blinds, curl up in the Fetal position and hang on through impact. Unfortunately or actually Fortunately, Cold Turkey is not an option. Thanks Guys & Gals for all your support. Peace MOTO


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:43 am 
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Good Morning Guys! It is now Day 20!
Wow, has it really been 20 days? Incredible. Hey Moto, The last 2 days? ZERO fatigue for me. I still have that "2:30-Feeling" or sinking spell in the afternoons, but considering what I've done to myself I am feeling DAMN good! I'm still having sleep issues though dammit. I'm sleeping in two shifts. I sleep from around 10:00pm to 2 or 3 am. Then I'll go ahead and do my "morning routine", Shave, Shower, eat something, Then go lay on the couch and watch TV and pass out again and sleep from 3 or 4 until 7:00am... I've found that 2nd "nap" REALLY makes the difference in how my day goes. Which over the last couple of days I've been just rockin' & rollin'!

In earlier posts we were discussing noticing changes since stopping... I found out yesterday that my sharp tongue, assertiveness and TEMPER are right back where they used to be years ago. I've definitely had a few "OMG did that really just come out of my mouth" moments lately.

Another thing for us men here, I was talking yesterday with an old friend of mine who happens to be a Doctor, I confided in him and told him what I'd been through and he immediately addressed the fatigue issue and suggested I go see a Physician right away and go get some blood work done. He says this is because long term and even short term opiate abuse lowers/depletes our testosterone levels. He was VERY adamant about this and stressed to me that the low testosterone levels would ABSOLUTELY cause major fatigue, sleep problems, libido and a whole host of other issues and that at my age (gee thanks) my body might already be slowing it's own production of testosterone and may or may not come firing back up on it's own. But that either way, I need to see where all my "levels" are and then get the proper treatment and promised me I would feel like I was in my 20's-30's again! SO, something to think about.

Late this afternoon I have my appointment with my Sub Doc. who has NO idea I'm off the sub. Ought to be a great appointment. I'm really curious to see how he reacts. Looking back & after hours of reading, I cannot believe they started me out on 24mgs/day in the beginning. But I'll let y'all know what goes down this afternoon!

Bye Guys!
-RSJ


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

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