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PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:09 pm 
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Look folks, weve all been down this road before. Well some of us who ve bn here awhile. Ok, so a warning has bn issued on the dangers of Bupe, if indeed there are to be believed.
Im not going to sniff around looking for trolls but i will say this , 5, please do get to a detox anre start real recovery
its out there in many ways bud. Yes, this is a pro sub place. A Bupe for life forum . We here on this forum are doing well without these problems or are willing to deal with the side effects. Our choise.
Help is here and much can be learned. Dr J, will tell it as it is. ..so my hope is you find real help and start to get heathy again .i really do..
For those who are angery, well its a public forum and not all ideas are as we'd like. so... Trolls, we had a big one last year or so. But hopefully 5, reads more here and will see the "Junig" knows what he is talking about..good luck 5, come back when the dust settles man....raz....


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 9:01 pm 
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Like I stated, preemptive apology in case I'm wrong, but try to understand that there's people who can and cannot accept that possibility. The lashing out at people trying to help you and agenda-pushing is why it is troll-behavior.
If that confuses you, then maybe you're unaware that someone would make up a story because it happens here. All the time. You may be new to the site (at least this year) and not know that the common knowledge of trolling is making a fake story, asking for help, and then grandstanding about helping others through the evils of this med as if that's something universal, and if we haven't had a fallout with sub yet it's going to happen or we just don't understand how enslaved we are, that's the one sided bull shit we get. Not always a story, but usually that's what it graduates to when the general subsux campaign proves ineffective, we even got one guy creating multiple accounts to start over and over every time he gets banned for inappropriate behavior.

But here's the thing... As others have told you, this is a recovery site and getting on here and responding to the posts that DID give you the benefit of the doubt with more anger and scare tactics, that's not helpful. It's also a forum that's been described at length to be somewhere for sub patients to discuss recovery on their terms, with like minded people who don't want to argue. The advice I'm gonna give you is to "warn" people or solicit help or whatever it is in the freestyle or side effects section, they get plenty of posting attention just like this one.

If this is really the place you're in, then consider what twincitieshardcore said. It doesn't have to be this way.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 9:03 pm 
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Razor I'm sorry I'm not trying to push it, literally right after I posted I saw yours trying to wrap it up my bad


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 9:50 pm 
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I'll never get these guys... it would be so easy for him to just go back to using, that I don't get his beef with buprenorphine. That's one thing about Suboxone or bupe-- it lowers the tolerance of the typical addict-- sometimes significantly-- so if they don't want to take it, all they have to do is go back to where they started. Instead they hate where they are, but won't do anything to move forward or backward. I've met people over the years that are simply incapable of being grateful for anything.... and that's my impression of 'five years'. The nicer you all became, the more he acted like a jerk.

We got a good group of people here. But that one simple rule-- to be decent to each other-- is too much to ask for some people.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:25 pm 
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An apologie from All Apologies..?...its all good 13!..
raz..

and that musta been some e-mail Doc!!..


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 1:14 am 
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5 years,

Do you want me to cancel your account with us? Subsux.com may be a more suitable fit for your point of view.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 10:36 pm 
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So 5 years has lost so much weight that he is down to just over 100# and it's all subs fault? I on the other hand have gained 35 pounds above my using weight (now at 165) and I'm positive it's indirectly due to sub as well. So it makes some people lose weight and others gain? Sounds like global warming. "Temp are rising - it's due to global warming" then this year with some of the coldest temps in a long time - that too is due to global warming.

I think it's time we all just get honest here and call a spade a spade - it's George Bush' fault! :lol:

BTW great first response Lizzie - don't ever apologize for well written comments like that.

Don


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2014 11:04 pm 
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thanks donh,I just didn't want this new member to think I was trying to be mean to him in his " hour of need" but it quickly became apparent my words fell on deaf ears, and he was here only to start trouble.
the next day, while lurking at subsux,I saw him posting the same garbage, and even their members told him the same things we said,so, hope he gets help somewhere.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 6:32 am 
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I'm with you Donh. I was severely malnourished and weighed way less than
I should of, to the tune of about 80lbs in my active addiction.

Since getting on maintenance over a decade ago, I am at an almost ideal, comfortable, healthy weight for me; perhaps a little over my ultimate desired weight but I'll take that over the walking corpse I used to be in active addiction. After more than that decade on maintenance, I have had nothing but positive experiences all around and normalization of my life and mindset, with zero signs of 'buprenorphine turning on me,' as is the argument of most of the anti-buprenorphine folks who see ultimate disaster as a given with the use of buprenorphine long-term.

That thinking/logic is totally the polar-opposite of my experience and the experiences of the multitude of patients I deal with who have made the decision to keep their addiction in remission long-term to indefinitely with long acting opioids approved for the treatment of opioid dependence (methadone and more frequently these days, buprenorphine.)

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 12:07 pm 
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I know there was a thread where some people were happy to finally honestly discuss their negative reactions to bupe and the downsides of treatment without having the entire thread swayed pro-sub, and people talked about how it's disappointing to just hear "but that's never happened to me I don't know what you're talking about". There was a certain context in which this was said that would take too long to explain, and I empathize.

But the fact of the matter is, strictly pertaining to my experience, I've never felt like that. Like it was turning on me or like my emotions were numbed, because if this is what numbed is for me, maybe that's not terrible. I've felt deep disappointment and anger and excitement and anxiety and sadness since I started sub, but as much as anyone else and when it was appropriate to feel that way as a reaction. I want to wean off sub one day and I don't really believe what I'm about to say but sometimes the thought just occurs to me that with my personality and brain chemistry maybe I was never meant to live that normally, by that I mean that fully feeling to the full extent or everything. I don't have bipolar or borderline personality disorder or anything like that (and I've been evaluated extensively) but it's something people with those psychiatric issues deal with. And I started feeling way more when I switched from my DOC to sub. That's just my experience and my take on the emotional affect thing.
I've also heard ppl get angry (usually not the same people who were concerned with the emotion stuff) about how it seemed their sub stopped working after however long. I don't identify with that either, I've been on 2 years almost with no break and it's the same, no cravings on the average day, no trying to get high on pills. I feel really lucky though that things are just as manageable, with the exception of things in life that have nothing to do with sub. I totally believe that some people have problems with it that may not just be psychological but were all gonna use oneself as an example of what to think about this med.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2014 4:08 am 
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FiveYearsOnSubox wrote:
" But, you need to realize that coming here and bashing Suboxone and Dr. J is not going to help you. " I'm not trying to help ME, I'm trying to help YOU! I know exactly what section I posted in, and I'm trying to warn you all of the dangers of this stuff. Go talk to people who have been on it long term, after the "honeymoon phase" wears off and you have no motivation, no drive, no spark, no appetite, no libido, endocrine disorders, and do nothing but stay in a darkened room all day unable to work.
.

Bupe does have side effects and some are unpleasant but all those things you listed aside from loss of libido are not true. You are describing the effects of depression bud not anything to do with buprenoprhine. If you sit on your ass in your moms basement all day and expect that by just putting a sub under your tongue everyday that its going to magically make your life awesome than you are sorely mistaken. Oh and any legit gripe you may have about bupe side effects (I haven't read one yet) most if not all of us already knew about the pro's and cons before we signed on for sub because we did a little thing called research. In this day and age with google right at our fingertips there is no excuse to not research a life altering decision like this and you know whats funny too I bet if the doctor gave you a list detailing every possible side effect that could occur you would of still taken it to stop your withdrawal symptoms.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2014 3:40 pm 
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donh wrote:
So 5 years has lost so much weight that he is down to just over 100# and it's all subs fault? I on the other hand have gained 35 pounds above my using weight (now at 165) and I'm positive it's indirectly due to sub as well. So it makes some people lose weight and others gain? Sounds like global warming. "Temp are rising - it's due to global warming" then this year with some of the coldest temps in a long time - that too is due to global warming.

I think it's time we all just get honest here and call a spade a spade - it's George Bush' fault! :lol:

BTW great first response Lizzie - don't ever apologize for well written comments like that.

Don


I crave certain foods with on Subs and have a really big appetite. So i don't know why it kills your appetite. Maybe it's because you take it for a buzz. I remember when i was doing 30s i wouldn't be hungry.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:56 am 
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Seems like if you have any sort of ailment or sickness, there's someone who will blame it all on Suboxone.

It's not spending 2-3 years shooting heroin into their veins, likely with dirty needles....
It's not pawning everything you own to buy another gram..or handful of pills...
It's not associating with drug dealers and suddenly becoming a target by police for being in places they know are high-drug areas..

Nope..none of that. It's several years later, when while on Suboxone, you suddenly come up with hepatitis.. unrelated to using dirty needles. Also, unrelated, is having to start over financially and buying things you already owned, but sold for pennies on the dollar for the next fix...and now, the Suboxone doctor and cost of medication, along with having to buy your life back .. those are all out to get you.
And lastly, being pulled over every time you leave your house, because you lived in your drug dealer's driveway for 3 years..and now they have caught on to you and they've never heard anyone say "I don't do drugs, it's not mine...I was just going to meet a friend"...

Past drug addiction usually causes undesired effects long into the future, even after it's well over and done with. I dealt with acquiring a felony conviction after I had been clean for 3 years...the closest I came to slipping the entire time I've been in treatment...
To do what I did to get cleaned up, and spend 36 months doing it...then suddenly have a family member take me to court and slap a felony on me that will haunt me for the rest of my life...it really put a strain on my determination to stay clean and sober...but I did it... because no matter what, I never need to go back to the person I was before.
Many of us here have stories much worse. Some people think their don't have a story bad enough to be deserving of Suboxone...but you story just doesn't jive, "5 years on sub".

Some posts you can read and feel a true sorrow for the person, as it's apparent they are in a tough spot and are truly regretful for their life's choices. That's not in this story... This story is one of anger and irrational thinking, and blaming an inanimate object for causing misery and grief. I've asked my Suboxone films, "do you hate me"...but they never do answer...so I find it quite difficult to believe that your Suboxone has a mind and mentality all it's own, and was just created specifically to deal you a shitty hand in life.

I guess I can consider myself trolled, but reading post #1 really insults those of us here who know the dangers of abusing Suboxone, but choose to use it as a tool, instead of using it as ammunition in the arsenal of drugs that leads to getting high.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 4:33 pm 
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Razor53 is 100% correct in the points he outlined.
I too see a doctor who has seen the true success of Suboxone, and as a result, he truly views himself as my Suboxone 'advocate' of sorts. He advocates for my recovery and therefore, he is there as a partner and to continue to assist me in my efforts of leading a clean life.

My doctor is fantastic. As Razor53 mentioned, there are some doctors who will advocate the 'Suboxone for Life' choice and some doctors who actually have a strict regimen in which they decide when & for how long each patient will be on it.
All I can do is speak for myself when I say that I am truly thankful for him and his outlook on the recovery process, as it relates to Suboxone.
My doctor and I usually always have a conversation when I go in for my refill script & we just chat about the success of the maintenance and what some of his patients are experiencing. Hazelden Addiction Treatment Center, one of the most renowned and respected institutions, just as of recently have allowed the use of Suboxone in their facility. I read that it's already had and continuing to have a major impact on the patients who would normally have come back or have come back more than once in terms of opiate addiction; less deaths and almost no overdose in addition to that.
He told me that Suboxone is currently the 25th most prescribed brand name drug on the market, which did not seem very high to me, but he let me know its’ extremely rare for a drug like Suboxone to be at #25 and that it was a testament to its growing popularity. Again that is only for brand name drugs. Reckitt Benckiser Pharmaceuticals only had an exclusivity with the drug for what he believed was approx. 6 years; other companies are currently developing their generic versions. Should be interesting to see just what this does in terms of pharmacies, insurance, etc.

It is my choice how long I stay on Suboxone and I like that I am in the driver’s seat. And let's be honest, most of us haven't felt in control while we were in the middle of active addiction...the hopelessness is completely gone for me. I have to do a UA every time I make an office visit and the only way I can keep in “good” with him is if I don't lie to him. He was very clear with me from the beginning. He only prescribes Suboxone for those who are currently in treatment or about to start treatment...and obviously for those patients who stay on it after they have graduated.
He explained that the only way anyone has ever died from Suboxone is when they used it in conjunction with benzodiazepines. (Xanax primarily).

Bottom line: addiction is a lifelong disease, just like alcoholism. Just because somebody who has an alcohol issue has been dry for years doesn't mean that they don't still have a desire to drink. It's different for everybody, but we all have to work to make our lives how we want them to be. And Suboxone has been amazing for me in that process.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 29, 2014 10:31 pm 
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I plan on being a bupe for life. I have chronic pain so my options are this or back to the endless battle with opioid abuse. I am only23 but I was first prescribed perks when I was 17 and from them on I went higher and higher. No I never shot up at used H but using 4 perk 30s or 2 Oxy 80s a day was taking a toll on my body. At 5`4 and 95lbs I looked like skeleton. I've been on 8mg of bupe 2 times a day for almost 3 years and I am now 115lbs and look better than I ever have. Fact my dad and I have super fast metabolisms but still pills were killing me and this med brought me back to life. I have beautiful daughter and a fantastic husband and honestly if I didn't have this med I don't know what I would be. So I am sorry your experience with this has been horrible I know a family member of mine tried talking me out of getting on it but that is only because he has been on it for many more years and he doesn't have chronic pain .. he just can't stop. Maybe u should try taking less of a dose that's might help


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