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 Post subject: do side effects go away?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 4:44 pm 
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Hi. Thanks in advance for any guidance. This is my first post.
Quick history...
Hooked on pain meds for around 8 years. Last 5 years I was only taking 1 pill (either a 5 or 7.5) a day. That's it..A DAY. I quit, but still couldn't stop my brain from not wanting them and then the cycle kept going of getting more, running out and then panicking. I guess it doesn't matter if you take 1 a day or 100?
So, i got tired of it and my P-doc started me on Suboxone films 1/2 and the side effects were insane--puking, broke out, throat swollen. So he switched me to Subutex. It's only been one week. I was taking a high dosage at first like 10mg. I tried 2mg and felt nothing. So the last 3 days i've only taken 4mg each day. I feel pretty good so I'm thinking the 4 may be my sweet spot dose.
The only side effects have been major (i've NEVER experienced this ever) constipation and itching. Benedryl may as well be a tranquilizer. I'm now taking miralax, i excercise 3-4x week (except this week cause i've felt like crapolla) and i only drink water & coffee. I'm one of those annoying health nuts.
I've committed to sticking this out to get healthy, but not sure if these side effects will be here as long as i'm on the sub? or do they go away. I had no side effects like this from my dinky one vic or perc a day---in fact, i always knew the second those things kicked in because it made me poop!
Thanks again, hope to be around here often and able to give my expereince after a while.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 5:17 pm 
HOLD THE FRONT DOOR. You were taking ONE vike or perc a day!?!?!?! AND YOUR OWN 4mg's of sub!?!?!? look if you enjoy your health and care about your overall well being (sounds like you do!) Get off of subs as soon as you can. Holy crap, i am beyond serious right now. take one perc a day and going to 4mg of suboxone a day is RAISING your tolerance, dependence, and overall addiction.

If you had trouble stopping one vike or perc. You are in for a painful, rude, eye opening experience if you continue to stay on this drug. Look you day one perc a day is like shooting yourself in the foot with a bb gun. You taking sub is comparable to putting your mouth around a M2 .50 caliber machine gun. Please for the love of god, you thought that one perc was bad. Taking sub for a week or two and then trying to switch back to that one perc from 4mgs of sub. one perc woulden't even come close to taking you out of withdraw. Get off subs right now and go back to that one perc.

You are playing with fire!!! Please for the sake of your sanity. bupenorphine the drug in sub is 40x more point then morphine i believe. You are increasing your tolerance and dependence to the freaking moon right now. All those side effects are obviously symptoms of over prescribed opiods.

You guys wonder why i am so anti sub. THIS IS EXACTLY WHY. Doctors hurting people instead of helping. I don't want to hear anymore people defending this shady, negligent practice. Every other day i see somewhere on line all these stories of doctors doing this. And you think they are not in it for the money? People have the nerve to defend this practice for the sake of drug pushing disgusting doctors. I would like to have them eat 32mg's of sub a day and lock there ass in a cell cold turkey for 2 weeks. Oh, im furious now.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 6:19 pm 
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thanks for a speedy and honest response.
hmmmm. This might explain why i feel a shit ton higher than i ever did taking my one dinky pill a day. You should've seen when i tried to quit smoking. I was doing the same thing....only 1 cigg a day and I couldn't stop just the one. And then I got the patch, which, even on the lowest dose was still more nicotine than i was smoking in a week! i still have trouble with that one.

Yeah, i don't feel healthy. I know my body pretty well and it feels like it's rejecting this stuff. I've never read anyone else having the same problem on the dosage i've been taking. but even after stopping the pill a day, i couldn't get past the cravings? it was as insane as it sounds. i couldn't make my brain not want to want them? so the doc said this would fix that.

but my question is, what is the difference if say i take 1mg a day of the subutex vs. 1 pill of the p or v? My rationale was that i can feel that itty bitty window of good 1x a day legally and semi-harmless with the subutex vs all the trouble i have to go through for the p/v ..and then i don't even know what damage those do with the acytominphin (sp)

I've been taking 4mg the last 3 nights. Should i just taper down in 1/2s ovre the next day and try again? The attraction with this is that I wanted to be clean.....and live a normal life. But now i'm wondering if i jumped from a frying pan to a fire.

thanks again, it's such a relief to not only write about this but have someone understand and talk to me about it! Even though i feel like a bit of a dumbass iwth my 1 pill a day.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:37 pm 
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Hey CoffeeMan!

Gotta say I love that java too. Will said it although I think I would have worded it a bit different, but the facts remain the same. Taking Suboxone at all for a one pill a day habit, and that's what it is, a habit, is not what the drug was meant for. It is beyond reason why your doctor would even consider giving you this. There are other ways to break a habit, just not any easy ones.

I don't think you even need to taper down if it's only been one week. Try to just stop taking it and see what happens. It will take several days for the Sub to get out of your system so give it at least 5-7 days before doing any more. If you do experience slight withdrawals, take a very small corner of the Sub and no more. Wait an hour and see how you feel.

Keep posting here so we can walk you through it, okay? Let's get this Suboxone out of your system first and then we'll deal with the one pill a day habit.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:44 pm 
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Im not sure what I see in the addiction of coffee. I know its the caffeine, but me myself I am more of a Mt Dew user. I am a smoker as well, but I did give up the worst addiction in my life, the pills. NO ONE is taking my Mt Dew away from me lol. My smokes, I roll my own so they arent as chemically full of crap as commerical made cigs. I use pipe bacco, not cigarette bacco that crap is expensive like crazy. I spend 7 bucks a week for smokes.That was one of the best things that I ever did was roll my own smokes. It is soothing too to set and roll them, I dont know why but it does help with stress.
If I was only on one Perc or Vic a day, I think that I would have left it at that and just tried to cut it to 1/2 or something. Suboxone is alot stronger, I can tell that with my cramps every month. When I was taking Vic and Perc's, I got cramps and they were mind numbing (cramps have always been my downfall) but on Suboxone they are still there but not as bad. Myself, I dont consider that an addiction but just a nagging fly that you cant swat away. If you were doing one and then having an attack of sorts and going for ten a day or something, I might say it differently. However, we dont know what you are going through until we walk a mile in your shoes.
We all have different levels of addiction, me I wasnt at the IV stage where I guess you would call it hardcore. I wasnt snorting pills, but I was crushing them and swallowing the powder to make them kick in faster. I thought about snorting, but then I happen to think about my tiny tiny sinus passages and my chronic sinus troubles. I sniff CONSTANTLY, I have to clear my throat ALL THE TIME, I have dealt with this since I was eight years old. I can remember the doctor telling Mom, she will always be like that, there is nothing that we can do to fix it. You will have to just learn how to overlook it and Mom did after awhile. I think she believed that my addiction would be the same, I mean for crying out loud she asked if Valium would make it better.
She understands a little bit better now, but I still cant get it across to her completely.
I hope that you dont stay on it long, please try to get off the Sub as quickly as you can. Its one thing if you are taking small doses for pain, and I mean like 1mg a day or something. Its another if you are taking it to stay off one a day Perc habit. There is Naltrexone that might help you, its cheaper and from what I hear there is no high, and it blocks the pain pills as well. I dont know alot about it but I do know its cheaper from searching it on Goodrx.com. Keep posting and let us know what you decide to do.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 9:58 am 
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heads up-this is long.
Okay, so all your information is so helpful and i can't thank you enough for taking time out to reply. i don't have a lot of support in my personal life and obiously none at work. so your replies go a long way for me.

I have to come clean about 2 things.... i actually don't like coffee. this registration thing kept booting me out and my co-worker left a javacity coffee cup on my desk and i used the name. And I'm a girl. i think another poster called me coffeeman. i just assume people can telepathically know me through these things, ha.

I looked at the sub to hydros/oxys chart and you guys are spot on! i was taking 5 mg (7.5 most) a day and 1.2mg of sub equals anywhere from 20-40mg. i can't remember exact # but it's like 100000000% more than i was taking! i did take 2mg friday/saturday nights and sunday none at all. i wake up feeling kinda crappy and still have only gone to bathroom onece in over a week. sunday morning i walked with a friend for about 2 hours and was throwing up throughout the trail. my friend used to be a probation officer so she thinks i should just stick it out and stay clean. she just doesn't get it. and then she scolded me for taking none becuase i need to go to the doc for a "plan." we went to eat brunch after and i actually fell asleep at the table. My last straw was when an effin clump of hair fell out in the shower last night! i must have slept for 18 hours since yesterday. i feel a little back to my normal self today. I'm also wondering since i haven't taken my normal dosage of v/p's in 2 weeks if most of that is out of my system because i think about it less. or it could be that i'm so effing sick that i'm distracted. i'm hoping for the first one.
i see my doc on thursday so obviously i want answers as to why he thought this route was healthier for me? i want to know why started me out on 8mg? one day i took 10mg and drove my 2 small kids to the zoo! i want to be clear with him that i'm questioning his methods. I NEVER, NEVER EVER had this reaction to my one a day habit. I'm wondering (and it may be stupid naive thinking) if he'd prescribe me either v/p as an anti depressant. it kept me stable and happy. and if he prescribed me monthly, it would still be controlled, a little. and it's not a ton? but i could just stupidly hopeful. i was thinking that one low dose of sub a day vs. one p/v would be the answer. but the side effects don't have much of a differnce except the itchies have worn off. but now i'm losing hair????

so here's my dilemma. I wish i could keep that plan. i only have about 20 v's left and it's getting next to impossible to score them anymore. i've doctor hopped myself out after 8 years and honestly, being a single mom, working a lot, i just don't have the time, energy and especially money. so no matter how you cut it, i need SOMETHING at night to keep me sane and relaxed. My bi-polar meds only keep me stable. i've tried everything too...i'm already in therapy, accupunture and even been getting hypnotized! which, is actually pretty fun. i hope he has a back up plan.
i don't know there is an easy answer, but it's become extremely clear that subs are not for me. my body is telling me no and i tend to take that message seriously. it's also clear that these side effects are way worse than my v/p. it feels like the equivalant of someone having a headache and given this med but then shooting off all your limbs and asking how your headache is?
in the meantime, i have motivation to stay off of everything until i see the p-doc on thrusday. if anything it makes me feel healthy and just fighting the cravings will be my burden and make me a bit depressed. i hope he has a backup plan. and i hope i poop by then!!!! do you have any thoughts? I'm not asking for a where to get drug solution one because it's not legal and sencond because it's not right or fair on a lot of levels. i'm searching for the most healthy lifestyle but to keep me stable and not spiral into a depression. and if you know when i might poop again, i'd appreciate that too, ha.
thanks again.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 5:10 pm 
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Oh my God! I cannot believe what I just read! To think that any doctor would prescribe you ANY amount of suboxone for a 5mg per day habit is completely insane! Believe me honey, this drug is not for you. The reason you aren't thinking so much about your v/p every day as you put it is because your opiate receptors are completely saturated with buprenorphine right now! That is what this drug does, but it is not meant for someone with such a low tolerance. All the symptoms you mentioned are symptoms that come along with a good opiate high. Heck, I used to wait for that good itch to come on after I dosed. Uhhhgggg....I don't want to make you feel bad, because I'm sure you were just trusting what your doctor told you. But he is a complete idiot!!!!!

Okay, so now that you are in this boat let's figure out what to do about it. First off, in my opinion you should not take any more sub. The constipation can be solved with miralax or milk of magnesia. As soon as the sub gets out of your system that will correct itself. The other symptoms should be gone if you haven't taken any in the last day or so.

Here is the cold hard truth that nobody else has told you yet. There is no easy way out of this. I understand that you want that once a day relief from your vicodin. That's how most of us got where we are. But eventually one isn't enough and then you wind up taking 20 a day. You think it's hard to score 30 per month? Wait till your habit increases and you wind up being sick when you can't find them. Seriously, think about what you are doing here. If you can make it with just one 5mg pill a day you are not physically dependent on these things yet. Please quit while you are ahead! No, it will not be easy to quit thinking about that nice buzz you get from them...but I promise you you do not want to go through the hell that is withdrawal if you can keep yourself from it. It sounds to me like God is giving you a wake up call here. Stop looking for the easy answer. Just admit you are beginning to have a problem with pain pills and that you need to give them up. Please don't take this the wrong way...I am not trying to make you feel bad. But you just don't realize what you are getting yourself into here if you continue down your current path. If I was you I would tell the doctor that prescribed the suboxone for you to go screw himself and find a real addiction therapist or something along that lines.

I hope this didn't come across as too harsh. But I really hate to see someone come here looking for help and not tell them the truth. If you keep taking suboxone you are going to wind up SOOOOOO much worse off than you ever dreamed. Let me also say, I am not a suboxone hater at all. It saved my life, I have no doubt. I think it is an amazingly helpful drug for those of us that need it. I just don't think that this is the case here....I really wish you the best of luck. If you can just tough it out for a couple weeks you can be free of all of this stuff and go on and live a normal life. I know it's not easy, but you can do it. It is not to late for you!

Please let us know how you are doing. This really upsets me that you have been put in this position. Good luck, I hope you can find another doctor that can help you detox that actually knows what they are doing.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:42 pm 
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1st of all lots of good karma to all of you! i'm certain that you just helped change my life--because i never would've explored this med the way i have since your posts. not in a million years was i realizing what i was getting myself into.

and absolutely no offense taken. i prefer a realistic point of view. that's why i'm here.
this afternoon i called the suboxone hotline. yep, it's dorky. the counseler about jumped out of his seat with outrage. this doc should NOT have prescribed this med. no doubt i should stop it and i did on saturday. he said after a day or so without any-- all my side effects will go away...including all this poop! i'm so anxious to get this out of my system now! i excersised for 30 minutes and sat in the steam room for 15 to sweat it out. That ALWAYS made a huge difference when i stopped cold turkey. i'm at 48 hours and already feeling normal.

but what he told me was kinda interesting, he said to call a homepathic doctor. for as little as i've been on, i need to identify my deficiencies and they replace those with vitamins/supplements. I know there's no quick fix and i'm coming to terms with it. even if i stuck to 1 every other day or weekends only (which is what i've actually been doing for about a month before the sub) i've never taken more than 1 a day for 8 years. i just need to stop wanting this little fix. I sound like the biggest p-ssy compared to what you all are experiencing.

i know you all are going through prob one of the roughest and most challenging parts of your lives and you deserve a lot of respect for enduring what you're going through.
i go back to this doctor on thursday. i do plan to shame him for what he's done. i hope that makes some of you feel a tiny bit better for all the bad docs out there! I worked in news for 10 years so i'm a pro on how to do my homework and put people in uncomfortable positions for clearly taking advantage and doing the wrong thing.
many thanks and good luck to all of you. i hope each of you get to where you want to be mentally & physically. thanks again.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2013 8:25 pm 
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Oh my goodness Java...I am so glad to hear that!

Also, I would be interested to hear what your results are with the homeopathic doctor. There are lots of us on here who would probably benefit from your findings there. I would love it if you would keep us updated on your progress.

I'm so proud of you for taking action here! Just keep chugging along girl, you will be fine!


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