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 Post subject: Starter dose and when
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 5:59 am 
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I work 3rd shift and get up every day about 5pm. By the time it hits 8pm i've already had a shower,full meal and headed off to work. I usually dose right before or on my way too work so anywhere between 8pm-9pm. So i take all mine at once instead of spreading them out and then what i'll do is through out the whole night/morn at work i wont eat or drink anything but water even skipping lunch because for me eating just kills it and then when i get home from work around 8am i will then eat breakfast, watch tv for an hour or 2 while i get a mellow comedown and then hit the sack. then REPEAT.

I know alot of people who wont go near sub because their first experience wasnt good either due to not waiting long enough or just not doing enough period.

So yet another round of classic questions, Whats the best dose to start at ? How long to wait since my last dose ? I see alot of "wait 24 hours" so does that mean 24 hours since last dose or 24 hours into WD ? Say i have a "normal monday" where i dose at 9pm, do i just do the first sub dose the next time at 9pm ?

Things to know,

I have been on this routine now EVERY day for almost 10 years. Even on my days off no matter if i wake up at noon i will wait till night to dose.

As i previously said, i take all my pills at once and just forge through the night instead of spreading out a few pills here and there over a long period.

I started out 10 years ago with a single dose of 2 10mg Hydros. now im up too about 80mg single dose. Sometimes im able to switch to 80mgs of Oxycodone or 60mg of Methadone several nights a month but 75% of the time its Hydocodone.

I DO NOT seek that dozing off falling over in my chair type of buzz. For the most part i just have to be able to function, do my job and have my sanity all in one.

I am a bigger guy 6'1 280 pounds and have a low activity level. all i do at work is sit and push buttons,write on a clipboard and do a lot of typing but i do make an effort to get up and walk around as much as possible.

By the time i get home from work i still feel pretty good. I know alot of people that think hydros only last a few hours and as far as it having like a 4 hour half-life that may be true but if you fill your stomach up before you dose and stay away from food they will last longer if you just give them a chance.

Please spare me the "you dont really take that much you should just go cold turkey". I just want my questions answered.

I've always heard theres no difference between the strips and pills weather their the 4mg or 8mg depending the time of the month i can probably get whichever so if theres a reason to prefer one of the other then please tell.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 10:21 am 
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Most ppl wait 24-36 hours after their last dose of opiates. I know u said u pretty much take hydrocodone 80mg, I didn't go on suboxone because of hydro so I can't for sure tell u how long to wait. But imo I'd wait at least 24. There's a sheet that doctors score ur withdrawal symptoms, it's called COWS, I think u need to score about a 25....not sure because my induction was done in my sub Dr's office, I definitely didn't attempt it myself. But I think u can find the COWS online so Google it and score urself during ur withdrawal.

If ur planning on taking suboxone, do not go near methadone. Methadone stays in ur system much longer than normal opiates.

Do u know what dose of sub ur going to start with? Just make sure u stick to a dose that covers ur tolerance and cravings, but not so high that you'll get sick. It's tricky doing an induction alone.

Good luck!

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:33 am 
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I do remember the COWS recommending 12-24 hours on short acting opioids but i would think that since i have been taking them every day for 10 years compared to someone that had only been at it for a couple of months that maybe it would take me just a little bit longer to feel WD since i would have so much built up in my system over the years. I dont know if after long periods of time ones fat cells would start building up retention towards it. Kind of like when someone ask me how long it takes for such and such drug to get out of your system due to drug screen and i have always said "Depends how long you have been doing it. Someone whos been smoking weed for 2 days compared to someone thats been doing it for 2 years will take less time to pass a drug screen." I know its a whole different system in play here but it sounds like it would make sense right ? I mean even if i was at 36 hours i would still be pretty damn nervous and also since i rotate my meds through out the month i know timing is more key then normal. I may take Hydros for a week straight and then do Roxys for a couple days and then back to Hydros another week and then methadone for few days and just a never ending cycle of slow destruction.. so my WD could come into play slower/faster depending which opioid i had been taking the previous days. and YES i know to stay away from methadone when switching to subs. Last time i was in WD was few months back, on a sat night i had only taken about half of my usual dose and then sunday i was out of meds so i got $40 of H and snorted it which just seem like a teaser felt like shit all night mad as fuck (Here they cut that shit like a turkey) so its hard telling what i even got in my sys all but by monday afternoon i couldnt even drink a sip of water without going to the bathroom.Was horrible. Im not sure what dose to start at i guess it depends what i hear from here and a bit of self knowledge


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:43 am 
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If ur only coming off 80mg of hydro, try it like my dr did with me.....

Take 2mg and wait 30 minutes
Take 2mg and wait 30 minutes
And so on til u feel like ur withdrawal symptoms are gone.

I dosed up to 8mg the first day then the second day started my regularly prescribed dose of 16mg. I was coming off oxycodone 150mg a day though so I don't recommend that dose for u, just explaining how the dosing went during my induction.

The key is to get a dose that takes away ur withdrawal and takes away ur cravings. Don't go to high or you'll get sick. See how 4-8mg works for u.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 12:09 pm 
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Actually I've been thinking about it and since you've been using for 10 yrs and u also take other things like H and methadone at times along with ur normal 80mg mostly, I'm not sure what dose would be best....4mg may be to low. Maybe someone else could also help with a dose recommendation because I'd hate to tell u to low or to high. But imo the best way to determine ur dose would be to just dose slowly at 2mg at a time every 30 minutes until u feel better. That way ur listening to ur body because that's actually the best way to tell. No one can tell u 100% without fully knowing ur tolerance.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 1:22 pm 
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Hey Joel,
Jenns givin you really good advice and a good induction plan. I wouldn't get to hung up on just how loug you ve been taking opiate s. Its really all about tolerance and as you have said if your at around 80mgs a day then imo you have a moderate tolerance.
If it were me id wait till your weekend begins. And id also pull back on your daily dosing if you can. Say 70mgs , then 60mgs and so forth, for a few days. Then when stopping , a waiting period of 24/30 hours should be enough time to start induction with little fear of PW's.

I like Jens numbers also. Starting at 2mgs then 2 more. I did the same and within a short time any wd was gone . I had a low tolerance when i inducted too. Less then 100mgs.
You should be fine Joel.

Oh and im a big fan of the films. There easy to divide when needed and the absorbtion is quick. Lets know whats happening and when. Good luck.

Razor.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:16 am 
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Welcome,

Please look up the COWS worksheet and be honest with yourself on the scoring. If you take suboxone too soon you will go into PW and they are HELL and even if you were to take your DOC afterwards it won't end the Precipitated Withdrawels.

As for what should be your starting dose, start at 1-2mg and move up giving about 45 minutes between each dose to see at what dosage you start to feel better at. Suboxone is a very strong drug and it doesn't work how other ones do, there is a ceiling so you can't continue to take more and more and get better results. The lower the dose you get stable on the less side affects it will have (such as sweating, anxiety, head aches and constipation). I have been a heroin addict for 10 years and was injecting about 1.5 gram to 2 grams a day and I didn't need more than 8 mg. I then very easily got down to 4mg with little discomfort after a month of sobriety and am continueing to lower my dose (9 months sober now).


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