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 Post subject: PAIN!
PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 9:42 pm 
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I was having a tooth ache on and off yesterday, was taking lots of Advil and then yesterday afternoon I just started feeling really sick, just figured it was pms or something. SO, I made dinner and got everyone settled and then passed out on the couch around 7pm. I woke every 4 hrs with a throbbing pain in my mouth and face so I would take more advil, go back to sleep, wake up again in 4 hrs do it all over agin. So, I wake up this morning and couldn't move the left side of my face. I look in the mirror and it's VERY swollen, I looked like half chipmunk.

I decide to leave right away for the ER (took my sub first of course could I knew it would help the pain) I don't have dental insurance so no dentist to see me....and I just needed some good stong antibiotics, wasn't even thinking about any kind of pain management at all cause 4 advil at a time was doing pretty well.

After waiting for about 2 hrs to see a doc he comes in and seemed ok at first. Then he keeps telling me over and over again that I need to get my tooth pulled or root canaled, that it's not gonna go away, the antibiotics are just a band aid. OVER and OVER. I wanted to say "Dude, are you gonna pay for it asshole?" UGH! Im unemployed with three kids jackass.

Then he says, I'll put you on some strong antibiotics. So I say great and thank him. then he look at me and says" So, you're on Subox-ine "(yeah he couldn't even pronounce it right) I say "yes, suboxone"

He says "well I can't control your pain then. Narcotics don't work well on that medication (yeah who you tellin buddy!) so the best I can do is give you big Advil" The look he gave me when he said "so you're on Subox-ine" was the worst look ever! Like I just did something really really awful!

After he left the room I was in tears. Thank god the advil and sub together are working ok for my pain and it's not excruciating (although it's about a 5 still on the pain scale) but what if it wasn't???? I would have had to leave there with no help! Im sorry but there has to be something else that can be done if something like that happens and you are in severe pain. Im so scared its gonna get worse and Im gonna be in so much pain. And this Dr just had no clue about sub obviously! I mean the triage nurse never even heard of it....Why aren't people (esp ER people) trained in dealing with people on this med?

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Of course there's such a thing as angels. Only sometimes they don't have wings... and we call them mothers. -Unknown


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 Post subject: sympathy
PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 10:26 pm 
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Toothache's are the WORST, I feel for you and I really hope you will find a way to afford the dental care you need. In the meantime hopefully the antibiotics will work. As for the doctor--what a jerk, there's really no excuse for him to treat you like that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jun 05, 2010 11:39 pm 
Laura, I'm sorry you're going through all this and I hope the antibiotics kick in right away. It's a disgrace how little the medical community knows about what is truly a breakthrough treatment for addiction. Unfortunately, I'm not surprised. After being on this forum for a while I'm hearing more and more that even the sub prescribers often don't know much about it. And I was clicking through some of the articles on Dr. J's blog and one study said that something like 85% of psychiatrists (even those who treat addicts) would not consider using sub in their practices. It's a crying shame.

Anyway, you didn't deserve to be treated disrespectfully. You weren't doing anything wrong and you were being honest. It makes me think that unless it's life or death I just won't disclose my medication status. The reason we're supposed to disclose is to let them know that we would need more meds for pain management, but it seems the only outcome is that we get denied ALL pain medication! It's unjust.
Sorry for the rant. Feel better!
Lilly


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 12:57 am 
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RTL, I am SO sorry that happened to you! There is no excuse for such ignorance and disrespect. I know somewhat how it feels, because I've had some trouble even with planned surgery. Dr. Junig once talked about how sub's manufacturer, Reckitt, is a small company and doesn't do enough to market the medication. You know how many pharmaceutical companies have reps educating doctors and giving out samples? Well, it's my understanding that Reckitt is severely lacking in the educating doctors category. I ended up sending a letter (as did my husband) to Reckitt about their responsibility for such education and why it's so important. I had, at the time, mentioned a letter-writing campaign to them, but I don't think anything came of it. I don't think two little letters did anything, but I do believe education is what's needed. Maybe we need to start writing op-ed letters to our local papers? I'm just one of those people who feels and sleeps better if I think I took some kind of action - no matter if it's just a drop in the bucket.

What about getting our doctors to write a short letter on their letterhead that talks about treating pain in an emergency, then keeping it in our wallets? I just thought of that and I'm thinking of mentioning that to my doctor the next time I see him.

Again, I think it really sucks that they treated you like shit, all the while when you weren't even asking for pain meds - I'm sorry you went through that.

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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 6:37 am 
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Thanks for the replies. Well I was up last night many times in horrible pain. I was afraid of this. The advil is starting to not work. I think I will write a letter to Reckitt. I also think Im going to keep the fact that Im on sub to myself unless its a very serious situation or surgery or something. That was the first time I ever had to deal with sub discrimination. It wasn't fun, and Im sure it gets much worse than what I went through.

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Laura

Of course there's such a thing as angels. Only sometimes they don't have wings... and we call them mothers. -Unknown


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 7:15 am 
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I just had a thought. What about going to your local dental school? It's got to be the least expensive way to get your tooth treated. I wish I had better advice for you. I hope your pain doesn't get so bad that you have to go back to the ER - or to a different ER. Good luck and please let us know how you're doing.


PS - It's difficult to find contact info for Reckitt Benckiser, so I thought I'd pass along what I found. Reckitt Benckiser Group,
10710 Midlothian Turnpike, Suite 430, Richmond, VA 23235, USA Phone numbers: 804-379-0907; 804-379-1090

Also, here's the link for Dr. J's blog post about them: http://suboxonetalkzone.com/?p=1773

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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 8:19 am 
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Thanks Melissa! Yeah, Im def. writing them. With all the money they get from this crazy expensive medication they need to pay some drug reps to get the word out about the med or send out some educational materials to ER's, dentists, etc.

I do have 2 dental schools in the city (about an hour drive) that I can call and a clinic about 15 mins away that I can call, although Im not sure that the clinic will do the extensive dental work I need but I know the dental schools will. So, Im gonna call tomorrow and It says on their websites that it takes at least 6 weeks to get in but I won't have the money for about 6 weeks anyway, but hopefully these antibiotics will hold me over for awhile.

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Laura

Of course there's such a thing as angels. Only sometimes they don't have wings... and we call them mothers. -Unknown


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jun 06, 2010 8:31 am 
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RTL,

Your situation just plain SUCKS! I highly recommend calling your sub doc regarding the pain control. The sub doc could likely give you something if you explain the other doctor just didn't know what to do for you because of the "suboxin". I love it when they pronounce it that way.

You know what really pisses me off about this topic? It is that every day in my job I encounter new questions from my clients, new situations, etc. When I encounter these, I admit that I don't KNOW the answer. I give them my best educated guess, tell them I will research it to see if I am correct, and then I get back with them (same day within 15 min to 5 hrs. depending on complexity) to give them the CORRECT answer. If I was a doctor I am sure I would feel the same way as I do now and it would be my goal to give the BEST health care to EVERY person who walked through the door and to ensure the patient was well taken care of and walked away satisfied with their care or why I did or didn't do something. Now you can't please everyone, but had he looked into it, he would have realized quickly that he COULD give you something for pain. He would have called your subox doctor and discussed it and they would have made a plan for you.

I don't think the CORRECT answer for pain management for individuals on suboxone is to do NOTHING. I don't see a lot of these doctors even TRYING to figure out what the correct answer is. Are they STUPID? I mean REALLY? This person is in excruciating pain. Pain you would generally willingly and generously prescribe percocet for. But you are going to allow a person with NO INSURANCE walk out with NOTHING and no ability to return the next day for help due to finances. SERIOUSLY?!?

We have to REALLY start standing up for ourselves because if they keep getting away with this they will keep on doing it. I would send a copy of that research article Melissa has to the doctor who treated you in the ER. I would tell him you were ok without the pain meds that day, but that it got worse and you researched it and this is what you found.

I am very sorry about your situation. Definitely sucks. I also know that tea bags help with swelling so you may want to try that for some of the pain. I think it may actually help draw out infection too but I am not positive about that. I would call my sub doc.

Cherie

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Criticism may not be agreeable, but it is necessary. It fulfills the same function as pain in the human body. It calls attention to an unhealthy state of things.

- Winston Churchill


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 7:30 pm 
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Seems to be more and more of these "idiot ER doctor" posts. I guess the level of education out there isn't improving one bit. :roll:


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Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

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