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 Post subject: Newbie
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 6:25 pm 
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Hello, joining this forum as another form of support as I start this part of my journey. I've been on subs for a few weeks now after 3 years of driving my beautiful life into the ground. I've always been an addict, starting young, but learned to focus those tendencies and behaviors in more positive directions from my early 20's after stints in rehab and other fun places. That is until about 3 years ago when a minor injury and a large prescription turned into an out of control problem growing to 300+mg a day and 3-5K a month.

I'm an executive professional who was addicted to money and success before this, and my arrogance led me to believe I could control, beat, or outsmart this. I went from never worrying about money, to being on a first name basis at the pawn shop, collectors calling nonstop, and borrowing from friends and family....but that's the end of the sob-story....In fact, I don't have one...I say all of that because for the first time in a long time, I am happy... and for the first time in my life, I am truly HUMBLE. I am so lucky I didn't lose more. I still have my wonderful wife, two beautiful kids, my home, and my job. I am honestly lucky to be here deciding between types of bankruptcy, with a chance to re-build my life.

I see a lot of different views on this site, and stories that show me how easy I got off, so please don't take this as arrogance, naivety, or rushing to a conclusion...I have no arrogance left, am too old to be naive, and too humbled by this experience to think I know much at all anymore....But, at this stage of my recovery, I'm thinking that I do not care if I am on this drug (which at this point I probably owe my life, freedom, and family) for the rest of my natural life. Maybe I will, maybe I won't, I'm only concerned as far as I can focus my eyes at the moment, and unless I'm missing something, or am blind to the slap in the face that comes around the next corner, this is a small price to pay for those three things that just a few weeks ago were less important than where I was going to scrape up the money for a pill, not to get high, but simply to function, and of course to find more money for dope.

Along with therapy, and three weeks of subs, I'm not asking how I got here anymore, and I'm working hard not to look back and beat whoever the hell that was into a coma lol. I'm just trying hard to let myself feel lucky just be where I am, and thankful that I'm looking forward to a tomorrow where I'm not chasing, lying, cheating, stealing, and using. I'm thankful I'm alive, have a life, family, and job I didn't lose, and I wouldn't have had those much longer if it weren't for suboxone. Just a rookies humble opinion. I look forward to being a part of the community. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Newbie
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 6:44 pm 
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Welcome to the forum!! We hope that you do stick around and become part of the community. There is a lot of collective wisdom and experience here. Even better, there is much compassion and empathy here.

I think your attitude about suboxone and the future is spot on! Taking the time to be grateful and experience humility is very important to recovery. There are people out there who start to blame suboxone for various things after they've been on it for some time, instead of blaming the real culprit: opiate addiction!

This forum is run by Dr. Junig. An addict himself, Dr. Junig changed from being an anesthesiologist to a psychiatrist who treats addicts with suboxone. There is a wealth of information both here and on his website: http://www.suboxonetalkzone.com/.

Amy

P.S. I find the reference to Kerouac in your username ironic. You have left the frantic, hedonistic, pleasure-seeking lifestyle behind, while Kerouac's book On The Road celebrates it. Interesting! :)

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 Post subject: Re: Newbie
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:00 pm 
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Thanks Amy, I've seen a lot of sub-hate speech across the web, and a bit on this site, as it was part of research in deciding whether to pursue it. Frankly, my wife and I did have the conversation about it being 'trading one drug for another'. Looking back at that, honestly it was just another excuse to keep using. I was always one big paycheck away from a rapid detox, one more stressful month away from a self-taper, or worse, thinking that somehow seeking treatment was shameful, and admitting defeat...lol....says the Junkie, who lies, cheats, and steals, right?!? Its almost comical to think of now.

Part of the pragmatist in me now says to that trade off conversation....So what if it is? If I had a degenerative condition where a pill a day for the rest of my life solves that problem and allows me to live a happy, fulfilling, and stable (very underrated IMVHO) life, why on earth would I not do that?
And if you were able to wipe away the social stigma, ignorance, and judgment from people's minds, what disease is more degenerative than addiction?

I'm an addict. Always have been, always will be. Somewhere in the mix of genetics and environment of my life, that became a truth in my life, as true as any other miserable disease that people suffer from, and as deadly. There is no cure here, only management, just as is true for many diseases that I'm myself hesitant to name in comparison (ironically I guess due to the very stigma I just mentioned).

So, if you substituted the name of one of those diseases in for 'Addiction', and a doctor told you there was this new drug, that with the right diet, exercise, and support system, could help you live without the horrible debilitating symptoms of the disease, then why on earth a short year after you started it, would your number one goal be to get off it?!?

Maybe I'm missing something, but I know one truth, I'm an addict, and will be 40 years from now, so if this still helps me not show my 'symptoms' to the world, and am able to watch my grandkids play in the backyard, then without shame, I'll still be taking this stuff.

P.S. you can take away my Oxy, but you'll never take my Kerouac, or Thompson, or Moore, or Robbins, or Hemingway :)


Last edited by Kerouac72 on Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Newbie
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:09 pm 
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Hey welcome "Jack"..ya love tbe name too...Your story sounds so much like mine.
well most of it really.
so glad you found tbis life saving med. It does save lives.

38 months ago i found away out. After 25 /30 pills a day, lost income lost wife an house all my money, 35 years of savings,i vestments, tbe boat ALL OF IT, a friend found me in a heep, in my office. I just wanted to die..i didnt. I found recovery. People who cared. Oh an i also found out who my friends truely wers/are. I may be on suboxone for the rest of my life. Who knows but i do know how much has changed becuz of sub..
Yes i still have amazing debt. I cant pay. However, at 55 i have time to change that too..

New hobbies has helped. My x wife moved me back in shortly after i got clean. My work is growing . I no louger drink either. Amazing what tbis forum has taught me an all tbe great people here. As Any stated please go over to dr j's Talkzone and read..lots of facts tbere an no bs... im happy for you Krouac. Turely...thank god for those wives an family for sticking with us an our selfish ways..on ward an upward!!!!! Wecolme again.....razor 55..

Oh and i just picked up a "new" version of On tbe Road..It is the complete loug roll/scoll tbat jack wrote.....


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 Post subject: Re: Newbie
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 10:13 pm 
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Its awesome to 'meet' a fellow Jack fan...I read it every year...The romantic in me I guess.

Yes, our stories are very similar. I burned through the big assets first...I could make more, right? Savings? Toast. 401K? Liquidated....Tax situation? Ominous. Nice things in my house? Who needs them! Just gimme my meds. Then it got to things like utilities...I got candles, right?

It feels odd to be so much more happy and hopeful while looking up bankruptcy attorneys, but my 'road' has been anything but normal thus far, so it's par for the psychedelic miniature golf course that is my life.

I'm taking both yours and Amy's advice and digging through the threads. My doctor is less than stellar, and that's probably a compliment. The PA (1 of 2) I was seeing on my weekly fill-up/checkup, her last day was Friday bc she couldn't handle it (The Doc) anymore. He's clearly in it for one thing and one thing only and has his 'program' set up that way. So the info I get here will be invaluable. Luckily after one more clean pee in a cup I get to move to 2x monthly which will save money and time.

The bad part is I have to use one of their therapists for at least one counseling session a month. Don't get me wrong I'm not against counseling. In fact, I'm just the opposite. I think a good therapist can be extraordinarily helpful if you are willing to do the work. Unfortunately their guy is pretty obviously someone no one else would hire and willing to work on cheap salary, with the main doctor billing him out at a rate like he's Sigmund freak' in Freud. Right now, given my financial predicament, I can't afford the weekly co-pay, weekly script, and a second therapist who has little things like, I don't know...empathy...or training ;) All that being said, I can't wait to be in a position where I can see someone who cares, but in the grand scheme of things these are small temporary prices to pay.

Its good to hear from someone further down the road and that it's still working for you. Thanks for the support!


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 Post subject: Re: Newbie
PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 10:44 pm 
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I loved reading your post. The whole thing was a good read, but I especially liked the part about humility.

While I was attending NA, the "senior" members always discouraged new members from speaking and that torqued me hard because I always got so much out of hearing the newbies. The newbies were bruised, broken and battered and it always served as an excellent reminder of the humility we need in dealing with our addiction. The senior members often did have good things to say about recovery, but trying to blot out the newcomers voice removed what could have been great information about recovery we all need to hear.

Thanks again.

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 Post subject: Re: Newbie
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 5:55 pm 
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Thank you Romeo...do you still do NA? I haven't done meetings since my early 20's when I first got into trouble. After 15 years of thinking that my applying my addictive behavior to drugs were behind me, this experience caught me on my high horse of arrogance and pride... Given that long gap in using, I don't have an adult perspective on 12 stepping. I've considered it, but am not sure if it's for me... I looked for a live oxy/sub support group in my town, but no luck as of yet. No judgement to anyone who uses these programs successfully, but I'm concerned about the attitudes you described, the noise I might here about choosing the sub route,and honestly the fact that I still have a few drinks here and there (truthfully). What do you think? Thanks for your kind reply...


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 Post subject: Re: Newbie
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 6:30 pm 
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I didn't start going to NA until I was off Suboxone for almost 1 year. So, I didn't have to worry about the whole dynamic surrounding being on Suboxone while attending NA.

While in NA, I did learn some good recovery techniques, but I found the whole NA experience to be quite rigid and truthfully, their approach to recovery quite archaic. After attending NA for about a year, it was pretty easy for me to see why the failure rate is so high. Having said that, I also witnessed many people succeed with the program. This is about the time I realized that there's no "one size fits all" to recovery. We each have to do what works for us. If NA works for you, more power to you, if it doesn't, find your own recovery and work it. To answer your question, no, I don't do NA anymore. It's been about 2 years now?

As for the drinks now and then, I don't have a problem with you doing that. I've never been much into drinking, actually hated the effects of alcohol. I think that's why I turned to drugs. Well, I'm an addict, that's why I turned to drugs. Anyway, even though I've never really had any issues with drinking, I try to limit myself to one or two drinking occasions a year because I do find I have cravings once in a while for booze and I just don't want to get started down that road. I've spent enough of my life riding the addict train, I've been off that train for almost 4 years now and I'd kinda rather keep it that way. :)

You just have to be honest with yourself about the drinking. Early in recovery, this may be difficult, so I'd suggest you get a good support group in place. Sometimes people in my support group see issues with my behaviors well before I do and they help stop me from screwing up royally. One of the trickiest things I've found about addiction is how easy it is for us to lie to ourselves. A good support group can help us with that.

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 Post subject: Re: Newbie
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 9:00 pm 
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Thanks Romeo. I think I will continue to look for a support group outside of the 'program'. Right now this place is helping. And I appreciate the advice on the alcohol...you are right, as an addict, I am the king of lying, to everyone, but no one better than myself. It seems like I'm like you though...alcohol has never been my DOC...always preferred the uppers, which for me was coke, speed, etc in my 20's, then the oxy, opana, etc this time. I was amazed how much harder this was to kick than coke....So the subs have been a life saver at this far. I've truly been ready to stop for a while, but couldn't discipline a taper, and was too embarrassed (seems silly now) to seek help. I'd get down to 60mgs or so a few times and then kick, but it never lasted more than a few days. Lots of excuses, some reasonable, some downright stupid rationalizations. Anyway, thanks for the advice and support, it's much appreciated.


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