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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:39 am 
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mama79 wrote:
Ya, rca, in due time you will work out those issues. You already have a HUGE project going! I know what it's like to suddenly feel everything agai , and not have something to turn to in order to shut those feelings down. Nighttime is the hardest when you can't sleep because it's nothing but you and your thoughts; no kids, work, husband, or life stuff to distract you! You'll get through it! I also have to make myself "pass out" from time to time to ensure I get at least SOME rest.

I will pray for you! You are treading through this like a champ!


Thanks mama, I have been praying like mad for "all" of us, and I appreciate your thoughts and prayers as always. I had a better night last night, with fewer (but not zero) meds.


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:54 am 
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Okay RCA, JI - I have to ask because I never got smaller than 2 mg. Exactly how big of a piece is .15 and .25? How do you know its exact? Just curious. I envy you guys for your ability to taper that low. You saved yourselves 17 days of crap! The first 17 days for me were tough. Day 25 and I JUST stopped with the "poo stew". Bwahaha ya lucky bastards!


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:24 am 
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trainer14 wrote:
Okay RCA, JI - I have to ask because I never got smaller than 2 mg. Exactly how big of a piece is .15 and .25? How do you know its exact? Just curious. I envy you guys for your ability to taper that low. You saved yourselves 17 days of crap! The first 17 days for me were tough. Day 25 and I JUST stopped with the "poo stew". Bwahaha ya lucky bastards!


Well, up unti .5 I was just using "fractions" knowing that one strip was 8mgs. Then I split the .5 in half from corner to corner to get .25. Then "Karen" pointed out the "taper guide" which is a PDF you can buy for ten bucks and you place the strip over the guide, (subs are see-through) and cut on the guide or mark the strip and cut. .125 is VERY small, just a teeny tiny square. But I even feel THAT, so that tells me what a powerful drug this is. Congrats on Day 25 and and "end" to the stew!! ha ha! (


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:20 am 
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Thanks for the props, RCA. When I woke up yesterday, I thought 'ferchristsake, am I really going to put myself through another week of a lower Subs dose level?' But putting off my jump seems even worse, so I went ahead and did it.

Another no-sleep night last night -- I basically passed out for an hour around 9 pm, which of course kept me up the rest of the right. At 5 am, I decided to take my dose (rather than waiting until after breakfast), and afterwards I did fall back to sleep for a couple hours. So even this low dose is having some effect (makes me wonder if I should think about adding a week to my taper, at .075 or something like that. Though I have no idea how to measure so small a dose, I get the 2 mg Suboxone pills.)

I have a theory about why nights are so bad. I take a single dose in the morning, and by night time, the dose is wearing off, and my body is feeling the absence. Other people on the forum talk about taking half of their split dose at night, which apparently does help with sleep. I don't want to change my pattern, though, not this close to my jump.

Also, at night there is nothing to distract me (e.g. work, friends, etc) from my thoughts. I don't get any strong emotional upheaval at night, but I have a hunch that there is a lurking fear, just beneath my consciousness, about getting off drugs 100%. I would explore this through mediation, except I'm just too damn tired to meditate in the middle of the night, and it's impossible to concentrate.

Anyhow, I think this is all just part of the healing process, and my taper is twenty times easier than straight-up heroin withdrawal. At this point, other than the sleeplessness and periods of stress during the daytime, I'm not getting much at all in the way of withdrawal symptoms.

I'm going to throw out a NiN song for my friends on this forum, Discipline. If you listen closely to the lyrics, you'll catch the connection with addiction recovery and our tapers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R_I2G_mWsc&feature=kp

-- JI

rca1004 wrote:
johnny_ikon wrote:
Hey rca, I managed to get 5 hours last night, so I'm one up on you (though I don't like 'oneupmanship').

Yesterday, no sleep notwithstanding, turned out to be a really awesome day. Went through the entire afternoon and early evening doing something I enjoyed, and didn't notice fatigue or stress at all. Came away thinking, if I can enjoy myself so much, how bad can this taper really be?

I went down to .15 mg/day today (wanted to do .125 but just can't measure that accurately), and am feeling rocky physically, but nothing unmanageable. Emotionally, I've felt really good"



You can "oneup" me anytime JI- I am happy for you! (BTW, I got 5 1/2 last night so BEAT YA- ha ha!- unless you got more last night, which i hope!!)

So glad to hear you "realized" you could enjoy yourself during the taper!!! Also CONGRATULATIONS on .15!!!! You have also "one-uped' me there!!! I may tray .25mgs today since I basically have zero wdls right now, excpet for the sleep issue, which might just be a purely "mental" issue and not just have to do with the subs....we shall see. Writing it out and getting supportive feedback sure helps.
Wow- .15!! Great news JI- you can DO IT!!! (I am trying to get some of trainer's attitude to rub off on me! :D )

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"Past and future veil God from our sight; burn both of them with fire."
-- Rumi, Sufi poet and teacher


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:32 am 
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I just realized that if I do add another week to my taper at .075 mg/day, my jump off day would be July 4....Independence Day. Hmmmm.

-- JI

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"Past and future veil God from our sight; burn both of them with fire."
-- Rumi, Sufi poet and teacher


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:59 am 
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johnny_ikon wrote:
I just realized that if I do add another week to my taper at .075 mg/day, my jump off day would be July 4....Independence Day. Hmmmm.

-- JI

Hey JI, I LOVE that you would be getting your independence on Independence Day! Seems like a sign to me! When I finished college and decided to move cross country by myself to start my career, I could have gone "any" day, and so I chose "March 4th"! (March Forth!).


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:07 am 
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What to say, what to say....feeling a little "stuck" at .375mgs, and mentally have really started seriously thinking about trying to just jump from this dose. I'm thinking that the time period of withdrawal will be the same from this dose or .25 or .125, just slightly stronger physical symptoms during this time, and I have to decide if I am a "warrior or a wuss" as Trainer's dad who is currently living in my head is telling me (ha ha). There will never be a "perfect " time. But things at home have settled down, I have some time off, and I feel like I am SOOOOOOOO close to "freedom" I can smell it. I also think with the emotional support and practical information I have found here, I have a really good chance of being successful. My kids are old enough that even if I am "sicK' for a few days, they will manage, and I do have help, so really, my only excuse is my stupid brain telling me I "can't" and it will be "horrible"....
I think I am going to challenge those thoughts, and give it a try on Sat, or Sun,...today I have taken .25, and am just gonna try and stay with that through tlll the weekend, then JUMP!!! (I may have to swim back and climb up the diving board again, but I'm gonna give it my best shot!)

Thank you EVERYONE for your posts, support, success stories, sharing your challenges, and especially your humanity with me...it is making all the difference!
Peace & Love,
rca


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:47 am 
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Hi RCA, glad to hear that you're getting yourself ready to do your jump.

Personally, I found that my taper has gotten easier the lower down I go in dose level, but then again I have no idea what to expect when I do my jump. I'm at .15 mg/day now, and am thinking about doing my first Sub-free day by this weekend.

But for all I know, i'll get some heavy withdrawal symptoms once I'm off Subs, in which case I may as well have jumped at a higher dose.

If you're feeling ready to do the deed, that sounds like a positive sign. Good luck!

-- JI

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"Past and future veil God from our sight; burn both of them with fire."
-- Rumi, Sufi poet and teacher


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:12 pm 
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If you feel 150% ready, I say do it!!!!! Honestly the time really does go by fast and before you know it, 26 days have gone by and you have put the crappy wds behind you. Since you have time off work, its 1 less thing you have to worry about.

the biggest secret weapon in wds imo is hot baths!!!! Cannot beat the power of a hot bath. I havent needed one in a few days but am sure after tonight (working my legs at the gym), I will be pruning up in the tub. Haha

its not as hard as we think it is going to be. Once you get past a week, and you see that you can do it, you gain momentum! Then it gets easier because you can feel the improvement every day. Some things took awhile to ease up for me (19 days of coldsweats anyone?), but at 26 days, all physical stuff is gone.

you can do it!


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:30 pm 
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Hey, thanks Trainer and JI!

Well, shit! It is a good thing that I was getting "mentally" prepared, because the "Universe" has decided that after my next .125 dose, I will Jump....like tomorrow.....or if I can hold out on taking that .125mg dose, then the next day (Fri.) will be my last.
Here is the deal. I prepared my subs for the week on Saturday as usual. I f-ed up and "somehow" did not put "anything" in for Wed, Fri or Sat!!! And am currently in a position where I can't get more for a few days, so I guess "this is it!!!" I am not 150% ready, but I am ready. HERE WE GO!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:39 pm 
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rca1004 wrote:
Hey, thanks Trainer and JI!

Well, shit! It is a good thing that I was getting "mentally" prepared, because the "Universe" has decided that after my next .125 dose, I will Jump....like tomorrow.....or if I can hold out on taking that .125mg dose, then the next day (Fri.) will be my last.
Here is the deal. I prepared my subs for the week on Saturday as usual. I f-ed up and "somehow" did not put "anything" in for Wed, Fri or Sat!!! And am currently in a position where I can't get more for a few days, so I guess "this is it!!!" I am not 150% ready, but I am ready. HERE WE GO!!!!


Here we go! Wheeeeeeee!!! :)


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:33 pm 
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I know that you have been doing anything and everything in order to prep yourself to jump; i.e. exercise, tapering, posting, etc. I can tell you that the symptoms aren't that bad, and nothing new from what we've already experienced during our taper. I always keep trainer in mind, and she said that she felt a hell of a lot better at about 14/15 days, and she jumped at 2mg cold turkey! It sounds like you have comfort meds, and you are at a much lower dose (as was I) so I think you could definitely handle it! BUT...don't feel bad if you have to jump on a little while longer, as I recently did (but then jumped again :roll: ). You know that whatever you decide you have a whole bunch of people here who will support you no matter what!!


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:27 pm 
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johnny_ikon wrote:

I'm going to throw out a NiN song for my friends on this forum, Discipline. If you listen closely to the lyrics, you'll catch the connection with addiction recovery and our tapers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R_I2G_mWsc&feature=kp



Self discipline sure beats disciplinary action! (unless maybe it's a kinky sexual indulgence, that one is into when in the mood for something different, lol)

Great how you made a song association with that one, for addiction recovery and such!

Am reminded that King Crimson put out an album with the title "Discipline". It's not everybody's cup of tea, but I like just about the entire album (it also available on youtube, in it's entirety), but here is the title track, which is an instrumental:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-dZNzXylVE

..best with headphone or earbuds, as lots happening on both sides and crossing over through the middle. Something different to listen to anyway, and see where one's mind takes them, while spacing-out (naturally, of course. Weed and such is optional. Personally, the stuff tends to make me paranoid).


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:44 pm 
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Well, I'm twelve days off around 1 mg. I have to be honest, i feel normal. A Little slugish but thats it. You just have to get past the mental side of it which for most i would assume, is the first three days. Its all mental rca, your gonna feel great and its going to be a huge relief.!! Ttyl


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:21 pm 
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no_boop_shoo_be_doop wrote:
johnny_ikon wrote:

I'm going to throw out a NiN song for my friends on this forum, Discipline. If you listen closely to the lyrics, you'll catch the connection with addiction recovery and our tapers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R_I2G_mWsc&feature=kp



Self discipline sure beats disciplinary action! (unless maybe it's a kinky sexual indulgence, that one is into when in the mood for something different, lol)

Great how you made a song association with that one, for addiction recovery and such!

Am reminded that King Crimson put out an album with the title "Discipline". It's not everybody's cup of tea, but I like just about the entire album (it also available on youtube, in it's entirety), but here is the title track, which is an instrumental:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-dZNzXylVE

..best with headphone or earbuds, as lots happening on both sides and crossing over through the middle. Something different to listen to anyway, and see where one's mind takes them, while spacing-out (naturally, of course. Weed and such is optional. Personally, the stuff tends to make me paranoid).


It just crossed my mind, that the King Crimson "Discipline" album cover might make for a great tat pattern. I liked the one you have of "serenity", posted elsewhere. Asian language characters look very cool, even if one doesn't know the meaning. I'm so glad a friend of mine talked me out of getting a tat of a nuclear mushroom cloud on my forehead; would have made new and improved job prospects a little more difficult, perhaps.


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:26 pm 
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m0jitoMan wrote:
Well, I'm twelve days off around 1 mg. I have to be honest, i feel normal. A Little slugish but thats it. You just have to get past the mental side of it which for most i would assume, is the first three days. Its all mental rca, your gonna feel great and its going to be a huge relief.!! Ttyl


Congrats on your dirty dozen day. Baker's dozen coming up! Try not to get superstitious about the number 13, just knock on wood and throw a pinch of salt over your left shoulder, and it will go smooth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uS3XJQA6voE


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 2:38 am 
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no_boop_shoo_be_doop wrote:
johnny_ikon wrote:

I'm going to throw out a NiN song for my friends on this forum, Discipline. If you listen closely to the lyrics, you'll catch the connection with addiction recovery and our tapers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R_I2G_mWsc&feature=kp



Self discipline sure beats disciplinary action! (unless maybe it's a kinky sexual indulgence, that one is into when in the mood for something different, lol)

Great how you made a song association with that one, for addiction recovery and such!

Am reminded that King Crimson put out an album with the title "Discipline". It's not everybody's cup of tea, but I like just about the entire album (it also available on youtube, in it's entirety), but here is the title track, which is an instrumental:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-dZNzXylVE

..best with headphone or earbuds, as lots happening on both sides and crossing over through the middle. Something different to listen to anyway, and see where one's mind takes them, while spacing-out (naturally, of course. Weed and such is optional. Personally, the stuff tends to make me paranoid).



I gotta discipline myself to get off this forum and go to bed!

(this time, with lyrics)

I do remember one thing.
It took hours and hours but..
By the time I was done with it,
I was so involved, I didn't know what to think.

I carried it around with me for days and days..
Playing little games
Like not looking at it for a whole day
And then... looking at it.

To see if I still liked it.
I did.


~King Crimson
song link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Od91ESn96YM


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 5:44 am 
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I gave up on trying to rest at a decent hour. The sandman is probably getting impatient, and about to bury me under a beach. But in my web and musical meanderings elsewhere, during the interim following my last comment, perhaps a tangent just came home, full circle.

I just realized the King Crimson CD sleeve/album art, is quite possibly a 2D representation of a
Gordian Knot (<-- Google image, search results hyperlink, & -->http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordian_Knot).

Image

RCA, since we got on a tangent about spirituality, the Universal Mind, and related mysteries elsewhere... do you think there is any possibility of a Jungianish, synchronicity-like thing happening? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synchronicity). As oddly enough, I go by another name when off-screen, that's not "boop or no_boop". And to further implicate my often self-centered self, that other name is my given name, which is "Gordie", which sounds somewhat similar, even though it is not un-Gordie or Gordie-un.

So perhaps I really will get that "Discipline" tat. Where, I dunno, but perhaps on my right bicep after the day arrives to celebrate the final mending of my right arm, so as a bonus, I can watch it grow to become more and more intractable in size, if I ever get to the gym.

It's so late/early here, the bird chirping is crescendoing with the arrival of a new day, that for me has become merged with yesterday, as my mind begins to finally slow down, and eyelids droop. Perhaps I'll make it out of bed around noon.


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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:05 am 
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DAY 1- SUBOXONE FREE!!


First off, Hey, it's "me" rca. I have always liked the metaphor of the butterfly = re-birth = spiritual growth = eventually moving from the physical to the "spiritual" realm for eternity, etc. Hence the shadow "butterfly" in my "old" avatar. I have been stewing in my "drug cocoon" for too long....or perhaps just "long enough"?. So, yesterday I only took .25mg. I slept relatively well, and woke up "today" and "just knew". I believe (for today) that I am done. Since I can be a relatively "stubborn" person, I am trying to take some steps to keep me strong (and stubborn) when I may be feeling less confident, and one of those is starting a new thread, with a new avatar and a new username (but if you still want to call me "rca" that is just fine :D I tried to make my new username "Butterfly", but it was taken. I actually prefer the "ButterFLYING" because that is what I am doing...flying AWAY from drugs and TOWARDS my true, complete "metamorphosed" self.

I (hopefully) will not be posting on this thread again after today (although if anyone posts here, I will try to keep up and read it, and there are a few things posted here I have not yet responded to that i would like to). I am starting a "new" thread: Flying Towards Freedom!
Hope to catcha there!!

ButterFLYING!
(aka: rca....hmmm...now that I have had to type that new user name a few times, I am re-thinking it- ha ha ha)

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 Post subject: Re: Need support
PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:29 am 
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no_boop_shoo_be_doop wrote:
RCA, since we got on a tangent about spirituality, the Universal Mind, and related mysteries elsewhere... do you think there is any possibility of a Jungianish, synchronicity-like thing happening? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synchronicity). As oddly enough, I go by another name when off-screen, that's not "boop or no_boop". And to further implicate my often self-centered self, that other name is my given name, which is "Gordie", which sounds somewhat similar, even though it is not un-Gordie or Gordie-un.

So perhaps I really will get that "Discipline" tat. Where, I dunno, but perhaps on my right bicep after the day arrives to celebrate the final mending of my right arm, so as a bonus, I can watch it grow to become more and more intractable in size, if I ever get to the gym.

Yes, Gordie (un), I believe the Universe is speaking to you...you most certainly are a "Gordian Knot"....A fascinating puzzle! Get the tat! And watch it grow! :D

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