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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 12:32 am 
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I have been posting on other sites trying to get some answers thank goodness I came here.
I have a few questions...
I started treatment yesterday morning. (Sat) I stopped taking 15mg Oxy IR (Roxi) I usually cut them in half to a quarter every 4-6 hours. Last one I had was Friday morning.
My doctor seems like a idiot he prescribed me 2 sub films 8/2. 1 is really high in the first place. This was my actual intake of meds no bs. My pharmacist told me to take 1 film or half. So I started on half of a film... I felt the instant release of withdrawal my chest got warm and my vision got funny. It scared me but then I felt fine good and full of energy. The whole day I was able to perform daily things and eat. Sat evening however I started feeling sick while riding in the car and I didnt sleep well. Maybe only have had small short brief periods of sleep. Today (Sun) puking all day cannot keep anything down not even water. What the hell? The nasea and vomiting is too much I feel like I have a hangover. I am also worried because I cannot lose anymore weight ill end up in the hospital. On top of that I have to be at work on tues because I took mon off in case I wasnt feeling 100%. Basically I need to be at a normal stable level. Not high... I haven't had any cravings. Just feeling another kind of sick. Kinda concerned my dr seems like a idiot so I am on my own in this.


My questions..
What the hell? Puking all day and why?
Should I switch to subutex?
Was I correct in dosing at 1 half of a 8 film for what I personally was taking.

Any answers are very much appreciated. Thanks! =)


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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 2:34 am 
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[size=12]Hi ambr, welcome to the forum.

I'm sorry that you're not feeling well. Hopefully we can get you sorted out so you'll be feeling better in time to go back to work on Tuesday. Of course, I should say that I'm not a medical professional and this is just my opinion, you should of course talk to your doctor, etc.

First I just wanted to clarify - you just started taking Suboxone this Saturday, right? You took 1/2 of an 8mg film and felt fine for most of the day, but in the evening you began to feel sick and didn't sleep well. Sunday you have been throwing up and still not sleeping. Did you take another dose of Suboxone today? If so, how much did you take?

And you were taking IR Oxy before - you said 15mgs...was that the total amount per day? That is a pretty small habit. Even if you were taking twice that much (30mgs per day), the amount of Suboxone your doctor prescribed (16mgs/day) would be excessive. 8mgs or even 4mgs might be way too much for someone with your tolerance level. Buprenorphine is pretty potent stuff.

One possibility is that you picked up some kind of stomach bug, but that seems like a BIG coincidence.

So lets say that your symptoms are a reaction to the Suboxone. What you described doesn't sound like precipitated withdrawal, so I'm going to guess that your dose was just too high.

Too much buprenorphine can cause nausea and vomiting, headaches, dizziness, insomnia, etc. One quick way to tell if you've taken too much buperenorphine (the active ingredient in Suboxone) is to take a look at your pupils. If your pupils are very constricted, that can be a sign that you've taken too much. Conversely, very dialated pupils indicates that you are in withdrawal.

I would say don't take another dose of Suboxone until you get the vomiting under control. Buprenorphine is long-lasting, so it might take a while for you to feel better. Have you been able to hold down any water? If you continue to vomit and can't hold water down, you might need to get some promethazine or something.

Once you've stopped throwing up and gotten yourself rehydrated, you will need to redo your induction. If I were you, I would wait until I was feeling moderate withdrawal symptoms and then start with a very small dose of Suboxone - like 1mg, so you would need to cut the strip into eighths. Take the 1mg and wait for at least one hour. See how you feel - are you having any withdrawal symptoms? Any cravings? Do you feel sick or strange in any way?

If the 1mg dose seems to be enough, then stay at 1mg. You can dose again 12 hours later if you need it, if not dose again in 24 hours. If the 1mg dose isn't cutting it, take another 1mg, wait an hour and see how you feel. The idea is to take the lowest dose that suppresses all your withdrawal symptoms and cravings. Once you figure out what that dose is and get stabilized on it (when you've been on the dose for a few days with no withdrawal and no cravings) then you can start dosing once every 24 hours. Once a day dosing is ideal because it helps us break the habit of dosing many times a day and dosing in response to how we are feeling. You want to take your Sub in the morning and forget about it for the rest of the day.

You asked if you should switch to Subutex. The only difference between Suboxone and Subutex is Naloxone, which is inactive when the drug is taken orally, so it really shouldn't matter either way. That said, some people find that they are highly sensitive to Naloxone and that it gives them headaches. One way to avoid this without switching to Subutex is just to spit out any fluid or residue from the film after it has been dissolved and absorbed. So you would dissolve the strip as usual, and after 10-15 minutes, you would just spit out whatever was left in your mouth instead of swallowing. After that, don't eat or drink for another 10-15 minutes. If you think the problems you're having are realted to Naloxone, this is something you could try to see if it helps. (I had headaches my first few weeks on Sub so I switched to the spitting method and they cleared right up.)

I hope this info helps you out. I'm curious though - you were taking a pretty low dose of Oxy - would you object to sharing why you decided to start Suboxone treatment? Are you using it for chronic pain or have you had issues with PAWS or something? I think Suboxone is a great tool and I'm totally supportive of people using it, so please don't think that I'm judging you or saying that you shouldn't be on it or anything. I'm just wondering if you're aware of the tolerance issues and of how potent buprenorphine is.

I'm glad you found us and I hope you'll keep us posted and let us know if you have any other questions. There are lots of smart, caring, compassionate, funny, and genuinely wonderful people here who will share their knowledge and experience with you - and we'd love to know more about you as well. I hope you feel better soon!
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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 3:31 pm 
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Yes I did just start taking half of the sub film sat and I took the same dose sun morning yesterday. I have not taken my dose this morning. I am gonna wait and see if I can hydrate and keep stuff down and begin feeling sick again and try the 1/8 of a film see if that levels me out. I feel kinda tired today.. Nauseated this morning havent vomited yet though. So thats good. Taking it easy. I think you may be right.. I didn't want to be on the oxy anymore even though it was a low dose. I do have issues because prior I used to be on higher amounts. I am dealing with the pain. Am I even able to take tylenol or ibuprophen while being on sub?

I was able to sleep some last night on my own so that is good.


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PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 2:38 am 
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Hey ambr - I'm glad you checked back in.

Yes, you can take tylenol or ibuprofen while you're on Suboxone.

When I first started Suboxone, my husband didn't know anything about what it was or how strong it was or anything. His friend was over helping with a project and hurt his back so my husband gave him one of my pills.* It was an 8mg one. He told his friend not to take the whole thing, but he didn't listen.

Anway, to make a long story short, his friend felt great for a few hours and then spent the next 24 hours puking. He was so sick that if he even tried to get out of bed he would just barf. And this guy wasn't a stranger to opiates - he was a solid recreational user. It took a day or two but he made a full recovery.

I would think that you should be feeling a lot better by Tuesday morning. Probably not great, but much better. Have you talked to your doctor at all?

When you do try to do your induction again, you might want to make sure you've had a meal first. I remember when I first started Sub if I took it on an empty stomach it would hit me really hard. And do give it a good, solid hour to kick in; though you feel it pretty quickly it does take a long time for the dose to kick in fully.

I hope you get a good night's sleep and are able to put this all behind you tomorrow! I'm sorry you had such a rough introduction to Suboxone and I hope you're able to get things worked out :D I had pain issues too and Suboxone did help with my pain, so hopefully it will work for you too. Take care and let us know how it goes.


*I had no idea my husband was going to give away one of my pills and I set him straight about that - he never did it again.

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PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 8:15 am 
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I think DOAQ has given you great advice. I just wanted to say that I'm on Subutex, not Suboxone....(financial reasons, I'm lucky my dr is giving it to me). When I first started, and I came off of methadone. Initially I was on 10mg, then 12mg and then 16mg the first 2 weeks. I couldn't eat much those 2 weeks. I was nauseated all the time. Never vomited, however. Then I'd have headaches when I upped my dose. I had w/d symptoms so that was why we raised my dose...so I ended up just pushing through....waiting the headaches out and the nausea subsided when I stabilized.

After 2 weeks I felt pretty stabilized. And now I'm down to 6mg. A couple of weeks ago I was taking my Sub and just popped an 8mg pill, totally forgot to cut it down to 6mg! and I got a headache....The point of this is that sub is so potent and sometimes it takes a while to figure out the right dose. Make sure you stay as low as you can...you shouldn't have any cravings at all...so, like DOAQ said, just take the lowest amt you need to keep the cravings at bay.

Good luck


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PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 3:41 pm 
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Currently I am stable on 1/8 of a film. The dosing was way too much even at half of a film. I felt better once I decreased the dose and took it at the same time everyday. I am almost at about 2 weeks on the subs. I have dealt with a few side effects. Constipation which is fine with some colace. I noticed I am more hungry and actually have a appetite. Dry eyes or watery.. Red and Irritated. I have allergies and I take nasonex for that. Some chills here and there they kinda come and go. Runny Nose comes and goes. Tired... Kinda depressed here and there. Thinking of seeing a psych doctor to help address some of these issues I have been having. Because I just don't feel right. It feels good to be off the meds. I will start posting around so you guys can get to know me and share my experiences.


Thanks for the help.


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