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 Post subject: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Mon Jan 27, 2014 4:11 am 
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Hey all. Well, I updated almost a month ago that I was going to be coming off of a dosage of .25mg of suboxone. I still find myself on it. :(

This has been so hard for me. I want so badly to come off. I have a 2yr old and just recently got a part time job. I'm having to wake at 630-7am and am NOT a morning person. Especially on suboxone. Before, I was able to wake up at 630am and work 40 hours a week. I was tired and have never loved waking early, but now I'm so scared! Suboxone makes me a zombie of a person. I'm lifeless. I'm so tired and emotionless but emotional at the same time. Its crazy!

I want to come off but I'm scared to. I'm scared of withdrawals, I'm scared I'll crave pills out of nowhere. I'm just scared.

I hope to have this place of comfort. I think it'll really help to have somewhat of a cheering on!

My friend came here and she felt such comfort from it. I have a husband who is also coming off of suboxone. But he works a lot and its always nice to have even more of a support team. He's wonderful as is my friend. But its nice to talk it out. I don't want to be in AA or NA. My religious beliefs are different than theirs and it's just not for me.

Anyway, I think I'm at .25mg now. Anyone have somewhat of a chart that might help me figure out better what my dosage is? And further down from here as well?

Thank you.


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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Mon Jan 27, 2014 4:32 am 
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Hang in there, I know you can do it.

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Here is the solution to the American drug problem suggested a couple years back by the wife of our President: Just say no.―Kurt Vonnegut
No! Ex addict, been to a Rehabilitation Center in Detroit. 12 years clean now :)


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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Mon Jan 27, 2014 6:05 pm 
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Hi there. Don't be too hard on yourself that you are still on .25mg of suboxone. Your body whether mentally or physically may not be "there" yet.

If you search this forum, there are many different methods in order to taper off slowly at your own pace.

I personally a few years ago tapered down off Suboxone and stopped taking in at .25 mg (right where you are) My withdraws were not severe and they lasted about 10 days.

To be honest, I stayed clean for a year, but I was miserable, I was STILL AN ADDICT, so I still had cravings. I went back on Suboxone which I am on to this day. It is not a perfect drug but it keeps me away from drugs and I would rather choose the side effects than the alternative.

I too do not really care for AA either ( it is a little too preachy for me) but I have really benefited from going to addiction counseling.

If you do decide to taper, have a plan and TAKE YOUR TIME> There is no hurry. But I would look on this forum for a tapering schedule that is right for you.

What helps me from feeling too Zombie-like on Subs is exercising everyday. Yup it sounds awful but I run 3 miles a day and it has helped so much with my energy levels and depression.

I wish you the best of luck


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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Tue Jan 28, 2014 1:08 am 
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Your 'zombie' experience is unusual. Exercise is a thought, I guess.. but frankly, I have a hard time seeing how buprenorphine would have such an effect. I have some very dynamic patients on buprenorphine-- attorneys, a couple CEO's, at least one triathlete, and a number of other people with more ordinary jobs, leading interesting lives.

I do have patients who are 'zombie out'-- who are or aren't on buprenorphine. The ones who aren't on buprenorphine don't have anything to blame it on, except perhaps for being bored with life, and not making the effort to make life more interesting. The ones who DO blame buprenorphine for feeling dull and lifeless often spend months trying to stop the drug-- and then months after stopping it, find that they are just as 'zombied' off the drug as they were on it. Some go back to using, and I suppose that adds a bit of excitement for them.

From 0.25 mg, I would tell one of my patients to 'shit or get off the pot'. I think about the normal things people do in life-- like the typical childbirth. If women worried as much about pushing out an 8-pound baby as people worry about stopping buprenorphine, we'd be extinct in no time. Things that are harder than stopping 0.25 mg of buprenorphine, besides having a baby? Losing 50 pounds. Training and running in a marathon. Having a moderate case of influenza. Going through job loss or divorce. Losing a close friend to drug overdose....

if you have created an entire life around stopping buprenorphine, just do it. By March you'll be normal. it isn't the end of the world. What really stinks is just sitting and dreading it for months and months.


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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:09 pm 
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The doctor is right. Thanks for sharing that subdoc. I've jumped off and 24mg before, and at 16mg before... So to get down to .25mg would be amazing.... To jump off at that would be nothing. It sounds like you just want to stay on it cause it's a crutch and you're waiting for something to happen so you can go back up on your dose. I can understand some people may have a bad view of NA but that's what's gonna keep you clean, not sub. I've never been to an NA meeting that preaches. And I've been to a lot. Infact their are people at NA meetings that are Wiccan, pagan, atheist, Christian, agnostic, etc. And they all get along because the focus is drugs not religion, it's not church, it's a support place and program for your disease... Addiction. That's the main reason you haven't stopped sub yet, you cannot make sub your whole program that's not what it's intended for. Sub can only be a tool. You have to have other means of therapy.

I have multiple years of sobriety, and many years of sub treatment. And I didn't make it this far because I shunned NA meetings. In fact I made it this far because of the opposite. I know some people just don't "get it" yet. And that's ok. But at some point you're gonna have to "get it" if you want long term real sobriety. And I hope you find it. Nobody, and I mean nobody,makes it without working a program other than suboxone. You might make it so far on your own but you won't get any further past a certain point without NA. That's just reality, statistics, and facts. It's not my personal opinion. It's just true. I too wasn't a religious person and my best friend in NA she is Wiccan. But we both know we gotta have NA. NA is the real medicine for our disease. You can't do this on your own.
Not trying to upset you, just giving you the facts.

I wish you the best.... And your husband.


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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 12:30 am 
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Hmmm.. where to start.

Hey JourneyBabe, I hear you! You've come along way, you're wanting to try life without suboxone but you're scared shitless. Add to that, your daily responsibilities and the fear of feeling unwell for a long period of time, and it's a lot to process. You've come pretty far already! .25 is practically nothing, my dear. Don't get me wrong, it can make a big difference as far as helping you to function and carry on, but you're probably feeling pretty crappy because you've, essentially, already been detoxing this whole time. You are on just enough to keep you going, but not enough to feel "ok" on a steady basis. So you are stuck in this limbo of constantly withdrawing a bit. Expecting the worst is the best thing to do (despite the fact that our fear can leave us so paralyzed) because in the end, you'll most likely be surprised at how easy it is to come off of suboxone. The harder part is living life clean from that point on, despite what anyone may think.

Please don't get too caught up in the post before mine. I disagree with almost everything that is said in it. You'll have plenty of support here. Keep posting! People find their form of therapy all over the place. Doesn't have to be NA/AA.


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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 1:03 am 
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ehhh, i believe KADYRX is spreading false information...representing PURE OPINION as facts...as i stated in another thread, i have never heard of ANY of kadyrx's statements to be true in any shape or form..

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Last edited by He-Reigns on Thu Feb 06, 2014 8:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 8:10 am 
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Hi JourneyBabe,

I wish I had read your post sooner! I totally get what you are going through, and it's not easy. I did exactly what you are doing last summer. Spent months tapering and finally got down to .25mg. I was mentally and physically exhausted, and so tired of feeling bad. The difference between you and I is that I wasn't ready to come off suboxone yet. I never had any bad side effects from the drug, and I had a doctor and a husband who were pressuring me to get off.

Once I got down to .25 I knew that it was time to "shit or get off the pot" as Dr. J put it! :lol:

I chose to go back on a low dose of suboxone, because I knew I was not ready. I would have been one of those who relapsed in a very short period of time and to me it was not worth it. I'm not saying this will happen to you...I'm only trying to explain why I did what I did.

My main point is that I remember how bad I felt at .25mg. I'm sure it would have gotten better if I had stayed there awhile, or if I had jumped. I was absolutely positive that from there I would have experienced very little WD. Or at least nothing much worse than what I had already endured. But, just like Tiny said above, you are keeping yourself at such a low dose that you are more than likely experiencing WD for most of the day. I really think the .25mg is doing more harm than good at this point. Giving your receptors just enough opiate to keep them wanting more, but not enough to calm them down.

Just so you understand how little opiate you are actually getting let me tell you this. When I finally decided I wasn't going to jump and went back on the subs I started out with a dose of 1mg. Believe it or not I was high as a kite for 2 days on that dose of 1mg! I was absolutely shocked at how much I had brought my tolerance down! I struggled for almost a year to get myself down to 1mg, and felt like it was doing nothing when I was there. It really showed me just how close I was to being fully detoxed at that stage.

So, my advice to you is to really search your heart and figure out what you want. If it is only the fear of WD that is keeping you here, then I say go for it! It's not going to be as bad as you are expecting, and there is no time like the present to give it a go. If you are really worried about it why don't you start out with skipping days first? I have read of a couple members here who did it that way and eventually found that they didn't need their dose anymore. You can start taking .25 every other day for about a week, then skip 2 days...so on until you feel comfortable stepping off.

You are going to be fine JourneyBabe, I hope you are still reading. Give us an update ok?

Q

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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 9:42 pm 
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Journey Babe,

I have to first say, that I have faith that your jump from.25 will be completely successful. your apprehension about going thru withdrawal is natural,and I wouldn't pay any attention whatsoever to someone saying that you are using it as a crutch or looking for a reason to increase your dose. it seems that you've tapered to a reasonable dose and should only experience mild discomfort from what I've read here from members who have done the same successfully. you seem ready to move on from Suboxone. if in the process, though you find yourself having strong cravings and in danger of a relapse, you always have the option of going back up on your dose, as others have done, and definitely should not feel guilty about doing so. relapse can happen to people with multiple years of recovery, and thankfully we now h ave Suboxone to help safeguard against relapse, which can prove to be a real tragedy, as we've recently seen in the news of Phillip s. Hoffman's death. Of course having some sort of other program, like meetings or counseling ot whatever works for you is important in staying clean after you've completed your sub treatment. but N.A. certainly isn't the only option. the Suboxone is the medicine in the treatment for opiate addiction while N.A. is a self help group to help addicts stay clean. we are all here cheering you on. please keep us posted.

liz


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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:07 pm 
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@JourneyBabe
Hey! Listen, your on .25Mg. You'll be fine! Don't worry! Worrying manifest's fear into something fictional. Your expecting the sky to fall right??? I was in your shoes 2 weeks ago. I went cold turkey from 2mg with Mild Withdrawals ..( R.L.S., with some minor insomnia). You feel like an emotional zombie right?? I don't see how Anyone can say that's unusual. Everyone I know who takes sub is somewhat Dull. Very Even quelled without much excitement or ambition. Every now and then I would get a taste of sobriety if I went a couple days without taking it, I would feel. Though it would be brief it's enough to make anyone want to give life a try again naturally. I understand that might be somewhat annoying to people who take suboxone. Sub saved my life so I'm in no way mocking anyone or anything about Suboxone. I'll be on this site every day until I feel 100% so if you want to talk, Send me a message. If I don't hear from you again Good Luck and remember to think positive. Don't focus on the horror stories.

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 Post subject: Re: still on suboxone..
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:07 pm 
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I agree with the previous posts- .25mg definitely keeps you in a state of mild withdrawal. I had the same fears as you when I tapered low and tried to jump. It's more of a mental thing that makes it so hard, not the actual subs; I know that doesn't make it any easier. My last jump was in June from 2mg and although it wasn't pleasant, it was quicker than the two years I spent tapering down to .01mg, with months and months in mild discomfort.

In regards to a "program," there are many options out there besides AA/NA. You do need to find something to address your addiction, especially in the beginning. I am in AA and it is by no means religious; I am not religious at all and still get a lot out of it. I am able to learn about myself, why I used, how to stay clean, and most importantly, I have the opportunity to help others which keeps me sober above all else. Opiate addiction has a very low rate of success with people who fail to take part in some form of recovery. I am sure people have done it without anything, but I can't imagine being just clean without some kind of ongoing support. Doing it alone rarely works from what I've seen, heard, and experienced myself.


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