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PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 11:04 am 
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i would like all your opinions on if subutex being a single ingredient medication is better than suboxone (and generics) ?

History- I had occasional anxiety prior to opiate abuse. About 3 years into active addiction I started getting severe anxiety & panic attacks.

I started on sub films & was ok for about a year, went to zubsolv and had less anxiety. And better pain control. Now I am wondering if the naloxone is the problem. A friend did some research and found some people are sensitive to the naltrexone in suboxone which can exacerbate anxiety I go to the doctor next week and need to have made up my mind by then.

So my question is what have you all experienced? What is the best maker of subutex?

Thanks in advance


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 1:41 pm 
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Hey Tiki, I don't have an answer for your question, but I do want to mention an idea. I read an article from the Journal of Psychiatry that suggests that patients receiving a daily dose of clonidine with their bupe can possibly help with anxiety. I was wondering if A, you have a supply of clonidine and B, if you would talk to your doctor about getting some, and C, if you would consider trying that regimen for a couple weeks to see if it would help.

The point of the article was not that clonidine helps with anxiety when dosed with bupe. It was more about the fact that dosing them together may potentially result in being able to dose a smaller amount of bupe, and that the clonidine with bupe seems to prolong the abstinent effect of bupe and decrease the stress of the patients. But I am wondering if the anti-anxiety effect of clonidine during withdrawal could also work when you're not in withdrawal. The fact that clonidine is a known benign medication and seeing that the study didn't produce any unfavorable results from dosing bupe and clonidine at the same time makes me think that the combination is safe to try.

But I am not a doctor! My idea is mine alone and should be discussed with your doctor to make sure it would be safe for you. As we know, clonidine is primarily used to lower blood pressure, so if you already have low blood pressure your doctor would probably conclude that this is not a safe regimen for you. It's just an idea from a non-medical person!

Amy

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2015 5:20 pm 
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Amy

Thank you so much for the idea! I take blood pressure meds so I will definitely ask my doctor. It makes sense and I have some from prior tapering and stopping opiates.

Which would you choose if it were you?


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2015 1:56 pm 
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I have only been on bupe meds for about 6 weeks or so, but I know I felt much better on Subutex than I do on suboxone, even though my dose of Subutex was lower. I have been feeling pretty lousy lately, and it started right after I switched to suboxone. I'm taking the stuff right, I'm swallowing as little of it as possible, but I am just miserable. I also wonder if maybe it's just a side effect of what I've been through in the last few months, detoxing myself off methadone in an unreasonable way, and maybe it's just that when I went on subutex, the relief was like a honeymoon period...and now I'm settling down to reality. I don't know, just don't understand why I've been feeling so bad. I don't even want to take the suboxone. I plan on talking to my doctor about it, but I know most doctors won't prescribe it once you are in the "maintainence" phase, and it's not likely he will either.

Also, I took clonidine when I was going thru methadone WD...didn't help one bit. No difference in how I felt, and it didn't reduce my BP or heart rate (which went as high as 135 resting!!) I know other people have said it works for them, but it didn't work for me. Hope it helps you, Tiki.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2015 9:20 pm 
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Laff
Maybe you can convince him to at least give you one month of subutex so you can see if you feel different I was on the films and was forced this January to use a generic by my insurance. I choose zubsolv and found I had less swelling and inflammation (I have arthritis) than on the films. We are all different and I wish it wasn't such a big deal to write for subutex.

I like the zubsolv but want to see if I have less anxiety if I just take bupe. Last month the doc said she had no problem giving me subutex. I go Tuesday. The biggest problem is that it takes so long for them to dissolve

If it were you what would you do?

Thank you for posting. I appreciate it.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 2:26 am 
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I went and saw my Dr today. He put me back on the subutex. Maybe I'm crazy, maybe it's all in my head, but I do feel a difference. Or maybe I'm just having a good day, I don't know. A lot of this is psychological. But even the subutex pills are easier to take - smaller, no yucky orange flavor, dissolve faster. The first subutex generic pills I got were big, white, Percocet size, and took a long time to dissolve. That's what CVS pharmacy has. The ones I have now are fron Rite Aid, much smaller, dissolve really fast.

Maybe prescribing subutex isn't such a big deal, not like I've heard. Also, I still have three 8 mg generic suboxone pills - I wasn't due to refill until Saturday, but my pharmacy went ahead and filled my prescription today. I thought that was strange, usually they want you to be out of one before they fill another, esp. with any type of narcotic.

So which is the zubsolv? Is that just a generic suboxone pill? Does it include the narcan? The generic for suboxone that I was on was a big chalky orange pill. Also, my dr told me that generics are not always as good as the real thing, that even though they say they are, the law allows the pharmaceutical manufacturers to just be " in the range " of the same strength as the non generics - meaning they can be either weaker, or stronger, by as much as 20%, more or less. That's a lot, don't you think?


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 7:34 am 
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Hi laff

Thanks for your help. Zubsolv is a small mint flavored pill that has both bupe & nalxtrone. The amount of bupe is 5.7 & the naltrexone is 1.4. It supposedly has a greater bioavailability that's why there is less bupe. It dissolves easily and tastes good.

I also had my appointment Tuesday. When I started with this doctor it was a good office but the doctor that started the practice has had to bring in a covering doctor as he is unable to come in (long story). I had a 9:30 am appt & ended up being seen at 2:45. Plus the doc was so backed up she wrote my script for zub again. I have to find another doc.

My addiction therapist gave me the name of a really good psychiatrist so I hope he takes me on!

Gotta go. Baby awake


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2015 10:16 am 
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Wow. I rarely even see another person in my doctors waiting room, never wait...in fact, some times I make HIM wait for ME. Can't believe you had to wait that long!! Crazy. And they know they got you over the barrel, cause you have to get your script. Hope you find another doctor soon!


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