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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 12:52 am 
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thank everyone for all the kudos... Im confused as to why the whole SLAVE issue got brought up... again...... that was over a half a year ago.... But either way... I LOVE LIFE

I know in rehab, your not supposed to bring up the using stories or how great it used to be. But just listen. Everyone knows the feeling they get when they use, the ENERGY, the DRIVE, the MOTIVATION, and that FEELING IN YOUR HEAD once youve scored.... well i honestly, truly, seriously want people to know, that i GET THAT NOW! No chemicals, nothing at all, its natural, i experience that several times a day. Im amazed at how amazing i feel. Get passed the initial crappy WD's from Subs, (which suck), i promise they get better, and i know its easy to say that.... I do get some PAWS occasionally, but its just sweats, easy to handle really. Actually got it today after i finished some work at my job. Legs just got like extra sweaty, but you know what.... who cares, ill take that over OXY W/D.....

Bottom line, i was one of the skeptics. I didn't think it was possible to get off subs. But here i am. 8 months with NOTHING. On fathers day this year it will be 3 years COMPLELETELY SOBER FROM OPIATES. Good fathers day present huh? Either way, there is hope, please PM me with any questions i dont care how personal, i know any hope is help. There is nothing to personal, i really want to help you all....


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:09 pm 
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Quote:
Im confused as to why the whole SLAVE issue got brought up... again...... that was over a half a year ago....


Why does that confuse you?

Quote:
In what way are you subservient to buprenorphine?


Because if I don't take it bad things will happen. At one point my goal in every day life was to make enough money to pay for my appointment and prescription at the end of the month. The fear of not being able to get buprenorphine controlled every day of my life. This is similar to the methadone clinic (but the MC was much worse). Much of my time was spent worrying about how to get enough money to pay for the clinic or, what would happen if I got arrested, sick or injured. It dictated where I could go and for how long (no more 'family vacations'). These factors caused me to do things that I normally wouldn't have done. Buprenorphine, just like most drugs, has the potential to do this as well. But regardless, many of us couldn't stop taking buprenorphine even if we wanted too without dire consequences. If that's not slavery then what is? There is something/someone that dictates what you can and can't do (and that you are dependent on) and if you don't give in to it/them then there are negative consequences.

Slaves can benefit from their masters, though. It's just semantics really. The only reason we are having this argument is because slavery has a negative connotation. If we all thought slavery was a good thing I think we would be okay with calling it slavery.


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 Post subject: The Real Master...
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:12 pm 
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I feel like the Sub saved me from the slavery of my DOC. I signed up for it. I take it every day. But this time, I'm taking it for a positive reason: to release myself from the actual slave, my DOC. How easily we forget who the real Master is.

For me, Sub is a half-step, an immediate (yet sometimes not perfect) way to arrest most of the negative, habitual behaviors associated with my DOC. It is a positive effort, a means to escape eventually to complete freedom from drugs. The process takes time. If we could do it alone, it would only take once to kick, and we wouldn't need clinics, counselors or rehabs.

Sub is an option within my control: a recovery tool. I chose it, it did not enslave me. It does not force itself under my tongue every day. But I do think the Drs who prescribe it should have more accurate information for their patients. I think it should cost less, too. I think patients should know that even a few milligrams of Sub is equal to 30mgs or more of Methadone (approx.) I think people need to know that at the end of maintenance therapy, it may take months to comfortably taper off.

My point is: it's there, it's a healthy option is used informatively, it's a vehicle for sobriety, and ultimately-- better than the alternative. So, is your glass half empty? Of half full?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2010 12:51 am 
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well for me... 10 months later with no subs... 3 months shy of three years without oxys.... still sober.... my glass is FULL :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P


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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 12:11 am 
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Im still updating to let people know... IM ALL GOOD.... This upcoming fathers day it will be the OFFICIAL 3 years clean... And almost a year without suboxone... Im doing great, been lifting weights. Ive gained 20 pounds in muscle, i have motivation and im always happy!!!!


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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 12:36 am 
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That is beyond awesome to hear! You have truly beaten the odds - do you know that? You should be extremely proud of yourself. Can you share with all of us how long it took for you to feel "normal" or let's say, feel like you do today, after stopping your Suboxone? In other words, how long post-Subs did it take for you to feel like yourself again? Was PAWS an issue for you? The more I read and research, the more I seem to find that a sizable number of people are able to stop their Suboxone but far fewer are able to either stay in remission without relapse, or are able to get through what some say is an agonizing length of time dealing with depression and other PAWS symptoms.

I know there are several people here that would love to hear the answers to these questions - and I am one of them! Congratulations once again on reaching this milestone. And even more thanks for taking the time to come back and let the rest of us know both how you are doing and that it really can be done!


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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 8:04 am 
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Congratulations on your successes! You truly deserve kudos for all of your hard work - and it paid off! You should be so proud of yourself. And being happy is the best reward possible.

Amidst the horror stories of stopping suboxone and how it makes your ears fall off, many people are showing that it can be done and you are the perfect example of that. So thank you for coming back to tell us of your progress. Your story is an inspiration to everyone who is ready to come off suboxone. And as donh indicated, many of us are interested in how PAWS affected you.

Thank you and keep posting on your progress.

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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 9:06 am 
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I am also keenly interested in knowing how long it took to feel "normal" again after stopping suboxone.

Congratulations on a terrific accomplishment.


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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 1:29 pm 
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I would like to know what you are doing to abstain from using drugs now that you are not on suboxone. This is the part that scares me as I start to taper. Congratulations on your success! If you could be so kind as to post more I would greatly appreciate it.

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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 2:01 pm 
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I am interested too! And as donh said -- CONGRATULATIONS!


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 Post subject: Really dumb!
PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:25 pm 
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Well i have been reading through and can relate and appreciate the stories and support.Well about me.I stopped sub abruptly at 18mg after two weeks.Stupidly without any research.And i was on methadone for about 2 years before recently going on Sub.The first couple of days were okay and but i was easily agitated and irritable.Then the WD started at day 5 when i took some Tylenol with codeine and did some coke.My back,legs and feet started hurting while i was at work.I had to leave early and take a couple of days off.I went back to my detox doctor to get some Ambient and Clonidine.I asked him how long the withdrawals will last and he said one week.Ya right!I also have Valium,Imodium and I'm on Wellbutrin.Wow!What a rough ride.I'm at Day 15 and i hope the worst is behind me.I still feel lethargic,depressed and CANNOT GET A GOOD NIGHT SLEEP!I'm trying to go for bike rides and sweat it out.I drink Gatorade and enough water.I think it's a combination of methadone and suboxone withdrawal if that's possible.Anyone else have experience with both methadone and suboxone and foolishly stopping sub like i did?And all the best to everyone else.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 1:08 am 
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suboxdoc wrote:
I skimmed, I admit... I haven't read the detail of every post. Agg... congrats, and good luck. Do keep in touch. I do NOT want anyone to relapse, so please don't interpret what I am about to say in that way-- I don't know anyone who has kicked opiate dependence without either Suboxone (staying on it, that is) or very intensive residential treatment followed by meetings that don't end. So it you are clean in a year, come back and tell me about it-- and I DON'T mean that like some kind of challenge or 'I be you won't' comment... Every time I have heard about someone 'kicking opiates' I find that the person is drinking like crazy, or on Kratom, or jumping from bed to bed in a sex addiction-- replacing one drug of choice for another. But it sounds like you did it the way I would recommend-- stay on it long enough to allow for some real personality changes, for example.

Teen addict mom, understand that it really is not about strength. A 'simple minded person' would probably have the best chance of recovery, as it is the complicated rationalization that keeps a person sick. There is a saying in treatment centers: nobody is too dumb for recovery, but some people are too smart for it! Some people who COULDN'T quit using include Ernest Hemingway, the author who died of alcoholism, a number of brilliant musicians in the 60's (plus Cobain from Nirvana more recently), Sigmund Freud, the psycho-analyst/cocaine addict; and a number of very bright doctors that I have known over the years.

I try to avoid statements like 'he is tough enough to stop', as that implies that toughness helps... when in reality I think the best thing to help one recover is humility-- the ability to see one's mistakes and admit to them, and the ability to open one's mind to other ideas and to change.

I agree with the others that a few weeks of Suboxone is not enough. In studies looking at outcomes, those taking it for less than 6 months just don't do well. As for cost, you will spend much more money from a couple days of using than you will from a month of one suboxone per day.

Good luck you guys,

Jeff


Another addiction such as Kratom or sex? You are a messed up individual if you get addicted to anything and everything in life. I am addicted to water, drink it every day all day long. DO NOT SPEAK OF KRATOM IN A NEGATIVE WAY AND QUIT PROMOTING THIS NASTY CHEMICAL SUBOXONE TO STUFF MONEY IN BIG PHARMA POCKETS AND DOCTORS ETC. DO WHAT IS RIGHT FOR PEOPLE!

Kratom is a miracle herb. There is so much junk on the internet of people calling Kratom a legal high and saying not for human consumption. This destroys the legitimacy of our herb and endangers it when classified as such.

Kratom works for SO MANY people for pain, to get off opiates, and to get off methadone, suboxone etc.

It is absolutely a miracle and cannot be underestimated. SO MANY people always say they wish they would have known about Kratom so long ago when trying to kick pills, or getting off methadone, suboxone etc. It is also only as addictive as caffiene, so stopping Kratom is a piece of cake. It TRULY helps people kick opiates.

For more information about Kratom Therapy check out www dot KratomTherapy dot com or Errowid


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 Post subject: Re: STILL SOBER
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 1:12 am 
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aggrorollintrs wrote:
ALRIGHTY THEN. I just checked all these posts and apparently people are upset at my word choices. WEll i too made it clear in the beginning. Suboxone SAVED MY LIFE. I thank god for it every day, and realize its okay to be on suboxone, we all know that. BUt the majority of the population still seems to feel that addiction is a choice and they wont have it. Now im not letting that sway my opinion and i realize addiction is a disease but ponder this.

NOw keep in mind, i support suboxone in EVERY WAY

I take prozac everyday, but i dont wake up and make sure i have it for the day, make sure i have a refill in time, or worry if i miss a dose. There is still a mentality behind taking suboxone.

Now if i had diabetes and needed insulin to survive, thats different, but if somehow weaning myself from the insulin my body would relearn how to produce it on its own, why wouldnt I make the decision to get off. Granted that I would have to keep a strict diet and monitor my blood sugar levels, then i wouldnt have to worry about the insulin.

Just like suboxone, my body is relearning how to do everything on its own, with daily maintinence, and watching my habits, i can stay drug free. Because i have a choice.

So that is just how I PERSONALLY FEEL. I wish people wouldnt get so upset over a drug ive been on for 4 years, i know it intimately and am not am extremist opposing it. I FULLY SUPPORT IT

It's strictly personal preference. For the first time the other day someone asked me if i wanted to go camping and i didnt think about if I was going to have enough suboxone to get me through the weekend and if I lost it what would I do.

SO im sorry if i made anyone mad. But ive been off the subs now like 3 months, and im good.


Totally agree... Well said.

Something else to help people that have self control is KRATOM:

Kratom is a miracle herb. There is so much junk on the internet of people calling Kratom a legal high and saying not for human consumption. This destroys the legitimacy of our herb and endangers it when classified as such.

Kratom works for SO MANY people for pain, to get off opiates, and to get off methadone, suboxone etc.

It is absolutely a miracle and cannot be underestimated. SO MANY people always say they wish they would have known about Kratom so long ago when trying to kick pills, or getting off methadone, suboxone etc. It is also only as addictive as caffiene, so stopping Kratom is a piece of cake. It TRULY helps people kick opiates.

For more information about Kratom Therapy check out www dot KratomTherapy dot com or Errowid


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:03 am 
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KratomTherapy wrote:
Another addiction such as Kratom or sex? You are a messed up individual if you get addicted to anything and everything in life. I am addicted to water, drink it every day all day long. DO NOT SPEAK OF KRATOM IN A NEGATIVE WAY AND QUIT PROMOTING THIS NASTY CHEMICAL SUBOXONE TO STUFF MONEY IN BIG PHARMA POCKETS AND DOCTORS ETC. DO WHAT IS RIGHT FOR PEOPLE!

Kratom is a miracle herb. There is so much junk on the internet of people calling Kratom a legal high and saying not for human consumption. This destroys the legitimacy of our herb and endangers it when classified as such.

Kratom works for SO MANY people for pain, to get off opiates, and to get off methadone, suboxone etc.

It is absolutely a miracle and cannot be underestimated. SO MANY people always say they wish they would have known about Kratom so long ago when trying to kick pills, or getting off methadone, suboxone etc. It is also only as addictive as caffiene, so stopping Kratom is a piece of cake. It TRULY helps people kick opiates.

For more information about Kratom Therapy check out www dot KratomTherapy dot com or Errowid


I dunno... but to me, that post sounded way more messed up than Dr. J's.


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 Post subject: The crave
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 7:43 am 
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The reason I use Sub is it stops me using the stuff I STILL dream about using. Those dreams suck.
What recepTors does KRATOM invade? The PLEASURE ones?


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 1:48 pm 
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aggroroll- i can feel the the emotions of a slave by my days going by much faster and my feelings sorta strait lined.
my family and friends drifting a bit. and why? i also have scored many times on suboxone, and i mean the things i
would not have scored with out suboxone. i don't like the every day feeling of waiking up with a feeling that i taken
some kind of drug". it sucks' but won'ts the day gets going" man it gets going , and i get a lot more done on subs than with out.
i think i'm seeing some family/ friends a little envy- but so what. i'm not doing a lot of the stupid things that my friends and family are still doing. i have medical problems and some long term treatment that i would not have done with out suboxone.
so now i think to my self". witch evil is the better of the too? like doc junig said humility is the best way to go. and if your
high up and then take suboxone it may bring you down. but if your lo down, and take suboxone '. it may bring you up.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 8:50 pm 
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i just wanted to say i have used kratom for over a year and now I have been on subutex for over two months. They are both miracles. You guys should stop arguing. For people who prefer the natural route, kratom may be a miracle. For people wanting to go the proven route, they take suboxone. It depends on each and everyone's personal approach to the matter. Kratom works amazingly well...and so does subutex (suboxone for me anyways-not so much). Kratom is just under-researched but it does have great potential. I suggest you check out kratomconnoisseurs.com if you want to learn from the experts.


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 Post subject: block addiction
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 1:07 am 
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I was under the impression kratom compliments the effect from opiates, and is often used in ever increasing doses.
Some users state consumption of 60+ caps a day, and battle to taper their use, or stop.
May-be some folks use suboxone to get high, but most use it create distance from their DOC, or to avoid WD., there's no high, and no need to follow your thought patterns to use, cause of the blocking effect.
All - Seeing Eye, are you using subutex to get high? If so all I cay say is ,"you lucky bugger".


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 Post subject: shelter
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 1:44 am 
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Hey johnboy, man I can relate to what say about your family, mine too. They look ten years older, and fat from guzzling methadone, and lying around the house all day. Sub at the right dose gives me a normal mind set, to go about the day, and get things done. Some times we forget sub's shielding quality. Sure you slip here and there, and it's gonna take a long time to learn to live free from opiates, sub is the half way mark, and I'll take it one day at a time.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:16 am 
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Quit with the spamming please.

Those here with the purpose of to spam / advertise are banned from this site.


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