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PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 10:42 am 
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Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 2:37 pm
Posts: 53
Hi All,

I've really been enjoying this site, reading many posts and getting a lot of questions answered.
Perhaps more amazing is that I actually have made it to day #5 post-Jump with only collateral
damage. I had very little sub in my system, so the w/d's were almost immediate. Luckily I have
all the Rx's I need for comfort.

Perhaps the answer to my question is obvious, but all the same anything but goes...

We all know about PAWS, and how it does go on for quite some time. And also that activity, especially
excercise can be critical to recovery. Also relationships, interaction, and therapy.
So once we jump, the question is, what next ?? Even on sub, I was altered or "maintained".

Most addicts, I think, have work, family, friends, church, 12 step meetings, etc. as a support system.
And I think that becomes pretty important once you face that big huge donut hole where opes or
sub used to Loneliness, emptiness, apathy, negative thinking, and perhaps all of these
things under the guise of "clinical depression", or PAWS for that matter.

When you're a loner (sorry ladies), it's pretty rough, especially from the male perpective.
For the last 2 years I've gone as long as a month without speaking to another human
being....many times. One has to wonder what the consequences are from that isolation.

It's embarassing for me to say, but I've got absolutely zero real friends, or even acquantences. I got
hit double, first with being homebound on disability for the last decade after a major bipolar episode.
I was a successful engineer at the time and in a relationship. And then being paralyzed by illness.

Presently,In short, I feel that my whole life has been devastated by sickness...and ain't worth much.

So it's not a "poor me" party here, but I know that I'm not the only addict who has sat alone
in his house for decades. That's one thing when you're drunk or high, but SOBER?

I'm open to all kinds of new ideas, but in the scope of "getting well", here's what I can do:
(I've been utilizing the "Everyday Success Planner" for some time now)
Excercise every day
Attend church regularly (activities)
See a therapist (just got me one and had my first session- she knows I'm a "piece of work")
Go to 12 step meetings Or......

Get high again today, because then I'll feel just fine.

Anybody get my drift here? Responses welcome from wealthy, elderly widowers.

Seriously though, it feels like my feet are lead and I feel like doing nothing. WTF?

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:55 pm
Posts: 4847
Location: Leesburg, FL
Hi runner,

I'm glad you made it past the hump since stopping sub. I know a little bit about isolation. You're right, it's common for us when we're using - at least it was for me. And I'm also disabled and haven't worked in over 3 years. I've been "clean" (hate that word) for over a year and a half and it's only lately that my life started getting full again. Like you, I didn't have any real friends to speak of. I think the older we get the harder that seems to be. Anyway, that's slowly changing over time for me. One of my friends I met from starting my in-person suboxone support group. So even though I'm still struggling to get members that was a nice change. I also have a pretty particular hobby and that has led me to new family/friends.
I know disabilities can be very challenging, especially when it comes to being more active. I hope you find some ways to start meeting people soon. You're doing really well!

-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.

 Post subject: You are not alone
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 4:33 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2010 3:44 pm
Posts: 500
Location: New York
I had to reply to your post because when you speak of being alone all that time and things to do that you probably don't feel like doing, reminds me of me. Without pills I don't and can't do anything. The w/d won't let me do anything. I can't even get out of bed. If I don't have enough pills, I'm shaky, don't feel like talking, breathing hard, can't eat. It's a mess so I would rather not go anywhere. I hope to someday go out and enjoy myself without pills in my system. Be strong

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 8:13 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:03 pm
Posts: 991
I can certainly understand what you are going through because when I went off sub, I felt the same way. I just didn't have the interest or energy to engage in conversation. In fact I met Hatmaker on here while going through that and after 3 months decided to get back on sub for a variety of reasons. I recall telling her I wanted to talk to her on the phone but not until I got back on the sub. Why? Because I didn't have enough energy to talk to anyone. I didn't want to maintain a conversation. I was SO isolated. It is definitely PAWS though.

I am confident of this because I recall being depressed and having anxiety long before drugs. But that feeling is different. I wish I had answers for you. I wish I could tell you when it will go away. But I don't have those answers. I do know it was frustrating and sad. Prior to drugs, I was always pretty social. I liked to engage in conversation. I was pretty much just like I am on suboxone. I don't know if I could have waited out the PAWS. It isn't like I wanted to get high because I didn't. But I did want "that feeling" to go away. It was depressing because I felt like when I started drugs there was some component of wanting to feel better that caused me to use. But I never felt THAT bad....and then look what I created.

I don't know if any of that makes sense. I have SO many emotions surrounding the whole thing and some of them conflict with each other. But I do relate and I am sorry and I am pulling for you.


Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things.

- Winston Churchill

 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Sep 29, 2010 2:16 pm 
Average Poster
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Joined: Sun Sep 26, 2010 8:44 pm
Posts: 25
"it's embarrassing for me to say, but I've got absolutely zero real friends, or even acquaintances. I got
hit double, first with being homebound on disability for the last decade after a major bipolar episode.
I was a successful engineer at the time and in a relationship. And then being paralyzed by illness."

I can really relate to that. I talk to my Grandmother every day, but other than her and possibly
dealing with a cashier at the bank,gas station or grocery store, I talk to no one. I had friends
in High School but they all went their own way and other than acquaintances that I have had
since based on using, I have not had a friend in a decade.

I have called some people friends in the past few years but they were all using friends-
using me, I have a bad tendency to be a push-over. I found that if I let someone use me
for my car, money , or whatever else that I can attain a temporary and false sense of not
being alone, but that sucks! and I cannot do it anymore. In the past I could only fool myself for a short
period of time and now I can't fool myself at all- since I took all drugs out of my life except
a legal Rx for Subutex which is saving my life.

As far as PAWS goes, this is the hurdle that I have only made it over one time in my life and that
was 10 years ago- I have been trying ever since- trying while I got myself into more
trouble,doing stupid shit like shoplifting a $1.50 item and getting caught. "acting out"
on my addiction.

In that decade, my diseases have progressed and I would estimate that
if I WERE able to get my Xone dose down to nothing and actually take the dive off the cliff
I would have to go maybe 5-6 months of Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome (daily panic
attacks, constant craving, that mouse wheel of "how could I get high and is it really
worth it to throw it all away") before I would catch a break and finally start to feel

I do attend NA sometimes, and I guess if I was forced to , I would site some of those people
as my friends but unfortunately that relationship is based on how many meetings I make. So
IMO they are not really friends. They have their own recovery to worry about and I guess
I hate myself too much to let it happen.

Those of you who go to, or have gone to meetings, you know the end of the meeting circle
where something like " look around you, don't look at the floor , there's no dope there, look
into each other's eyes because due to the nature of this disease there is a chance that someone
here tonight may never make it back. We will say the "we" version of the serenity prayer..."
is said every night? That is so hard for me. I hate having to except hugs from strangers.
I think a lot of them get off on it but it just hammers in the fact of how alone I feel.

After that everyone starts to talk, smoke and mingle. I always feel so stupid at this point because
even though I know most of the people well, I just don't know what to say. I usually walk out to my
car and leave without saying anything to any of them which makes me feel like shit because
it reminds me of how socially re-tarted and totally alone I am.

When I see my psychiatrist next I want to check into whether he thinks I mite be bi-polar. I am on
(psych med wise) Seroquel and Remeron and they do nothing for me other than allow me to
sleep. And even then I wake up many times and do not dream. I have to sleep from 12am to
noon the next day in order to get enough rest.

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