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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:55 pm 
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Hi all,

I relapsed about 6 months ago and luckily only ran for about 3 weeks. Anyway, I had a hard time with withdrawls, got this bad idea, and researched a bit on IM-ing or Intramuscular shots of suboxone b/c "it goes a longer way" or "holds you longer". Well IM-ing the subs definitely was more effective than sublingual, but here I am 6 months later with fricking abscesses galore (some treated, some not treated) and need to stop the insanity ASAP.

I'm just scared that I have a higher tolerance b/c I'm IM-ing? I'm only IM-ing 1mg-1.5 mg a day whihc I know is low, but given absoprtion and all the science behind adminsitration, I'm wondering what 1.5mg IM is equilvalent to sublingually? Any idea? Also what's this I'm reading about taking it sublingually and alcohol hleping w/ absorption?

I'm also considering plugging...which I know isn't the best idea, but I figure it's much less harmful than IM. Any advice or support you might offer would be greatly apprecaited. My skin is a f#cking mess with scars and abscesses and I can't take this anymore.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:04 am 
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This is what I would look in the mirror and say to myself. Please don't be offended, I often talk to myself this way. (This is also my opinion and advise).

EFFING STOP IT!!!! STOP IT RIGHT NOW!!!! WHAT THE H E DOUBLE HOCKEY STICKS (couldn't resist being funny) ARE YOU DOING TO ME. YOU KNOW BETTER. GET THAT HATEFUL, LIFE SUCKING ADDICT BACK OUT OF YOUR HEAD AND DO IT RIGHT. YOU TOOK THE STEPS TO GET CLEAN AND NOW YOU ARE AFRAID TO FACE DOING IT RIGHT AGAIN. FIRST TIME IS HARD, SECOND TIME, NOT SO MUCH. DO IT NOW BEFORE YOU REALLY HURT AND HATE YOURSELF!!! NOW. DO NOT MAKE ME TELL YOU AGAIN.

Ok, that was just for a little drama. """Courage is not the absence of fear, but doing something in spite of it."" Mark Twain.

I hope this helps and makes you laugh a little. If it doesn't I have failed, but I WILL try again. LOL Good luck.
:wink: :shock:

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 Post subject: Stop this behavior
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:28 am 
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Do yourself the biggest favor ever find a Dr to help you , ya ya money might be tight , do it !!! Trust me its going to take a long time to get this shit straightened out ( years for me) its not going to get any easier tomorrow .... OMG Suboxone is a lifesaver ... You'll never find out how much of a lifesaver it is using it like this , Good Luck ,,, and by the way post before mine is so great and spot on , look in the mirror and say it , mean it ..... Mike Sullivan 1mg per day , 2 mg on the mornings my bipolar is acting up , just 1extra mg changes my whole day , I may do that only 3-4 times a month , can't take extra Suboxone every day , it won't work


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 8:33 am 
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hey guys, thanks for the feedback. I know this is WRONG and I know I have to change NOW, but my question is how to go about it? I have a doctor, but he's clueless all around. I have plenty of subs as he has been prescribing me 8mg a day and I only use or shoot via the muscle 1mg per day. Should I start back sublingually with 4mg, maybe 6? I know IM-ing absorbs much more than sublingual so I'm just trying to get an idea of where to start sublingually. Thanks.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:51 am 
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Oh,I see what your asking now. Let me get this straight. You are prescribed 8mg per day but you were only taking 1 mg intramuscularly, and nothing sublingually? You want to know how much to take sublingually to match the 1mg IM right? I don't know the answer to that, but why don't you start with 2mg and see how you feel, if that's not enough take another 2mg and so on until you feel normal. That's what I would do anyway. You have to quit the IM' ing...seriously, you know that. Just do it, it might take a few days for your body to adjust to the new dose but you will be fine. Keep us updated k?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:02 am 
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qhorsegal2 wrote:
Oh,I see what your asking now. Let me get this straight. You are prescribed 8mg per day but you were only taking 1 mg intramuscularly, and nothing sublingually? You want to know how much to take sublingually to match the 1mg IM right? I don't know the answer to that, but why don't you start with 2mg and see how you feel, if that's not enough take another 2mg and so on until you feel normal. That's what I would do anyway. You have to quit the IM' ing...seriously, you know that. Just do it, it might take a few days for your body to adjust to the new dose but you will be fine. Keep us updated k?


thanks, Q. yes, that's exactly what I'm asking. You are right though, start low and increase if need be. I apprecaite the support. Tomorrow I will offically be done with the needle. I did IM this AM and threw away all rigs. I needed that kick in the a55 that was provided above. I will keep you guys updated. Any tips, feedback, or support is still much apprecaited. Thanks all.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:40 am 
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Hey Almost..

I don't think I could offer any better advice other than what you have already received! What I will offer is this....you have to rise above this and you will rise above it. One of the hardest things to do is acknowledge that your in a tailspin and reach out for help. You have done that! Please keep us posted, we care!

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:50 pm 
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ATFG,

I would start with 4mgs.. even if you have to split dose 2 in the morning and 2 later on. You need to make sure that you're getting enough sub so the temptation to use rigs is gone, as it is you'll be fighting off the physical habit/ ritual.. no need to make it worse by not getting enough sub into your system and dealing with cravings to boot. So add more if you have to, you just need to break this habit.

Good luck to you, you know what you need to do. Do it. Give your skin a chance to heal and for the love of all things good, get any remaining abscesses looked at! Don't let those go, you may need to have them removed.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 1:11 pm 
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thanks, TD.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:49 pm 
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I just want to say good luck tomorrow! You can do this!

Amy

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 8:15 am 
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Great point TD,

I hadn't thought of the extra issue of breaking the habit/ritual aspect of the needle. That's why this forum is so great. Different people with different experiences coming together to help one another with the thing we all struggle with. Love it!

@ATFG - Good luck today! Be strong...you can do it! The first few days are always the hardest, just try to stick it out ONE DAY AT A TIME!


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:10 pm 
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Hey ATFG,

Welcome to the forum!!

Sublingual Suboxone absorption is usually pegged around 30%. If IM were 100% absorption, then you'd have to take 5mg sublingually to equal 1.5mg of Suboxone via IM.

Someone else already said try 4mg and I think that'll get you very close to where you wanna be.

Good Luck!!

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:47 am 
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hey guys, so I'm not quite there yet, but making progress. I tried going from IMing to sublingial cold turkey and it was tough so I mapped-out a plan or schedule where I'd steadily decrease my muscle dose and increase my sulingual dose. So I'm currently at 1 muscle shot per day (vs two a day just over a week ago) and 1 sublingual dose per day. I've steadily dropped the muscle dose from about .75 twice a day to .5 once a day, and at night I subligually dose about 3mg. My body is adjusting and by this time next week...NO MORE RIGS. I hope to be around 4mgs total sublingual only per day.

One of the hardest parts to adjusting is mostly mentally and patience. With a muscle shot you feel the sub working within 10 min and that early morning creepy crawly feeling going away quick. Since sublingually takes much longer (close to an hour for me), I was getting impatient. However, I'm feeling much better about the whole situation and should be back to normal sublingual use only within a week or less!


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 Post subject: Progress, not perfection
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:18 pm 
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That's great ATFG,

At least you are working towards a goal. Most of us would have preferred if you just plain stopped the needle but if this is working then, hey, whatever it takes to reach the goal line.

When taking Suboxone properly, it does take away an immediate rush of feeling good. We who are trying to recover from all drug abuse take it just like the good old doctor said. That way you don't look forward to anything to change the way you feel. Suboxone therapy is supposed to keep you on a steady dose of Bupe with very little highs and lows. I sure hope that is what you are striving for. Anything less and you are still in active addiction. (my 2¢ anyway, other views may vary)

Congrats on your progress and I really hope to see your post next week telling us you are only taking the Suboxone as prescribed.

Rule

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 9:34 pm 
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Rule62 said, "Progress, Not Perfection"......took the words right outta my mouth, Bud.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 9:45 pm 
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Progress...not perfection.

I think this should be my new motto!


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 9:40 am 
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Hello all,

I don't want to jinx it, but I'm excited to report, at least so far, today is the day! I took 4mg SUBLINGUALY :D :D :lol: :lol: this AM about 3 hours ago, which is the same time I'd usually be sticking myself in my arm or shouler (yuck), and I feel pretty damn good! not high, but normal and "even". If I can get through the day without resorting to a rig, I think I'll be fine. I plan on antoher 2mg later this evening for a total of 6mg sublingual on the day! Damn, I already feel like a TON of weight has been lifted off my shoulders.

Next on the agenda, get all these abscesses healed. I went to the emergency room last saturday b/c a couple of them wern't healling correctly. They lanced two and put me on antibiotics and they are looking MUCH better. The sad part, my skin is a f@#$ing mess. I have so MANY scars. gross. I still have 2 or 3 abscesses in the ealry stages. It's weird, in IMing subs I've found that, at least for me, abscess can take 2-3 months before they come to the surface and are ready to be treated. Even the doctor said she's never seen that as they usaully coem to the surface and get red and painful within a coupld of days. I have some lumps or hard bumps (one on my stomach and two on my arm) that aren't sore yet or red, but it's just a matter of time. So in short, it's just a waiting game at this point to get them all healed up. what a f@#$ing mess. Hey, at least I'm on the right path and won't have to deal with them again. I'lll be a bit embarassed taking my shirt off at the beach and answering quesitons, but that's the hole I've dug. It could be A LOT worse.

Lastly, I just want to thank EVERYONW who posted above. Some had more to say than others, but every post was helpful and supportive in some way shape or form.

Thanks again and I'll keep you posted on my progress. Have a great day!

-ATFG


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:13 am 
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Yay!!!!

Just the fact that you started your day with sublingual dosing instead of IM is great! I'm proud of you.... :D

And you feel good, no noticable WD??? Awesome!!!! Stick with it, you can do it! It's amazing how much of this crap is mental...it sucks because we know it in our head but it doesn't make it any easier to get through it. Stay tough!

-Q


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:40 am 
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hey q. thank you. You are so RIGHT, so much of this is in our heads. I went into this with a good attitude this AM and feel great now. tried the same thing a week ago, but wasn't as positive in my head and I failed.

NO WD's at all! I feel exactly the same as if I were to muscle my normal shot. Granted, I took 4mg sublingualy vs my usual roughly 1mg IM, but this is great. I feel great. I got over my biggest hurdle, the fear of WDs or feeling "uncomfortable" when making the switch, but there was none :) that was all in my head. Now that that fear has been lifted, I'm a new man :)

I'm planning on hitting the gym at lunch and doing some light cardio ;-)


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:45 pm 
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ATFG,

I'm SO happy to read this update. Honestly, you need to just max yourself out on sub sublingually, so you forget about any other routes of administration. I'm also really relieved to know that you got yourself checked out, that's really good. I'm not surprised, at all, by the trouble you've had or that the nurse was surprised to see it. Injecting pharmaceutical pills is more troublesome (IMO) than plain old heroin. It has to be all the fillers. I got the "fever" so many times from Oxy and never with heroin.. go figure.

Anyway, I'm happy for your that you're on the right path. Don't fret about your scars now, just keep moving forward. Some could fade and others will remind you of where you've been and how far you've come.. like little battle wounds. ;)


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