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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:43 pm 
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Please, anyone, I need some advice:

I have a very, very good friend that I consider a brother that is doing something completely off-the-wall, and illegal. I do not know how he is getting by with it.
He and I share the same Suboxone Physician. However, yesterday morning, he called and asked me to ride around with him. He said that he had some "errands and stuff." I agreed, he picked me up. He pulled into a local Suboxone clinic, went in, and was seen by the Doctor there! I said "what are you doing?" he replied to me, very jovially, that he has "been seeing two different Suboxone Doctors for about 7 months now." When I asked him why he told me "2 a day is not enough for me". I know that these Physicians are both in different states, but now I am in a moral and ethical pinch. He is a really close friend of mine, but it blew me away when I discovered this. I do not want to see him go to jail, but I am afraid of what may happen if he continues to do this.
How is this possible? I thought that these "Doctors" had a moral obligation to make sure that this stuff did not happen? If anyone has any decent advice for me, please let me know.

Thank You![b]


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:56 pm 
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Welcome to the forum. Certainly this is a concern, but I guess I have to ask you, what would you like these two doctors to do? How would you like them to figure out that this "friend" is doctor shopping? This is a huge problem in the medical community. Many doctors are pretty smart and sharp but they don't have special powers or a crystal ball. To expect them to have "a moral obligation to make sure that this stuff did not happen" is a bit much. Some states have prescription databases that help to prevent this. However, the fact that your buddy is going to doctors in different states makes even that very difficult - even if either of these states have the database.

As for going to jail, that is really not very likely. Certainly if he is selling the Suboxone or buying it on the street legal repercussions could occur. However, the crime of "doctor shopping" is rarely prosecuted. It's just not worth the time of most law enforcement.

So, then, what should you do? I think all that you can and the best that you can is to speak to this friend about what he is doing. In reality, it's not really going to harm him. It's not getting him high. In fact, taking more than 16mg is really not doing anything for him. It is very, very likely just all in his head. I would try to work with him to get him to understand how Sub works and that taking more than 16mg will not provide any additional effect. See if you can get him to understand. Beyond that, I'm not sure you can do too much. And again, while I don't at all support what this guy is doing, in the grand scheme of things, he could be doing much, much worse.

Hopefully some others will give you their thoughts as well. In fact they may disagree and give you some different advice. That's what makes this place so great!


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:56 pm 
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Some would say the morally right thing to do would be to tell the doctor. If it were me I would just let it be. Suboxone poses no risk in overdose so you need not worry about that. I'm sure he knows the risks of his actions so what can you do? I guess you could mention to him that what he's doing is illegal but I don't think that is going to stop him. I'm sure some others will have differing opinions here.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:09 pm 
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Hi caesar and welcome. It's a shame that your friend has put you in this difficult position. What sounds weird to me is that if he wanted a higher dose, why not just ask the doctor? Or switch doctors entirely? Is it possible that he's selling those extra subs? It's just something that occurred to me, mainly because of how odd his explanation is.

As for him going to jail...I live in Michigan and here it is illegal (or will be very soon) to obtain opiates from a doctor by being deceitful. I don't know what state you're in or if there's a similar law there, but if there is, I suppose it is technically possible for him to get into legal trouble because of this if he's found out.

If it was me, I would try talking to him. I'd ask him why he didn't ask his doc for a higher dose or why not just switch doctors. His answers might help to determine if he's selling the extras or not. Obviously I could be way off base with my suspicion, but I at least wanted to mention it.

I hope you can work this out.

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 Post subject: Welcome to the Site....
PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:29 pm 
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Hi caesar...,
Welcome to the Forum and I hope you find it helpful!! I agree with what everyone has said. There is Not much you can do. However maybe if you tell your "Friend" that what he is doing is "Addictive" behavior. If he is on the Suboxone to help him in recovery then what he is doing is really defeating the whole purpose! If he is NOT going to counseling I would Strongly suggest that as well. But I would definitely be more concerned with his addictive behavior.... A) He is Dr. Shopping and B) he is taking more Medication then he has been prescribed.. Both are sure signs of his addiction controlling the situation... That of course is ONLY my Humble opinion and I am only a Recovering addict & Alcoholic.:) . No matter what he does he is lucky to have a friend like you that he can go thru Recovery with that cares enough about him to come out here and ask the question and try to help!!! Please make sure you take care of your own Recovery and Don't let it get side tracked because of this! We hope you come back and post again. I hope everything works out for you!!

God Bless
TW

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 4:12 pm 
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Thank you all for your kind replies and answers. I would never turn my buddy in. My biggest fear and worry was that he would overdose. But I guess it appears that it is not possible for him to Overdose on Suboxone. That takes a HUGE weight off of my chest. I know that he does not take any other meds. I'm gonna talk to him and just see where his mind is at; and in the meantime, move forward in my own recovery.

Thank You All So Much!


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 6:38 pm 
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chances are that most states are eventually going to have the database system in check and will most likely cross reference other neighboring states so that they can catch people doctor shopping. I know that Kentucky has KASPER but KY isnt west VA. I agree with everyone who posted their suggestions however i hope he isnt selling them .


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 11:07 am 
Hi,

I agree with the consensus here, it won't harm him, but I've no idea what the penalties over there are for doing that. I can't even get 1 doctor to give me subs so I'm quite jealous :wink: On a serious note the selling issue is a difficult one for me. It is because of people who sell their scripts that I can't get a script for subs unless I consume my meds daily at the chemist (drugstore?). But now, because I can't get to the chemist everyday, I am only able to use subs because people sell them. I am now part of the problem that prevents me getting a script in the 1st place!

One thing I am confused by, don't you guys have to pay to see a doctor and again for the meds? Isn't your friend wasting a load of money? I know you got insurance over there but surely they wont pay out twice?

Homer


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:37 pm 
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Homer, are you in Australia? If so, which state?

Hey Caesar, and welcome. I still don't underststand how he put you in a difficult situation? It's not like what he's doing is affecting you, no? If it's an issue to you, just say to him that you'd rather he didn't talk to you about it and did it in his own time when you're not around. Problem solved.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:38 pm 
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I got a gut feeling from reading your post that maybe he is selling them, and he took you out for the ride to feel you out. If I'm wrong, I apologize in advance. So I guess the only thing you can do is warn him about the trouble he could get in, and then just keep your own nose clean. Hope things all work out for both of you.


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 Post subject: consequences
PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 4:00 pm 
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Yeah, tell your friend that you are worried about the consequences of what he's doing and that under no circumstances do you want to be drawn in. You might ask him--why doesn't he just tell his first doctor that he feels he needs his dose increased. And if you find out that your friend is selling sub--same thing only even stronger, tell him you fear for him because of the consequences i and that you want nothing to do with it. I know that it's hard when you see a friend that you care about using bad judgment, but all you can do is tell them your opinion and then watch out for yourself by staying out of the inadvisable situations they may get into.


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