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 Post subject: Slipped Again...
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:59 pm 
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For those of you keeping count, I just had my 5th slip since coming off of Suboxone 2.5 years ago. I made it 9 days short of my 1 year clean anniversary.

A couple of weeks ago, I got very sick with some kind of nasty stomach bug from hell. For the first time in years and years and years, I was puking my guts out and being that sick triggers some kind of quasi wd in me. That first night was almost unbearable and I took 24mg of Codeine to help me feel better. It didn't really do much, but it worked better than the Advil I was taking. I ended up being sick for almost 6 days and took 24mg of Codeine at a time 5 more times. None of those uses of Codeine did anything for me in a high kinda way.

BUT, after I got to feeling better, I made the idiot decision to try taking 48mg of Codeine on three separate occasions to see if I could catch a buzz. I caught a tiny buzz each time. I knew I was headed for trouble, so I told my wife what I did and she took the Codeine and flushed it. That was 5 days ago.

I was bummed out by the whole situation and I know what I did was wrong, but it is what it is. Time to pick myself up and move forward......again.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 10:39 am 
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I appreciate your honesty, Romeo. When you started that "I lost my drugs" thread I had the strong feeling you were either thinking about using or using. We're addicts, and no matter how much drugs have hurt us we can always find a way to romanticize or get nostaligic about our former use. I recently went 3 days without Sub, and even though I wasn't in WD I was having drug fantasies that were right up there with sexual fantasies in their intensity (just being honest). For me, it's pretty easy not to pick up when I have bupe on my receptors. Without it, all bets are off and sobriety requires constant vigilance. I know you needed to step away from NA, but maybe connecting with other sober people would be a good idea, especially at this time of year. I'm glad you didn't get into a full blown relapse and you're still here.
much love,
Lilly


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 11:30 am 
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Hang in there romeo, dont beat your self up over it, stand up brush yourself off and move on with your sobriety


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:41 pm 
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[font=Comic Sans MS]Romeo....What to say.... You certainly don't need a lecture, though some people cannot help themselves,
so you may get a few on here. I'm not going to be one to give you one.

I agree wholeheartedly with LILLYVAL...I really do. I was thinking the same thing about that thread you
started. While it's funny sometimes, it was NEVER on my mind. I kinda wondered for a second, what made
you think of that. Or what triggered that thought in you.....Now we know. No big deal, this time, but it always can be.

You recognized the dangers of where you were headed, and got the hell out of dodge, before the devil sunk
his claws in deep. Good for you! Maybe just be a little more vigilant, like Lily said, for a while....We are always
here if you need us. You know that! So take care ya knuckle head!!!! Be good to your self, and don't be too
hard on yourself either. You did the right thing by telling on yourself and coming here for support. Keep moving
forward! Take Care~[/font]

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 Post subject: Rome
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:29 pm 
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hey Rome, You are so lucky to have a wife that is so supportive and that you feel comfortable going to. Says a lot about The Mrs. Romeo. Glad you felt secure enough to come on here and be honest. You are only human and we humans can screw up from time to time. Pick yourself up and dust yourself off. You are so good at catching yourself these days. Proud of you. Have a great Holiday season.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 6:17 pm 
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Romes,

Totally agree with Sweet 16 here.... It's great you came here and were honest with us, but more importantly, it's great that you were honest with YOU!

Yeah, were all human, addicts or not and we've ALL done things we're not proud of... before our addictions, during and after treatment. Those of us still treating with suboxone have NO idea what will happen to any of us once we're off the medication, and more than a few of us are almost guaranteed to slip up from time to time.

It's so freaking awesome that you have such an understanding wife. I'm glad she flushed the shit, but that's an incredible relationship when two people can be that honest and that trusting in one another.

You've got this under control or you wouldn't have told us, I'm not worried about that... what I do worry about is hearing stories about an ex-addict who craves that high again so badly that they accidently overdose trying to achieve it. You knew you weren't getting there, so you gave up and came clean with your wife.

You've given so much great advice to so many people here on the forum and never once have I ever felt that you would lie to make yourself look better or like you were somehow better than the next person. You came here, you told us what happened, and what's done is done... dust yourself off and jump back on the wagon dude! :lol:

Like Sweet said, she's proud of you, and so am I. It takes a lot of courage to admit when you've screwed up. You still have a lot of knowledge, and it's pretty damn awesome that in 2.5 years, you've only slipped up 5 times. Yeah, to someone who's never gone thru addiction in the way we have, may sound like a lot, but you were in active addiction for what, 25+ years? .....yeah, I'd say you're STILL doing great! Keep it up and keep on keepin on..... that's all you can do.



p.s. I didn't think your post about losing your drugs really had anything to do with this... but, maybe I'm wrong? I just thought it was pretty damn entertaining to read and only reminded me of how thankful I am that I don't have to worry anymore about where I left my pills or tear up the house looking everywhere for those few pills I stashed away for emergencies... LOL

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:57 pm 
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I've had the flu for days.. haven't been to work all week. I've been achy, cold, stuffed up, restless but exhausted. I feel like I'm DTing all over again. I will admit that yesterday I wish had something to take the edge off. Luckily I didn't have easy access to anything but if I had, I'm pretty sure I would have taken it. I'm past it right now but you're not alone. Don't beat yourself up. I think -some of us- get a little smarter with each slip. Eventually the idea is that you realize it's just not worth it for an hour or two of feeling ok.

Pat on the back for talking it out!!


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 12:33 am 
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WOW..........

can YOU feel the love????

:wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink:

Seriously,,,,
Just like YOU and WE always tell people, we can't change anything that happened in the ''past''

You did the right thing,,,, and YES we ARE addicts, it happens......

I was thinking,,
maybe this is just YOUR PATH
we all have one, and although your entire time OFF suboxone hasn't been COMPLETELY "slip-free"
It HAS been
HONEST
and that counts for a whole shit-ton............. (thats a WHOLE FREAKING BUNCH in case you didn't know!!)

so maybe this is how ROMEO stays outta the gutter,,,,,
this is YOUR PATH ,, your recovery and hey, at least your improving!!!!!

So, All I'm gonna say is,
you screwed up briefly, don't beat yourself up, most importantly :wink:

BUT,
don't forget about it, either.........ok?

And WHY is it that being SICK is like the WORST trigger for us opiate addicts???
it is me, too......... horrible, horrible cravings, EVEN ON suboxone!!
jjjjjeeeeeessshhhhhh I cant IMAGINE, not on suboxone!!!!

Dude, your stronger than you know, and your doing well :wink:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 3:58 am 
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Romes,

I'm sorry that you've had another slip, but I'm super happy that the slip didn't turn into a lapse and I'm glad that you have the character to admit it here. Wasn't it around this time last year that you had a reality check? It might be the season as much as the sickness that prompted the slip. We've all had bad things happen in life, and you certainly don't have to share what that might be for you, but is this normally a difficult time of year for you? If that's the case, maybe next year you could be ready with some kind of sobriety booster plan for the beginning of November. I would like to be able to promise that I will check in with you next November, but my memory isn't perfect (and it's getting less perfect as I get older! lol)

Your wife rocks! And she is your rock. It would be so easy for you to shut her out. It's one of your strengths that you let her in. As long as you keep the communication open with her, I feel very good about your long term sobriety. Everyone makes mistakes. :)

As your friend, I want you to know that I support you more than ever. But I also don't want to blow too much sunshine up your ass either, because I know that you can use too much positive support as a buffer against reality. My challenge to you, therefore, is that you really figure out what really triggered the slip. Was it feeling sick or does this time of year make you feel bad? What can you put in place to prevent the same outcome next time? How was it that codeine was available to you? Maybe it's not a great idea to have it in the house. At least not until you can get more than a year without slips under your belt. Do you think I'm being a little tough on you here? If so, good! I care way more about your recovery than I do about whether I annoy you here or there!

Keep strong! I'm always here for you.

Amy

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2012 11:50 am 
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Lillyval, I thought about hitting a few NA meetings, but truth be told, I couldn't put together 3 months of clean time while I was in NA. I tried NA for a year and slipped the whole way through that year. When I finally got out of NA, I put together almost a full year of clean time. Right now, I'm still very leary of me and NA. I know NA works for some people, but I just can't stand the constant barrage of bullshit I hear when I'm in meetings. I really wonder if it isn't just the meetings in the area I go. There are several different meetings, but most of the same people frequent the different meetings. Anyway, thank you for you concern and for your continued support!

mg113, thank you. I'm up, I've brushed myself off and I'm moving forward. Thanks for always being there for me.

Goinstrong, thanks for your support and thanks for not lecturing me :)!! I know I messed up, I know I did wrong, I know it was my fault. I'm trying to learn from what happened and use it to make me and my recovery stronger.

Sweet16, yes I am very lucky to have a wife like mine. She's very patient and understanding with me. She brings such stability to my life and that helps me immensely. Happy Holidays to you too!!!

Invis, thank you so much for that response. It is true that I spent just over 25 years in active addiction. I used drugs of one kind or another every single day for just over 25 years and it is pretty difficult to completely leave that lifestyle behind. A lot of days, I'm still shocked that I have ANY clean days. For so, so long I never thought I would EVER be clean, I had basically given up all hope of ever really being clean, so from that perspective, I am doing pretty damn good.....but I also know I can do better.

tinydancer, CONGRATULATIONS for not using while you were sick. I know how damn hard that must have been for you and my hat is off to you!! I think some of us get smarter with each slip too. Hmmm, after 5 slips, I should be up there with Einstein right about now!! :) Thanks for the support, it is appreciated and make sure you give yourself a pat on the back too!!

Amber, thank you for always being so supportive and honest with me. You're so right that I need to not beat myself up, but I also need to not forget what happened or give myself a free pass. I'm trying to balance those right now and it is a little bit tricky. I know me well enough to know that it'll take me a few days to be completley honest with myself about why I used and how it started, so that's where I'm at right now.

Amy, you bring up a good point....why was Codeine in the house. I've had that bottle of Codeine sitting on the kitchen island since I quit Suboxone. Damn thing had dust on it! I've never been able to catch a buzz off Codeine before and foolishly thought Codeine was "abuse proof" to me......fuck, I don't think chewing gum is abuse proof to me....it's just in my nature to abuse substances. I don't think the season has much to do with my slip, I love the holidays, but it's certainly something I need to think about a little more. Thanks for bringing it to my attention. Thanks for not blowing too much sunshine up my butt (LOL) and I don't think you were too tough on me, you did great. All of you at some point in time have caused me to stop and think about what I'm doing and as hard as that it is at times, it necessary.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 3:13 pm 
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Romeo, thanks for posting your experience. A lot of addicts could use situations like yours to use from. It is a great example of how as much as our spirits want to be done with opiates, we have to remember that our brains are separate from our consciousness (or... either, it's all the brain, but there are different parts of the brain that go their own way, and it's our struggle to use one part of our brain to control the other part of the brain). If you didn't post this, it would just be one less example of how there are lots of times in which people quit and appear to be clean for a long long time but just never tell anyone about their slips. Not on purpose per say, but just that it never comes up in conversation. So it's nice for everyone to know that Hey we are all human and no one is perfect.

Why do you think that you slipped up and turned to codeine? I mean, codeine isn't really a drug to abuse unless your addiction is in its infant stages. I mean, it's just a lil stronger than Tylenol. And codeine isn't prescribed to get rid of the flu. So, maybe do you think that after years and years of conditioning your brain, you have taught your brain that when it feels sickness (nausea, aches, tiredness, throwing up), that if it takes opiates, that it takes all of this away. But generally the sickness was from opiate sickness, not the flu. So whenever the brain feels these sicknesses, it tells your body to get some opiates to take it away. Like it can't tell the difference if you feel this way because of dope sick or because you have the flu. And so even a year after being sober, maybe it takes a while for the brain to catch up and re-condition? I just wonder because it's good to know why we slip up so that we all can plan ahead and be on the lookout for when they happen. I mean, your story has taught everyone enough -- if you have the flu, watch out because you might want opiates. But, I just mean, maybe this can be applied to other triggers too? That maybe, you can't just re-condition your brain in a couple months. It can take a year or longer? I mean I guess it would make sense... if you've been addicted for decades, it could take years to re-condition the brain. Well, I hope you don't feel guilty because codeine is like candy, there's like barely any opiates in it, it's not even really a slip up. Like you and everyone else said, you weren't trying to get high. Your brain got confused and you were just doing what it said to do. It's really hard to ignore what you're body is trying to say to you. I mean, we are hard-wired to do what it says. It's like a staring contest. It's really hard to not blink because they body is telling you "Blink! Blink! Blink!". And that's how addiction is too. You're a master at not listening to the body. You don't have a drug problem. Yeah, after you were done bein sick, you used it a few more times, but that's just your brain's old pathways opening up thinking that "Omg if you don't keep taking more of this stuff, you are going to get sick, remember? So you better go take some!!" just like how it makes your thirsty before you are actually dehydrated. It's OK -- you're strong mentally and very conscious about your brain and you realized what was going on and you stopped. As the years go by you'll have fewer and fewer slip-ups, and one day, your brain will finally be conditioned enough to forget about opiates. It might take a decade or so but you will feel real proud of yourself and know that you're real strong spiritually.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:02 pm 
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Rome-

I just saw this and wanted to shout out and say congrats for dusting yourself off and moving forward and being honest about the experience. I know that for me times of sickness are one of my biggest triggers because as an opioid addict I 'know the cure.' and if I'm sick it's 'legitimate to take.' You know the story and maybe it's partially true but as an opioid addict even using once to stiffle some cold/flu symptoms can lead me back into a real nightmare very quickly if I'm managing the situation myself for myself. Not to press the issue but as a pharmnerd I'm wondering how you managed to get such an odd mg of codeine, was it an OTC prep of some sort or a RX liquid?

Travis

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 Post subject: Well...............
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 6:35 pm 
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Romeo...........well you know what I could say here....if you recall your last relapse thread had to be locked because you almost OD'd and then did it again. Everyone came on here and said no problem little buddy....dust yourself off...it will be ok......wow you are amazing for being so honest......that is the BULLSHIT I have trouble with about AA/NA and sometimes this forum. I have always respected you ROMEO that is why I tend to jump your shit when this happens. I know we already know what we did and we do not need lectures.........remember when I told you we should call you Relapse Romeo...........I wanted you to get mad....I wanted you to mad enough that you said that is it.....I am done with this shit.

You are kind to yourself and others but how many more times is your beautiful wife going to put up with this?............you daughter needs her DAD....ROMEO you know this is a deadly disease and I honestly worry that your thinking sometimes is going to put you just over the mark and you won't be able to recover.'

The last time this happened they locked the thread put you were really considering rehab............I had my relapse and I got on the phone and begged and pleaed till I could get a bed because I knew I was going to die if I didn't do something. Tomorrow...Tomorrow..that's when I will stop.......this Monday I will stop.........I just couldn't... Hope you find the way out and believe me it my not be AA.....it may be church or just pure will or even God's will

Think about this we have been on here for a minute now. In the last 4 yrs we see them come and go..........I worry everyday about laddertripper.......I have PM'd, texted her, called her..................NOTHING. This disease kills...........slips and relapses are not a part of the recovery process despite what people think........

Now some will get mad and say I am being too hard on Romeo but you know yourself that ..........that is not the case in this email. Take it anyway you want to but the reason I finally am sending this to you is out of concern for another addict.....

This has been the worst year of my life and mostly sober or maintenace on sub. I lost one of the best jobs I ever had, lost my home, my truck and all I have left is my car and clothes......I am renting a room out of a house and I though rock bottom was 3 rock bottoms ago.............Something or Someone is allowing me to continue to wake up daily and somehow afford my sub appoiintments, my subs and the fact that I still get to see my boys from time to time. I am working on getting my life back together and I know if I go back.......there is no place left to go but jail or the insane asylum. The only reason I don't go to the hospital is because I am afraid they will keep me..........FOREVER.

There are so many of us that wish we could change places with you and have that unconditional love of a wife and daughter......a great job, home...........and love. Don't blow it man......you worked too hard to get where you are.........

Jim


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:55 pm 
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Much Respect for posting your relapse...I am worried about you! Too many slips up and some of your posts about drugs..Stay strong...but your playing with fire imo and I think you know it.. Try to find different ways to get natural highs.. Exercise..music..doing something u have a passion for..etc...they are out there u just have to find them and work at it a bit..Come on man...U want to be part of an elite group?? You got to get stronger and smarter..Stop FUCKING around! Love ya!


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:42 am 
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Yeah Romeo it took some balls to open up on this forum after the last time. I have a lot of respect for you opening up and giving it another try. Hellz if you ended up listening to the dominant voice back then, you'd have gone back on Suboxone and you'd still be taking it to this day. IMO you're fucking miles ahead of those of us on Suboxone even after this codeine incident.

Lillyval said it herself recently that she feels like she has to be a LOT more vigilant now she's off Sub. I'd even say it takes as much vigilance and effort to stay clean off Sub for 30 days than it takes to not use for a year while on Suboxone. It's a whole other ball game. This is partly why I feel apprehensive to be hard on you about these things. I feel it's a bit hypocritical esp given I'm not even clean in the NA world.

That being said, this forum is one of your big support bases and if every member had this belief you'd be robbed of a lot of support.

Just be careful of permitting yourself to let go because ... it's as if these lapses / slips / relapses, while being many months apart... still have some regularity. A while back I said you're making progress in recovery if your clean stretches are getting longer each time. I kinda said this to combat a belief I saw in NA that when people lapsed or relapsed after 1, 2, 5 years clean... they felt like their clean time was all for nothing, totally forgotten, and they were back to 0 and considered a "newcomer". Keeping that idea in mind is useful if you find yourself ruminating or beating yourself up. But flipping it around to make it easier or allow one's self to use while still holding onto a feeling of progress kinda defeats the purpose.

The main reason I say this is because ... even though I feel I know you personally yet I don't ... I genuinely feel you have a capacity to stay clean off opioids for the rest of your life. If you haven't been hiding anything from the forum and your lapses have been as spread out as has been reported, and you've been as proactive in dealing with them as you say you have ... I genuinely believe you have a capacity to stay clean for the rest of your life. You're no newcomer to this recovery gig, and you've proven you can stay clean off opioids for decent stretches.

It's as if these uses you're doing are some kinda way to release tension built up in your recovery over time. Maybe look for other edgy things to do keep that dark side at bay like ... getting tied up at some bondage club and whipped by a woman dressed as cat-woman (with your wife's permission) ... or hiring a Ferrari and taking it down to the strip on the weekend and race it... shit like that.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 3:22 am 
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I don't know too much about this, but I do know that getting clean is HARD WORK, no matter our methods. You've chosen to do it (as you say) 5 times? I'd say that's a whole lot of STRENGTH.

I hear that you keep getting up, which is more important--in many ways--than getting knocked down.

That sure gives *me* hope, and I don't think I'm alone.

~J


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 4:05 am 
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Yeah Romeo,

I agree with Reraise. How long is your wife going to put up with this?

I cant talk too much shit because I had a relapse in may. And I was on sub while I relapsed by the way. But Romeo, I went back to treatment.
It seems like you have these slips and nothing changes so you slip again. What are you going to do differently this time? I feel like you should do something! Talking about it here is not helping you.

Know that I only say this because you are a great guy who supports so many people here. You deserve to hear the truth.

I dont want to see something bad happen to you Romeo.

Take care and please get some extra help.

PS. Im worried about Laddertipper too. Do you know if she is OK?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 6:41 am 
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[font=Comic Sans MS]Ok, that's twice that Laddertipper has been brought up. I don't want to change the subject of
this thread, but I've been worried about her too. I keep checking her thread to see if she has posted
anything, and I've noticed that she hasn't been on here either.

Jim, you said that you haven't gotten any responses from her??? That sucks. I'm going to keep her
in my prayers and cross my fingers that she is just too damn busy! Anyway, how are ya Romeo???
Hope you are feeling a little better anyway....[/font]

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:12 pm 
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Just to clear things up in response to TeeJay's post: I went off Sub Dec. 2011, had a relapse that ended with me snorting heroin even though I had only been on painkillers prior to the Sub, and I went BACK on Sub this June.

Romeo - not to beat a dead horse, but Jim is right. When I was relapsing I thought I had every thing under control, but I could have died, either copping heroin or doing it. You might think it was "only" Codeine, but look ad Dr. J. He started on Codeine and ended up shooting fentanyl. Once the opiates are in our bodies it's game on. Lucky for me, my husband threatened to take the kids away from me when he found out about the heroin. Your wife gives you a pass EVERY time, so unfortunately for you something from within is going to have make a change - and that is by far the hardest. But I totally believe you can do it.

I tried contacting ladder tipper, too, and go no reply. I'm really worried. If anyone has heard from her, please let us know.
Lilly


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 12:43 pm 
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I haven't heard from Laddertipper since she last posted on here. I've called her, texted her, PM'd her and emailed her.....no response. I think on her second to last post, she had 30 days clean, but I'm 99% sure she was drunk when she posted her last post on this forum. I'm thinking she probably went to rehab?

IM, you asked why I slipped and turned to codeine.....it was in the house, that's the only reason I took it. We've had codeine in the house for years and years. I think you're right on that I've conditioned my brain to the extent that when I'm sick, I feel I deserve and need relief from an opiate. I know plenty of other people on the planet get sick without turning to opiates and I've got to get accept that I have to be one of those people. Thanks for your reply, I appreciate it.

TwinCitiesHardcore, where I'm originally from I can get codeine OTC. It comes as Codeine Phosphate (8mg), Caffeine (15mg) and Tylenol (300mg). It comes in bottles of 50 pills, 100 pills or 200 pills. During my active addiction, I always had several bottles of the 200 count laying around the house in case I ever ran out of my DOC. Codeine never got me a buzz, but it did help when I inevitably ran out of my DOC. Because it never really got me high, I felt safe leaving it around the house. I know better now. No more codeine in the house now. Thanks for your message and thanks for the support.

ReRaise, I get ya man. I understand where you're coming from. Last night after reading your message, I did something that I never did before.....I put myself in your shoes looking at me. All of a sudden I was able to see exactly what you were saying. You've been on this board longer than I've been, you've seen me go through all of my slips and you've also seen me stuck smack dab in the middle of serious denial. I see now how frustrating that is for you, not because you hate me or anything like that, but it's because you do care for me and you're getting sick and tired of watching me fall, get up, fall, get up, etc. I honestly don't know what to say to you right now. I can't promise you I'll never use again because I can't see the future. I can promise you that I'll once again do what I can to learn from what happened, try to make myself stronger with it and keep moving forward. Jim, I hope things turn around for you soon. You've had an awful year and my heart goes out to you. Right now all I know to tell you is to keep putting one foot in front of the other and keep going forward.

Hellmuth, I was playing with fire, it just took me a bit to realize it. I'm very fortunate that I didn't end up hitting something stronger and end up with 3rd degree burns all over. Just an FYI, I've been lifting weights for well over a year now. I lift between 5 and 6 days a week and I LOVE it!!! Lifting weights is one of the best things I've done for myself and my recovery. I love the challenge, I love the natural high and I like seeing the changes in my body. I've never been muscular and I'm certainly not muscular right now, but at least I'm getting some muscle definition and it's pretty cool to see the changes. I do think you're right that I need to find something else, in addition to my workouts, to help keep me a little more busy. Thanks, man.

TJ, I think you're right on about having to be more vigilant. My recovery was going pretty good, I was completely comfortable with not using drugs and I think I probably got complacent with myself and my recovery. I don't think the complacency is the sole reason I used, I think me getting sick was the master trigger, but feeling like I was really on top of my recovery and all that happy shit was more than likely a factor in why I chose to keep on taking the codeine and see if they would get me a buzz. Thanks for your message and I firmly believe I have the capacity to stay clean for the rest of my life too, if I didn't, I would have went back on Suboxone. K, I have to go check on some whips and chains and a Ferrari now!! :)

Jolene, thanks for the message!

OrangeDoll, I have to disagree with you where you said it seems I have these slips and nothing changes. I'm light years ahead of where I was 2.5 years ago. I may not have learned every recovery lesson there is, but I've learned a bunch and I've put many of them into place. I probably shouldn't do this, but if I compare myself to other addicts who were in rehab or NA or whatever, I'm light years ahead of most of them too. I understand how from your point of view it may look like nothing has changed, but I know I've done a lot.....I also know I have a lot more to do. You know what I hadn't considered until I read your message.....my addiction counselor. I'm gonna take your advice and give him a ring. Thanks OrangeDoll.

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Be kind to yourself. Our character defects do NOT define who we are!


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

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