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 Post subject: Need advice.. :/
PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 9:23 pm 
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So i was on percocet for 3 years for a few reasons, pain, could work harder/longer, and my wife dying. I decided enough was enough and tried to stop with suboxone and help of the doc. I did pretty well for awhile bout 6 months was on for 8. I slipped 3 times and was lucky enough the doc kept me on. The other main issue was i am a self employed contractor, i do the work all myself and no helper so it became difficult for me to make the appts. I missed/no showed a few of them and canceled last day or day before another 5 or so. Being on the percocets and everything else i dealt with over the time period, I became very forgetful with short term memory thus why i missed alot of appts among missing things with normal life.
My question is, I've tried to call the doc and office manager back several times with no follow up from them to get me back in, essentially i got kicked out of the program..how do i get back in? And can i get in to another doc?? How do I go about doing it? I know I'll probably have to pay the several hundred startup cost but thats the least of my worries, I'd like to stay alive too.
I was having a very hard time being completely off the subs from getting kicked out and have been having to take the opiates off and on for 2 months, not like i have before but if i cant get back in, I'm trying to essentially ween myself off to the point i dont struggle all day when i work or my daily activities. I keep picturing and remembering how my life was before the little hell pills and it helps motivate me some days.
Thank you for the responses and trying to understand.. i know everyone is different and stronger, and unfortunately i guess im a weaker one mentally more than i thought and that is very depressing for me


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice.. :/
PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 10:45 pm 
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Hey Edge and welcome to the forum!

Well if you've been calling ur doctors office and unable to get in touch with anyone or any call backs from them, can't u just go to the office personally. If u can, I'd explain that ur willing to follow all the rules and be 100% this time. I'd also be honest about using again, that will show them that ur in need of this. Doctors that prescribe suboxone has a patient limit, so as long as they have a spot available and willing to give u another chance, it's definitely possible. If they can't take u bk, look for another doctor and don't stop til u find one. Hopefully now u have seen just how important this is for u, and u should do everything u can to dust urself off and try this again.

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 Post subject: Re: Need advice.. :/
PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 12:55 am 
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Hi Edge,

I can only mirror what Jennjenn said about the patient cap. (100 patient limit) If your spot has already been filled then you're SOL and will need to speed dial all the Suboxone doctors in your city to find one that has an opening. Sorry, I wish I could think of something better to say.

If by chance you can get back in to see your original doctor and get back on the Suboxone, you might want to ask him to keep your spot open for at least six months until you have surely gotten them out of your system and don't need it anymore.

Good luck on your search.

rule

P.S. I moved your thread to a more appropriate section.

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 Post subject: Re: Need advice.. :/
PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 4:53 am 
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Welcome Edge,
It sounds like you're in the right space to recommit to ORT and I really hope you find a DR that is understanding and supportive. While given only a glimpse into your history, it sounds like you have survived some painful and trying experiences.
I disagree that you are lacking in strength, actually I feel the opposite is true.
Give yourself a break. You deserve to have the life you dream about.
Wishing you the best and keep us updated on your success


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice.. :/
PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 12:39 pm 
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It sounds like your doc is one who sees people very often; you say you were on buprenorphine for 6 or 8 months, and you missed 'a few' appointments and cancelled at the last minute for 'another 5'?

I'll share my perspective, as maybe it will help you find the right approach to use if you get a chance to communicate with this doc again. With the cap, I get about 3-4 calls every DAY from people begging for a spot. I have to tell them that I'm sorry, and there is nothing I can do-- and they sometimes go on and on about how horrible things are 'out there', and promising to be perfect patients.

So if one of my 100 patients doesn't seem to take the chance seriously, I get angry that I took the wrong person. I realize that people struggle-- and I don't kick a person out for using a couple times... providing that the person CARES that he/she was using. The combination of using a few times, and missing appointments, gives the impression that a patient just isn't ready-- at least not as ready as the other people knocking on the door.

Understand too that missed appointments are deadly to a doc's practice; the staff are there, the electricity is running, the malpractice insurance is being paid, the rent is paid... but the doc is sitting in an empty office with no business income. I see 10-12 people per day, so if two people miss, that's a 20% cut-- not in pay, but in revenue. If you do the math, you will see that in a case with fixed costs, taking 20% off the top reduces the business 'profit' (i.e. the doc's salary) by a lot more. Don't mean to get lost in the details-- but if I don't show you what I mean, you'll think I'm exaggerating. If $2000 comes in for the day, and $1200 is accounted for by fixed costs and employee wages, that leaves $800 for the doc. Two missed appointments cuts that in half. It is doubly annoying to sit for 2 hours with nothing to do... when the phone is ringing with people who you can't schedule.

It would be like you going to work from 8-5, and being told some days that 'we won't need you from 9-10 and from 2-3 today, so we're paying only for the 6 hours we actually need you.'

I've probably made it clear how annoying it is to me...

I think that some docs fail to respect the time of the patient too-- by keeping people waiting, or by scheduling so many sessions or visits that the patient has no chance of holding a job. That may be the case with you... but those terms should be spelled out up front, so that you know whether the program is a good fit for you.

Hopefully you'll get a chance to bet your way back in-- but after 'a few' missed visits and more cancellations, that door may be closed.


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice.. :/
PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 11:10 pm 
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Edge82 wrote:
I know I'll probably have to pay the several hundred startup cost but thats the least of my worries, I'd like to stay alive too. [...] I'm trying to essentially ween myself off to the point i dont struggle all day when i work or my daily activities.

Thank you for the responses and trying to understand.. i know everyone is different and stronger, and unfortunately i guess im a weaker one mentally more than i thought and that is very depressing for me

Hey man, I don't think you're weak at all. Remember that many people from all walks of life fall into similar traps. You're trying to recover and that alone takes strength!

Addiction is a powerful thing; when we use drugs, or even just eat something like ice cream, we're essentially "hacking" our bodies with stuff that they didn't evolve to handle. In some ways, this is a fantastic and beneficial tool; beyond the pleasure involved (e.g., saturating our taste receptors with fat, sugar, and chocolate or vanilla!), we can heal or protect or even "condition" ourselves with this stuff. But in other ways -- like if we accidentally stumble into the root directory and discover one of the most powerful admin tools of all, Stimulate Reward System On Command -- it can lead to disaster, sending systems out of whack in ways we haven't had to deal with before.

As you may have guessed, this last analogy is about opioids. Ice cream and other, similar foods (fried chicken, chocolate bars, etc) or even some activities (sex, gambling, shopping) are "superstimuli", in that they have a lot of what we crave combined into one kickass package, lighting our pleasure centers up like Christmas trees. "Wow, we want this!" parts of our brains think, and send us rewards in terms of pleasurable sensations... and endogenous opioids. So when we take (exogenous) opioids directly, we're essentially telling our brains "this activity is the best thing in the world, more rewarding than sex and ice cream put together." The systems in the mind, such as those responsible for learning, don't know how it's being done, or whether or not it's "fake" (more properly, simply unwise): all they know is that reward chemicals are flooding in, and their job is to reinforce whatever makes rewards happen.

Thus, you end up with a super strong attraction to the pills or heroin or whatever. (This goes for other addictive drugs and even addictive activities, although the strength of the attachment will vary between people/drugs/activities.) It's probably reinforced in other ways, too, from inadvertent behavioral conditioning (I ended up liking everything associated with scoring) to conscious thoughts of "hey, I love getting high!" Struggling with this is not weak. It's an absolutely titanic battle between your inner hero and all the darkness trying to escape the Pandora's Box you accidentally opened.

You're in the process of getting clean... hell, you are clean 99% of the time, it looks like... and that's a heck of a lot more than many can say. Good for you, and I wish you the best! Please keep us updated. I think you've probably learned how important it is to show commitment to recovery and not miss appointments or slip up -- suboxdoc's comment above is helpful to remind me of that, too -- and I'm rooting for you to get another chance!


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 Post subject: Re: Need advice.. :/
PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:12 pm 
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Edge, I just wanted to add that I am so sorry that you lost your wife. I'm sure that going through so much grief has made things extra tough on you. Are you getting help for your grief? Please do.

My mother died young at 59 and my father wouldn't see a therapist for more than a couple of times. He became so angry (his reaction to his depression) that he became emotionally abusive to my great aunt who had moved in with my parents. He made crazy decisions that deeply impacted my sister and me. In fact, it was when I was grieving for my mom and grieving for the dad I had once known that I became addicted.

Do you have children? If you won't get help for yourself, do it for your loved ones. If you suffer, they suffer right alongside you.

I wish you the best.

Amy

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