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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 4:42 am 
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Being over 50, I am getting arthritis in both shoulders. When I mentioned this to my caseworker, I asked what to use for the pain as aspirin/paracetamol/ibuprofen do nothing and i can't take an opiate. He suggested DICLOFENAC, which is marketed under the trade name VOLTAROL in the UK and VOLTAREN in the US and Australia. It is a NSAID ( non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug).This comes as tablets or as a topical gel, I have had both and they are very effective at damping down the pain, which can be bad enough to keep me awake some nights. See this link for more info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diclofenac
I have searched the web for articles on possible dependency on this drug, but have so far found nothing. However, I would be cautious. The drug companies would have us believe that EVERYTHING they sell is totally safe, until the casualties start suing them. I have kept my own use of this stuff to a bare minimum, using the gel only on nights when the pain is simply unbearable ( it works a treat!) . The only time I took the tablets was during a hospital stay in the summer of 2009, and found a single tab works very well also. One tablet contains diclofenac potassium 12.5mg. This is an OTC (over the counter) medication in the UK.
I hope this information will be useful to some of you who are suffering chronic pain, we have suffered enough already.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 7:48 am 
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Hi sneaky,

I've never heard of this! Thanks for sharing this information. As someone with chronic pain issues, this may provide a ray of hope.

I'd love to hear what Dr. J has to say about this.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 9:22 am 
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Thanks! I am quite interested and this is something that might actually work for my condition to some extent. Or maybe even ease some of the pain a little bit. I will check it out.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 11:37 am 
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Thanks Sneaky! That was interesting. I am going to read elsewhere besides your link to see what else I can find about it. But the 'Wiki' link was great. So, from the sounds of it, there should be less stomach problems compared to say ibuprofen or naproxen (Rx strengths) or other NSAID's? Plus it says it last longer 6-8 hours approx until next dose, so like 3 doses a day, hypothetically (sp). I was wondering, with several disk herniations and sciatica issues, would it be of use to me? How about the topical form? I would assume that the pills would be but I don't know about the topical. I am willing to try anything to get out of pain except come off of Suboxone and back to full agonists (and/or dope) AND I will not get surgery yet. I have had success with Melissa's advice and links for Guided Imagery, but I am always looking for other meds I could take as well. I already max out on Ibuprofen's usually every day. Naproxen isn't for me. I could go on with a list of meds, but why bother. I have one of those "inversion table's" that does actually help, but only when I am on it and inverted. Once I come off, it is right back to the pain, and it always 'seems' worse after I am inverted because for those 5-30 minutes I am actually almost 'pain free'. Well, I am WAY off topic. Whoops!

Thanks!

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 9:26 pm 
I think Voltaren works pretty well. My mother was prescribed it around 5 years ago for her bad back (failed fusions, etc) and had good luck with it. I've taken it a few times as well for back pain and sciatic nerve pain and it worked much better than OTC ibuprofen or naproxen. I'm kind of surprised no doctor has ever tried you on it BigRed.....might be worth a try. I don't think there is much, if any, abuse potential there. It did absolutely nothing to me or my mom, mood-wise.
By the way, speaking of my mother....craziest thing - the woman has had these problems with her back for years and years, has had several major back surgeries and opiate med exposure, yet has not become addicted!! The most she's ever taken is 1 - 10mg hydrocodone twice a day. They tried her on the lowest dose Fentanyl patch and she was sick as a dog....seems like her tolerance has barely increased over a good 10 years of opiate use! Crazy, huh?! Then there's me!! lol!!


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:48 pm 
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Setmefree: That is great that your mom is able to get relief from such small doses. I WISH that I could have ended up with a max 20 mg hydrocodone per day 'habit' (not really a 'habit', but you know what I mean) after the 10 years of my opiate history compared to what I actually ended up on. Your mom is so lucky/strong! I am sure you too think, man, if only I could! I know I do!! Now I say, "if only I could 'not remember' what an opiate/opioid maked me feel like", but "that aint happenin (as so correctly said)". Well, thats why we have Suboxone and this forum and our family/friends/support I guess.....

Anyway, since I have looked into Voltaren/Diclofenac (sp?) after sneaky had brought it to my attention and having heard some others experiences with it, I have decided to see my neurologist when I get some more free time/extra funds and suggest it to him and see what he says. I haven't seen my neurologist since my last pain med script a while ago, so I don't know how that will go. Plus I am SURE he will want to write the 'usual' script and I am not sure what to say to that. I hate lying anymore, but I DO NOT want to let him know about my addiction and Suboxone treatment. I would just want to try other, non narcotic pain meds. I guess I could always find a different doctor, but paying all cash, no insurance at all, can get very expensive when seeing multiple doctors (not 'doctor shopping').

Well, thanks for the info sneaky and setmefree, I will most definitely try to pursue the 'voltaren/diclofenac' to see if it would be of any help for my pain.

This probably isn't the place for it, but would a muscle relaxer help with disk herniations/sciatica pain (left leg)? I know any anti-inflammatory (spelling, again!?) drugs seemed to work rather well for me. Oral prednisone, epidural steriod injections, ibuprofen (limited tho), plus a few others. Of course muscle relaxers don't help with that sense (with inflamation), but I was curious because currently I do not take any, but I have an old script (legal and filled) of 800 mg 'skelaxin'. I used to get 10 mg flexeril, but haven't in a while. I was always so 'doped up' on pain meds (so many different ones) while taking the muscle relaxers that I don't know if they would really do anything for me now, being just on Suboxone. The real reason why I haven't taken any yet, is because even though I know they are my script, they are from like 10 months ago or so and its not like my current doctor has me on them right now. I am not worried about any interactions with the suboxone, but I am almost 'fighting with myself' if it is 'ok' to take them. I know they aren't percs, or oxy's or whatever, but maybe it is because they are not scripted from my current doctor that I see now (the only one at the moment, my suboxone doctor....I haven't seen pain doctor the neurologist, in months) ..... I dunno

Thanks all, take care!

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 8:35 am 
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Big Red,

I think you're wise to hold off taking the old muscle relaxers until talking with your current doctor. Some people do abuse muscle relaxers, but that's not to mean that you (or any of us) necessarily will. Different strokes for different folks.

When it comes to your neurologist, try just asking for non-narcotics without a detailed explanation of your addiction. But then you're kind of opening up a can of worms by him/her not knowing all the meds you're taking. But it's ultimately your decision whether or not to share that personal information.

Personally, I take zanaflex and it absolutely helps my pain, but honestly, I have no idea if it will help your back pain. But I think it's worth a shot though, don't you?

I know what you mean about different doctors. I have my family doc/suboxone doctor, rheumatologist, dermatologist, urologist, and gynecologist - oh, and my psychiatrist. And they all prescribe me something! What a mess.

Let us know what happens with your neurologist. I plan to ask my rheumy tomorrow about the Voltaren (sp?). We'll see...

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 10:26 am 
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Melissa, thanks for the advice! The last thing I would want to do is have to start from square one again, with another pill addiction... I can say that I would never have had a script of any pain med just lying around. The fact that I have been able to hold on the the muscle relaxers and really not even think about them too much says a lot for me! But, I will be careful and for know I prob won't take them. Please let us/me know what your Dr. says about going on the Voltaren and how that works out if you do go on it. As for the zanaflex, I am going to have to look into that cause I never been on that and only heard about it a couple of times. Another possibility is always welcome! I will check it out.....

Thanks!

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 11:05 am 
I agree - you're right to be wary of muscle relaxers. I would advise you not to touch Soma (carisprodol.) It has a very high abuse potential. Many doctors won't even prescribe it these days because of the potential for abuse and the fact that there are better muscle relaxers out there. I can take Flexeril with no problem....doesn't even make me sleepy. But I've heard of others who 'feel' something from it and abuse it. My Subox doc actually prescribed me the flexeril for my back, so apparently he's okay with it. I have to say, though, it didn't help my back a whole lot. I have taken Skelaxin before and didn't feel anything with it either. My mom takes Zanaflex which seems to help but does make her sleepy.
So I don't know, I'm thinking it wouldn't hurt to try a muscle relaxer because it really might help with your back. I know you really suffer with it. On the other hand....be a little bit careful.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 7:48 pm 
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Thanks setmefree for the insight. I have taken the skelaxin (I have been scripted first robaxin, then flexeril, and lastly skelaxin) before, but never on just suboxone like now. I am going to hold off on the skelaxin for the time being just to be safe. I will talk to my suboxone doctor in a couple weeks about them and see what he says. Also, if I do see a different doctor for my back then I will be bring up all the different meds that you guys have mentioned. I did a quick google of zanaflex and that could be another possibility (thanks Melissa, setmefree). I guess what I have concluded for now is that since my muscles aren't really the source of my pain, then maybe a muscle relaxer wouldn't be as beneficial as I first thaught (until I speak to a doctor anyway). I know that besides narcotics, the anit-inflammatory meds are what works best for pain for me, so until I do see a doctor I will stick to the OTC pain meds (ibuprofen or naproxen...yippie!). I seriously think that unless it was an opiate feeling, I don't think the skelaxin would make me crave and return to active addiction, but that is exactly the thinking that can seriously screw me! Thats why I am being safe and just waiting. Even though the facts that they still sit, right now 4 feet from me, for nearly a year and after I have been through the couple 'bouts' of pain recently, I really think they wouldn't be a problem. Again, I will not take them for now, at least until I talk to the Dr., or someone says that they are the 'ideal' med to help with my back pain at the moment! Doubt thats gonna happen! So cheers to the naproxen today! (every week I usualy switch between naproxen then ibuprofen then back and forth and etc..... sometimes tylenol but rarely since now-a-days I try to be nice to my liver, and also rarely asprin, but NEVER asprin with the NSAID's).

Thanks so much every one for your ideas and suggestions!

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"Have no fear of perfection - you'll never reach it." ---Salvador Dali


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 7:45 am 
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Found another really great page of info on Voltaren:

http://www.drugs.com/mtm/voltaren.html

I take ibuprofen often for headaches, so I'm thinking I may not be a good candidate for this. Also it says don't take it if you smoke, which I do.

Great information though, thanks again for providing it.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:10 am 
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I use Volt on occasion when my shoulder is bothering me. It's no miracle cream, but it does take the edge off the burning pain I get.

I was given several sample tubes of the gel and told it was kind of like a gel version of Advil. I thought that was great, because Advil/Ibuprofen has always done a decent job with muscle and bone pain.

The verdict: It's ok. It helps, but it doesn't "make it go away". depending where your pain is, you may need a partner rub it in for you, If not, a spatula can work. It's nice because it's a gel and not a cream, so it doesn't leave an oily residue.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 2:33 am 
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I know this is a very old thread but it peeked my interest as I myself am always looking for ways of combating pain without the use of opiates, besides suboxone of course.

I don't know if anyone had noticed this but after some searching on Voltaren......

"This medicine can increase your risk of life-threatening heart or circulation problems, including heart attack or stroke. This risk will increase the longer you use Voltaren.

I don't know if I like the sound of that. I guess they have to state all the necessary procautions, even if only .001% were found to have suffered one of these problems as a direct result of this drug. Just thought I'd throw that out there.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:49 am 
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I'm actually glad you revived this thread, because lately I've been hearing about people taking Ultram along with suboxone for chronic pain. Now this hasn't come from a doctor or any medical journals/articles/research, so I was hoping anyone who has info about this could chime in. I'd especially like to hear Dr. Junig's take on this. For me, even if it was possible I think I'd still try to get high off them, so it wouldn't be a good choice, but that's just me. It could very well work well for other people. Because for those of us who are trying to treat chronic pain with suboxone, it's always good to find alternatives/other methods.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:35 am 
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Thank you for the enlightening post! I too am a chronic pain sufferer and am on a muscle relaxer (Soma actually) however I couldn't imagine intentionally trying to abuse the stuff though. I should mention that I have been successfully taking Suboxone and well stabilized for the last 8 years without relapse but I was on some pretty hefty pain meds too before that.(hydromorphone) I will say that if you have abused prescription muscle relaxants then I would certainly refrain from them or anything with abuse potential. I am interested in that med in the first post and hope there is an American equivalent. I suffer from mid-stage liver disease, Hep-C and traumatic arthritis so Tylenol and motrin are very dangerous to me. God Bless and thank all of you for being there for me/us.


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 Post subject: Zanaflex
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:24 pm 
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Hey Hatmaker, glad to hear someone else but me is taking zanaflex. I've been on it about 6 months now it still works great for me. I am prescribed 4 mgs 3 times a day but I only take 2 mgs at bedtime. 4 if i had a really bad day. It knocks me out. I guess that's why it works so well. I didn't know if I could take it with suboxone but my pharmacist said it was ok. I didn't think to ask my dr about it. Sometimes I think the pharmacists knows more than the drs. Have a good one thogan.


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 Post subject: volt
PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 12:49 am 
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I have tubes of the stuff and found it worthless. I wish it did something. It smells horrible and I am sure it causes cancer.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 4:07 pm 
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Be careful with anything over the counter. I seriously was taking close to ten advil a day at one point, which was not a good idea. It seems to me like with some of these pain pills they just leave me looking for a little more relief. It's scary.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2016 4:36 am 
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BigRed wrote:
Thanks Sneaky! That was interesting. I am going to read elsewhere besides your link to see what else I can find about it. But the 'Wiki' link was great. So, from the sounds of it, there should be less stomach problems compared to say ibuprofen or naproxen (Rx strengths) or other NSAID's? Plus it says it last longer 6-8 hours approx until next dose, so like 3 doses a day, hypothetically (sp). I was wondering, with several disk herniations and sciatica issues, would it be of use to me? How about the topical form? I would assume that the pills would be but I don't know about the topical. I am willing to try anything to get out of pain except come off of Suboxone and back to full agonists (and/or dope) AND I will not get surgery yet. I have had success with Melissa's advice and links for Guided Imagery, but I am always looking for other meds I could take as well. I already max out on Ibuprofen's usually every day. Naproxen isn't for me. I could go on with a list of meds, but why bother. I have one of those " best inversion table reviews 2017 's" that does actually help, but only when I am on it and inverted. Once I come off, it is right back to the pain, and it always 'seems' worse after I am inverted because for those 5-30 minutes I am actually almost 'pain free'. Well, I am WAY off topic. Whoops!

Thanks!


I am surprised to know that inversion table did not helped you. Will you please share some of your exercise routines you have been doing with inversion table?


Last edited by Quinnow on Wed Nov 30, 2016 1:23 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2016 12:50 pm 
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Quinnow,

Don't expect an answer anytime soon. If you look in the top right corner of the page you'll see this thread started in 2010 and ended in 2011. The members have probably moved on with the exception of Hatmaker, who pops in from time to time.

For me, my doctor said take 2 Aleve and 2 Tramadols for my neck & back pain, add in arthritis now and that did the trick. Now my insurance company, BCBS, sent him a letter asking him not to prescribe Tramadol as it is considered an opiate, albeit a very weak one. No way a Suboxone/Buprenorphine patient would ever feel the effects of the drug. Meaning, I used to be addicted to Tramadol but while on Suboxone I only used 2 scripts per year of 30 each. Now it's just Aleve which is okay by me. It still pisses me off though.

A good topic to bring up top again. Welcome to the forum!

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