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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:57 am 
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I wanted to share my story because I see a lot of pregnant women post on here asking questions about taking suboxone while pregnant. I was told it was safe and that there were no recorded birth defects/problems with baby from the use of Suboxone. First I'd like to say I had a c-section. I lated there for 3 days in excruciating pain because they would not administer pain meds because I was labeled as an addict. I'm given Suboxone because I have chronic pain issues. I've been on it for 5 years and have multiple letters from doctors stating I am not in it for addiction issues. Those were useless. The nurses were rude and judgmental and couldn't possibly make me, a first time mommy feel any worse about taking the medication. My daughter was born at 5lbs exactly and she is now suffering from severe withdrawls. So bad I had to have her transferred to a better hospital that could treat her. She is now in a Neonatal Intensive Care Unit. The nurses falsified my charts stating on top of the Suboxone I was on Norcos and other narcotics even though all my drug tests from the day I found out I was pregnant until me giving birth came up negative. AS Far as where they got this information I couldn't tell you because my last prescription for narcotics was written in 2008. My baby is now being administered Morphine and cannot come home for 2 months. Her heart rate is unstable, her body is tensing up, she has high fevers, cannot keep any formula down, and has lost lots of weight. Her brain did not fully develop either. Its heart breaking....please if you are on Suboxone and can go without while pregnant, please do so because I don't wish this upon anyone. Now the horror of being labeled as an addict had been brought back into my life, the way people treat my is atrocious, and I have to deal with the pain and guilt that my beautiful baby girl is sick and its my fault for listening to doctors telling me not to worry. I hope this gives some insight to you soon to be mommies and that you can prevent this if possible.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:00 pm 
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Hi Markey, I'm so, SO sorry you are going through this. Even if you had been on Suboxone for addiction, it is cruel and outside the bounds of medical protocol to deny a woman having a C-section pain medication. If you have not already, please contact your doctor who prescribes the Sub and tell him what happened.
As far as your baby, Dr. Junig just last week posted about pregnancy/newborns on Sub, and I encourage you to read it on SuboxoneTalkZone.com. There is zero, zip, nada data that correlates Suboxone usage in the mother to either brain or heart defects in the baby. Please stop beating yourself up. Your baby needs you to be OK right now so you can be there and make the best decisions possible for her.
I would strongly suggest you send a copy of your post directly to Dr. Junig. I know in the past he has contacted doctors on someone's behalf in extreme cases. This case may even require a lawyer, as you were denied a minimum standard of care and your medical records were falsified.
I pray that your baby is getting better, and please feel free to post here for support as much as you need to.
Lilly


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:58 pm 
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^ Once upon a time it was encouraged that pregnant women smoke cigarettes. This came from doctors. They though it was relaxing for the baby. Just sayin'.. There really isn't enough information out there yet.


OP- I'm so sorry you went through that and are still going through that despite why or how it happened. I hope that you're little one pulls through. Lillyval is right, you can't beat yourself up. Your baby needs a strong mother right now and you don't know for sure what went awry. Additionally, you've only done as you were told by doctors. I'm so sorry.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:57 pm 
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I can't imagine what you are going through right now. I am so sorry you are dealing with your baby girl's illness and being treated so badly by medical staff.

Lilly is absolutely right that you've been treated so far outside medical protocol that you may need to contact an attorney to protect your rights and to make sure that the hospital in which you gave birth be held accountable for their actions.

It is true that there is no current evidence to show that suboxone affects the neurological development of babies, but I'm sure that is scant consolation to someone facing the battle you face. There are so many things that can affect the neurological development of a fetus that it is difficult to say why your baby's brain is underdeveloped. It could be that it was the suboxone. It could be that it was something different that was completely beyond your control. It's so hard to know.

Obviously, if your baby is suffering from withdrawal symptoms it's from the sub. Is it normal for babies in withdrawal to have high fevers? I hadn't heard of that. Are you still lactating? It could be that your milk would be more easily digested than formula for your baby. Or maybe you could try milk from a breast milk bank?

Again, I'm so sorry that you and your baby are going through this! It's heartbreaking to watch your child suffer. I pray that she gets better very soon!

Amy

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 12:37 am 
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Congrats on your baby girl and im so sorry you and she are going through this right now, its a mothers worst nightmare.
My daughter is now 8 months old and I took sub throughout my whole pregnancy, I started out at 12mg and by the end of my pregnancy was up to 16-24mg cue to my blood volume increasing. I understand this happening may bother you a bit more because like you said, you were not on this drug for addiction. Others, like myself for example are on this drug for addiction. I chose to stay on subs throughout my pregnancy and take the chance that my baby be born dependent because to many with addiction problems, that small chance of NAS is way better then going off sub and risking a relapse. Addiction is life or death for alot of us. What was best for me and my unborn child was to remain on subs. My daughter was born happy and healthy, she was almost 7lbs and had no withdrawal whatsoever. More babies than not born on this drug are born withdrawal free. I do also believe that a stigma is put on us for being on subs during labor and delievery.. Ive heard stories of being treated badly, nurses claiming the baby was in withdrawal when he/she wasnt or making the tiny bit of withdrawal the baby did have out to be much worse, when you said the nurse lied about what you were taking it reminded me of that. If I was you and I dont know your circumstances at all, im just giving you my opinion based on what you said but if I were you I would educate myself on what the withdrawal symptoms actually are in newborns and learn everything you can pertaining to NAS because honestly from what you said im kind of wondering if the nurses are just claiming your daughter is in severe withdrawals just because they have a problems with people they think are "junkies" (that would explain them lying). Some of the symptoms you mentioned to me dont match up with newborn withdrawal symptoms and I would definitely be questioning whether or not there wasnt something else wrong.. You definitelt do not want your daughter put on morphine or any other narcotic unless its absolutely needed.. definitely educate yourself on all this and make sure withdrawal is definitely whats going on.. Also trying the breastfeeding is a GREAT idea, especially since your little one is sick and breastmilk is the best thing you can give her.. dont worry, there are only trace amounts of sub found in breastmilk so basically nothing will be passing to your daughter. PLEASE look into everything though and make sure your doctors and nurses arent looking over another medical problem because they cant see past the suboxone and wanna blame everything on withdrawal.
I wish you and your daughter the very best and send my prayers.. remember, either way YOU DID NOTHING WRONG.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:10 pm 
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Thank you all for your kind words, thoughts, prayers, and opinions. I am stating as strong as possible but st times I cannot even look her father in the eyes because his unspoken words are enough. I did not produce breast milk so for now I am going to leave her on formula. I will however look into everything that everyone has suggested. Just seeing my baby ask drugged up and "out of it" is so heart wrenching. I asked them to cease the meds but at third point a social either is involved and I do not have much day. My sub doctor did fax ask of my negative stuff tests over to them and he is going to make some calls to the hospital about the staff and their treatment toward me. Also threw cardiologist that came in to give her an EKG and Echo told me straight out, I don't think she is withdrawing. He sat with her through 4 feedings, and feels that the nurses are claiming every cry, hiccup, stretch, and spit up is withdraw even though I've seen plenty of healthy babies do that. She didn't cry much and when she does the nurse would say "that is a detoxing cry". So apparently she should be crying 24/7? She has never cried for more than 30 seconds straight, and when she does its because she's hungry or needs to be changed. She did smile at me today....it did wonders for me. Its hard to stay strong but I have no other option because now I have to be there for her.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:12 pm 
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I apologize for the typos, I'm Swyping. I was trying to say a social worker is involved


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 12:41 am 
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I'm very glad that your sub doctor is going to advocate for you! It's pretty impressive that the cardiologist who checked on your baby doesn't think withdrawal is the problem. To me it seems that the nurses are just finding what they want to see, which is terrible nursing!

Hang in there! I'm so glad you got a little smile out of your baby girl! Moments like that are precious!

Amy

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:45 am 
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That just sickens me that you have other doctors telling you they dont think its withdrawal and that poor baby is on morphine.. I dont know what I would do in your situation.. Is there any way you can get her into a different hospital? Get another doctor to evaluate her? something? I dont understand why a social worker is involved either, even if you were on sub for addiction purposes no sockial worker should be involved unless they can furnish some type of proof you were using some other substance. I would sue the sh*t out of that hospital for everything you did and are going through now, for lying.. Just EVERYTHING.. I would definitely make sure no other mother had to ever go through the same situation. Morphine should NEVER be given to a baby that they are not positive is in SEVERE withdrawals. I feel so terrible for you and your precious daughter, I wish I could go to that hospital myself. PLEASE for your daughter make sure you do EVERYTHING you can to make sure her diagnosis is correct and make sure she is not in that place longer than she has to be.. If she is not withdrawing, they are forcing an innocent, healthy baby to become dependant on morphine. DEFINITELY get another opinion. Please keep us updated, im sure I speak for everyone here when I say we will support you through this.. none of this was your fault.. Prayers are with you and your daughter :)


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:39 am 
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I don't mean to impose here but reading last few days has been interesting. As for what happened I wanted send my sympathy. I just wanted to share my thoughts with you after reading your post. Ok were you prescribed suboxone for pain or the lower dose Buprenorphine for chronic pain? From what i understand High dose/Suboxone can not be use for chronic pain. Are you sure you were not Prescribed the microgram dose of buprenorphine such as butrans or buprenex?

It wouldn't surprise me if the medical staff just seen Buprenorphine then a nurse writes down suboxone not realizing or caring enough to get the dose facts right just because buprenorphine is on the record and assuming you are an addict, stigmatizing buprenorphrphine with addiction not knowing that there are buprenorphine applications indicated for chronic pain.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:42 am 
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Lawsuit time is later. Right now you need to ensure the best care possible for your baby. Please enlist that cardiologist and your Sub doctor as your allies. Maybe the cardiologist can talk to the doc ordering the morphine and change his mind. The nurses, no matter how judgmental they are, cannot give morphine without a doctors order, period.

I'm also thinking tha maybe since the nurses are so set on punishing you for being on Suboxone, that maybe they have overstated other things as well. What are they basing the brain underdevelopment diagnosis on? Usually it is not until infants fail to reach certain milestones during the the first 6-12 mos. that they are looked at for developmental issues. It could be that a lot of her issues are things that many low birth weight babies face. So definitely stay hopeful.

Try to stay in communication with the DOCTORS and don't get into debating the nurses, who already have their minds made up. State calmly and professionally that you do not want your baby on morphine. And by all means DOCUMENT everything that is happening (even in a pocket journal) because you will want to get a lawyer at some point.

And I know it's hard, but don't forget to take ars of yourself - you just had surgery.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:24 am 
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Ditto very strongly everything Lily just said!


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:27 pm 
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I was on suboxone for a year and a half before getting pregnant and they switched me to subutex. I was going to a midwife who was really judgmental about the subutex. She made me feel so bad I would leave every appointment crying..she told me to immediately get off the subs and that it would have no effect on the baby. She sent me to a specialist, probably thinking he would tell me the same thing and he told me NOT to stop taking it. He said the withdrawals could kill the baby. He said when you go through withdrawals while pregnant there is nothing they can do for the baby..but when you have the baby and it goes through withdraws they can help and watch the baby. I went to many different doctors and they all agreed on this. Well besides the midwife. They also said subutex has no effect on the baby besides the withdrawals..I don't know if that's true. It sucks to be judged by all the doctors and nurses. I felt that way too. they tested me and the baby in the hospital and subutex didn't show up. I told them about it anyways so they could watch her for withdrawals and some one called child services. They came in and talked to me for a few minutes and 5 months later I've still never heard from them. I hope they leave you alone too. I don't see how its there business..when your taking what is prescribed to you.

I don't think my daughter went through any withdrawals..I guess sometimes even people on a high dose have babys with no withdrawals and people on a low dose can have babies with severe withdraws. Don't blame yourself and don't let anyone make you feel guilty. I hope your little one gets better soon.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 2:35 am 
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I have been on 16Mg of Suboxone for 4+ years. The last year they put me of 20mg because my pain in worse during the colder seasons. From what I was told about Subitem, the withdrawal from the Naloxone could cause miscarriage, so I was advised to stay on Suboxone. Now from what I'm told, they are giving her the morphine when she is fussy. Really? Fussiness now constitutes as withdrawl? This is the 3rd doctor that has looked at her and it seems no matter what sign she shows its due to "withdrawal". Its sickening...not to mention reach nurse handles her differently as far as feeding and calming and if she doesn't act according to that nurses liking, they give her a high Nas score which puts her that far away from coming home. I see her 16-18 hours or of the day...itseems the only time she doesn't do well our gets a high scoring is when I'm not there. She is acting like a normal newborn. I'm not sure about the brain issue bite she lost weight, some if it was in her head but they are having problems feeding her. I side feed her and have not had an issue with her not reading or spitting up. The cardiologist and suboxone doctor told me they would do anything I need them to. I just don't get it...she is acting like a normal thatnewborn and there is . no reason why she cannot come home. I am documenting EVERYTHING,.including the inconsistencies between the nurses. I feel like they are keeping her for no reason. All the different nurses tell me how excited they get when their shift starts and they are assigned to tale care of Gracie because she is so adorable, not to mention easy to take care of her because there is NOTHING wrong with her. Point being, I don't care how excited you are, she has no business being there. I'm exhausted, I haven't slept since I had her and the runnng back and forth to the hospital, plus day to day things that need to be taken care of...its just all so stressful and exhausting. I'm so angry and there is nothing I can do to get her released. I just hope this ends soon, from there I'm going to hit this hospital with something they've never seen before


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 3:45 pm 
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Ive never been through this so I dont know if its possible but I would try to get her transferred to a different hospital.. from what you have said I DO NOT think your daughter is in withdrawal and if thats the case they have put a newborn on morphine for no reason and her care is being compromised. If I was you though I would gather as much info and evidence that I could and this hospital would definitely have a lawsuit against them as soon as this was over. I would feel it was my job to make sure no other mother or child has to go through this again. Please stay strong for your daughter though and take care of yourself.. DOCUMENT EVERYTHING POSSIBLE and then do whatever humanly possible to make sure this never happens again but take care of you and that baby for now.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 1:20 am 
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I did have her transferred, had in dept conversations with the new doctors and they are testing her the same. They also did not remove the medicine the original hospital "claimed" I was on. What a mess! They are bringing her morphine dosage down slowly because apparently they gave it to her when they told me they weren't going to, now she is dependent on it. I cannot get away from the addict stereotype and she's suffering for it. I don't know what to do at this point but wait. Now my boyfriend/her father is telling me this is all my fault and I intentionally poisoned our daughter and I'm disgusting for bring so selfish. The blows keep coming


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:00 am 
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Your boyfriend is obviously reacting in his pain, fear, and helplessness, and you are the target of all of his uncomfortable feelings. While it's understandable that he needs an outlet for his feelings, it's a damn shame that he's chosen you as his outlet. Please stand up for yourself!

Tell your boyfriend that you understand why he's upset, but that you've done nothing but follow your doctor's orders! Tell him that you wish things were different too, but blaming you is not going to help.

You take care of yourself!

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:27 pm 
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This is my first time posting or replying; I am new to this forum, but not new to suboxone. One of the main reasons I have been reading through here is me being worried about being pregnant. I have an 8 year old daughter that I had when I was 17, and now I am at a point in my life where I would want to actually plan for a child ( finances are in order and my fiance and I are on the same page with it). But I have been on suboxone for a year and a half. I share my script with my fiance b/c he has insurance through his job.
It has literally been keeping me up at nights worrying about this. We want to get pregnant soon, since my daughter is already 8, I didn't want to have to wait too much longer to grow our family. But I didn't know how safe it would be for me to stay on suboxone while pregnant. And I am definitely not ready to get off of it completely. So reading through so many testimonials of pregnant women on subs and having a healthy newborn really put my mind at ease to an extent. Yours is the first post I have read with a bad experience.
I am so sorry that this happened to you and I am completely horrified. My worst nightmare would be if my child was born into this world having to overcome an addiction and withdraws because of me. But after reading more, it seems to me that your baby might not even be going through withdraws... If you see your baby happy and looking healthy, and not seeming like she is in any pain, then that would take a huge weight off my shoulders. Just to know that your child isn't suffering is great news. I know you may not be able to see this now, but I would rather be in your situation, than be in a situation where my baby actually was detoxing and obviously in pain and always uncomfortable. Now putting up with nurses that are judgmental and lying and all-around horrible to you is a whole other challenge to deal with, but eventually you will overcome this. As long as you know in your heart that your baby is happy and healthy, then all the other problems with hospital staff is just a stressful situation that will be over eventually.
You did absolutely nothing wrong by following doctors advise. Just try and stay positive no matter how hard it may be , and think about the moment when you will be able to bring her home with you and love and care for her and be a great mother to her. And think about how you will have a big, nice new house to grow up in, and college paid for, when you get a settlement when you sue the hell out of this hospital!!
As for your boyfriend, I'm sure all it is is nerves or him being worried about the health of his baby, and him needing to place the blame somewhere. It's horrible that you don't have him on your side and supporting you and having your back. I'm sure it would make things a whole lot easier if he was.
It gets to a point where you're going to have to do your best and block out everything negatively affecting you. Easier said than done, I know.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 10:48 am 
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I am so incredibly sorry for what you are going through. The whole situation sounds like the nurses are too busy being gossip queens and steryotypical bi***es towards you that they're main job, TO NURSE, has gone out the window. Praying for a good update from you soon. This baby will be coming home to you. I am so thankful for all the good advice that has come your way and listen to them carefully. Your family will be okay. NONE of this is your fault. You are being the best mother you can. Who can ask for more.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 11:02 am 
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I have been under so much judgment and stress. I am 14 weeks prego and the sub dr has been the most judgemental and rude in my experiences so far. And my husband and I are having a hard time getting along thru all of this stress. My point is, how are you doing? Is your baby home/better. What's the news?


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