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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 10:13 am 
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...but, I keep telling myself that I can't.

I'm sure that it didn't help that I stayed up until 1am reading "Pill Head." My purpose for reading the book was a good one. I wanted to see how much I could relate. Am I really completely an addict? That question often dogs me. Any definitive pronouncement that I make in admitting that I am, is challenged regularly by my thinking and then the doubts return.

When I read, "This is what I've been waiting for my whole life. Three Vicodin. That was all it took. I was in love," I couldn't believe that my first opiate experience was in print... by someone else. My gut quivered and knotted and I shook. I was probably drooling, though I think that I wiped at my nose. I should have returned the book to the library shelf that very moment. But, I didn't.

Ohhh.... I remember that first day when all it took was three hydros! And that's what attaches to my brain and makes me unable to get the thought of using out of my mind. I have to force myself to remember that within two months, I was scamming and stealing because I progressed to ingesting 110mg of oxy at a time and, frustratingly, was not able to get high.

It sucks that I metabolize opiates and build a tolerance as quickly as I do. Although I never want to want to use, I often feel that life's been unfair. I shouldn't have this much of a problem with opiates after such a short period of abusing them.

But, it is what it is. So, I have to remind myself that I don't want to become a liar and a thief again.

It's just that I miss the feeling SO MUCH sometimes.

I've been on about 3mg a day of Sub for the past few weeks. I alternate days: 4mg and then 2mg which averages out to 3mg a day. I looked at the calendar this morning, hoping that I had taken only 2mg yesterday. Hmmmm... maybe that's part of why I'm obsessing like I am. But, I took 4mg yesterday. Today, I get only a quarter of a tab.

I want to take a whole tab, just to see if the extra bupe would sate some of the need to disconnect. Of course, Josh (the author of Pill Head) abused Suboxone in rehab. I was freakin' jealous of him last night. I never really felt high from my Suboxone. But.... my thoughts keep wondering: "Am I just enough below the threshhold that a boost in the amount of Sub would bring some relief of this obsession?".

I don't know if I think that typing this will help get some of this out of my system. I went to a morning AA meeting, hoping that would happen, but I feel just as fixated as I did before going.

What I would give to have a normal brain that never screamed to get high!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 10:24 am 
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Hi Christin,

I'm sorry you're having such a rough time right now. It's my understanding that at your dose you're right around the ceiling. This might account for the reason you're having cravings. It might be worth considering raising your dosage (of course with your doctor) to 5-6 mg. That might help. Stopping the cravings is one of the biggest benefits of suboxone, so it occurs to me that you're only getting partial benefit from being on suboxone. Granted, some people don't have cravings at 3-4 mg, but there are just as many people who do. (4 mg is largely considered to be at or around the ceiling.)

You mentioned how when you are thinking about getting high you're trying to force yourself to remember what happens to you when you are using. I think that's very smart of you. I think 12-step programs refer to that as something like "playing the tape all the way through". In other words think of EVERYTHING that happens when you use, not just the "feeling' but also the consequences. So like I said, I think you're smart to do this.

Hang in there and please keep us posted.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 12:40 pm 
Hey Christin,

I am so glad you posted this. I think ALL of us addicts feel this way from time to time. I know I have.

But now, since I have been on 8 mg of sub daily, this type of thinking goes away pretty fast for me. The last time I felt this way was about a month ago. So I did some laundry, posted a bit about it, talked about it at my relapse prevention place, and totally forgot about it. (Until now when you brought it up!) So because of this, I wonder if your dose is just a bit too low. I mean this is just my experience ya know? I am no sub doc. I just dont have powerful thoughts about using anymore. They are just fleeting now, in and out of my brain.

I have also made some other changes in my life. You kinda remined me of this Christin.....I don't read books like that anymore. I used to LOVE reading shit like that. And watching the drug movies.....I just don't do it anymore (4 whole months LOL) I guess I am kinda scared that they would make me feel just like you did. I also used to LOVE listening to my hard rock station in the car. Now, it all kinda sounds like doom and gloom to me ya know? So I just started listening to news raido or some more up beat shit. It kinda works dude! ( I still play my Disturbed CD though......"Down With the Sickness" is the best song on earth!)

I think you are doing the right thing by talking about it and trying to use some AA techinques to get through it. Talking to your doc cant hurt either.

Are you on that dose of sub because you can't afford more? Or are you just trying to wean down? I would love to know as I am going to go down to 6mg this month. I think 8mg is not necessary for me.

So please post again. I would love to hear from you! Kire


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 5:07 pm 
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I think Kire's right, we ALL experience what you're talking about.....I too used to love reading about drugs, watching movies with drug use, and also listening to songs with references to drugs.....but you know what? watching movies and so on that had really accurate accounts of the WORST parts of addiction really helped me...watching the later episodes of The Sopranos for instance, where one of the characters was having a relapse--it just showed some of the ugliest and accurate portrayals of an addict using and addict being high. I'm not recommending anyone to seek out more shows or books with using in 'em but I just wanted to share that for me, the ones that show accurate portrayals of the ugliest parts actually seems to be able to make me feel disgusted about the idea of using instead of making me want to use. Trainspotters was one movie and also the movie about Jim Carroll's early life (I forget the name of that movie). Again, I'm not recommending, it's just that those did it for me--showed the worst most ugly and most un-fun parts of using heroin--and not just withdrawals--the ugly parts of using....

Other than that, Christin, I too have struggled with my sub dose and I wish I could get high on it, I have the same thoughts about trying to get below the ceiling or even stopping sub for a while ....so...you're not alone and you sound like you're doing WELL with it--I know it's hard, incredibly hard...and it's hard to just wait for it to get easier, I know. But with time it really really should get better....Aren't you about 1 year off drugs? (sorry if I've got it wrong). Well, the first year has GOT to be the hardest, so it really should start getting some easier for you, regarding cravings. Meanwhile, well, I guess we just have to do the best we can to distract ourselves when we're in the middle of the obsessive thoughts. And I too think Hatmaker has a good point, maybe you should talk to your doctor about your dosage. For me, I think it's probably essential that I stay above the ceiling level, at least for now.

Anyway, I wish you luck, I hope you start feeling better soon....distraction.....getting involved in something that takes your concentration--I know that can help. I wish I could be of more help. But Christin...you are an inspiration to me becasue you are fighting so hard and...winning too. Thanks for posting.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 7:30 pm 
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Thanks for the replies and the encouragement and, yes, autononymous, I’ve been on Suboxone for a little over a year (July 30 was 1year). Until this past Spring, I was on 16mg. I was amazed by how well it took care of the cravings. Since tapering this spring, I’ve had a few “relapses,” two on alcohol and one on trams & flexeril. This is better than my first try at Sub, which was 6 months earlier. I was started on 12mg and began tapering right away. I can’t say that I recall having more than a few days without cravings. Within two months, I had relapsed back onto oxy.

Although my current doctor doesn’t advertise a 90-day treatment plan, he doesn’t believe in keeping people on Sub for “a long period of time” either. (He sees that as switching one addiction for another). So, I’ve been tapering since April. Although I ideally would like to get off Sub, it seems that every time I get below 4mg, the “fleeting thoughts” of using become obsessive and I start to feel desperate. Maybe you all know what I mean when I say that the thoughts are like thinking about how much you need to breathe when someone’s trying to suffocate you.

Today, I caved and took a full 8mg tablet. I haven’t taken that much at one time in a few months. But, part of me thinks that it was the right thing to do. After all, afterward, I knew that I was blocked, no question about it. Of course, I also knew that, deep down, I was hoping that I would feel something from the extra milligrams, even though I really knew that wasn’t possible.

I appreciate all the replies and what you’ve shared. I’ve been feeling fairly level-headed this afternoon and evening. I hope to return to my 4mg/2mg/4mg/2mg schedule tomorrow, though I don’t want to push too hard because evan as okay as I feel right now, it’s almost as though I have an ominous cloud above me, just waiting for me to become vulnerable so that it can rain down a storm that will drown me.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:04 pm 
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christin wrote:
Maybe you all know what I mean when I say that the thoughts are like thinking about how much you need to breathe when someone’s trying to suffocate you


Christin,

You express the feeling so well! I am going to put my personal opinion out there for just a moment and you can take it or leave it (I won't be offended either way). I disagree with your doctor's philosophy on trading one drug for another with suboxone. I do not think of suboxone like this at all. I am taking a drug in order to remain in remission from addiction and without this drug, my disease of addiction will return full force. The "trading" philosophy suggests there is a choice. You accurately equate a craving as being suffocated of oxygen. A necessity for life. What choice is there in that? You aren't imagining that sensation. It isn't in your head. It isn't because you have some character defect that makes you think of it that way. It is chemical and biological and likely genetic.

Are there people who are able to maintain a remission long term without suboxone? Yes. Some. But it isn't easy and all people can't be expected to do that in 90 days or even a year of trying. Suboxone is a tool to get you there. Someone with diabetes might be able to enter remission without insulin eventually. But that takes time and effort and skill and knowledge in order to re-learn behaviors and foods and exercise, etc. Doctors don't say "well let me give you some insulin for 90 days and then you need to be off of it because you are just taking (trading) insulin in exchange for calorie reduction. No. They are given the insulin and counseled on how to reduce the severity and possibly on how to enter a remission. If the patient does this then great. If they do not then they keep prescribing the insulin.

I know some people don't like to equate addiction with diabetics, etc. But I think it makes the point well and I just think you have a medical condition. A doctor needs to treat it and you in whatever way is the most likely to be healthy for you and the most likely to result in success. You walking around feeling like you need air all the time is bound to result in a relapse despite your best intentions and best efforts. Not to say you can't do this because it is possible that you can. I wouldn't want to place limits on anyone. I also think that these expectations are quite high and not everyone can live up to them so easily. I encourage you to do whatever you think is most likely to keep you from relapsing and if for a while that means you need to take a higher dose of sub or get a different doctor and take this slowly, then this doesn't mean there is something wrong with your character. It means you just need more time and if that is what you need then you should take it without feeling guilty and without feeling like a failure. It would be a balanced choice. A solid choice. A healthy choice. Either way.

Cherie

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:10 pm 
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One of the great things about "the program" or any type of recovery that involves changing the inside is that I've gotten to know myself. I know my strengths and shortcomings, I know my limitations. I am approaching 7 years sober, with the help of suboxone, and I still get those thoughts. I still remember the high and still miss it sometimes. On 24 mg of sub or 3 mg I am still a drug addict. I think about coke, amp, heroin, ect... atleast once a week. I know if I was not on sub I would eventually give in. This is just who I am and something I will probably always deal with. Don't get me wrong, I don't have over powering cravings or thoughts but I always loved to get high from the time I was 13. What your feeling is completely normal. It's big of you to confess your thoughts. When you get some years in the program your the one people come to for answers and your the one who speaks at meeting when the lead doesn't show up so it's hard sometimes to talk about my cravings when people think I have it all figured out. Hatmaker mentioned "playing the tape through" and that's exactly what I try to do to this day. I think past the high and think of the jails, rehabs, and shady characters I'd have to be around. Don't fight the thoughts or let them get you down just remember to do the right thing when they come up. I've always said "any addict that says they don't think about using once in a while is lying" IMO anyway.

One more thing, I found it alot easier to take 3 mg a day than to split 2 and 4. It's easy with the 2 mg tabs. Give it a try, as much of a pain as it can be breaking pills in halves and quarters, I always adjusted faster that way when lowering.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:13 pm 
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Hi again christin - I hope you don't mind me saying this, but I think it's a damn shame that your doctor - someone who is treating your for addiction - doesn't seem to understand how your treatment works. Suboxone is hardly another addiction - a dependency, yes, but not an addiction.

I'm not saying you should stay on it long term - that's obviously your call. You know what you need better than anyone. But if you decide you're not quite ready to taper off you might want to think about getting a new doctor. It just seems like you're still struggling at low doses. Going off sub in that state of mind must be a bit scary.

Whatever you decide I wish you the very best.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 11:53 pm 
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I agree hatmaker, I was thinking the same thing but wasn't sure how to put it in words.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 9:50 am 
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hatmaker510 wrote:
...I think it's a damn shame that your doctor - someone who is treating your for addiction - doesn't seem to understand how your treatment works.
This seems to be the case of the doctors in my area. We only have three that prescribe, one is a cash only business and the other is never accepting patients because his patients all come through the hospital rehab (something I never did).

I've had two of these doctors and it seems to me that the only one who knows what he's doing is the one I've never had treat me.

Quote:
It just seems like you're still struggling at low doses. Going off sub in that state of mind must be a bit scary.
Yes, it is a lot scary and I get the impression that my doctor doesn't think that there's any physical component to my addiction anymore, at least not after being on Suboxone. At my last visit, he said,"After being on Suboxone for awhile the addiction is all psychological."

I don't think that I'll try to go under 4mg just yet and wait until my next visit when I'll ask to be prescribed the 2mg tab so that I can do as (I think that it was) Smoothy recommended... 3mg on all days. I've been doing 2/4/2/4 because it's far too hard to break an 8mg tab into 1mg doses. It's hard enough getting anywhere near an accurate 2mg dose.

I'm so glad that I'm feeling better today. At this morning's AA meeting, an addict shared about getting a Vicodin script last night. I shared that yesterday morning or the night before, I would have done almost anything (hell, anything) to get his script. He had said that he hadn't filled it but was thinking about it (because he legitimately has pain, though, after the meeting, he confessed that he's considering selling the pills).

Although there definitely is still a pull, an interest that I don't want to have, at least I'm not fighting that desperation that sucks me in so deep that the "tools" that I've been told to use seem impossibly out of my reach. I much prefer being in a place where I'm able to be around a guy thinking of filling and selling his script and tell him that if he does, I'd rather not know.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 2:27 pm 
Hi Christin, I just got back from vacation so I'm reading this thread for the first time. I hope you're doing OK. I know what it's like to have an obsession to use, and it's not pretty. Honestly, I wouldn't try to get the 2mg tabs from the doc. I would try to convince him that you need to stay on 4mg or above. That way you will be at the ceiling level and it should help your cravings. A responsible doctor shouldn't force you to reduce your dose when you are in danger of a relapse! Keep us posted on how you're doing.
Lilly


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 3:45 pm 
I agree with Lilly! Print out some articles here that Dr Junig wrote about addiction. Speak with your doctor in a calm professional way. Tell him how you are feeling. Maybe you will teach him something!!!

Smoochy and Jack- I love what you guys wrote... Honestly, I love reading what everybody writes on here and how they support eachother.

So thank you all. I got some support from all of you!!! Kire


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:41 pm 
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I've been back several times and have read the posts on this thread and on some others. I've had another rough week, but I think that yesterday was the beginning of an upward swing finally!

I've been steady on the 4mg and surprised (well, more like shocked shitless) that I wasn't really feeling any better, psychologically that is. I've been making stupid errors at work because my freakin' brain has been in the cubicle of the woman who's off work with her bad back (hmmm... did she leave anything behind???)

Once I finally dragged my mind out of there, it would be scheming about going to the ER and telling the doc that I'm between primaries but that my herniated discs are killing me (yes, they can hurt but they aren't actually KILLING me right now). No sooner had I corrected the errors that I made with that brain wandering and my thoughts travelled to the recesses of my father's kitchen cupboards (there just HAS to be a couple of bottles of Vicodin that he's forgotten about). Then, Wednesday night, I got online here, read some posts, and poured my heart out to you guys... only to screw that up too. I deleted the entire post and then deleted the post saying that I had written one and deleted it. :x

The anxiety and subsequent irritability on Monday night almost did me in. After work, I started searching my house, even though I know that I've had nothing here for over a year. I did find a straw that had been cut short. A dusting of white powder lined the inside. Was it oxy or was it from when I snorted the Sub? The straw was pink, so I figured that even Sub dust would appear white. I cut the straw and licked it, not that it would effect anything. I just wanted to know, oxy or sub? I was sure that it was oxy or was that just wishful thinking? Wishful??? Why would that be wishfull??? I corrected myself.

I was really afraid that the obsession was going to win. This time it didn't. My sponsor is confused as to why I still have such struggles. Her sponsor has suggested that the Suboxone might be a "God blocker" and that until someone is completely off replacements, the steps that they do are merely "going through the motions." My sponsor assures me that she's just relaying the comment and that she's not making any recommendations or suggestions to stop the Suboxone. But, she asked if I still felt that I would use if I were to come off the Sub.

:( I had to tell her that I think that I would. With the way that I was chomping at the bit this past week, I know that I would. I realize that there are people who quit without any replacements. I wish that I could grasp how they are able to do it. But, I can't, not yet anyway.

My doctor prescribed 2mg tablets this week (they're so little and cute!), not to lower my dose but so that I could take them throughout the day without having to cut the tablets. He seems to think that's the best way to take Sub, throughout the day, not in one dose.

I'm exhausted. Time for bed. Sweet dreams to all!


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 7:16 am 
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Christin, I'm sorry to hear you're still fighting with yourself on this issue. I know it must be hard (to say the least). I can't help but wonder if you need to be on more than 4 mg. Most people consider 4 mg right around the ceiling. The idea of being solidly at or above the ceiling is to do away with the cravings. Perhaps you should try 5 or 6 mg? Maybe 4 mg for you isn't quite at the ceiling. Just a thought that came to me from reading your post(s).

I'm impressed that you came to us and used this forum to talk about how you're feeling. Way to use your support system! Keep doing that, keep letting us know how you are. I'll be thinking of you.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 2:52 pm 
Christin, I know what it feels like to have an obsession to use, as do most of us here, and it's harsh. I, too, had a strong obsession to use while on Sub, it didn't remove my cravings as it does for many people. I did find that raising my dose alleviated it somewhat. Also, trying not to be alone with your obsession is helpful. Spend as much time as you can with people who aren't using. It's not easy, and we're pulling for you.
As far as sub being a "God blocker", we've discussed that here before as well. Your sponser must seriously underestimate God! Hang in there and keep posting.
Lilly


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 5:44 pm 
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Thanks to everyone who keeps coming back to this thread.

Last night was a long night. Even though I didn't get to bed until late (or early this morning to be more accurate), I woke a few times wanting to use and, one time, actually thinking that I had and that I was desperately waiting for the euphoria to kick in. I think that I must have been half sleeping at that point because it took me a little bit of thinking to realize that I haven't been using and that nothing was going to happen. That aside, the last couple of days have been okay.

Of course, I'm tired today and I'm probably more sensitive than I usually would be. But, my husband just pissed me off so bad. I hate being made the bitch in my family, which is exactly how it comes across when he's "sorry" for "not thinking" before he has said something that makes me out to be the asshole. Damn it! He's the asshole who can't be around my son's girlfriend because of his sex addiction. Yet, to keep his anonymity, I don't say anything and he's allowed to "be sorry" when he makes a slip that makes things appear as though I'm being the bitch in not wanting her to attend functions with us.

I hate that my first response still is to want to use. Then, when I tell myself that I can't do that, I want to abuse my Sub. Then, when I remind myself that taking more Sub will only raise my levels and, therefore, block me further, I don't. Hell of a reason not to abuse the Sub, isn't it? Ironically, I don't ever get high on Sub and I know that I'd only get ticked off at myself if I took more. So, I don't abuse it.

That being said, times like these are definitely still a challenge not to get high.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 12:01 pm 
Hey Christin, don't be so hard on yourself. It's actually a good thing that you recognize the triggers that make you want to use. And as far as abusing your sub, I've been on it for 10 months now and I still have a compulsion to take extra when I'm stressed or want to get high. I told my doc about it at my last appointment and he said something that surprised me. He said it's not necessarily a bad thing to take a little extra when you feel this way. It satisfies the urge to take something while at the same time loading the receptors with more opiate blocking bupe which in turn makes it harder to actually relapse. I know there are those who disagree with this, because after all we're on Sub to recover from our desire to take a drug to change the way we feel. But I was reasssured that my doc felt that it wasn't hurting my recovery to take a little bit more when when I was in a bad place. He said it may only have a placebo effect if I'm above the ceiling anyway.
So the good news is you didn't relapse (it was only a dream). You're still here and you're still clean. Give yourself a pat on the back for a change!


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 06, 2010 1:20 pm 
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Lilly wrote:
Hey Christin, don't be so hard on yourself... Give yourself a pat on the back for a change!

Thanks, Lilly. It's funny. I've convey these same sentiments to others, as many do, but find it hard to accept them for myself. I don't think that I'm alone in that, though. Am I?

So often, I feel as though I'm just going through the motions of living and that the one thing that actually feels real about me, I can't do. That's not to say that I want to act on it. I just wish that I could feel that I'm a part of what is happening around me.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 10:53 am 
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I applaud you. I read the entire thread of your posts and it moved me. I hope you see this message because I'm about in that state you were in.(hope it's better) I have been on & off subs about 1 year. Multiple surgeries and an amputation of my left leg. I am so limited now that I get in a rut and want to feel that high. But I know the consequences and I struggle thru. I hope things have gotten better for you since those posts. If so, tell me how you did it. I feel like I am so weak. I'm terrified of wd's yet I wish I could feel that high. How incredibly childish of a 68 yr. old woman. Yes, i'm 68 and on subs . What a bummer. Then this darned amputation is so hard to adjust to. Wheelchair, electric scooter. I just say "f" it and stay in my bed, watch tv and be glad when it's time to take the subs. Christin, again, I applaud you. Because of you I am writing this. God bless you & help you thru this. love & hope, queenie


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:31 pm 
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((((queenie)))) My heart goes out to you. It has gotten better since I started this thread, though last night wasn't as good. Multiple stressors throughout the day led to anxiety and heart palpitations last night. I couldn't sleep. I had rushed taking my sub that morning. Had I not absorbed enough of the Suboxone? Was that why I was feeling panicky?? Those are the things that go through my mind on a night like last night.

When I went to bed, I knew that I should pray. I told my sponsor that I don't know why I didn't. Writing this to you right now, though, has given me a little insight. I didn't pray because I didn't want God to calm me. I want the peace and calm that my head remembers the oxys giving me. How I wish that my brain would recall the bad times that easily!

I tossed and turned ALL night. I can't even recall thinking much of the time. I just wanted. That's what consumed my night: wanting and anxiety. I finally slept three hours before having to get up. But, last night was the exception of late. My nighttimes have been better. I've been asking God to hold me and get me through the night without me polluting my mind with thoughts of how good it would be to feel high again. He's met me more than half way since I've been praying. I'm not going to pretend that everything has been wonderful. If you find some other posts, you will see that I've had my share of daytime struggles. But, this particular bedtime escape has improved remarkably for now (I've experienced too much to make blanket statements. Today is not tomorrow. I have no idea what tomorrow will bring).

Queenie, my mother would be 67 if she were alive. She passed away 4 years ago. I cared for her the last 9 months of her life. She was a diabetic on peritoneal dialysis. She had hoped that it would allow her to be independant, but it ended up that it was I who hooked her up and took her off her dialysis machine every day because she ended up with a non-healing amputation.

Several times each day, I cleaned her stump wound. I remember the phantom pain that she endured and the drugs that they gave her in the hospital which caused her to hallucinate and to become very agitated. She was one of those individuals with an extremely high pain threshold (when she was younger, she would take Tylenol to pass kidney stones. And, she had LOTS of kidney stones during her life, resulting in several lithotripsies and surgeries).

I thank God that my opiate addiction was not active at that time, though my mother was never taking a narcotic outside of the hospital. If my addiction had been active at that time, I'm afraid that I would have connived to get some prescribed to her. At least, that's what I did with my father's multiple myeloma.

I'm telling you all this because your post really touched my heart in a place that is very close to home. I applaud you for being on Suboxone at the age of 68!

Many times, I have feared that I will have to endure the humiliation of having pure white hair and being all wrinkled as I walk into a drug rehab pushing a walker and wearing two hearing aids. "Maybe the doctors will have pity on me when I'm 80+ and they'll just prescribe the little, old lady as much oxycodone as she needs." I've consoled myself. Then, I think about the isolation and the loneliness that active addiction brings. I think about my kids and my grandchild just born and the grandchildren yet to come.

Recovery is not easy and I can't begin to imagine how difficult it must be for someone in your situation. Please, please don't feel anything but proud about where you are with your addiction. You're not using. That's something that's absolutely awesome!


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

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