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 Post subject: Pregnant and STRUGGLING
PostPosted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:41 pm 
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I am around 30 weeks pregnant with my first and a recovering opiod addict. I have managed to ween down to 2mgs of subutex and now i am taking half that with the intention of completley stopping in about a week. Weening down wasnt hard until now and i am starting to kick, you know, the restlessness. I didnt sleep last night and i couldnt stop crying i was so miserable. I want to go thru this so my baby doesnt have to but I dont know how I am going to get thru. I am also bipolar and not taking any medication so im like beyond emotional. I feel so alone and have no one to talk to. My husband works from 1230-930, I am getting ready to move out of state in with my mom in a week and a half. My house is in a short sale. I havnt packed anything yet...im thinking of just throwing everything out! I just quit smoking and im on the third day after going cold turkey. The guilt was just killing me so I decided to stop but i cant tell you what i would give right now just to have one cigarette. I was reading blogs before from women who were in similar circumstances, being pregnant and weening off the subutex, some stayed on it and the baby was fine. I just dont know what to do. My dr says the withdrawl should only last a few days but im hesitant to believe that. Guilt is just driving me crazy but all this stress i am going thru cant be good for the baby either. logically I know what im doing by stopping these substances is good for the baby, but i have never felt so overwhelmed and emotional. I really need a friend to share with, or advise, or just someone to tell me it will be okay.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 11:20 am 
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Liz,

Hi! Im so sorry your having a tough time. Pregnancy is supposed to be a wonderful/beautiful experience. I hate that it seems as though your not enjoying these last final weeks.

I saw your post last week, and have been reminding myself to respond since I read it. Im pretty busy myself these days.......I just had a baby boy on the Sub ten weeks ago. I do apologize for not getting with you sooner. I KNOW how stressful it can be (being pregnant AND being on opiate maintainance at the same time)

Liz, just know this........taking Sub prescribed by your doctor, is a safe, responsible decision for you AND your baby. Don't let ANYONE make you feel bad about your decision to take control of your addiction and your life by getting on/remaining on the Sub.

I don't have much time today (as Im about to go outta town for the day) but I wanted to get something out to ya, so that you KNOW that you're NOT ALONE and that we care. I'll get back to you ASAP.......but PLEASE look at the pregnancy section. There are alot of helpful/encouraging posts......AND some scary ones too.

Liz, there's NO WAY to tell which babies are gonna have NAS. It seems as though it dosen't matter what dose your on during pregnancy (in regards to whether/not your baby has NAS) I was on 14-16mg of Subutex my entire pregnancy.......and my baby was born perfectly healthy (with only some mild fussiness the day we came home).

IMO, I think its too dangerous for you AND especially your lil baby, to come off Sub right now. You seem to be pretty busy right now, and you'll surely be BUSY once your baby gets here. I don't suggest even reducing your dose right now. It sounds like your having some w/drawl symptoms......THATS NOT GOOD FOR YOUR BABY.

Im not a doctor, just an addict like yourself.......but I really don't want you to endanger yourself/your baby by going into withdrawl. Talk to your OBGYN and your Sub doctor about whats going on. Im sure that neither of them will want you to get off or even taper any more right now. Focus on keeping yourself healthy and HAPPY. Remember, babies feel it too when they're mommies are upset. Please take care of yourself, and like I stated.......I'll get back to ya soon!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 11:35 am 
Hello Liz. I'm sorry for what you're going through right now.....You sound very upset and worried. While I am very impressed at your efforts to take care of your unborn baby, I'm not sure that what you're doing is the best thing. Granted, in a perfect world, all babies would be born with absolutely no exposure to any substances whatsoever while en utero. However, that is not always possible. In fact, there are times in which it isn't even advisable. There are many maternal health issues out there which require exposure of the fetus to medications, many of which no one would even question. For example, a diabetic mother's need for insulin, or a hypertensive mother's need for her blood pressure medication. Yes, I know your situation is different. But not completely.
As far as the cigarette smoking, I would encourage you to keep trying to quit. That is a realistic goal for you to achieve over the next few weeks and I don't know of any adverse effects to your pregnancy that could arise from your quitting. The Subutex is a good bit different, however. I'm pretty sure that there is data out there which strongly discourages stopping Sub during pregnancy. You are 30 weeks pregnant and you could put yourself at risk for premature delivery by stopping it. The physical aspects of stopping any opiate cold-turkey are difficult, to say the least. Not to mention the psychological aspects of it. It's just too much to ask of yourself, in my opinion, to stop the Sub at this point. You have done a good job of getting yourself down to a relatively low dose during your pregnancy and you should be applauded for that. But, again, completely stopping it at this time, is likely not your best option. I am a little surprised that your doctor has not advised you to stay on it until you are much closer to delivery time.
You are right, there are mothers who have delivered babies on Subutex whose babies have no problems whatsoever, and there are others whose babies do show signs of withdrawal and are treated for it. I don't think there is any way to know for certain which category your baby will fall into. While no mother wants her baby to suffer at all, I am pretty sure that whatever suffering would be involved with a baby born with NAS (at full term and with no other problems) would be less than the suffering of a baby born prematurely, and much more time-limited than many of the effects of a preterm birth.
I would just encourage you to try to stop feeling guilty about these things. You have done and are doing the best you can for yourself and your baby. You have quit abusing drugs and you have quit smoking cigarettes and that is HUGE! The best gift you can give your baby at this point (in my opinion) is to get back on your low dose of Subutex and enjoy the remainder of pregnancy, feel well and continue preparing for your baby's birth. The absolute worse thing would be to have quit the Subutex and then find yourself either before or shortly after delivery, relapsed back to opiates. Talk about a shame! That would be a shame for your baby! And for you!
I am not a doctor and I'm not an expert of any kind. There are other stories here on the forum about women's experiences with pregnancy and Subutex.....you should take the time to read those if you haven't already. And speak to your doctor/s again about what is best for you and the baby.
I hope that helps and I hope you'll come back and let us know how you're doing. Congratulations on your pregnancy!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 11:46 am 
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Hi Liz and welcome. I'm not a medical professional, so this is my opinion from one addict and mother to another. I would go back on the 2 mg and stay there if I were you. It's going to be better for the baby for YOU to be healthy and stable. Two mg is a fairly low dose, and if you read the outcomes reported by many of the new mothers here on the forum you will find that their newborns did well and did not have adverse events because of the Sub. You have an awful lot going on, and it's going to be enough to handle without going through withdrawals.
You migut want to go on suboxonetalkzone and read what Dr. Junig says about Sub and pregnancy. You will find it very reassuring. Soon that baby is going to be here and s/he is going to need a healthy Mom - I truly believe that is what is best for a new baby.
Keep us posted,
Lilly


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 1:22 pm 
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Hi, Liz. Sheesh, I relate so much to how you feel. I had a baby on Sub too. I was taking a bunch when I found out I was pregnant, and then I got quickly to 3 mg and stayed there until a week before my c-section, at which time I jumped off because that's what my doc told me to do. My baby was born w/o any w/d.

I'm not sure what you should do, because I'm not a doctor AND it seems like doctors cannot agree of what pregnant women on Sub are supposed to do. My doc told me to stay at 3 mg because if I stopped taking it, I could have a miscarriage. Of course, then he also told me to jump off for that week before surgery, which made no sense, because I would have thought THAT would make me miscarry. I asked him to explain and he said that was what the anesthesiologist said, so........

That week was horrible though. I went into labor and by the time I got to the hospital for my surgery, I was at 7 cm, but I never complained because the w/d was so bad, that was all I was concerned with. To a degree, your baby is going through what you are going through. It is safer for a baby to go through that outside the womb, where doctors can monitor them better and intervene, than inside the womb. If I were you, I'd try taking small doses, probably 1/4 of a mg, at a time and waiting until you start to feel yucky until you take more. When you have a powerful reason to do this, it works very well. This way, you gradually need less and less but you never feel too badly either, which will put less stress on your baby. Also, by taking small doses, you never put too much in your body at any time.

Just a thought :D I know it's hard to believe, but you will soon be to the other side of this and will feel stable again.

laddertipper

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First you take a drink, then the drink takes a drink, then the drink takes you. ~F. Scott Fitzgerald


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:34 pm 
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Oh my ladies i cant tell you how much I appreciate your responses!!! Things really havnt settled down yet Im in the process of packing up my house now and im moving this weekend. I have managed to stay off the cigarettes, i think its been 7 or 8 days. It sucks but I feel proud of myself for providing a smoke free enviornment for my not-yet-born child. As far as the subs i have been so conflicted. My mom the nurse who besides going to Naranon knows nothing of what it feeels like to be an addict, thinks the "right" thing to do is to go off completley for the baby. While I was trying to go with out she said things like she was so proud i was going thru the w/drawal so my baby wouldnt have to. WOW!! talk about the guilt!! I have been emailing my sub dr and i just had an appointment with him and honestly i think hes great but leaving the decision to me. he said hes never heard of someone losing a baby going off 2 mgs of subutex. he keeps saying my w/drawal wont last long and i will get thru it, however, if im really uncomfortable, to keep in mind its not fatal for the baby to be born on the sub. AAAgh!!! I know there are risks and benefits to both decisions. So anyway, i havnt decided exactly what to do. i dont have a new dr yet to where im moving so my dr gave me 2 months worth but i think once im setteled at my moms i may try to cut down to 1 mg. until then i decided to stay at 2 mgs so that w/drawal is not something im worrying about at this moment. i just want desperatley for everything to be ok. thanks again for the responses its very comforting and i have really been considering the advise. I will be updating my situation soon.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:16 pm 
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Liz wrote:
Oh my ladies i cant tell you how much I appreciate your responses!!! Things really havnt settled down yet Im in the process of packing up my house now and im moving this weekend. I have managed to stay off the cigarettes, i think its been 7 or 8 days. It sucks but I feel proud of myself for providing a smoke free enviornment for my not-yet-born child. As far as the subs i have been so conflicted. My mom the nurse who besides going to Naranon knows nothing of what it feeels like to be an addict, thinks the "right" thing to do is to go off completley for the baby. While I was trying to go with out she said things like she was so proud i was going thru the w/drawal so my baby wouldnt have to. WOW!! talk about the guilt!! I have been emailing my sub dr and i just had an appointment with him and honestly i think hes great but leaving the decision to me. he said hes never heard of someone losing a baby going off 2 mgs of subutex. he keeps saying my w/drawal wont last long and i will get thru it, however, if im really uncomfortable, to keep in mind its not fatal for the baby to be born on the sub. AAAgh!!! I know there are risks and benefits to both decisions. So anyway, i havnt decided exactly what to do. i dont have a new dr yet to where im moving so my dr gave me 2 months worth but i think once im setteled at my moms i may try to cut down to 1 mg. until then i decided to stay at 2 mgs so that w/drawal is not something im worrying about at this moment. i just want desperatley for everything to be ok. thanks again for the responses its very comforting and i have really been considering the advise. I will be updating my situation soon.


I just want to tell you again how much I relate. There are no easy answers. That's exactly what I discovered. I mean, I had to go to a fetal specialist in addition to my OB, not just because of the Sub, but because of my complicated history with my non-Sub pregnancies. I'd already decided to follow my doctor's orders and stay on the 3 mg until delivery. This woman at the fetal specialist's office (she was the genetic counselor) was talking to me about my Sub. She said something insinuating I should stop taking it, and I asked her about that, since I'd been told not to stop it. She said, "Well, you have to decide what's more important: the baby or your drug." Seriously, that killed me AND confused me. BTW, she got in trouble, because she was not a doctor and was advising me to go against my doctor's advice. Plus, she really upset me.....

Here's just a thought and take it for what it's worth. If I were you and considering a significant future drop or completely discontinuing, I'd probably try to find the middle of the road and simply reduce my dose if I could. I don't know how in danger you are from cravings and whether you are worried you are going to relapse if you cut down further. If you feel confident that you are in a good place, you could try simply cutting down a small amount, small enough that you don't make yourself uncomfortable and, thus, don't worry on the baby going through that.

I gotta tell you, though, that you are on a relatively small amount. I know there's no promises and no perfect formula, but I'm going to be shocked if your baby has any w/d at all. I am pretty confident in saying that, from all the stories I've read, you are most likely going to have a totally healthy baby. As soon as your baby is born and you see that all is well, this horrible stress and guilt is OVER!!! I'm eager for you to be out of this. It really bothers me to hear of another mom-to-be going through this. Like you said....no easy answers!! We are doing the best we can....

I guess I'd also tend to err on the side of caution and not drop my dose quickly or stop it if I were you. You are already 30 weeks. I had my second (non-Sub) baby at 29 weeks. You are well into the range of where babies will be born and do okay. Of course, you don't want to have a baby early, but my point is that you've gotten into the green zone. The worst thing that could happen is that your baby would have some w/d and then your baby would be given medication and would be fine in the end. So, even the worst case scenario, with your baby having some w/d, ends in everything being okay. Why take any chances by stopping your Sub abruptly? I just wouldn't do it. I stopped mine a week before delivery and I worried the whole time because the stress of my body was pretty significant. I swear it made me go into labor, since I went into labor three weeks before my due date and was so dialated when I went for my surgery and I'd never gone into labor with either of my first two pregnancies. IDK...Just be careful. Even if your baby goes through some NAS, your baby will get through it and go on to be fine. Jumping off Sub makes your blood pressure soar. If your blood pressure soars during pregnancy, they take that so seriously, so I'm really surprised to hear that your doctor would want you to stop taking it.

laddertipper

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First you take a drink, then the drink takes a drink, then the drink takes you. ~F. Scott Fitzgerald


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:07 pm 
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Well im at my moms just beginning to settle in. the move was awful. ive been so stressed and emotional im glad i decided to stay on the sub, well at least for the time being. I drove by myself here (my mom following) with my 65 lb husky in the backseat. after 4 benedryl and 3 1/2 hours he finally laid down!! Being away from my husband is absolutely the hardest part, I have been crying and crying and.... Today i feel very emotionally hung-over. My new thing with this pregnancy is swelling in the ankles and feet. pretty sure tho its because i have been pushing my body too hard.

Im still taking the 2 mgs and it must be from the pregnancy that i still get restlessness sometimes. although if i take the sub it takes away those symptoms. i went onto suboxone dot com and ended up calling them and they were very helpful in finding me a sub dr. that was close and took my insurance. (Highly recommend that to anyone moving to a new area.)

Just want to let you know your blogs and responses have been so helpful. Although i havnt decided 100% if im gonna stay on the sub or try to cut down i have been able to let go of some of the guilt. so for now its all good.


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