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 Post subject: Severe Lower Back Pain
PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 12:31 am 
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I was on Suboxone for 7 years and then got off it in March 09. A few months later I got right back on it at a low dose. I was having lower back pain for about 4 years but finally just got insurance. I had an MRI done and was told I have severe arthritus and spinal stenosis with several spurs near my nerves. On a scale from 1 to 10 my pain is a 10. I feel like I can not walk at all the pain is so bad. The Ortho told me to see a pain doc, when I saw the pain doc he wanted to talk to my Suboxone doc about boosting my suboxone dose to help with my pain. I am also taking nerurtion and ibuphrofen 800mg. I am currently on 10mg of suboxone and now the doc wants to get me up to 24mg. My question is have any of you had your dose go up to help with chronic pain and if so did it help? I am also starting therapy, deep tissue massages, acupunture and chiro sessions to see if that helps with the pain. Any advice would be great. Thanks and stay warm out there! Its FREEZING in Illinois!! BURRRRRRRRRRRRR


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 2:15 pm 
I'm sure sorry about your problems with back pain. Back problems are so difficult to address - it seems like it's either surgery, which is usually followed by need for more surgery OR therapy, meds and pain management and most commonly-both! My mother has struggled with these issues for many years and it's difficult to watch her suffering. Fortunately she is not like me and has no problems with opiate addiction and manages her high pain levels with very reasonable amounts of pain meds.
Back to you - I have no experience personally with Suboxone for chronic pain. I have been on it for 5 months to help treat my addiction to pain medication. You mentioned your history only briefly - 7 years on Suboxone and then off for a short time and now back on, if I understand correctly? I'd love to hear more about your experiences coming off Sub after being on it for such a long time. And were you on it for opiate addiction to begin with? What was your drug of choice, etc?
And I'm assuming you were put back on it to treat your pain because of your prior unhealthy relationship with pain mediction. Because from what I've read Suboxone is a pretty crappy pain medication. I know for me, I've had a few incidents of acute pain while I've been on Sub and I didn't feel like the Sub helped at all! However, chronic pain is a different animal and I've seen some of the members of this forum post that they do pretty well on it for their chronic pain issues.
As far as increasing your dose to address your unmanaged pain at this time - I am not optimistic that it's going to help. Suboxone has that 'ceiling effect' which means that after a certain dose is reached there will be zero further effect to be gained by going above that dose (which is usually somewhere around 8mg I think) I am not a doctor and am not an expert on Suboxone or pain management or anything so don't take what I say as gospel. But I did want to respond to your post and welcome you to the forum. Hopefully someone with more experience will chime in for you. Best of luck and keep us updated on your progress!


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 5:48 pm 
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Welcome sunshine -

I hope you are reading the replies to your post. I am with setmefree regarding your experience on getting off Suboxone after 7 years?

As for chronic pain, are you in a pain clinic?

The reason I ask, is that most of the people here don't typically get suboxone for pain management. The reason is it's a partial opiate agonist, and the pain blocking is only partial. It also has a couple of factors - in that it is stronger than other pain killers - so if you are on suboxone 10mg - and you chew up a oxycontin or something - you'll not get any relief. You would have to drop off suboxone and ramp up on a full-agonist pain killer to get more relief.

If you go from 10mg's of Suboxone to 24mg's of suboxone sublingual - the prevailing discussions on forums, and from suboxdoc is that you won't feel any different - but may actually feel more side effects (constipation, etc.)

Maybe there are a lot of folks that get good Chronic Pain relief from suboxone, but most people that post here are in the process of using suboxone to get off other pain killers - for various reasons (one was to use a new device to stimulate the spinal column of the back - but won't allow it with any opiate pain killers in the system).

Thanks for updating us. I personally am very interested in how you came to use suboxone for chronic pain management, (or if you wound up there from dependence/addiction to regular pain killers) - and how you got 'off' suboxone after 7 years.

Good Luck, and please keep on posting!


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 23, 2009 4:50 pm 
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xxsunshinexx wrote:
I was on Suboxone for 7 years and then got off it in March 09. A few months later I got right back on it at a low dose. I was having lower back pain for about 4 years but finally just got insurance. I had an MRI done and was told I have severe arthritus and spinal stenosis with several spurs near my nerves. On a scale from 1 to 10 my pain is a 10. I feel like I can not walk at all the pain is so bad. The Ortho told me to see a pain doc, when I saw the pain doc he wanted to talk to my Suboxone doc about boosting my suboxone dose to help with my pain. I am also taking nerurtion and ibuphrofen 800mg. I am currently on 10mg of suboxone and now the doc wants to get me up to 24mg. My question is have any of you had your dose go up to help with chronic pain and if so did it help? I am also starting therapy, deep tissue massages, acupunture and chiro sessions to see if that helps with the pain. Any advice would be great. Thanks and stay warm out there! Its FREEZING in Illinois!! BURRRRRRRRRRRRR


are u an addict...and if so, does your pain doc know?


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 25, 2009 12:59 am 
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I too have chronic lower back pain from several disk herniations. The pain goes down into my left side, starting with my back, then to my butt (numbness begins), down my thigh, into my knee (where the numbness really progresses), then into my calf and all the way down my foot to the tips of my toes, mainly the first 3. Down in the foot/toes the pain is severe usually and the numbness is ridiculous. It is what got me into this opiate mess. I do not want to have surgery, all though that was what my neurologist wanted, I think I am too young at 26. I do work the pretty much worse job for having a bad back, lots of physical labor but I try to minimize chance for aggrevation the best I can. I exercise regluraly which also helps.

Of course the full agonist opiates worked better for the pain at the correct dose compared to suboxone, because that correct dose for me numbed everything and usaully made me high. And of course we cannot feel our pain if we are passed out as well as numb. I figured I would be taking oxy and stuff for the rest of my life. Well, I am not going to get into it here, but now I am on suboxone as of 6 months ago. Currently at 12 mg per day because of my opiate addiction due to my back/leg pain.

I had to switch dr's a while back and was not on suboxone for about 6 days. I know I was in discomfort from simply going into w/d's, but my back pain was much greater than while I was on suboxone. Upon starting suboxone again, and being with the same dr. for a lil while now, I still have pain EVERY SINGLE DAY OF MY LIFE. Sometimes I want to SCREAM, other times it is much more tolerable. I do know that suboxone must be helping a little bit, because even before I started on opiates in the very begining, I was taking tons of APAP, Asprin, and/or Ibuprofen to try to control my pain, but it NEVER helped especially compared to being on suboxone. It is not like taking 240mg oxy in a hand full, but at the same time I actually do have a clear head and can MANAGE my pain to a tolerable level now with my current 'breakthru' meds: good 'ol asprin or ibuprofen and suboxone.

It is something that I am struggling to manage, but I do manage it. PLUS I am not chasing a tolerance that I can NEVER catch. That is so huge in keeping things under control. I never made my pain pills last to when they were supposed to. BUT with suboxone, I can even sometimes take less than 12 mg, never had to take more for any reason and do not feel the need since being stablized on this dose with my current doctor. I usually take one full 8mg in the morning, then 4 mg in the evening. Sometimes I take all at once in the morning, sometimes I actually break it up to 3-4mg doses per day. Not for the addictive behavior, but because Dr. Junig and actually my doctor as well said that breaking up the doses seem to help some of the chronic pain patients. The 'bad' days I split into 3 doses, if the pain is not as bad, I usually start with full one 8mg in morning leaving the 4mg option later if I do have a severe pain issue or something. Sometimes I cannot even tell the difference, others I can it seems. The otc pain meds do sometimes take the edge off of the pain, but be careful not to take too much of these babies! They can probably hurt us more than the subs can!!

I know this was a bit long, sorry. Just my experiences and opinions from what I have heard and read from. I am not a doctor or expert....just a recovering addict!! Good Luck and take care................Merry Christmas, Happy Holiday's!!

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"The past is finished. There is nothing to be gained by going over it. Whatever it gave us in the experiences it brought us was something we had to know."----Rebecca Beard

"Have no fear of perfection - you'll never reach it." ---Salvador Dali


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:43 am 
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What can cause a person to have a burning searing pain in back and groin and leg? I have had two discectomies,just had a epidural steriod injection.I am experiencing a increase in pain.On a scale of 1-10,I am a 9.If these needles work,how long will this last?After awhile a person gets tired of pain every single day and nothing relieves it.Does back pain ever go away?A person can't even function at everyday things the pain is so intense.Please anyone,answer this question.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:50 am 
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To the above post: (beatherica)

The epidural steroid injections usually lasted about 2-5 months for me, more like 2-2.5 months. The injection procedure left me in pretty bad pain at the injection sites but my actual back/leg pain was about the same for the first 3-5 days. After the 5th day or so my pain levels were dropped a solid 3-4 points (say I was a 9, it usually brought me down to as low as a 5 or 6). STILL IN PAIN EVEN WITH THE EPIDURAL, but not as bad and I was able to function much better. The only problem is that once you are out of pain, sometimes one tends to over work themselves and cause more injury. It can happen, happened to me and some others that I know. If you take it easy like you are supposed to then it probably is a great procedure. When I was getting the epidurals I had decent insurance. I forget what the copay was but it wasn't crazy high. Of course then I became uninsured. The actual cost of the epidural steroid injections for me were never less than $2350 per time. That is why I haven't had one in a while, I cannot afford that per epidrual every few months at the moment anymore. Not to mention I haven't had a MRI in years and I can feel more pain then when I had my first DX, so I know there has to be more damage. I don't blame the epidural's for that at all, its all my fault but just wanted to let you know! If you want some more info, maybe PM me or make a new topic?? I guess it isn't 'nice' to change the topic in someone's own topic....but who am I to judge!!! If you need any help, advice, or whatever I can offer just gimme a shout, or make a new thread and ask the whole forum if you want. I am not a doctor or expert, just a recovering addict in chronic pain. Good luck.....



Sunshine:

What has been going on with your pain and suboxone doctor, and all the issues you posted about a few weeks back?? Have you had any success? Did you switch off of suboxone, or are you still on it? Did you up your dose? Did it help, if you upped it? Have you tried the epidural steroid injection as mentioned?? Also, I have heard of 'facet never deadening', or something along that line....I guess they 'kill' nerves so the pain sensation is not felt, but the nerves (nerve endings? I dunno) do grow back eventually. As little as every few months, or upto a year or more. I haven't had that done yet, don't know if I can/will be able to, for many reasons...but maybe you could?? If you can/want, let us know how everything is! Thanks, and good luck....

_________________
"The past is finished. There is nothing to be gained by going over it. Whatever it gave us in the experiences it brought us was something we had to know."----Rebecca Beard

"Have no fear of perfection - you'll never reach it." ---Salvador Dali


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 1:06 am 
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Welcome, Sunshine,

I went on Suboxone for my opiate addiction that started from my abuse of prescribed pain meds (I have two chronic pain conditions). When I started, they upped me from twice a day to three times a day (total 24mg). The doc said something about needing it more often for chronic pain, regardless of the half-life.

All I know is my pain is so much more manageable now with suboxone than with all those opiates. There are differing thoughts on the subject; however, and some say it isn't great for pain. But with my addiction and life-long pain, I'll be on Suboxone for the long haul. They do supplement my suboxone with a muscle relaxer, but nothing else. The pain isn't gone completely, but it is for the most part manageable. Not a doc or expert, just thought some additional info would help you.

Good luck and keep up posted.

Melissa


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 Post subject: Re :
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:05 am 
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Thanks for sharing your pain. I would like to share my experience with the serious chronic pain. I took all types of medicines for my back pain. Even then I could not tolerate the pain. I was suffering a lot. Finally I found a solution and remedy from Marian massie, with her hypnotherapy treatment. It really changed my life with the painless relief. I am completely relieved. Thanks to her. I visited at marianmassie. com


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