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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:34 pm 
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Hey everyone, this is my very first time on here, I am excited and happy to have found this site. I have my first appointment with the suboxone dr tomorrow, and am nervous yet hopeful. If you all don't mind, I'd like to take a moment to tell you all my story.

My addiction to pain pills (Hydrocodone, Percocet, then graduating to plain oxycodone and oxycontin) started innocently enough with a car accident 11 years ago. I was 26 @ the time, and after seeing a chiropractor for 8 weeks I was right as rain. This was in 2006. Fast forward to July 2012 when I saw an orthopedic dr for bulging discs in my cervical spine and a couple of more in the thoracic spine. Next came physical therapy and pain medication. Dr didn't want to prescribe it forever, but after 1 month I was hooked. He sent me to a pain management dr. Put me on so much stuff, then about 6 months later discharges me because they found gabapentin in my system. (My dad was prescribed it and I thought it would help with my pain.) So bought them off the streets. Was taking about 300-400 mg of oxy a day for too long. I was "high functioning." You could've had a normal conversation with me and be none the wiser. I had my whole family fooled. I finally got in trouble with my job.....you see, I was (am) a registered nurse. The day I got fired was a slap in the face. I decided enough is enough and on July 15, 2015 I started my own detox at home. Told my husband I had the flu. On July 18, after taking Clonidine, Gabapentin (which I now had a script for,) lamotil, benadryl pretty much every hour, for the past 3 days, I admitted myself to inpatient rehab. When I was discharged, they did not prescribe me ANYTHING, didn't even mention Suboxone. I was ok with that, though, and starting researching natural ways to fight addiction. After about 6 mos I found Kratom. Long story short, that is what helped with my PAWS. I am trying to get my license reinstated, and they wiuld rather you be on medication assisted treatment instead of Kratom. Very long story short, my induction appointment is tomorrow. My last dose of Kratom which was 1.5 grams, was at 12 noon today. My appointment is tomorrow at 4 p.m. I realize there is not much study and terms of Kratom and Suboxone. Has anybody out there switched from Kratom to Suboxone because of a particular career like mine? Thank you for taking the time to read this. I value all of y'alls opinions and experience. :roll:


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:51 am 
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Congrats on getting clean! There are many effective methods which one could use to successfully stay clean and sober. Suboxone is popular right now because it is very effective when used in conjunction with individual or group therapy. The practice I frequent requires an appointment with the "Suboxone Doc", a drug test, and 1 or 2 groups per prescription. Most other practices in the Pittsburgh area are about the same. While Kratam can be used to subdue urges and manage pain, drug companies, politicians, and health officials frown upon its somewhat inconsistent potency, potential for abuse, and the lack of industry standardization and oversight. Plus there's always the money factor... My brother has taken Kratam for years and has been on the front lines fighting to keep it legal for all. I personally prefer the Suboxone route. I love going to group sessions where I can talk to people who understand my struggles, my doctor is phenomenal, and the drug tests prove that I am staying clean. I have had dirty tests and slip ups in the past, but as long as I go to group meetings, see my doc, and keep working on my recovery, my treatment team and insurance company will stand with me. Suboxone is physically addictive, but I have personally weaned off twice. It just takes time (one or more months) and patience to do without discomfort. If someone tells you Suboxone isn't addictive then they are either ignorant or lying. Its very imporant to find a doctor you like and trust. Dont settle for so-so or pushy or someone who always tries to rush through the visit. Not everyone seems to care who treats them, but good help can make a world of difference. Also, its better to keep your husband and any close family or friends in the loop. They can help you to reach treatment goals and be part of your safety net. Sadly I cant talk to my family about much, but my long term boyfriend and some of his family are very supportive. It can be hard to break the ice, but you might be surprised how many people battle some sort of addiction or bad habit whether it be gambling, smoking, binge eating, whatever. Everyone has a vice, some just hide theirs and pretend to have the moral high ground. We are addicts and we should not be ashamed of that. Screw all the haters and uppity pretenders! So long as you are honestly trying to live clean and sober you can walk proudly with your head held high. Best of luck to you! :)


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:51 am 
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Hey Greyskies - That was an awesome first post. Very supportive and you seem to have a positive attitude about your treatment. Welcome and I encourage you to start a thread about yourself in the Introductions section of the forum. I'd love to learn a little more about your story too!!

MrsCaptAmerica - I would like to welcome you as well. Thank you for telling us about your story. I admit your story strikes me as rather unique. And not just because you're a nurse, I've learned that addiction is an equal opportunity destroyer. White collar, blue collar, whatever collar. Addiction doesn't care does it? Your story is a little different because you're going from kratom to suboxone. So many of the stories you read about here are mostly about the stronger narcotic pain pills and heroin. And you were certainly taking quite a bit during your "high functioning days" (literally).

Am I understanding you right that you've been off the oxy's for 2 years now? You went through treatment without the aid of suboxone and then started to experience PAWS sometime after that. That's when you turned to kratom to relieve some of your symptoms or did you just want to get high again? And I mean that in the most gentle way of course. I also have some experience with kratom and can understand it's appeal at first anyway. Your last dose of 1.5 grams... was that a usual amount for you? I experimented with doses and found that I needed higher amounts to get the "opiate-like" effect a lot of people desire.

I'm certainly not an expert on the substance but I did have quite an intense addiction to it physically after high doses every day after about 3 months of lighter use. I remember telling myself that I would never use it everyday. That would be my red flag that I was getting hooked to it, and wouldn't you know that's just what happened. I tried to rationalize it. I needed it first thing in the morning or I would get horribly sick. I was so angry at myself once I realized I had a major problem with it. I really should've known better but a mind in active addiction will cause you to be blind to the very warning signs you should be looking for.

Towards the end of my use I experienced some of the worst restless legs syndrome and violent vomiting I had ever had before, even with heavy duty narcotic pain killers. I'm sure part of the problem was that I really had no actual way of knowing exactly what was in it. I had did such great research on it and thought surely it was a miracle plant. I even bought mine a kilo at a time from a very reputable herb store, it wasn't some shady looking head shop. I didn't buy it in capsules. I supposedly got it straight from the growers and their farm. I just had to 'overlook' the small label on the back that said "not for human consumption". They told me they had to put that sticker on there because of the law but that it was safe... wink wink.

When I finally got over the withdrawal from kratom I told myself that I didn't care how pure and clean it was supposed to be. It's just not the right thing for me. I think it should be studied more in it's unadulterated form for it medicinal value. I know it's been used by the people that have grown it for hundreds of years. But I think there is real potential for harm when people buy this stuff in a few capsules at a head shop. I realize it unfairly got a bad rap at first because it was marketed right along with bath salts and synthetic marijuana. But any time you have a product that can generate the kind of money that kratom can, it's always going to attract the people who don't care what it does to their clients as long as they keep coming back for more, and they can get away with selling it legally... or not for some vendors.

So I know you can tell what my opinion is for myself and kratom, but I am very interested to hear about how it was for you. Specifically the type you liked to use and the dosage you've been at everyday now. Because these are factors that will come into play when you go see a suboxone doctor. Suboxone is a very powerful medication and you really need to respect it. It's also safe when used correctly at the right dosage. I would assume your kratom intake was pretty high to warrant treatment on suboxone. I would think your doctor would probably start you out at 2mg and see how you do first.

That's part of the tricky thing with kratom, you can never know exactly how strong a given batch is due to all of the variables. You need enough subs to take away your cravings and any withdrawal effects you might be having. Please do come back and let us know what happens in as much detail as you are comfortable giving. There are a lot of kratom users out there that probably read these forums and it would be valuable information to have documented here. I hope your induction goes as smooth as possible and we'll certainly try to teach you anything we've learned in our own experience. Good luck!!

- OM

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:41 am 
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Hello welcome!

Good luck on ur appointment, I'm truly hoping u drop the kratom and just stick to ur suboxone. I have to admit that I've never tried kratom and never plan on it, it wasn't really around when I was in active addiction (at least I hadn't heard of it).

The thing with kratom is it can contain contamination and make u very sick. U can take it for a long time and not experience it but randomly it can happen. Go to the search function and type in kratom, read through some of the stories ppl have experienced with it. Even Dr Junig (suboxdoc & founder of the forum) has warned against it. In my opinion it's dangerous plus it's addictive. So I hope u put it in ur past and start fresh and new with buprenorphine :) I know one of our members went to rehab with someone who was trying to stop kratom.

Anyway I'm going to stop my rant about kratom. I think you'll be very happy with ur buprenorphine treatment, it will remove cravings so u can focus on getting ur life bk on track. Hopefully u can get counseling also. It's been almost 6 years and I'm still required and attend meetings at my clinic. Helping the newcomers and seeing how much they need to see ppl who's successful in this treatment is very important. Please let us know how ur appointment goes and if u did ur induction too. Good luck!!

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:09 pm 
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Hi MrsCaptAmerica! Very interesting story you have there. Please come back soon and let us know how your doing. I really hope your induction is going well today. Wow Openmind, I didn't know you had that history with Kratom. You learn something new about the people here every day. I actually tried the Kratom when I was skipping days and trying to come off Suboxone but I couldn't tell I took anything. I tried the Kratom two different times and nothing. I paid like $40 for the two little bags I had and I still have one bag left. I don't plan to ever use it but anyway I do still have it. Enough rambling. Have a good one guys, Sincerely, Angie


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 4:35 am 
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Wow all, thanks for taking the time to read that and for all your support. I am so thankful for this site and people like you all. God bless you.

So a little more detail about the Kratom use. I started to use that about 4 months after I was discharged from rehab. One of my friends who knew about my addiction had told me about it, for she had been on it for about a year as well. She started taking the Maeng Da for a "boost" of energy, then switched to the Malay because of the pain killing effects. She happened to work in a head shop too :? Anyway, after the whole "90 meetings in 90 days" and intensive outpatient therapy for 8 weeks, I decided to get some, and have it on hand, just in case cravings were going to be too much. I figured taking an "all natural" substance would be much better than the alternative. I started with 2-4 0.5mg capsules a day as needed, and there were days when I didn't even take it. I took them pretty sporadically for about 5 months, then the usage started increasing due to stress-stress about money, job, kids....just your average stress that to an addict is not your average stress lol. Anyway, I started gradually increase my doses, cause I thought "hey, since this stuff has been in southeast asia for a gazillion years, its safe to take as much as it takes to make me feel better." At one point I would take 22-24 0.5mg capsules a day. It woukd make me feel better....not like opiates, certainly no euphoria, but more like I had been before the monkey climbed his way on my back and dug his claws in. Back when I was"opiate naive." When I started taking 24 a day, just to feel "normal" I knew I needed help. Plus, the nursing board doesn't look too kindly on nurses using Kratom. So in March I started going back to group, and meeting with a doctor and a cognitive behavior therapist. At the 3rd (?) visit, we went into detail avout MAT. She was pushing hard for the Vivitrol injection. I was leaning toward Suboxone. The Vivitrol scared me because I didn't think I could stay off the kratom for 7 to 14 days in order to get the shot. I also tend to be a "worst case scenario" person and thought what if I get into a horrible accident and they have to amputate my leg? What are they going to use for pain, Advil? They can override the Vivitrol injection, but apparently it takes A LOT of IV anesthesia, and I don't want them to accidentally kill me. So I wanted something that wood control cravings, but be able to leave my system in a relatively short period of time. After basically making me feel badly for disagreeing with her about the Vivitrol, I decided it was time to find a new doctor, and lo and behold, here I am! :lol:

So my appointment today was awesome yet brutal. I had to really be honest with myself about the reason for my need for medication, and the sh*tty things I did when I was using. My former doctor asked me about all that on the first visit, then subsequent visits led to "taper down" your dose by 2 pills a day (a little too quickly if you ask me) to pushing me about the vivitrol. I brought my research that I had done with people using Suboxone to get off Kratom, because she said there wasn't any"case studies" about it that she was aware of. She also began prescribing me Clonidine to help with anxiety. Told her I couldn't take it at work, because it knocks my BP down so low I'm not even allowed to take it. She is a whole other topic for another day, and this is already a freakin' book :shock:

Thank you all for taking the hour it took to read this lol. I look forward to hearing from you all, and if I can help with anything, please don't hesitate to reach out.


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