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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:12 pm 
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Hi well im really new to this whole site wasnt sure where to post my question/ message but i have a problem i have 3 weeks untill my dr app check up and to also refill my suboxone script but i am out now i didnt keep track and frankly just took to much not evryday but some i take ruffly 4mg a day but have been taking closer to 8mg most days idk what the heck i was thinking but im afraid of relapse but also affraid to call doc please help withdrawls are in full swing!!! thanx to anyone willing to read this and help


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:28 pm 
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Hello- take a breath, been quite a while since I've had to panic b/c I was out of my DOC, or suboxone, and was going to have w/d's. You will get good advice from this site, so stick around. Some questions, how long have you been on suboxone, do you see the doc every month, and how much sub are you prescribed, and what's your dose? Most of us here have been in that unfortunate situation of running out early, at least I did the first few months I was on suboxone. I ask these ?'s, b/c some people I know go to the doc weekly, twice a month, or once a month, and we have to know a little more about your situation to avoid giving bad answers.

Without this info, I'd say it depends on how long you've been going to the doc, how is your relationship with the clinic/doc, and that a lot of stories I read on here, explain how people were scared and freaking out, but then called their doc, and either went in early to see him/her, and things worked out okay (sometimes it doesn't). I'm giving some vague answers b/c I don't know your situation yet, just hoping to help out if I can.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 3:03 pm 
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You are not alone. The addict behavior in us is difficult to control, but I hope this crisis will give you the motivation to avoid this in the future. You have to come out of this experience having learned a few things.

1. Unless you are brand new with suboxone you are not going to feel any effects from taking your sub. Once your opiate receptors are saturated there is no physical difference after you take another dose, except that you're keeping a certain level of buprenorphine in your blood. If you think you feel something after dosing beyond the first few weeks it is all psychological.

2. Likewise, there is no feeling better or high or anything similar if you take an extra dose. If you feel something after you take an extra dose it is also psychological.

3.Therefore, there is no benefit to taking more than you regular dose of suboxone.

Some tips on avoiding the psychological impulse to take extra sub: distract yourself for 15 minutes and the impetus to take more will most likely go away. Call a friend, go for a walk, watch a show, play with the dog or cat, etc. The more you allow yourself to think that you want it, the harder it will be to resist. If you have outside support in terms of a support group, a helpful spouse, your favorite cousin, your best friend, set them up to be your support person. Text them or talk to them and make sure they know you need to be distracted.

Do you know whether your sub doctor is a hard ass or not? If your doctor has said things like, "One slip and you're out of here!" he or she is probably a hard ass. If, however, your doctor seems to understand that addiction includes slips and relapses you may be able to call and ask for an early appointment. You might begin with a hypothetical like, "My friend is on suboxone too and he was kicked out of the program for one bad UA!" See how your doctor reacts to that kind of statement. Unfortunately there are doctors who will kick you out of the program for running through your meds too soon.

As for survival over the next three weeks if you can't tell your doctor about your screw up, there are several medications that can help you deal with the withdrawals you may have. If crossfinger posts he can tell you about the benefits of loperamide (in Immodium). Clonidine is a go to for folks in opiate withdrawal too. Keeping active and busy will help.

I wish you the best as you go through this crisis. Many people who come and go on this forum have been in the same situation. Like I said, you are not alone.

Amy

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:10 pm 
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ok well ive been on sub for 2 1/2 years im prescribed 3 1/4 a week or around 4mg a day i only see myy doc every 4 months idk what happened really but ive had a ton of stress last 2 months and just went nutz taking more more more to escape the pain im also on an antidepressant as well which helps alot but im afraid i cant do withdrawls ive tried many times and the thought of hurting myself to end the pain creeps in my mind when its happened in the past i feel like i wanna just call my dr and say whats going on but some ppl say they will be suspicous i dnt giv out my meds ever idk im so lost


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:31 pm 
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You've heard good advice. If you were my patient, I'd say 'three weeks early?! WTF?!' I wouldn't be 'angry'-- but I would be frustrated that you waited THIS long to address a problem that was surely evident weeks ago. If people TELL me that they are struggling, I can help them. But when they run out VERY early, it becomes difficult. All docs feel like law enforcement and pharmacists are keeping track of 'loose prescribers'.... and so some extent, pharmacists DO have impressions about the docs who ask them to fill early all the time.

If this was a one-time, rare thing, I would consider giving you just enough medication to keep you from getting sick-- maybe half of your usual dose (usually I give 8 mg per day in this case, but for some reason, you are already on a very low dose). I would call the pharmacist, explain that I chewed you out, and ASK the pharmacist to give you those extra tabs. Understand that pharmacists do not HAVE to dispense them. I do not get to just 'order' them to do it!

I would tell you that going forward, this can't happen again-- and here are some thinks you can do:

Have someone else control it.
NEVER take extra in your pocket; take your morning dose and at most, take your afternoon dose with you. Better yet, take none-- and if you take a second dose, wait until you are going to bed.
Get a plastic container and fill it each week-- that way you will directly see if you borrow from other days.
Get on a regular schedule-- do NOT take Suboxone 'as needed'. That defeats the whole purpose.
If you don't do those things, I would intervene by giving you less at a time. In severe situations I've prescribed as little as two days of medication, with, say, ten refills that cannot be filled early.

But this does not mean you are a bad person; this is a very common thing. Just understand that the doc has stake in the game too-- and it is frustrating, as he/she has no control over the situation (except as I described). Be proactive--- devise a solution, and USE it. The most frustrating thing is when a patient does this over and over.

Finally, patients should NOT be kicked out of treatment for this situation-- unless it keeps happening, and the patient has no interest if solving the problem... OR if the medication is getting diverted. THAT behavior risks the ability to use this medication to treat addiction!


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:47 pm 
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u r exactly right my problem has been lately i just take them when i need which is not me im older i have a job family lots of things but stress gets to me i have yet after all this time gone to na meetings which i know wudd help i just always think im in control when im not my hubby takes them and gives them to me as perscribed but.......he gives in 70% of the time with more than he shud so who else can hold them??? this has never happened to me before ever but at this point i feel like relapse is an absolute i dnt want that but i cant call off work cuz im vomiting etc i think calling my dr is my best option but he has alot of faith in me and i dnt wanna let him down idk


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2015 10:04 am 
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Thanks for the info, you're very fortunate to have a doctor who gives you enough for 4 months, most of us have to go every month. You are experiencing addictive like behavior, stress comes, and you run to the medication to help get you through it. I did this for years upon years, popping norcos and somas like candy, and when things got especially overwhelming (dealing with wife, kids, finances especially), I'd drug myself so hard just to kill any emotions- just trying to get rid of the anxiety, stress, and anger. This is how addicts deal with emotions and issues in life, which is why I went to counseling for a year or so when I first started suboxone. I still get into stressful situations, but now I recognize what's happening, and I talk to my wife about it, or I call a friend. You have to find ways to cope that don't include self medicating.

Now, I have empathy for your situation, because no one likes to be in withdrawals. If your doctor has faith in you, like you said, don't let your fear overwhelm you, call the doc and go see him. If the office where he works lets you talk to him, then explain the situation, depending on the doc, he may help you out, but you also have to be mentally prepared to accept that he may not. If he is compassionate, and you have a good track record, then your chances are better, as opposed to if this was your first or second month, when the doc is evaluating if he can trust you. IMO, if he gives you enough for 4 months, and you haven't had this issue in the past, then I can't see why he wouldn't help. If it were me, I'd try this option first, before your mind tells you to find something else to keep you from withdrawals.

Having your husband hold the medication is a good idea, but he needs you to tell him it's okay for him to tell you no. I'm married, so this is a tough dynamic to deal with, as your spouse doesn't want you to be angry with him, and hold it over his head. I wish you the best, and hope this was good advice.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 9:35 am 
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I've had this happen in the past... and not because of self-medicating...I think with years of suboxone in the rear view and no slip-ups... some of us think of ourselves as being damn near professional when it comes to addictive behavior and having an addict friend show up that is dealing with the same issues we've dealt with years prior.... I have to admit I've been that friend who had someone come knocking because, through whatever loose-lipped mouth, they heard I was on some sort of drug that helped addiction to pain pills...

In the past 3-4 years, I've stopped accepting the excuse that "I cant afford it" or " (insert random BS excuse here)"....because in the end, we all have to make our own decisions when it comes to addiction and devise a plan to come out of it, unless we just don't want any better for ourselves...

But I gave some to a friend...trying to be a friend..
Eventually, it got to a point where this caused me to be VERY short...helping someone else became being no better than the dealer who's slinging pills for $7-$10 a piece...
Luckily, I had enough self control to limit myself to 1 a day for 2 weeks until it was time for a refill, and didn't have to mess up my perfect record with my doctor by going in early...
But, it taught me a valuable lesson.

The take-away from this is keeping a close eye on yourself. You are the main person who is responsible for your actions.. Don't let your mind give you any excuse to take more, give 1 away...even just one.. Don't let anything deter you from keeping yourself straight...
In the end, it's all you got. We all slip up. I doubt anyone here will tell you they've been perfect the entire length of treatment....it's addict behavior.. it's what got us to this point to begin with...
The main goal, is curbing that behavior and making sure we kill the triggers... Don't allow ANYTHING to change your focus.
It might seem like it helps to take some when there are more bills due than there is money to pay them...or the kids are fighting like cats and dogs and stress has reached extremes...
Suboxone won't treat anything but what it was designed for...
Keep your eyes on the prize..

I'm happy to say that I havent had issues like this in a couple years. I have my schedule...routine...whatever and nothing changes that. I stick to it religiously. And nobody gets to hear about what med I take.. (don't take it publicly...don't let anyone see you take it). My med is between me and my doc and pharmacist.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:06 pm 
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Jam

How are you? What option did you pick? If you are using its ok to say so. We want to support you here. If you did "lapse" we can help support you when it's time for you appointment.

Thinking of you. Hope to hear from you. There is also a private message option here. If you want to talk we can private message.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:22 pm 
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Well i must say im really glad i found this site i appreciate that im not the only one in the world this happen to its been a ruff week for me but i have to admit i did relapse i did cold turkey for a cupl days nope cudnt handle it i feel so weak i was crying uncontrolably for days and suicidle so i made the decision to find some opiates i did start back at my na meetings at my church but ive never had a sponser idk yall im kinda a mess i have 18 days till my app unless i call my dr and this isnt a thing of me giving my meds away i never do and i dnt tell ppl i take em ever i just in all honesty about two months ago thought my hubby was cheating and down the rabbit hole i went i still dont know about calling my dr im just kinda riding the wav at this point waiting for it to crash i feel like 2 1/2 yrs are wasted!!


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 2:07 pm 
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Hey jj,

No one is judging u at all for making a mistake and over taking ur med. I'm so sorry to hear about the relapse. And I think there's several ppl here on this forum, myself included, that knows the horrible feeling of someone cheating on them (even if he didn't it's still awful to think he did). So ok, u relapsed now what are ya going to do? I honestly think u should make u an early appointment with ur Dr and be 100% honest about what has happened. The reason I think that's the best route is because if u wait for ur appointment, ur gonna test positive for opiates now right? Plus ur not gonna have any sub in ur system and that's gonna show up also. So why not just roll the dice and call or go see ur Dr? If u don't do that, ur going to spiral out of control worse than u already are.

Please don't feel judgment here, we all make mistakes. It's how u handle those mistakes that counts. Don't let this take u bk to the place u were 2 1/2 yrs ago, it's not worth it.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:44 pm 
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You have to ask yourself where would you rather find yourself...admitting (to your doctor) that you made a mistake, that it won't happen again, and telling him you want to be completely honest (which would give him even more reason to be compassionate)...or, going in 18 days from now with no sub in your system, having to tell your doctor a lie at that time, and risk a chance of getting caught in the lie?

Here's something else to take into consideration:

Suboxone stays in your system around 5 to 8 days depending on your metabolism. If your doctor tests you and you have absolutely nothing ..not even trace amounts, he's going to know that you've been out for a week or more, and that's going to put a big dent in the trust he has in you..
I would consider very deeply just biting the bullet and calling the doc.
Everyone falls off the horse, you don't want to get trampled by the horse on top of that...

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 5:02 pm 
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JJ

Ok. Now there are 18 days to go. Jennifer is spot on about telling your doc. You will show positive for whatever you are taking and there won't be any sub in your urine. Can you get sub anywhere?

Have you thought about what you will tell your doctor? Have you been going to the same doctor for the 2.5 years? It sounds like I had a similar relationship with my doctor. He trusted me and I respected him. I was going to run out a week early so I called his office and asked to come in earlier. His front desk person is his wife who I also respect. I really didn't want to call but I knew I would relapse. He knew my life was crazy & I had a ton on my plate so he said come in.

Basically, he told me he was glad I made the call & asked me to go to therapy and learn to change my coping skills. He gave me an " emergency" script and an addiction therapist phone #. I called the therapist after I left and have been seeing him since then. I have still screwed up a time or 2 but have caught myself & took less to make sure I could make it to my appointment.

You are not alone but we have to figure out your next move.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 10:03 am 
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The previous 2 1/2 years are not wasted.

I agree with what others have said. I, too, went through this during my Suboxone journey - taking more hoping to "feel better" then running out early. I told my Sub doc and he told me he'd rather raise my dose than see me relapse. I'm guessing your doc would agree. If you keep buying opiates for the next 17 days you could end up in a real train wreck of a relapse, and your doctor is still going to find out, but it will be worse.
Go ahead and make the call. I'm sure your doctor has had this happen with other patients. If your history with this doc has been good, I'm sure he won't want to see you fail.
Good Luck and let us know what happens.

Lilly


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:29 pm 
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thank you everyone for all the advice i have yet to call im still scared too for alot of reasons if i knew i cud speak with my dr directly i wudve already but his secratary is not kind or compassionate its like pushing cattle thru to her sooooooo idk im gunna wait a lil longer i have had a sub since so im taking it very sparingly!!!!!!! im not proud of taking anything other than my own but.....im sure we have all been there i have my first na meeting tomorow and am seeking free or cheap counciling in my area to help also i guess im starting from scratch but i do believe this is gods way of showing me its shit or get off the pot time pardon my cursing love you all will keep yall posted!!


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