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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:09 pm 
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Well, I finally cannot get anymore suboxone. And took my last piece yesterday. I can't quit cold turkey though. I have a job and a seven year old. And please don't say "call off" or "have someone watch your son" because those things arent an option. I got 16 15mg oxycodone pills and have been using them by the half as my sub withdrawal kicks in. How long will it take to beat the suboxone? As far as it leaving my sytstem and then me worrying about kicking the oxy, which i'dmuch rather face. Suboxone withdrawal is the worst thing ever. I've tried to do it three times over the last three years. And this time I have no choice. I just cannot stand the fatigue. I CANNOT have fatigue like that for a month or two! It's just NOT doable! I have too many responsibilities. I just want the subs to be out and then i'll kick the oxy straight up. I dont plan on exceeding 30 mg at any point per day. What is anyones advice please? Or experiences?

Nice to meet you all:)


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:26 pm 
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Can you give us a breakdown of how much Sub you are on and have you started tapering? Everyone will tell you doing oxy to get off subs is a BAD idea. That being said, if you have no choice, the amount of sub you have been taking and duration on that dose will have a ot to do with your wd's. Do you have a doctor who will prescribe Clonidine? It is a comfort med and will help a lot.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:39 pm 
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yes, I started tapering but way too fast. I was down to a quarter of an 8mg tab for the last week. I didnt taper long because my supply was low. And I had to hurry the process.
Why is taking oxy a "BAD" idea? I'mnot worried about becoming an addict to the oxy. I just want to be done with all opiates! The only reason im doing this is because of how long sub withdrawal lasts. I wish I would have known this three years ago. Suboxone is horrible. It's good to learn how to be sober in your daily life ... but its a DRUG and its the same as heroin. Except worse. Just because a guy with a degree sells it to you and not a guy withoput one doesnt make it any better.
the oxy relieves the withdrawal instantly. but only for short periods. i had been on at least 1 to 1 anda half 8mg's (subs) a day for two years.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:42 pm 
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people who took 3, 8mg tabs of sub a day are nuts! NO ONE needs that insanity! And thats exactly what taking that much causes. INSANITY!


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:49 pm 
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I can kinda understand where you are coming from. If you had no responsibilities, I would say harden up and get it over with. Given your responsibilities, I can understand the motivation. I still can't get over the idea that you are using the drug you used Sub to get off to get off the Sub. It reeks of addictive thinking IMO. Are you sure your reasons aren't just rationalisation?

Before you lunge into using the Oxy's - I gotta ask whether you've considered the added risk of relapse by using your drug of choice to get off Sub. And of course, if that happens, your functioning will be screwed a lot more than just taking two weeks off work ... or even losing your job. Keep that in mind.

I'll just say that if you do manage to use the oxy responsibly ONLY for relief of withdrawals, you might be able to pull it off and even get growth from it. For the sake of harm minimisation, I'd suggest having someone else of the non-addict persuasion hold the Oxy for you, and you both agree on a strict regimen with limits. Also clue them up, before you are in withdrawals, of your style of manipulation so they know not to give into any games that might kick in to get more Oxy than you may need.

Oxy was never my drug of choice so I can't give any details about dosing. But Sub acute withdrawal lasts two weeks for me. If you DO end up using your Oxy (which I stress is a bad idea) I'd only start using it when the withdrawal makes it impossible to function. The dose may increase a bit when Sub withdrawal climbs, then it should taper down to virtually nothing as Sub withdrawal fades. It'd be wise to take a dose that only allows you to function, not that removes your withdrawals completely. And DEFINITELY not enough to be euphoric AT ALL.

And I gotta stress that if you DO start taking more than you need (and if you are honest with yourself, you will know it) --- you will be screwed. It'd be virtually inevitable you will continue taking Oxy. And if I had the choice, I'd choose taking two weeks off work and risking my job than risking relapse, in which case ALL responsibilities are out the window.

Understand the gravity of what we're dealing with. Health comes first. If we fuck with our health, everything else falls. Job, relationships, kids, housing ... everything is on the line.

Why can't you find a Sub doctor?


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:01 pm 
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I have no insurance and i just want off the subs anyway. Oxy's arent really what got me on subs ... I just could get em so I did. I used em for energy at work. Which actually got me multiple promotions at work. I'm not manipulating, I promise. I'm being very honest here. I'm using the oxy's only when i get withdrawal and only to take the edge off. as you suggested. I agree with that logic.
So two weeks you say? So when will the worst be? days 6-10?

thank you by the way:)


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:26 am 
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Speaking from experience, using oxy to ward off sub WD is counter productive. Not only is it playing with fire, it causes the sub WD to last longer.  I stopped sub @ 1 mg after 3+ years.  Acute WD lasted 2.5 weeks, however it was nothing like acute oxy WD.  I had an appetite the whole time, only missed 2 days of work (I work 12 hour days 5 days per week). Don't get me wrong, it was not fun but very doable.  I did use oxy a couple times, but it prolonged the total time of WD. You need your neurons to heal and make new pathways. When you feel bad, it's literary your brain re-wiring it self. "Nuerons that fire together wire together" so if you use a full agonist like oxy you are stroking the same area of your brain that the sub did and healing can't happen. See Dr. J's quote from a post:


"Because of the tendency to bail out of a taper, most people who start out tapering end up ‘jumping’ at some point—raising the question of whether people should just jump from the start, planning to be miserable for a good few weeks, and then just tolerating it.  For those taking that approach, the main thing is to STICK WITH IT.  In order for your receptors to return to normal, you MUST be miserable— that misery is what causes the neurons to manufacture new receptors.  If you take a break from the misery by using for a day, you turn off the forces that are moving you toward feeling better, delaying the process by days to weeks.  To be direct, the quickest way to stop Suboxone and get back to zero opioid tolerance is to avoid opioids completely until you feel better."


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:52 am 
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Hi Robert,

Welcome to this forum! I hope that you will find lots of information and encouragement here as I have over the last week or so. I have to say, and I hope you understand that this comes from a place of genuine concern for you, that I am very worried about this plan to take oxy's to help with suboxone withdrawal. I understand that you never had a problem with them in the past, but you did admittedly have an addiction to suboxone. I don't think it is a good idea for anyone with ANY kind of an opiate addiction to take oxy's for any kind of long term treatment. I believe that as addicts we might be able to take them for very SHORT time periods if ABSOLUTELY necessary for medical reasons, but only after our addiction is under control and we have the tools we need to deal with the temptations that surely will come along with that drug.

I hope that you understand that I am not attacking you, I am just very concerned for you and want you to be very sure you think this through. There are so many people here who have seen oxy take over their lives....it can happen so easily, even when you have the best intentions. Please think this through, maybe read some of the posts on here that people have written about where this drug has taken them, what it has done to their lives. It really isn' t something to play around with....

No matter what though, I wish you luck with your recovery!


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 12:17 pm 
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Oxy is an opiate. Suboxone, Oxy, Vicodin all supply your brain with neuro-transmitters. None of these are substitutes. They all prolong your addiction and none of the allow your body to product the neuro-transmitters naturally. I don't know which neurotransmitters are supplied by oxy, vidodin & suboxone. Whether it is dopamine, serotonin, whatever (I am not a doctor but understand homeostatis -- your bodies ability to control things and reach a steady state.

You need to see a counselor and figure out a safe way to ween off without impacting your life.

You are in denial (as was I) if you think you can use one drug to kick another.

There are safe alternatives that don't affect your brain's ability to rehabilitate its neural synapses.

I had to take a blood pressure medication, Catapres (generic is Clonodine HCL 1 mg) to help with horrible spine-crawling. But the Catapres did not prolong my withdrawl.

Don't do it. You will abuse the Oxy, it is too powerful. I was going to be "in control" of Vicodin until I was taking 30+ per day. I suspect you will gradually increase your Oxy usage -- it is a creeper. And, it seems I was great at denying I had a problem and that I was strong enough to "control it". Yeah, until I felt crappy and had to take more & more. I thought Vicodin helped me stop smoking marajuana. Haha, what a dead end that was! Sure, I stopped smoking marajuana, but the Vicodin was far, far more deadly to my health, family, and lifestyle. Thank God I wasn't fired.

Please see a good Suboxone doctor who can cut you down properly!

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 3:31 am 
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I am a rare case. I was never addicted to opitates. I started seeing a girl that was and I told her it's the drugs or me. She told me about suboxone and I was so happy she was willing to try it. Well, 5 years later, she's still taking 16mg/day and I was taking 4 - 8mg's/day. I was never addicted to opiates and I've now I truly believe coming off subs is much more difficult. I say this because I have suffered the last 8 weeks w/d'ing and I ran into 15 perc 5's... These made it soooo much easier the last 2 weeks. I took 1 a day and it made the last 2 weeks bearable. You really need to suffer and while weaning down and you should go 7 - 10 days without anything at all but you will still be in a lot of pain but if you don't have much of an opiate addiction (believe me, I know most here do and I'm a rarity) then this can really help.... I need to travel for a week for work and I was so afraid of the w/d's since I can't carry subs w/o a script. I hope I can make it but I'm feeling much better today than I was 2 weeks ago and I've taken about 2mg's of sub in the last 3 weeks.... I never thought I'd make it this far!!!! Good luck to all. If you need someone to talk to, I've been through plenty and I've been supporting many friends that have been going through addictions for years.... I'm not out of the water but I try 1 day at a time and I hope we all can find the strength within! GOD SPEED!


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