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 Post subject: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 4:23 pm 
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Hello,

I have been using Suboxone for over 5 years, actually approaching 6 in a few months. I am done with it. I have decided to come off of it and it's finally time. I have read so many ways to taper but so far I have been using the Roberts method and I'm finally down to 8 mg per day and going to 6 mg tomorrow. Throughout the years I've used various dosages but my highest dosage was 24 mg. I brought that down to 20 for a couple months and then decided to do this. So about 10-12 days ago I was using 16 mg per day and now I'm on my 4th day of 8mg. I have a feeling everything now moving forward might be a little harder. I have experienced little w/d symptoms. Mainly physical aches and pains and this morning I woke with restless legs. Nothing I can't handle at the moment. Surprisingly my mental state seems better?? I thought I would be depressed by now. I am just really committed to getting off. Reading blogs have helped. I just was wondering about some people who have come off of similar dosages like mine. I keep reading about people who only on .5 mg or something like that. I wish that was me. Anyways, I'm ready to end this half decade addiction and finally have some freedom. Unfortunately I don't take the film anymore because my insurance copay is only $10 for the generic Suboxone tablets so it's harder for me to measure exact dosage. Anyone come off of the tablets? I used the film for years but my insurance changed and then I went back to the tablets. I am nervous, anxious, excited, and a million other feelings about getting off of this. Also I am a GM of a major restaurant chain and I was curious if I will need to take vacation when I finally do jump off the low dose that I get too. Sorry to wrote so much I am just seeking some advice, motivation, or anything really.

Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:07 pm 
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Welcome five years. The area of your post is one I currenty find the most fascinating. I'm about in your term also at five and one half years. I was and sort if still am tapering so I've really researched and paid attention to those who have done this. While I can't point to research to substantiate my claims they are based in observation not personal feelings or guesses. Here's what I have found.

1. The most successful people get to the point you are where they are just "done". Something goes off inside of them. They just know its time.

2. Being on 8 mg is really no different than being on 12, 16 or even 32 mg. other than for pain patients there is little difference.

3. Most people can get to 4 mg with little to no problems. Again, I refer to non pain patients taking Bup for addiction.

4. Getting to 2 mg is where most people start to struggle.

5. If there is an average low dose jumping point it seems to be 0.25 mg. that's where many seem to jump from.

6. How long you've been on Bup over about three months does not seem to effect withdrawls for those who slowly taper to 0.25 then jump. Those on it for 7 years seem to suffer no more than those on for 7 months. A long and slow taper appears to be the most important.

7. When the final dose is taken, most people "suffer" for 10 - 14 days. This suffering is nowhere close to withdrawl from full agonists but they do suffer.

8. Most people start to steadily feel better between day 14 to day 21. By day 21 many claim to be 75% their normal selves. By day 28 most claim to be 90 to 95% normal. Sleep patters seem to be the largest complaint and the last thing to return to normal.

Now will this be your expierence? It's more likely than not but nothing is certain. Everyone can vary. Also understand that the relapse rate is significant. Being on Bup at least one year and over 30 years old decreasies the chance of relapse but it's still very real.

You should do fine until you hit 2 mg. from there go very slowly using small dosedrops every week to ten days. Get as low as you can and it again appears many just know when it's time and they take their last dose.

Hope that helps!


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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 7:42 pm 
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Thanks Donh, I appreciate that insight. Yeah I have literally hit the point of wanting to just be free from it. Suboxone completely changed my life for the better and allowed me to get off my crazy other opiate addiction, but I am ready to be me again, whatever that may be. I am also planning a year long move abroad with my wife and baby in 2016 and I can't be still on this stuff. It's will be an amazing year of no work, no stress, and no Suboxone! Just family time. Anyways, I have read some of the same stuff and I am hoping that my regular gym workouts with heavy cardio will help me. I have read it will. I wish you luck with your taper as well. I literally don't know anyone else on this stuff so I am hoping to meet some people on here like yourself that could help me finish this thing off! Thanks man.


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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 8:22 pm 
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Hi, I can't add much to the upper dosage conversation but can when it comes to the lower dosage.

First, you are right about the exercise. It definitely helps, even if you don't feel like doing it. It is our brain's natural way of producing endorphins, which naturally improve mood and decrease the sensation of pain. So working out is definitely a good plan.

When it comes to the lower dose, I have found the most difficult time is when I got below 1 mg (for some people that number might be 2mg). There are different opinions on this, but some find it better to split the dose to twice daily when you get that low. Some find that this adds to addictive behavior, but it helped withdrawal symptoms better for me taking .5mg every 12 hours rather than 1mg once per day. And then when it was time to lower it again, I could go down to .25mg in the am and .125mg in the pm. And then I went to .125mg in the am and in the pm. And so it goes...

I agree that .25mg is a common jumping off point, though some get lower than that. You may get to a dose that seems to not be working for you in staving off withdrawals, be it .125 or .25 or wherever. If you get to a point that it isn't helping after several days, then that is probably the point where you should jump.

Hope some of this helps and makes sense. Good luck!


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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 10:21 pm 
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ThanKsu Steph, so when you go that low and jump off, would I need to take a week off of work? I know everyone is different, but I'm curious in how I should plan this. I am a GM of a restaurant chain so I get to make my own schedule, but it's obviously long hours and long weeks at times. I'm a little nervous about the jump. Obviously though I am more worried about right now which is tomorrow I am supposed to go down to 6 mg based on my plan I'm on. Good news is I went to gym today and felt great so I will continue that for sure. I am also off this weekend so I just need to suck it up for 2 days in the 6mg and then the 3rd and 4th day on 6mg I at least won't have to deal with a stressful weekend at the restaurant. I'm very anxious to come off and excited. I am hoping the 25% drop every 4 days is a good plan and works for me. I would LOVE to get down to .25 mg. that's a dream! Lol. Thanks for the info. Good stuff.


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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:33 pm 
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Great comments Steph!

5years- 25% every four days is a pretty aggressive drop when you get under 2 mg. at the 2 mg point or as Stepg 1 mg for some people, small drops and slow is the ticket. I doubt you will feel much if anything going from 8 to 6. That should be very easy. It's when you are lower. As for a week off work, I see more people needing two weeks. As I said you'll fel at your worst from about day 2 or 3 to days 10 or as much as 14. That's the point mist people can tell they have turned the corner. Now let me also say many work during this time too. It's not like you can't get out of bed or something. You just may not feel like it for a few weeks post drop.

What I really want to know is his in the hell can you basically go on vacation for a year? That's awesome but what your secret to that??? Wow!


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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 9:42 pm 
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Donh, that's good to know that after 2mg it becomes tough. I would have thought it would be easier at that point until jump off. I honestly have gone from 20mg to 6 pretty easily. Little things I notice but nothing I can't Handle. Lol, yeah people think we are crazy, but I have been inspired. Basically we as Americans are trained to learn for the first 25 years of our lives (school college etc), then for the next 45-50 years we work, and then if we are lucky to still be alive and somewhat healthy, we then retire for 15 years and do Whatever we want. So basically I read about this guy who basically took his kids and plucked one of those later retirement years while he was still young and in the prime of his life. So We are doing the same! We have found a country that is beautifil and very very affordable on a budget. We are basically saving 40k by selling our home, our stuff, moving to cheaper place, and also saving all of my quarterly bonus checks as well as tax returns this year and then moving abroad for a year with a budget of about 3k per month. We will live VERY well for that amount and we are just doing to do whatever the hell we want for that year. We work so much and I miss so much of my sons life so we decided this is what we want to do. I think it will life changing and AWESOME. Why only take a retirement year when I'm old as hell? Anyways, some people think it's awesome and some of our family think we are crazy, but I don't care. My son isn't in school age yet so the time for this is now before he starts school. We are hoping to be gone by next April. We actually have a trip booked next month to go make sure it's the place we want to go and assure we live it, otherwise we have to change locations.

But this is obviously a huge initiative to come off if the subs and I habe plenty of time. I am hoping to be off subs for at least a few months before we go so I can get to know who the hell I am without this stuff in my body.


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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 4:44 pm 
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Hi 5 years!

I am loving your idea here! How wonderful that you have that to look forward to as motivation for you taper. It seems as if everything is working together to push you in that direction in this time of your life. I think it's fabulous!!!!!

Be sure and keep us updated on your progress, I'm totally invested in your story now!

Q :D

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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 8:17 pm 
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Hi 5 Years,

Just wanted to say that I've been tapering below 2 mg and it hasn't been too bad. I've had less time on subs than you, but from what people have said above, it doesn't matter too much once you've been on it for a while. Anyway, just wanted to give you some hope: I had an easy time getting to 2 mgs, then my first drop below hurt, but my last three drops below 2mg haven't been too bad, only about two days of minor symptoms and it has been doable.
I'm no expert, but I thought it might encourage you to read about how getting below 2mg is entirely possible without too much discomfort. I'm sure I have hard times ahead, but from what I've read from other people on this forum, tapering is completely doable. Some people say they didn't take any time off work for their final drop (this is at low doses, like .2mg or much lower) and some say they needed about 4-7 days off of work to make it through the rough patch. It's encouraging to hear these stories and know that we can achieve what they've achieved.

Best of luck to you. I hope your year abroad is amazing!

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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 8:24 pm 
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Oh and I forgot to add: if you only have access to the tablets, get a mg scale. I bought one off of amazon for $25, and it has allowed me to measure my tabs in 10% decreases accurately. No surprise WDs from inaccurate doses. I will have to use the liquid taper to get down to really low doses once I'm below about 1mg, but the scale has been a lifesaver for me.

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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 9:59 pm 
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Q & BK,

Thanks so much for the Hope and inspection there. There is nothing better than hearing direct experiences from people. Obviously fear is a factor and I know our minds play tricks on us with this stuff. Anyways, if love to hear about your progress as well as you get lower on your taper. I have been on 6mg for 4 days now and I am going to go to start 4.5 mg tomorrow. Also great idea about the MG scale. I have also been reading about the liquid method that I will probably try eventually as well. So you are doing 10% drop ? How long are you waiting to drop? Or just waiting til you feel leveled off? Just curious. I'm sure I will have to go less than my 25% once I get to 2mg. Honestly I'll be really happy when I get to 2mg. How fast did you drop to the 2?


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 Post subject: Re: Stopping Suboxone
PostPosted: Mon Mar 09, 2015 10:54 pm 
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I was on subs for 8 years man I can tell you how it is and how I did it.I am day 19 100% off all drugs!!first off I balanced to 2 mg once a day.within the course of a week I tapered to roughly .5 mg.never adjusted to it but was pretty easy to do.you will need roughly ten days off work.I cook at a restaurant :) ten days max.the wd is very mild worse is no sleep and rls.Imodium help tremendously with the shits and rls but don't take too long as in high doses it's a otc opiate that crosses bbb.anyways the wd peaks out on day 7.day 8 on just feels like the flu and not flu times ten !! Day 10 went back to work no issues man.today I only have sweaty under arms that's it.I sleep 7 to 8 hours a night on my own.I also wd from heroin before the subs and methadone.heroin 7 days normal.methadone 4 months of hell.subs ten days then golden.very mild lingering wd not even worth mentioning.I'm male 31 yo 170 lbs.I made it and I know you will too brother I have faith in you my friend


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