It is currently Sun Jan 22, 2017 2:24 am


All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Our Sponsors





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 3:38 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:35 am
Posts: 4
I have been taking suboxone for almost 3 years now. At first I was on and off for a year, then after breaking up with my ex-girlfriend I stayed on it because it helped with depression more then anything I've taken for depression before. I originally started suboxone due to a really bad fatigue syndrome, as it was the only thing that allowed me to have energy throughout the entire day or 24 hours vs. when using hydrocodone, which only gave me energy for about 4-5 hours. I was prescribed at 8mg a day (which was way too much for me) but ended up only using about 4mg after the first dose of 8mg. Within the past several years I would take random doses depending on how I felt and on how depressed I was. I also stopped seeing the doctor because it was just retarted expensive to see him once a month then pay for the meds. Sadly, it was cheaper getting subs elsewhere threw dealers or online.

Last year I wanted to stop because it wasn't really doing anything anymore for me and instead would only help with my fatigue or depression if I purposely put myself in withdrawals then took it. So I decided to see a psychiatrist and what they could do for me. He was worried about the subs I was buying online, thinking they could be fake or something else and didn't want to prescribe me anything unless I promised him I wouldn't take the meds I got online. He ended up only giving me Gabapentin and Lexapro, and said the Gabapentin would help with the anxiety of not taking the suboxone or worrying about the withdrawals and would calm me down. I never took the Lexapro because I took it a few years ago and when I stopped I had the worse headaches to where it felt like my brain wanted to explode. I filled the Gabapentin script but saved them until I was ready to stop taking suboxone.

Fast forward a year later, still on subs, got down to about 1mg a day at one point but then back up to 4mg (2mg twice a day). I started to hate myself for not being strong enough to stop, it was making me feel suicidal that I had to depend on something. Preventing myself from going on vacations, visiting family, etc. This next part might sound really stupid, but about 3-4 weeks ago, I was flipping threw the Japanese programs on Netflix (I love Japan, lived there for 2 years before I started Suboxone) and I cam across this show "Terrace House". It is a show where they film the lives for 6 Japanese people living in the same house together for 9 months. While watching the show, all I could think about was I would LOVE to be on this show. I started to get this burst of energy and mental strength on stopping suboxone like I've never had before. I was excited about doing this, so I created a taper plan from 4mg to .25mg in three weeks with whatever subs I had left.

Last week on Tuesday morning was the last time I took a sub, but I started to get the anxiety and called the guy I usually get from and figured I would just get some as a 'backup' if I needed it. He told me to come over in an hour, so I did. When I got there, the room smelt like burnt glass and two people were smoking from crack pipes. I held in my breath because I wasn't sure what they were smoking and didn't want it in my system. Then the guy who was suppose to sell me subs is running around his house talking about how someone just tried to rob him and he was holding a bat with this spike headband thing over it. As this is going on I just said to myself I need to leave and never come back. I told them I left my wallet in the car and never looked back.

The first two days were the roughest, but I ended up taking the Gabapentin I had from last year (500mg) when the RLS was the worse. Then my roomate gave me some marijuana when I wanted to go to sleep. I've never been addicted to anything else, I don't drink beer, smoke, etc. So I'm not worried about 'swapping one thing for another'.

Days three and four, I had a short burst of energy and feeling that the wd's were over? Thinking because I tapered down to .25mg that maybe I did it. So I stopped taking the Gabapentin and marijuana.

Day five started out like 3 & 4, but when night time came I had the terrible wd's. Worse then days 1 and 2. I am really contemplating calling to get subs now. All I kept thinking about is I could feel better in 30mins if I just had some but at the same time I felt like a HUGE loser if I caved now. Feeling like a loser trumped wanting to feel better. So I googled what I could do to help with the wd's if anything. Many people said to take immodium, so I looked around the house and had some. I took 5 pills with a large glass of water and amazingly within about an hour the wd's were gone. I was shocked, couldn't believe that it worked. I slept 10 hours this night too.

Day 6 my body felt like shit because I haven't worked out in days. Before quitting I would work out daily, so I drank tons of pre workout to get as much energy as possible. Normally this doesn't even work due to my fatigue issue. It's more of a mental thing then physical when drinking the pre workout for energy. I can drink 4-5 scoops of pre workout and fall asleep 10 mins later with no issues. Once at the gym I felt excited to be out of the house, but also noticed I had huge black/purple eyes in the mirrors. Not sure if this was due to the wd's or lack of sleep/eating. This kind of made me feel self conscious, so did a 35min full body workout and finished with 10mins of cardio. I was so exhausted while doing cardio, this really made me mad because I would normally go for hours but within minutes I felt tired and shaking. Either case, I was sort of happy I got some exercise in. Again on this day, just like day 5, once night time came around I started to feel wd's. Instead of taking the immodium again, I took 500mg of Gabapentin and this helped with the ease of wd's, however it took me AWHILE to fall asleep (about 15 episodes of Vampire Diaries on Netflix).

Day 7, today. Woke up late due to going to sleep late but got about 7-8 hours of sleep in. I want to say that today has been better then all the other days. I was able to clean my house and eat a decent amount of food. It is 11pm now and no wd's all day, so I am hoping I am out of the clear? I am going to make an appointment to see my psychiatrist to see what I can get for depression because I think I am in a fake stage of euphoria being excited I am getting off the suboxone. However, I don't want to take something that I will become dependent on like Lexapro. So I am unsure what they will be able to give me this time. A friend of mine swears by something called Wellbutrin but I am unsure if this will cause issues once I stop as I normally tend to not want to take things after awhile.

That's all I have for now, I have stopped before several times and started again but this time I am mentally strong and HATE how this controlled my life making me feel chained to the ground. I feel this is key for anyone wanting to quit, then planning what to do/take during wd's as long as it isn't something addictive. On Day 4, I did take some kratom tea at a kava/hippi cafe which did make me feel super relaxed but only felt like this could prolong the wd's, so never went back. I might go to a few NA meetings this week but my anxiety and fear on going might stop me, we'll see. It's been about 40mins since I drank my pre-workout to write this post, so I am going to go to the gym and see if I can workout longer this time. Thanks for reading! がんばって!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 3:57 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:42 am
Posts: 3631
That's quite a story.

Your life has been controlled by your mind, not a medication that many people have tapered off to low amounts and stepped off with very little problems. Because most of us taking bupernorphine are physically dependent on it rather than psychologically dependent.

Do you realize that you've listed a whole bunch of problems with fatigue and depression and life and listed several medications plus MJ that you've been on and off, but you've somehow narrowed it down to buprenorphine as the substance that's controlling you? Doesn't it seem like there might be other possibilities?

Kaito, feel free to stick around, share your progress, get support from others, which you will. We just don't put up with a lot of buprenorphine bashing/criticizing here unless you have some scientific evidence to back it up. Just wanted to let you know.

Amy

_________________
Done is better than perfect!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:01 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:03 pm
Posts: 1348
Thanks for sharing Kaito. As Amy wrote, your battle to stop buprenorphine appears, from your post, to be a big part of your life.

Ideally, people get to a point where buprenorphine fades into the background, so that the taper is one small part of life. The problem with a big battle with buprenorphine is that when the battle ends, opioids are still a big issue-- making relapse more likely down the line.

We would suggest thinking of buprenorphine as someone would think of a med for hypertension. Take it each day-- and try not to spend time thinking about how you 'feel'. If those thoughts are always there, you may want to put off tapering until they are less of an issue.

When it is time to taper, consider purchasing the film cutting guide sold by a reader of this forum, and making very small reductions every week or two. Many people write about 'jumping' at some point, but you don't really need to jump. A better approach is to 'slide' off a very small dose.

Of course, you're already at a point where it makes the most sense to remain abstinent-- and so I hope you'll stick around, and use the support when you need it. When you're struggling, let us know-- and we'll cheer you on. You're well over half the way there, so stay with it-- and good luck.


Top
 Profile  
 
Our Sponsors
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:41 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:35 am
Posts: 4
Thanks, it means a lot. Today was another successful day, only took amino acids and advil when needed. It takes me awhile to finally fall asleep, but when I do and wake up I feel okay. I am just struggling with wanting to do stuff, I want to remain in bed all day. Then as the sun sets and it gets dark outside the restlessness starts to kick in like clockwork. This is where temptation is at its worse because I start saying to myself "if I only take a little, it will be okay." When I start to think like that though, I pick up my phone and take a walk playing Pokemon GO with my cat ( yes I walk my cat :lol: ). This helps a little but I feel like the walking increases my anxiety and takes awhile for me to calm down when back home.

Before taking Subs, I did come close to getting H just because it was cheaper then everything I was taking/buying on-top of being stronger then what the docs originally gave me but I saw how bad my friends were that were on it and they all said the same thing, that they wish they never started. Personally I wish I never started subs and just quit cold turkey years ago but I've seen how it has saved many of my friends lives who couldn't kick their habits, so I don't hate the medicine and what it stands for. I just am upset with myself for not thinking about the ladder consequences when I started this venture.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 1:20 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:42 am
Posts: 3631
I love that you and your cat play Pokemon Go! My 18 year old son played it for a while but got frustrated when it stopped working so well? We have a spazzo cat (indoor only) so I doubt she would do very well on a walk.

I know you're disappointed in yourself for going on suboxone instead of going cold turkey. I think it's pretty easy to second guess yourself in this situation, but remember what you've done in the last three years. Were you able to focus on other things besides your obsession to use? Were you able to rebuild relationships and either start working or do a better job at work? Are your finances better? I hope that you also spent some time working with or without a therapist on why you may have been vulnerable to numbing yourself on drugs in the first place. Do you know what your triggers are?

I don't mean to badger you with questions, but I do want you to reflect on what the differences are that you've made in your life the last three years. And I'm not doing this to make suboxone look good. I want you to recognize how far you've come. If you look at the scientific evidence you would have had about a 90 to 95% chance of relapsing if you had tried an abstinence only, cold turkey type of recovery. You probably would have had to go to an inpatient facility to detox and then to keep you away from the outside world. You would have had to white knuckle a recovery and probably relapse several times over the last 3 years. You write that you were pretty close to switching over to heroin when you got on sub. If you had relapsed during the last three years the likelihood is that you would have moved on to heroin.

There's a chance that you would have been among the 5 to 10% of people who don't relapse, but the odds aren't good. The changes made in your brain by addiction are, unfortunately, still there. You will always be vulnerable to relapse because of it. But I bet you have a better chance of staying straight now than you would have had three years ago. You have a rebuilt life to focus on and that helps. You have an opportunity to find a support group if you haven't already. (I recommend SMART Recovery.) You can even find ways to help other addicts if you feel strong enough.

What I'm trying to show you is that your time on suboxone was not wasted time. It's time that you can feel good about living a life in recovery without the obsession and craving for your drug of choice. I think it's better in general if you can look at that period of your life with some pride. I'm proud of you. You have three years of recovery under your belt. That's no small thing.

It's not unusual to have a little anger at this point when you're detoxing. And, although I want you to take personal responsibility for yourself, I would rather you think poorly about the medication right now than about yourself. Just try to keep it off the forum. :)

Amy

_________________
Done is better than perfect!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 10:16 am 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:40 am
Posts: 144
your a lot like me..

for the workout thing let me say this

if you let your body rest and focus on different activities for a week or two .. you'll jump right back, you can push yourself to the limit but you'll be surprised the gains - no sub.

you got this and I couldn't be happier for your recovery , keep pushing !

the fluctuating dopamine levels I experienced were severe for the first little bit,


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 9:04 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:35 am
Posts: 4
Quick update, day 12? I think and it has been SLOWLY getting better. Easier to wake up, still having issues falling asleep. Getting out of bed is 50/50, sometimes it will take 1 or 2 hours or I can get up immediately. I am sneezing a lot too, several times a day I will sneeze uncontrollably for about one whole minute. It's not a bad thing, I actually enjoy sneezing lol but my roommate thinks I have a sneezing problem now.

I stopped drinking my pre workouts because a friend told me that caffeine caused wd's to last longer and would also make it harder for me to fall asleep. So with the lack of energy I've only been going jogging for about 30mins a day, just to get my muscles moving. Lifting weights right now is just impossible but I do random 20x pullups threw out the day when I can.

Today though, was the first day that I was able to sit down and focus on work. I was also able to play Diablo 3 for several hours with some Skype buddies. I've only been taking motrin now, two in the morning and two more if I need them later in the day. Last night, I couldn't fall asleep due to a slight RLS and the RLS just bothered me to the point of giving me anxiety, which made going to sleep worse. I got out of bed, grabbed some Gatorade from the fridge, walked my cat for a bit. Then when I got back inside, I ended up taking two benadryl's. I was worried about taking benadryl before because I thought it was going to make me 'head' tired while I still had too much RLS to where my brain wants to sleep but my body doesn't. However, I had the strangest sensation where it felt like my legs were tingling with warmth. Almost like any area that was trying to be restless was being warmed up. That warmth in my legs made it very relaxing to fall asleep.

I just can't wait until my muscles/joints will start to feel normal so I can be more active. Thanks for all the comments too, it means a lot.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 4:30 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster

Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:40 am
Posts: 144
the rls will be gone soon, its the other issues I had to worry about. I suffered bad stomach pains for quite some time


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:06 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:35 am
Posts: 4
Today (day 13/14?) I felt amazing, almost like my normal self. I had a lot of energy, ate a lot of food and was even able to work out. Still having issues falling asleep, so I am just staying awake until I pass out which has given me time to read books as well ('lunch with buddha', i read 'breakfast with buddha' awhile ago and didn't know the author wrote another and the Lightbringer series).

It's crazy how bad the physical symptoms are for the first 7-10 days and I shake my head at myself for almost caving at one point but I was reading other users journals on going through the withdrawals and just reading how it DOES eventually get better and you DO start to feel normal made me wait it out.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 3:38 am 
Offline
Power Poster
Power Poster
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2016 7:01 pm
Posts: 44
Location: Mid-Atlantic
have you tried melatonin to fall asleep. i take 20mg which is a lot, but you really can't take too much. they are usually 3mg, 5mg or 10mg supplements.

congrats on 7 days!

_________________
death make angels of us all...and give us wings, smooth as raven's claws.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Our Sponsors
Suboxone Forum latest topics RSS feed Subscribe to the entire forum

Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group