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PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 7:15 am 
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Today was suppose to be the day. The first day of the rest of my new life. I've been saying that for a while. That on new years day I would start. Well I'm in wd I have coffee in hand and some lortabs and subs in front of me. But I'm in this alone.
This has been one hell of a ride for me. I started on vikes at least ten years ago and never abused them. I'd save them for rainy days. Then when I bought a house I used them as superman pills. Sorry they were prescribed for rotator cuff tears and premature arthritis. I'm a body builder with a ton of injuries. Later as my tolerance went up I was switched to lortab 10s 4 times a day. Then to oxy 15 three times a day.
That's when I got rolling. I started craving the oc and it was never enough.
I realized my add was back so adderal was added and at the same time as my original vike I forgot to mention valium 10 and a sleeping pill was added. I'm typing on a cell so its hard to edit.
Anyway now I'm in my early 40s I have lortab almost unlimited valium 10 three times a day adderal 10 three times a day sleeping pills testosterone because my levels were so low and my head is a mess.
Having nothing to do with my habits my wife and I have been fighting for weeks mostly because she puts her family ahead of me and I've had it. I actually had my daughter xmas eve and she left and the opposite xmas day. Yesterday my dad was rushed to the er. He is stable now and under observation and my wife not knowing had already taken my daughter to her moms. When she found out about my dad she didn't come home so Im In an empty house.
All the makings to chicken out while this phone slips in my sweaty hands.
No one knows about my pills. I have the adderral under control. I only take it in the morning and a half if I need it later. The valium I take to keep my muscles lose from Injuries. If I don't take it I eventually get sick. Its the pain pills that have me.
My worries, as of last night because my wife didn't return home knowing mydad was in the hospital I told her I'm through. Her family definitely comes before me. My job. Raising my daughter and god only knows what the future will hold and the gym. Training is what I have now.
I'm afraid of not being able to train because Im too tired. Not having an appetite. Not being able to take care of and enjoy my time with my daughter now that my marriage js a joke.
My stomach is shot. My nose is runny. My skin is crawling. Its 6 am. Been up since 5.
I don't have a sub doc but have a ton of subs.
I know the decision is mine. But will I be able to train, eat, focus, and survive on subs? I must take the valium or ill wd from it. I'm hoping the testosterone will help too.
Does everyone go through this, its just a pill I tell myself.
Will life be better if I start today or put it off?
I also don't want to take subs forever. My goal is to be totally clean of opiates.
I guess my biggest question is how will subs effect the gym. And my personality? My life is about to hit bottom and the joke is the pills didn't do it. My dad has a heart condition. My wife has always put her family over me its just now that we have a baby I think experiences should be ours as our own family. My job has become more stressful from the state.
The pills are my choice right now to stop because I'm sick of them. I just don't want to lose my edge and energg right now when I need it most.
I hope to hear from someone. I'm sitting at the table coffee in hand alone in an empty house confused. Scared. Just tired. If you saw me you'd see a 200 lb body builder shaking and sweating trying to make a choice.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:37 am 
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Hi giveitmyall

Yes, choose suboxone as a recovery aid! I had similar concerns but after 4 months on suboxone i feel ok, human & better than that, other people close to me (like you no one knew about my oxy habit) are treating me better, trusting me more....I have changed for the better! I have energy & my pain is under control!

It took me a few weeks to be ok on the sub. IMHO some who do it themselves don't give the sub enough time. I was taking 360-400 mg oxy with xanax & I am am older than you. It was not an easy transition for me & i also had a bunch of PK's around but I choose to stay on sub & give it one month & I am so glad i did.

I hope my post is not to late But if you made the PK choice there is always tomorrow. I also see an addiction therapist & he is helping me so much. He is not pro or con about sub he is there to help me change my behavior.

Let us know how you are doing & I bet others will chime in soon.

Tiki


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 10:23 am 
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I want you to know that you're not alone. We've all been in a desperate place before. Everyone here who reads your story can identify with your feelings of pain and uncertainty.

I can't give you guarantees. I can't tell you that you'll definitely feel the way you want to feel on suboxone. I can't say that going on sub will solve your marriage or make your dad healthy.

What I can share with you is how my life changed when I stopped the crazy pill train and went on sub. Before suboxone my life revolved around pills. I was obsessed over how many I had, when my next dose was, how many I needed to take to get my next high, etc. I neglected my son and my husband, my education, my friends, and my life. I spent most of my time in bed.

My sub doctor had me withdraw for 60 hours before being induced. That amount of time was excessive, but the beauty was that I went from abject misery when I got to the doctor's office to feeling on top of the world, but normal when I left.

I noticed within the first 24 hours that I had my life back. I didn't know what to do with the new freedom in my brain that had been so occupied by obsessing over pain pills. I just didn't think about getting high anymore! It was a miracle to me. I was interested in life again, in my family and my son.

Will suboxone be a miracle for you? I don't know for sure. But we are here to help! We can help you through induction and trying to find a correct dose that works for you. (Hint: Start with a low dose!)

So make the choice to start fresh today! Ask questions and we'll help you as we can. You can do this! There is not one of us who hasn't been where you are. I wish you the best of luck!

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 10:36 am 
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Hey Give it,..look man tiki is right. You can do this. If we are to late, ok well, tomarrow is another day. Funny thing about tomarrows,they can start to stack up.
I have 3 years on the 14th. Sub changed everything.55 years old now and i have done more in the last three years than the ten years past. I work hard.no i dont train but its work. I hear alot of pain in your post .
When i started sub,id lost the wife, the houses, the money. Today im with the x wife in our house. What im sayn here is i had to first clean my ass up man. Pills WERE the problem. Tbey ALWAYS ARE. You want your life back, start sooner than later.
Im very sorry your goimg thouth this alone. Sorry your dad is ill. A hell of a way to start the new year. But this can work for you Give. Please come back and post. Its bn 3 hours so maybe its to late to start but you seem like your ready. ..
One more thing,i suggest finding a dr to help you Give..heres one reason, i see that when addocts take sub off the street,it acts more like a drug than a MED. I hope you understand that i am not judgimg you and glad you have found some sub,i just think its good to have one on one help too..
Idk if this did any good but we are all here to help you...for real..hang in there an just remember why and what you want to recover from..it gets better..really...
Oh an one more thing. I took 4 mgs the first day and never looked back..amazing even today!!!!!!

razor55....


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 10:45 am 
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.....Amy is also right here too...right on.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 11:43 am 
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You have a ton of subs and you are wavering? Listen, just take the subs OK. It's so not worth it the other way around and believe it or not you will feel so much better.
Don't concentrate on what was and how you got here, take the first step to leaving that behind...
I wish you all the best and I do hope you choose the subs, but either way, even if you didn't today, you can choose the subs whenever you want to, don't forget that!
Sending you good thoughts.
Jennifer


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 12:11 pm 
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Hi Giveit.
Would be a good idea to look around for a sub Dr. You will probably need more sub at some stage and stuffing around buying from street isnt very relaxing etc.
Im a similar age to you (45) and also train a lot. Things will be a thousand times better on sub and without all the other pill BS going on. You will be surprised on how much better things will be. May take a month for the mental stuff of being used to take things every fee hrs or so, but this will settle. You will be grateful to not be in wd all the time.
Another thing with the training. I noticed a lot more gains when switched to sub. I was on methadone and trained for years and struggled to put on size. Gains seemed to come easier without methadone/dope etc. Im also taking test. I have a feeling the opiates lower test levels or affect muscle growth in some way. I was taking same amount of test in cycles and had much better results on sub and now even better sub free.
Gym will not be a prob. In fact the oposite will happen. Youvwill feel good and have more energy and enthusiasm. Its amazing how youvget used to a certain funk and just work/exist in it. Take it away and you cant beleive youvspent so many years in it. Believe me, you will be doing yourself a favour. Junk the pills, start sub. When ready taper off. I trained right through my taper. Was ok.
Took me a year or more to taper from 4mg. Been clean for almost 6 months now.
Couldnt of done it without sub. Was stuck on methadone and using for 15 years. On sub for approx 3 years.
Go for it Man.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 1:02 pm 
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Thanks for the support. I chickened out jan 1. I just couldn't bare one more thing on my plate.
BUT, I started subs last night before bed. I just took tiny chips until I got to about 2 MSG.
I'm at work and feeling better. My wife and I are through, I just can't see it any other way.
I needed to be back at work to have my mind fully occupied to start. I'm so busy I can't think of anything. I tried every thing I could to get my wife to stop and finally I just manned up and said I'm doing this for me. Not for anyone but me. My whole life is crumbling around me, but I am here.
I just decided that after my dad was discharged to go home and take my daughter to the mall. We walked around and she hugged and hugged me. I thought about my life and that I know I will lose her. My wife which is a separate issue has never really loved me and I realized I took more pills just to cope with her. Well I'm done with that. So far I feel ok.
I do have some questions.
I use phenibut, should I stop?
And is the adderall a good thing to have or bad?
I don't know what tomorrow will bring in terms of my marriage but I do know I'm ready to take my life back.
Anyone have any suggestions on what I should use or not use of how to taper to get clean?
I can not go to a sub doctor, that's not an option. I must man up and make this on my own. I have about 30 subs and have easy access.
I was hoping for some type of plan to use what I have to beat this and move on.
I can't believe I made it. I did it. I started.
Thanks to all.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 02, 2014 3:20 pm 
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Hey Man
Dont know about the aderal and other one you mentioned. Someone here will.
If it was me i would cease everything else you feel you can and stabilise on the sub and see how you go. You can reintroduce things if you have to.
What dose are the subs you have, 8mg or 4's?
Just take the lowest sub dose possible to hold you. You will need longer than you think to taper. Yhe good news it is nowhere as bad as the opiates you have been taking to wd from.
What dose is holding you now? If it is just 2mg thats great. Dont go higher, it will just take longer to taper down. I reckon from 2 you could have a pretty smooth landing over 6 weeks. Probably prepare for longer as you want to be as comfortable as possible.
In reality i would take 2 or 3 months to do a nice slow taper from 2 mg.
Mentally you will have to get used to not popping a pill whenever stressed or feel like one. You will still want to take them even if not in wd anymore. Can taper sooner if prepared for a certain level of shitiness.

Dont be alarmed. It really isnt too bad. Especially if you have only experienced full opiate wd (pills/dope etc)

Dont include other drugs when tapering. It just makes things messy. Eat well and i found ibuprohen worked ok. Nothing else really makes any difference. The test will be ok though. Probably dont cease for now as depression may come in a bit. Especially with your wife issue.
With the taper when ready, reduce by 20% of current dose each week. Sometimes leave a fortnight if need a rest. No rush, unless running iut of sub.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:17 am 
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I'm back and still at it. Thank you to everyone that replied. Today is my second day. I need some real help now so that I get this right. I keep my subs in the car to hide them from my wife so I will post how many I have later. I think at least 30 8mg subs.
Let me start from the beginning. My life fell to pieces all on its own. I decided to stop taking lortab 10s. I would take anywhere from 6 to 20 a day. I would also take timed release 30 morphin when I got it. I was at the point that I couldn't sleep or even go to the gym without eating pills especially as my marriage is falling apart.
I started stocking up on subs. I started a few times and stopped. I just couldn't get it right. This time I'm giving it my all. I read about every herb and vitamin that could help me with this fight. I started with them here and there but I am going full force as soon as I stabilize, which I need help with in a minute.
Let me tell you what I have so hopefully I can get feedback, GABA for relaxation nervous tension, l tyrosine for healthy glandular function mental alertness, adrenal reset to fight fatigue from stimulants and reduce cortisol, ashwagandha helps immune system and stress, dopa mucuna a neurotransmitter that promotes enjoyment and interest in life, dhea stimulates hormones because I'm on hormone replacement, vitamin b6 for energy, 5htp for positive mood neurotransmitter support, taurine supports a calm mood, alpha lipoic acid fights free radicals antioxidant. Those are over the counter.
I'm also prescribed Valium 10 three times a day, tamazapan for sleep, and adderall 10 three times a day. I only take the adderall once in the morning and a half in the late morning if I must.

This is how I started the road on subs. I took one 8mg piece and cut it up into 8 pieces. I used lortabs during the day to get by. I took my last pill around 5pm. Then before I went to bed I took 1mg of sub and a sleeping pill. I woke up a few hours later and took another 1mg piece of sub. That happened a few times. By the time I left for work I noticed I used 5mgs between starting before bed and going to work. I felt ok. I felt a bit edgy almost nasty. But I was ok. I made it through the day. And when I tell you my personal life tested me every way possible, my god. My wife and I are on the edge of a cliff and its just which one will fall first.

Then I read the posts about not taking too much so I didn't take another dose. I knew today we would have snow making it an easy day so I went to bed with my mind on fire, marriage, pills, work, daughter, all racing around. I woke up at 1am and felt not right. I remembered someone saying 2mgs max a day or it will take forever to get off so I took 1mg. I managed to fall back asleep.

I'm up now having coffee. I have the day off from work and a long weekend ahead in a disfunctional house. I will be tested to the max the next three days. I mean tested. My wife is playing games with my 20 month old daughter. Every time I go near her she screws with me. I know this isn't a marriage board, but I'm just venting. My parents are the only ones that know I'm trying to quit pills, but they think I'm just trying to quit what the doctor gives me.

Since my marriage is falling apart I can't have all of this in the system I will never get custody when it finally fails. I am well educated, actually a teacher, have several degrees and a lot of responsibilities as I am sure you all do. I know that many of you are and always were highly functioning. I don't hold myself higher than anyone. We all got here one way or another. I just hope that you can help me succeed and get out of this grave.

I read about induction and stabilizing. I know everyone is different. I am trying to lay out a plan to take me from where I am now to clean. I know many of you have done it.

I plan on keeping my testosterone levels pretty high to stop depression and I forgot to mention that I use growth hormone. My levels were borderline so I went for it. That alone has helped me feel a bit better on pills so I'm hoping it helps me get through.

Can you please give me some ideas on what to do. Should I split doses? Do I take just one dose? What time of day should I take it? I can start clean slate dosing when I find out what to do.
I'm feeling decent on 1mg since 1am right now. I want to beat this for my daughter and myself and start my life over again. I am however terrified of the post depression that I read about after getting clean, but I'll cross that when I get there.

I know there is information out there but I find when I read it it gets confusing. Plus I have no one to talk to at all. I can't tell you how much your replies mean to me.
Thanks to all. I'll check back after shoveling.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 10:02 am 
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Hi Again

I don't have much experience with sub but want you to stay connected to this forum. Alot of us are getting hit with a major snow storm so there could be power outages which is why you haven't gotten many replies.

Have you looked in the Stopping Suboxone thread or Bupe in the rear view? Some of your answers may be there. Many people have used sub as a detox tool so there must be something here. Also try typing in sub as a detox tool or something like that in the search box.

Sorry i can't be more help. I am rooting for you though. You will have to be extra strong living in a dysfunctional house. You may be surprised how differently you see things once you are off the PK's & on sub. Some things may be clearer to you & will give you the extra push you may need to get clean.

Keep writing & asking questions...as you saw people pop on here all different times & replies come just sometimes not quick enough for us :D .


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 2:46 pm 
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Just dose once a day. You will probably feel a bit 'speedy' but not in wd. I did when i changed from methadone to sub. You dont get the depressant effect on sub. It stops wd but doesnt give you that opiate effect. At least in small doses. This lasted for a few days or so with me.
All those herbs and supplements are cool but try not to obsess on it so much. I know it will be the only thing going through your mind, when do i feel ok. How long, when do i start to feel better etc.
Sounds like 1 or 2 mg is holding you. Stay there for 2 weeks then drop a fraction. 30 x 8mg will be plenty if commited. 30 x 8 = 240 mg. At 2 mg a day this is 120 days worth. Dont forget you will be reducing down so will have more.
Get down to 0.5 or 0.25 and can jump from there.
Just makw sure that you are actually being held over next few weeks. Otherwise its going to be too much of a mental struggle getting used to not taking something all the time. When stable on sub its good for the cravings. You have plenty so could afford to take a little more for first few weeks. Try to just take enough to hold though.
Its doable.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:08 pm 
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Hi GIMA,

Wow, you are going through a lot this week huh? I'm sorry that you don't have the support of your wife while you are going through this, but I get why you think you need to do this the way you are.

My suggestion would be to try to stabilize at whatever dose makes you feel the best. You don't want to take more than you need, for obvious reasons, but don't be so cautious that you wind up in pain or craving again. The best way to do it, even with your plans of a quick taper, is to get completely stable for at least a few weeks before you begin to drop your dose. This isn't a race bud, you really need to take your time and be sure that you give your mind and body time to heal from this before you start tapering. The worst thing that could happen would be to go through all this pain and hardship, struggle and fight and get clean, only to relapse later on because you really weren't ready. KWIM?

The time of day you take it isn't really that important. If you need the extra boost of energy you get from it then take it in the morning. If you find it helps you sleep at night you might take it before bed. It varies from person to person. I always take mine mid-morning. The main thing is to get into a routine of taking it at a set time so that you aren't giving in to the urge to take it when you think you want an extra buzz. The point is to break the habit of dosing multiple times during the day whenever we feel like we "need the fix" of the pills. Split dosing is ok if you need it for pain management, or when you get down to very low amounts, but I wouldn't start off that way.

The main thing to remember is that you are doing this for yourself. All the extra stuff going on in your life is going to make it harder, no doubt. But you can push yourself through it and focus on your future. Focus on giving your daughter a healthy, happy Daddy to have in her life. It might give you the push you need on those days when things get tough.

You have already taken the first step...that's a biggie! Good job, you are on your way to a new you! Just keep at it, I know you will do fine.

Welcome to our little forum!

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 6:26 pm 
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Thanks for all the messages. I need to up the dose I think. I felt much better on 5 than I do right now. I'm craving bad. I'm going to go to four mgs a day for my first four or so days. I am afraid of the horror stories I heard about
startingtoo high but this isn't good. So Itook 5 mgs day one. Then 1 mg at 1am this am. Now took 4mgs more. Will I be ok at 4 mgs a day until I make it through the first few days. Since its the weekend I have too much time and temptation to use. I skipped the gym for the shovel today.
Thanks for the advice about once a day. I was going to do twice a day because i read it was easier to quit in the end.
I would say that I've been popping pills for at least ten years. Lost control when I got married. She just never loved me for me and the pills fixed it all. Now with everything to lose I'm trying to quit. I want a clear head. I want to be me. I resent hiding behind a bottle for so long. I just hope I can do it. Pills made life easier. My hope is to get myself back. I realize that collectively you have so much knowledge and I'm grateful for everyone. To live this way with my wife and this house and have no one at all to talk to is hard. I have an ipad and this tiny smart phone to reach out to you. I do it in secret constantly erasing my cookies and traces of the site so no one knows.
So todays question is can I use what I need 4mgs or so to get passed the first few days because I felt bad at 1mg.
I can always get more subs so if you think I need them please give me a ballpark of what I need to be done with my old life.
I know I keep repeating myself but I've been using lortabs for about ten years. Did blues on top for about a year but haven't touched them in months. So I'm trying to beat lortab 10mgs anywhere from 6 to 20 a day. I know there is no exact science but ill grab them asap so that I'm not tempted.
On a different note I saw a lose dog crossing a major highway last night and got out of my car called the number on the tag and waited in the cold for the owner. When he came he thanked me and tried to hand me money. I shook his hand and told him just to pray for me that helping him meant more to me than anything. I could not even tell my wife when I got home because its that bad. All of you are great people for being here and I am so grateful for having something to read when I log on. Sucks being alone.
Thank you again and sorry for going on.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 12:59 pm 
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Take whatever holds you. But do allow a small transition period in the first week. It will settle down pretty quick. It is a different style of opiate to what you are used to. Body just needs to readjust.
Once you find what holds you just take once a day. It is a long acting drug so no real need to take multiple times thru day. Choose whatever time of day suits best.
I started on 4 mg per day and was ok. A little bit of mild wd here and there. Gave me the shits but did settle in a week or so. The majority of that week was ok though.
Dont fall into the trap of having a little piece at different times thru the day as a 'pick me up' you will just be using it as a crutch, like the pills and wont really be able to get on top of it.
Get nice and stable. Then reassess in a few weeks. Dont analyse too much right now. Wait till you feel good


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 6:34 pm 
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I'm glad you are hanging in there and coming back here with us. With so many things going on I can completely see how you can get overwhelmed. Many here struggle enough with (only) an opiate addiction without all the rest. You then add in the adderall plus the Valium plus marriage issues and there really is a lot for you to deal with - most certainly too much to try to handle on your own. I'm sort of surprised and certainly disappointed that no one has already said what I'm about to say to you.

Trying to do this on your own by self medicating is extremely unlikely to work in the long term. Most certainly the LAST thing you should even think about now is getting off of subs. That, my friend, should be no less than 6 months to a year down the road. Getting off the Valium can be extremely dangerous - deadly so. Then the adderall is doing the opposite to your body than the sub and Valium - or pain pills were. It's nearly like holding the brake peddle while stepping on the gas at the same time. You would never do that with your car so why do it with your body?

You stated you "can't" go to a sub doc. Why not? You CANT or you DONT WANT TO? These are not the same. Then there is the marriage issue - which you blame 100% on your wife and seem to be certain has nothing to do with your addiction and drug abuse - which is absurd. Of course it does. Plus rarely if ever is marriage problems all because of one person.

I'm not trying to pile on here but you have to start to see that you are still very much in active addiction and now abusing subs as well. What will happen to your life if you get arrested and face drug charges? What then? Taking benzos - especially in unlimited quantities with sub is also very dangerous. Don't be someone who has to get arrested yo be forced into recovery.

Yes, you are better off abusing sub rather than percs or Lortab but if you truly want your life back you don't stand much of a chance without professional help. Asking strangers on the Internet won't do it. If you had a bleeding ulcer or diabetes would you try to treat it yourself through the black market and Internet?

Please consider getting into a true recovery program and getting under the care of addiction professionals. Your daughter needs you. Your wife likely needs you too. If she can't get what she needs from you turning to family may be her best recourse. Please do this for your daughter and most importantly for yourself. You need professional help. The great people here will do what they can but they didn't go to medical school for 8 years and do a residency for addiction. Get under the care of someone who has. Please consider this.

Don


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 6:52 pm 
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don is right on the money. you def. need to get into a program.. i too used to self medicate with subs before i went to my doctor.. he gave me an excellent comparison than went like this: he asked me what i did for a living, i told him construction. he said ok, well you using subs on your own are like me and my doctor buddies saying "lets build a house today" and so we'll go buy a bunch of lumber and some tools and go build a house.....how do you think that house will turn out?

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 8:25 pm 
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Ok so I can explain a bit more. I feel much better now. I guess my body is switching over. To answer some of the questions everything that I use except the subs are legally prescribed. So maybe the subs could get me in troublebut I'm in this to clean myself upand shooting for short term use. My marriage issues sidndidn't start from pills it started because my wife never left her family to truly start a family of her own. She was always running down to them and it started to get old. Then her dad was diagnosed with liver cancer. That meant that every free minute was spent with her dad and I didn't exist. Then he got worse so we got worse. Then he died. Now she morns him all the time and runs to them even more. She won't go to grief counsling. So basically I saw the writing on the wall with the family issues and got slammed when her dad got sick. I want a life of my own and a family of my own where I come first. I don't have that. My wife puts me second. Shes not going to them because I am not functioning and don't want to do things she goes because she never grew up and truly wanted a family of her own.
I hope that kinda clears up the wife part.
The adderal and valium are prescribed and monitored by my doc. The same doc that gave me the pain pills.
The reason I can't start a program is I'm a teacher and have other certificates that would be jeapordized by coming out.
Just based on the info that I received I have a very good idea on my plan. Its true that I made mistakes and got wrapped up in pain pills but as I said I'm prescribed three adderall a day but only take 1.5 and have never gone over my valium number. Just because I lost it with lortabs doesn't mean I did with all my meds.
I also ran two night clubs for years but never drank. It just wasn't my thing..
I made it through today on 4mgs maybe just a tad more. I trained hard. Ate six meals and drank a gallon of water.
That's my normal routine. Up by 5am. Teach. Six meals a day. At least a gallon of water train for about an hour and play with my daughter.
I actually trained for two body building shows while I was popping pills now that I think about it.
I thought back to day one deciding to stop popping pills. I didn't have to. I didn't get in trouble. I wasn't running out. My marriage is screwed because I let my wife put me second for so long that now I'm just sick of it and I wanted to be number one again. I was afraid as heck. But I did it. I started. The subs don't make me feel great I just don't feel sick. For right now that is ok.
I actually am glad someone came down on me because I'm the type of person to prove them wrong.
It was just what I needed. If you knew me really knew me you'd fall out of your chair. I never did ac work but when I bought my house I read a book a long with being handy and put in a 2 ton and 4 ton unit from the ground up. I made the trunks did the electrical everything. I trashed the oil furnace and built a gas boiler sweating 409 fittings and more pipe than you could imagine with just the internet and being handy. I laid 1200 sq ft of tile and finished 3000 sq ft of hardwood.
So I now have a new goal. I will continue to read and educate myself and do this. Tomorrow I plan on using 3mgs since I should be about stable.
Then I will figure out my taper.
As far as the comment about no one being a doctor. Sometimes once the information is out there especially for something like this u don't need one. Yes open heart surgery but not for tapering. Most doctors know what they read. They never actually went through it. So I trust some of ur ideas more. Wish me luck and thank you for the push. Thats what I needed. Ill be back to tell u how I am progressing.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 12:38 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2014 1:28 am
Posts: 85
Location: Reading, Pennsylvania
i really do wish you the best! and whichever path to recovery you choose is entirely up to you, but i just personally think its foolish to assume that you can defeat your long history of addiction with zero counselling and by self administering a medicine like suboxone over a very short period of time...its a proven fact that suboxone does not change the brain into non-addictive functioning. but i really hope the best for you and hope that this path does work for you and that you can be successful by using soley this forum alone. good luck and God bless!

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 2:29 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:54 am
Posts: 90
You can do it on your own. All it takes is major commitment and not using just one more time.
Thousands do it. counselling etc doesnt make it easier.
Whatever works. Sounds like you have the resolve good luck Man!


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

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